The Mega **Management Company** thread

Faolchu

Seems MUD was signed by the president

Paulw

Faolchu wrote: »

Seems MUD was signed by the president

Link?

markpb

Paulw wrote: »

Link?

ApartmentOwners.ie

Faolchu

sorry meant to put the link up. now only two sections will be enacted straight away it still needs a minister of justice to sign it first or something and we know that there may be a slight problem with that at the minute

The_Conductor

Faolchu wrote: »

sorry meant to put the link up. now only two sections will be enacted straight away it still needs a minister of justice to sign it first or something and we know that there may be a slight problem with that at the minute

No problem there- the Minister for Agriculture is double jobbing as Minister for Justice- its a bit irregular, but entirely legal.....

Paulw

markpb wrote: »

ApartmentOwners.ie

I was more looking for a link to a Govt website to say such. Anyone can post info on a privately run website, in fairness. Not disputing the information, but would like a govt link with the information.

The_Conductor

Paulw wrote: »

I was more looking for a link to a Govt website to say such. Anyone can post info on a privately run website, in fairness. Not disputing the information, but would like a govt link with the information.

Its certainly not on the Oireachtas website. Private websites are suggesting that 2 parts of the Act are being implemented (Sections 14 and 32) however that commencement orders are needed for the rest of the Act. It is also suggested that the Act has been renamed 'Multi Unit Development Act of 2011', No. 2 of 2011. Its certainly not referenced correctly (Act No.2 of 2011 is an Environmental Act dealing with pollution).

I would love to know whether this has in fact been enacted- and if so (or not) where folk are getting their information from.

jd

http://www.president.ie/index.php?year=2011&section=24&lang=eng

Titles of Acts signed by President McAleese


An tAcht Cumarsáide (Sonraí a Choimeád) 2011 (Uimhir 3 de 2011) (Signed on: 26th January 2011)
COMMUNICATIONS (RETENTION OF DATA) ACT 2011 (ACT NO. 3 OF 2011) (Signed on: 26th January 2011)
An tAcht Um Fhorbairtí Ilaonad 2011 (Uimhir 2 de 2011) (Signed on: 24th January 2011)
MULTI-UNIT DEVELOPMENTS ACT 2011 (ACT NO. 2 OF 2011 (Signed on: 24th January 2011)
An tAcht Um Chomhaontuithe Bretton Woods (Leasú) 2011 (Uimhir 1 de 2011) (Signed on: 21st January 2011)
BRETTON WOODS AGREEMENTS (AMENDMENT) ACT 2011 (ACT NO. 1 OF 2011) (Signed on: 21st January 2011)

The_Conductor

Ok- so in short- its been signed by the President, however there is no enactment date associated with it, and most certainly won't be in the current Dail.

Virgo2011

Hi - quick question

If i wanted to build a wall (back garden) between my neighbours garden and mine, would this have to be cleared with the management company?

The_Conductor

Virgo2011 wrote: »

Hi - quick question

If i wanted to build a wall (back garden) between my neighbours garden and mine, would this have to be cleared with the management company?

It depends on whether your property is leasehold or freehold. If its a freehold property- providing your neighbour is in agreement with the wall, and there are no planning considerations- you're sorted. If its a leasehold property- you have no right to make any structural modifications without the agreement of the management company (and any modifications might also be subject to planning permission etc).

d125

could you please help

We had our agm at the start of december the directors never turned up,they sent the head guy in the office and the auditor turned up.between the both of them they say the would send all the paper work and bank statements to the resident committee, they will not return calls or emails. we pay for tv and the tv company say the have not got any money in the last year and half. Any ideas on how to get this information or what our next step should be.




thank you for your time and help

Paulw

If you get enough unit owners together (a quorum), you can force the directors to call an EGM.

Send them a registered letter, demanding the full set of accounts (as is your right).

I would guess that a good number of people aren't paying their management fees, hence financial problems.

The_Conductor

I would add to this that not calling a properly constituted AGM within a prescribed time frame, and supplying shareholders with a set of audited accounts, prior to said AGM, is a supression of minority rights under company law, and could potentially lead to the directors being proscribed. It is also crucial that an AGM is held and audited accounts lodged with the CRO- as failure to do will result in a actions culminating in the company being struck off. If the company is struck off- legally its assets become vested in the Minister for Finance- and you will have no end of issues trying to get the company reinstated.


The fact that the directors are fobbing off owners, is bad- but the implications of not performing their statutory duties, as directors, have implications far above anything they may have considered.

Shane

d125

How do i go about calling the EGM do i need the poeple to sign and say the want it or write a list of the problems and sent a resigtered letter.

The have a two other AGM and the directors have never turned up the always sent this guy (site manager/or ex site manager), we have the audited account but we would like to see the bank statement to see where the money is going on some services, we have never got mins of meet the directors have about the management company to do the budget( as we no one service has not begin pay in the last year and half but the are still chargin for it)

could i get onto the office of the director of corporate enfofrcement about them

thank you for your help

Faolchu

heres one that baffles me. who is responsible for clearing up illegal dumping in a managed estate? is it the management company and if so what can they do if they find who is responsible through license plates or through personal documents in the rubbish? or is it the local council?

Paulw

The management company are responsible to clear it up, but they can report illegal dumping and littering to the litter warden in the local authority (as far as I know).

Faolchu

pawlw that's what i thought but apparantly the local council in our area have told our agent it's nothing to do with them.

markpb

Faolchu wrote: »

heres one that baffles me. who is responsible for clearing up illegal dumping in a managed estate? is it the management company and if so what can they do if they find who is responsible through license plates or through personal documents in the rubbish? or is it the local council?

It depends... if the property is a public road, the estate has been taken in charge or the rubbish is visible from a public road, it's up the local authority to clean it up. If it's on (or only visible from) a private road, it's up to the management company. I'm not sure what steps they can take to recover the costs though.

macbrada

Faolchu wrote: »

heres one that baffles me. who is responsible for clearing up illegal dumping in a managed estate? is it the management company and if so what can they do if they find who is responsible through license plates or through personal documents in the rubbish? or is it the local council?

a good management company will check through rubbish for identification of dumper such as letters with addresses etc.. The then report the offence to the litter warden who issues proceedings.. After a few fines word spreads and the dumping levels are dramatically reduced

ur mentor

macbrada wrote: »

a good management company will check through rubbish for identification of dumper such as letters with addresses etc.. The then report the offence to the litter warden who issues proceedings.. After a few fines word spreads and the dumping levels are dramatically reduced

It is a pity that the illegal dumpers also know this and make sure not to leave any letters or id in the waste they dump.

markpb

ur mentor wrote: »

It is a pity that the illegal dumpers also know this and make sure not to leave any letters or id in the waste they dump.

Not all of them are so clever

The_Conductor

markpb wrote: »

Not all of them are so clever

Even when people think they're pulling a fast one- its actually quite rare for no identifiable matter to be left in the refuse. It makes sense to use the maximum possible punishment on any offenders found- serves as a warning to others.

ur mentor

smccarrick wrote: »

Even when people think they're pulling a fast one- its actually quite rare for no identifiable matter to be left in the refuse. It makes sense to use the maximum possible punishment on any offenders found- serves as a warning to others.

Agree about the max punishment..recent case suceeded in getting a person fined, who promptly handed the fine to their social welfare officer to pay.

In my direct experience it is rare to find evidence of offenders names and addresses in illegally dumped waste.

skinny6781

Hi bought a house in a development were there is to be 17 detached house's built, 13 are built and founds are in for 2 more . 6 of the house's are sold

Managment company fee were 1300pa
All home owners are contesting the billing for 2010 as we think it far to high, main common area is a building site at the for last 3 years.

Question 1:
What payment does the developer have to pay , some saying he has to pay nothing , so saying devide the bill by 13 are that's the number of home built and other saying devide the bill by 17 are that the number in for planning permission.

2 Site is not finished , no tarmac on raod , lighting to go up ,ect ,
do we have to pay managment fee even tho the site is NOT finished?


we also never seen any invoice for any work done on site for 2010 ,
no AGM in 3 years for other in the site ,
we know we have to pay something but we not willing to pay the 1300 ,
the developer is running the managment company at the min

Thanks

ur mentor

Interesting Questions

Looks like you have a steep learning curve there. Most of the answers are on the thread if you read backwards.

the much talked about MUDS does not apply to housing Estates so you are dependant on other existing laws etc to guide you.

I presume you do not want to pay for services that you do not get and to have some understanding of what you are payign for?

The service charge is on the face of it quite high.
Typically Estates have 5 costs
1. PL cover on roads etc. say 600
2. Agent- say 2,500 in a small company like this
3. Grass cutting, weed control, liter picking etc. - say 2,500 pa.
4. Audit, company filings Say 1500 per annum
5. Street lights???? 120 per lamp per annum
Total of about 7,500 give or take.
I assume that the project is on mains water and mains sewage.. If not costs will rapidly and I mean that- rapidly-- escalate.
So how many pay this?? Well that depends.
When it is fully finished and sold all house owners will become members of the company and as members will contribute, usually on an equal basis. So when that happy day arrives all is clear and easy.. then you can concentrate on doing all the work yourself to avoid paying contractors..or pay the contractors and be happy with the service and the time and effort they are saving you.
But what happens in meantime..how many pay into this 7000 or so.. There is no specific LAW on this. The answer is to determine exaactly who are the members of the company. The company secretary keeps a register of members. The company sec name is available at www.cro.ie. You will need to know either the company number or its exact name to find it there. (You will also need 2.50 and a credit card!). Ask the sec for the register of members. The members support the company. If the developer is not listed as a member ( in either a personal or corporate capacity) then they may not have to pay. If the developer is not listed as a member then it is interesting to note that they may not attend the members AGM.- leads to another whole area that I am not going into here.
If they are, and they probably are, members, then as members they are liable to pay.. However as members they are also able to appoint directors and directors are able take on costs and liabilities into the company and also to 'forgive' service charges to (say) unsold properties. Not too smart if it means the company is operating in an insolvent way or supressing minority interests of other members. Again something I am not going to go into here.

So lots of stuff for you to learn...

judeanthony

Hi all

Im having a nightmare with my management agent - KPM - they management the development in carrickmines

im assuming others are having problems with KPM too .. can you tell me what other developments do they manage - ie , i want to take legal action against them and we will have strength in numbers.

thanks again

markpb

judeanthony wrote: »

im assuming others are having problems with KPM too .. can you tell me what other developments do they manage - ie , i want to take legal action against them and we will have strength in numbers.

As far as I know, you cannot take group court cases in Ireland, each case is taken separately. Also as owner/shareholder, you do not have a contract with the managing agent so I doubt there's anything you can sue them for.

Instead, you need to talk to the directors of your management company (who are either the developers, a developers appointee or someone who owns apartments in the complex) and pressure them to get a better level of service from KPM. If there are legitimate reasons why that service cannot be achieved (people not paying, developer not paying, etc) then the directors need to work to fix that. If KPM just aren't pulling their weight, the directors can replace them with another agent.

Faolchu

looks like MUD was enacted
http://www.justice.ie/en/JELR/Pages/Implementation%20of%20Multi-Unit%20Developments%20Act%202011


http://www.justice.ie/en/JELR/SI95of2011.pdf/Files/SI95of2011.pdf

my concern is that it comes into operation on april 1st LOL

30kmph

Regarding the new "Multi Unit Development Act 2011" as discussed above, can anyone tell me what this means "The vesting of the common areas of existing management companies shall take place within 6 months following the enactment of the Act." Double dutch to me...