Is WW3 starting ?...

Paddy20

In view of Iraq and the Middle East calamity. Are we due to the American, British, Israeli attitudes, heading into World war 3 .

Imo we are now closer than at any time in my lifetime, and I am concerned, are you ?

Pepe LeFrits

no

bizmark

Er no who are we going to have a world war with ?

and judgeing by both iraq war's it would be one hell of a short war

Pepe LeFrits

marsians living in paddys basement...?...!.

AndrewWK

No

bizmark

Honestly though who the fu*k are we going to have a war with ?

what do you be thinking about in your free time paddy been playing to much command and conqure me thinks

sceptre

Originally posted by Paddy20
Imo we are now closer than at any time in my lifetime

You don't remember the Cuban missile crisis?

kano476

fu*k it lets invade the ukraine. that'll teach em to win the eurovision.

actually a second emergency would be great craic.

Dont Ban Me

No!!

Lump

No, I don't think WW3 is on the way. However, people in the Uk are starting to relise that Blair was a n00b for backing Bush..... it only took a year


John

Chinafoot

roll on november.......but bush cheated once whats to stop him cheating again.

as for WW3, who knows.

Funky

no

Ellesmere

absolutley not, look at what happened during the 'cold war'. theres too many people on the make to let something like 'mutual assured destruction' ruin it.

BlitzKrieg

I was thinking...


do you think there would be a chance of a Second American civil war???


Far fetched but maybe more likely then ww3?


could be spurrned on if GW cheats again...or something similar (unpopular legistration etc etc)...


or are they too patriotic to let such a thing happen...


actually now that i think about it...civil wars seem to be impossible once a country gets into the western world (i.e bloody rich) maybe all this consumerism is controlling the populace to such a large extent that large scale mobilisation...



hmm....

ooo its 530 time to turn the brain off...

Hobbes

Originally posted by BlitzKrieg
I was thinking...


do you think there would be a chance of a Second American civil war???


Far fetched but maybe more likely then ww3?


could be spurrned on if GW cheats again...or something similar (unpopular legistration etc etc)...

http://johntitor.strategicbrains.com/

daveg

Originally posted by sceptre
You don't remember the Cuban missile crisis?

Bet me to it.

BlitzKrieg

man...that john titor stuff is interesting...

pity he doesnt mention much about the world outside america

(how would want to nuke the irish?)

whosurpaddy

Originally posted by bizmark
Er no who are we going to have a world war with ?

and judgeing by both iraq war's it would be one hell of a short war

em we are neutral, last time i checked.

hedgetrimmer

Neutral in a very pro-USA/UK way, in fariness.

I'd be kinda worried about the China Taiwan situation, and America's willingness to step in there too. I don't think Ireland would get involved in a war directly, but I think there's trouble brewing on many horizons at the moment, and USA is involved in too many.

As long as this one bypasses Europe - we've had our fair share of major wars

BlitzKrieg

awwww but we are the experts now.....nothing like experiance.


i know i said i'd go to bed at 530 DAMNIT ITs 10 GO TO F***ING BED HITS SELF WITH EMPTY CHAMPAGNE BOTTLE....meh

Agent Smith

i just cant wait to blow some guys head off... YEAh!

only kidding....
/me ponders


in short.... no world war 3 isnt happening anytime soon, keep watching sky news tho... they'll tell ya the truth!

RE*AC*TOR

Originally posted by Paddy20
In view of Iraq and the Middle East calamity. Are we due to the American, British, Israeli attitudes, heading into World war 3 .

Imo we are now closer than at any time in my lifetime, and I am concerned, are you ?

I think he meant "we" in the global, "we" as humans heading for another world war (not "we" irish).
I would admit that it is the closest currently in my lifetime to another WW (and no i don't remember the cuban missile crisis - wasn't around in 1962).
I think the critical thing here is the need for the involvement of a serious (ie abundance of troops and nuclear weapons) counter-power to the US. So that could be Russia (unlikely), Europe (very unlikely), China (probably not) or India / Pakistan (you never know). If India and Pakistan were to flair up against each other the whole place could go nuts. China and Russia would get fairly nervous and Israel / Middleeast could devolve into further quagmire. The US is stretched enough already. Europe could become involved and we could be a nice easy target on the periphery (but most likely not).

Xterminator

I think the only bloc that is powerful enough to trigger WW3 are the Chinese.

If the sh|t hits the fan in Korea or Taiwan I reckon at could trigger somethng major.

Mind you Injdia and Pakistan have been doing their best recently to bring about the first 'nuclear exchange' in war.

But the Arab states lack the ability to bring the fight to the west, on a sustained basis. That is why 'terror' is the only weapon they have. Thus they migh inflame public opinion, they might fan the flames of war, but I cant see a WW3 scenario coming from Iraq.

X

Paddy20

sceptre,

Of course I remember the Cuban missile crisis, when Kruschev and Kennedy had us on the brink.

However, the world has changed dramatically since those days. More nuclear threats, glad some posters noted the India/Pakistan nuclear war risk.

I am concerned at the number of countries and terrorist organisations that now already have or are capable of obtaining nuclear or chemical warfare materials which could easily be used to wipe out the worlds citizens in a manner never before imaginable, and I believe there exists a number of 'suicidal' mindset lunatic fringe groups who could trigger WW3 by their actions, and basic inexperience, or just a total lack of respect for 'Life on this planet'.

New risks exist today that I believe are beyond control.

Slutmonkey57b

ww3 is teh win!

DMT

"The Holy Angels of Jesus" will apparently protect Ireland from WWIII according to some nun on the radio a few ago. I think they're going to use force fields and shit.....

So nothing to worry about then....

ixoy

But we're already involved in a global war - the war on terror! All hail the President for bringing us here!!

Oh, say can you see, by the dawn's early light,
What so proudly we hailed at the twilight's last gleaming?
Whose broad stripes and bright stars, through the perilous fight,
O'er the ramparts we watched, were so gallantly streaming?
And the rockets' red glare, the bombs bursting in air,
Gave proof through the night that our flag was still there.
O say, does that star-spangled banner yet wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave?

On the shore, dimly seen through the mists of the deep,
Where the foe's haughty host in dread silence reposes,
What is that which the breeze, o'er the towering steep,
As it fitfully blows, now conceals, now discloses?
Now it catches the gleam of the morning's first beam,
In full glory reflected now shines on the stream:
'Tis the star-spangled banner! O long may it wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

And where is that band who so vauntingly swore
That the havoc of war and the battle's confusion
A home and a country should leave us no more?
Their blood has wiped out their foul footstep's pollution.
No refuge could save the hireling and slave
From the terror of flight, or the gloom of the grave:
And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

Oh! thus be it ever, when freemen shall stand
Between their loved homes and the war's desolation!
Blest with victory and peace, may the heaven-rescued land
Praise the Power that hath made and preserved us a nation.
Then conquer we must, for our cause it is just,
And this be our motto: "In God is our trust."
And the star-spangled banner forever shall wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave!

Dont be at yourself

Maybe if Bush gets re-elected and decides to start **** with North Korea.

Tails

No, No war, but maybe its the falling of america as a superpower, look at history great empires fell not from other great empires but internal struggle or barbarians. The barbarians in the case could be these terrorists everybody is talking about.

bizmark

Originally posted by whosurpaddy
em we are neutral, last time i checked.

By we i mean the eu or west there’s VERY little chance of England and Germany going at it again or the usa attacking the eu ......Russia is to poor and ill equipped to fight a world war china....well i don’t think china is up for a war tbh

Theres no great power out there right now that wants to fight each ...and any way if they did the whole MAD thing would put them right off all that’s been happening lately is a bunch of small wars that where over in a week or two this has been happen since the beginning of time

seamus

Originally posted by Hobbes
http://johntitor.strategicbrains.com/

Heh, that's cool. I'd heard the name, but never read the whole thing.
The only thing being mildly convincing is the prediction about suppression of civil liberties, which came well before 11/09/2001 and the Patriot Act.

There are a lot of intelligent, but highly bored people on the Internet though. It wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if someone went to a crazy amount of effort to pull that off and try to create an Internet legend.

Big Ears

Originally posted by bizmark
Honestly though who the fu*k are we going to have a war with ?

what do you be thinking about in your free time paddy been playing to much command and conqure me thinks

North Korea by any chance .

I saw a documentary on BBC about the country ( a very un biased in my opinion one ) and they realy hate America .

and thev've military power .

so my answer to your question is : The People's Democratic Republic of Korea .

Big Ears

Originally posted by NekkidBibleMan
Maybe if Bush gets re-elected and decides to start **** with North Korea.

sorry hadnt seen this post

bizmark

Originally posted by Big Ears


and thev've military power .

s

They have 1 million solders afaik but numbers only tell a small part of the story how well equipped are they? How well trained ? Hows there moral? Whats there air force like? There navy?

Iraq had the third largest armored force in the world during the first gulf war but the yanks superior training/technology/moral destroyed them very ease......I douth anyone bar the eu china or a rebuilt Russia could really start a war and hope to win it

Hey i could be totally wrong though

vorbis

North Korea is also suffering from some sort of famine. Not quite ideal for a big army. Similar to the russians, I'd be amazed if they could march an army to a battlefield without mass desertion.

Ellesmere

I don't think the 'War on Terror' constitutes a 'world' war. I'm no history buff but what I do know about the last two world wars was that they were truly global affairs. With armed forces all over the world mobilised and millions of people killed.

They were on a much more massive global scale than any potential or current regional wars and conflicts that have been mentioned. The only potential 'World War' still is between NATO and Russia/China. I just can't see that happening, strategicly it is of no advantage to either side.

dangerman

that john titor stuff was great.

Very scary though, great hoax/or respect to the guy for being so honest about it all and ignoring the crappest of all star trek rules, the temporal/prime directive.

Dont be at yourself

Originally posted by bizmark
They have 1 million solders afaik but numbers only tell a small part of the story how well equipped are they? How well trained ? Hows there moral? Whats there air force like? There navy?

Iraq had the third largest armored force in the world during the first gulf war but the yanks superior training/technology/moral destroyed them very ease......I douth anyone bar the eu china or a rebuilt Russia could really start a war and hope to win it

Hey i could be totally wrong though

North Korea supposedly have nuclear capabilities and are possibly able to hit the US mainland. And if they did use nukes, the americans would almost certainly retaliate likewise. And who knows where that would leave us.

And while WW3 does seem an unlikely proposition now, so did WW1 in 1910. Of course, that doesn't mean it will happen, just that it's not the outrageous possibility people seem to think it is. I mean, look how much the world changed in the space of the last three years.

pork99

Originally posted by NekkidBibleMan
North Korea supposedly have nuclear capabilities and are possibly able to hit the US mainland. And if they did use nukes, the americans would almost certainly retaliate likewise. And who knows where that would leave us.

N. Korea is quite a small country in area. There's rumours might just possibly soon have missiles that can reach Alaska or the West coast of the USA, maybe Seattle. If they ever were "lucky" enough to get just one missile onto an American city the response would be such that there would be quickly nobody left alive in N. Korea to fire a second one. I doubt if it's even feasible for N Korea to build ICBMs anyway, those things are basically a type of space rocket developing and using them implies you have either have a space program for doing things like launching guidance satellites or access to someone elses space technology. They certainly do not have the capacity to build cruise missiles.

If you think about it N. Korea would need at least 20 or 30 ICBMs to destroy America. A single US Navy missile submarine sitting in the middle of the Pacific ocean could obliterate North Korea with 5 or 6 warheads (each sub carries 24 Trident missiles, each missile has 5 warheads, each warhead is a nuclear weapon far bigger than the Hiroshima or Nagasaki bombs). The N Koreans have no way of knocking out the USA's capacity to retaliate overwhelmingly.

Hecate

Iraq had the third largest armored force in the world during the first gulf war

As Bill Hicks said, "yeah mabye, but after the first two largest armies, there's a reaaaalll big fúckin' dropoff...the hari krishnas are the 5th largest army in the world, and they've already got our airports".

But back to the main point; War is somthing that humanity has only gotten better at waging, its constantly evolving and probably reached its destructive peak during the middle of the last century with the development of icbms and mirvs with huge kiloton yields. I guess most people have realised you can't win a nuclear war but thats not stopped people from wanting to kill each other. So war has evolved once again, into extremely bloody localised conflicts that are happening in central africa or places like chechnya.

Still, I think the time to start worrying is when the oil runs out. Then you'll really see who our 'friends' are.

sceptre

Originally posted by NekkidBibleMan
North Korea supposedly have nuclear capabilities and are possibly able to hit the US mainland. And if they did use nukes, the americans would almost certainly retaliate likewise. And who knows where that would leave us.

I doubt that they've got missiles capable of hitting the continental US, though that's only my own feeling with nothing to back up the opinion. They do have missiles capable of hitting South Korea, Japan or Taiwan though and that's pretty much as good as.

bizmark

As Bill Hicks said, "yeah mabye, but after the first two largest armies, there's a reaaaalll big fúckin' dropoff...the hari krishnas are the 5th largest army in the world, and they've already got our airports".

Lol

Really the big threat i see is a massive arms race in Asia. Japan = second biggest economy in the world see's its nasty neighbor building nukes (or trying to) able to reach Japan they say "well **** this" and build up there army navy airforce and nuke stockpiles. China see's this and does the same.. India follows........now you have around 5 countries (Japan Russia India China N.K) in that area with big ass armies and a lot of nukes ......like Europe of the past just with bigger numbers and better technology

pork99

Originally posted by Hecate

But back to the main point; War is somthing that humanity has only gotten better at waging, its constantly evolving and probably reached its destructive peak during the middle of the last century with the development of icbms and mirvs with huge kiloton yields. I guess most people have realised you can't win a nuclear war but thats not stopped people from wanting to kill each other. So war has evolved once again, into extremely bloody localised conflicts that are happening in central africa or places like chechnya.

Well according to this guy we're already fighting World War 4. World War 3 was the Cold War, which was fought through proxy wars like Vietnam and Afghanistan.

It makes sense I suppose. THe destructiveness of the 2 main combatants weaponery made a direct confrontation impossible so you fight indirectly.

The "War on Terror" now is a new type of war. Unfortunatly the Americans seem to have some sort of obsession with refighting the Cold War and the 1991 Gulf War when what is needed are radically new strategies, tactics, weapons etc.

Hobbes

Originally posted by sceptre
I doubt that they've got missiles capable of hitting the continental US, though that's only my own feeling with nothing to back up the opinion. They do have missiles capable of hitting South Korea, Japan or Taiwan though and that's pretty much as good as.

They managed to drop a missile off the shore of the US some years ago.

However they wouldn't even need a missile. During WWII the japanese experimented with timed ballons which used the jet stream to attack the US. Those ballons did in fact hit the continental US. The US was so scared of the terror it might cause they censored it happened until long after the war.

I doubt Bush would go after NK. South Korea and Japan would have something to say about it, as would China. Bush has done more damage to the US then any other president before them, I doubt he is going to get voted in again.

melodicmarsbar

Yeah, well I think that GW is just stupid enough to start WW3. He's an idiot in charge of a huge country - how does that sound right????? Can't wait til November, he'll be kicked out alright!!!!:cool:

pork99

Originally posted by Hobbes
They managed to drop a missile off the shore of the US some years ago.

Where did you get that information?

If they ever get around to building the Taepo Dong 2 missile they might be able to hit Alaska. According to the Federation of American Scientists anyway (They're developing the "No Dong" missile )

Link to map

seamus

Pork, sweet mother of god that pic is 100KB. If I was on dialup I'd kill you.

pork99

Originally posted by seamus
Pork, sweet mother of god that pic is 100KB. If I was on dialup I'd kill you.

Replaced with link - sorry!

popinfresh

Actually I'm choosing to be an aquard b*astard and disagree with the majority of posters here . But really, I'm actually just as freaked aout about WW3 as you are. And I'm taking my suspiscions from history.
The reason for WW2 was because some cun7 of a government, (which ironically happened to be the world's greatest military power before the war) was invading other countries for oil. Countries like France and Britain found this to be unacceptable. They could not have economically survived with a hyper-power German state was hogging all the oil. and so they declaired war on Germany (NOTE* It was Germany's intention to take over Russia, not the world) This in turn led us to a bloody war. (Also please note Russia won ww2 not USA, there a much larger number of nazi soldiers on the eastern front that the west, USA just helped out)

And so, what can we learn from WW2? The answer: If one of the main super-powers of the world starts acting the cun7 and invading other countries for financial benefit (financial security in USA's case) there's gonna be trouble.

In my opinion, unless a different, renewable effective way of creating energy than oil is introduced WW3 is an inevitability. The wold does not have the resources to offer the "American way of life" for 6 billion people. Oh and also take note that China seems to be rapidly progressing towards the American way of life. I'd say bout the year 2015, oil resources (The spine of the Western World) are going to start getting tense, and hence there'll form a tension between the super powers of the time. Most probably China vs USA.

Where does the Iraq war fit into ww3?
America is being smart and attempting to secure it's future economy. It is America's intention to have Iraq run by American oil companies, aka let USA have a very significant influence over Iraq. In order to reduce their dependance on Saudi Arabia for instance. Once ,lets say, China realised the implications of what America pulled off (if they manage it) there's gonna be trouble (tension)

Where does the middle East fit into this?
The middle east isn't really significant militarily, but it is the most important region in the world when it comes to economy. So realistically, if ozzy laaden get's what he want's, muslim nations forming afghanistan style west snubbing governments throughout the region, Not only will USA declair war, Russia Europe and China will as well. (God I can see the propeganda all ready "We will not live in a world where women get treated like that etc...")

And so, my bet is tension'll start between China and USA round about 2008, and by 2012-2015 they'll be in a cold war state like Russia and USA were. The interesting thing is though, will they actually go to war? Again I'd say yes, the cold war was just a tension between two different styles of government communism and democricy. This war will be about raw materials, And both of these super-powers would rather go to war than watch their economy's completely crash, sending them back to the stone age...... </me> starts building a bomb shelter

BlitzKrieg

Poppinfresh in a double blow of agreeing and disagreeing



-Agree: Japan was the state that went on a hyper war trip for oil, they admitted it themselves, they needed to conquer said countries to secure and sustain the amount of oil required to preserve a Japanese empire. The reason for Pearl Harbour was that sooner or later there desire for oil will mess with the American desire for oil (and security in pacific) and America would act against Japan. So Pearl Harbour was designed to push America out of the Pacifc theatre secure the required oil routes and outproduce america in a naval race to keep them away. Course Yammamoto (Japanese admiral who came up with Pearl Harbour) admitted this he said if pearl harbour fails he can assure Japan that after 4 months of success for Japan, America will slap back and kick their asses. And he was right. America was lucky (supposably) and was able to strike back.

Disagree GERMANY was more into Racial and superiority of the German people and invaded first Austria and then Czech...To reclaim the lost German lands and people (from ww1) Similar reason for poland (which led to declaration of war by GB and France) Yes Russia was for natural resources, but it also contained politcal (fascist vs Communist) and racial qualities (eastern people were meant (according to hitler) to serve the german people as slaves)


On the WW3 front, i agree we will need an oil crises to actually cause western politics into a large scale conflict. BUT apart from America most other nations are starting research into alternative means. So i stand by an American Civil War after their Economy goes arse ways because of the lack of oil while other nations (noticable central europe) will take the blow alot easier...

Superman

If its not the reds its the A-rabs!