Ftv Cards Obsolete !

arkles

taken from posts on digital spy forum
http://forum.digitalspy.co.uk/board/t/71966/a443ffb415a32c8cbdc54b2f7b3d5b6cds.html

"CONFIRMED BY SKY

08702 403000 - programme services

Chap called 'Robin' confirms that ALL FTV CARDS WILL BE SWITCHED OFF IN STAGES FROM 'BEGINNING OF JULY'.

Anyone wishing to see these channels wiil have to subscribe..."

Lennoxschips

I'll believe it when it happens.

maisflocke

"Robin"

The only Robin in Sky works hard on lame tatics to frighten some into subscribing, hence "Robin" your dosh

I agree with Lennoxschips.

carrolls

The other Sky guy who confirmed it was Mustapha Million.:D

Icehouse

Yeah, so the FTV card that I got for a friend a couple of weeks back and that will be activated in the next day or 2 will be deactivated permanently in the next week or so. DON'T BELIEVE EVERYTHING SOMEONE POSTS ON digispy. Sorry for shouting ;op

Icehouse

I just found this, posted by "digitalbanana" on digispy

Hi, I know a lot of this has been speculated upon here, but heres an official letter received from the CAI (governing body for the aerial industry) yesterday:

"Five (Channel 5) and Conditional Access on Satellite

By now most of you will be aware of the changes being made to the delivery of the terrestrial public service channels via the ASTRA satellite. The BBC has announced that by the end of July their services will be available via the satellite without the need for a viewing card.

This has certain ramifications for the remaining broadcasters using satellite carriage in that they effectively would have to fund the free-to-view (FTV) card system without BBC finance if they wish to restrict programme viewing.

ITV and C4 still have to decide on whether or not to continue within an encrypted package on ASTRA

Five however have decided to continue with conditional access. To sum up, the transition will end with Five becoming part of a Sky subscription package. In the meantime viewers with 'old' FTV-P1 cards will soon no longer be able to view Five via the satellite. Viewers who have received a replacement card between January and June should not be affected, nor will existing Sky subscribers.

From 15 July, the FTV call centre will carry a message explaining that the service is no longer available and giving 08702 430604 as a contact number for digital satellite packages.

At some point during July, Sky will broadcast an on screen message visable to only FTV-P1 card holders stating that the service will soon no longer be accessible. There should be a specific number on screen to call for information."

SOURCE : Letter from the CAI, dated June 25, 2003


Who is to be believed, and Why for once can we not have official announcements on air or via press release to the papers/websites (and BEFORE the event)

EDIT : I've just e-mailed the editor of the Guardian to see if they will research what's happening with ITV, 4 and five.

axious

Source: LogoFree TV

Official Response from SKY!

Dear Mr Wheeler

First of all, may I apologise for the delay in responding to your initial email.

Although the BBC has decided to discontinue its funding of the provision of new Solus cards, digital satellite viewers already in possession of a Solus card will continue to receive the encrypted services of ITV1, Channel 4 and Five for the immediate future.

As you are aware, the current generation of digital satellite viewing cards, including Solus cards, is due to be phased out in the coming weeks. In their existing arrangements with Sky, neither the BBC, ITV, Channel 4 nor Five has chosen to fund the provision of replacement cards for those viewers who do not subscribe to a pay-TV service.

Should one or more of these broadcasters choose to fund this facility, Sky will resume the provision of Solus cards. Under the regime overseen by OFTEL, this service is provided by Sky to all broadcasters on regulated terms.

If the terrestrial broadcasters continue to choose not to fund this facility, viewing cards will only be made available in future to subscribers to a pay-TV service.

Yours Sincerely

Robert Fraser Corporate Communications Manager BSkyB

Webmaster comments:

The Free-To-View party looks like it is over for Sky controlled Digital Satellite users. Should the FTV cut-off go ahead in 2 weeks time, this will make Sky a pay-to-use platform only in terms of UK Public Service Broadcasting.

What does this mean for the 5 big Public Service Broadcasters?

- For ITV, who joined Digital Satellite in November 2001, it means relatively little. ITV has suffered a decline of share in the multi-channel environment. Its users will simply return to their analogue signal.

- For Channel 4, who has developed ornate (but unwanted by us) Interactive Television applications, this will mean 560,000 fewer revenue paying homes.

- For FIVE, who only have 82% analogue signal coverage and a limited programming budget of less than £200M, this is a disaster for the broadcaster and viewers. 560,000 homes will potentially no longer receive FIVE via Digital Satellite. This webmaster acknowledges FIVE as having some of the most distinctive and interesting programming on TV today.

- For the BBC, who instigated this problem by pulling out of the SOLUS / BBC (Free-To-View) FTV Card scheme, it gives them what the Director General wants: A BBC dominated nominally non-Sky platform that will currently exclude the BBC's Public Service rivals (channels 3, 4, and 5). It also makes the FREEVIEW DTT platform seem more attractive, in that in theory users can not be cut off at the whim of a Conditional Access Module supplier.

The Government's promise of a Digital Britain has suffered a major set back today, with the prospect of 3 of Britain's public service broadcasters no longer being available to 560,000 homes via Digital Satellite. This is a bad day for the plurality and diversity of Britain's TV culture

Mike 1972

ITV Channels 4 and Five could pay to keep the FTV scheme running (or stop encryption like the BBC hace) in the morning if they wanted to

jez

So people in the know

Does this mean that the FTV Card whether new /old, ex Sky sub etc etc...will by RIP by the end of July or sooner and is it advisable to crank up those Chorus boys for a bit of O.T.???

Icehouse

Well Jez, the ever-so (un) reliable FTV 'help'desk told me that the BBC were going FTV on July 14th and that ALL FTV cards would be de-activated 'a couple of weeks later' - why the delay I dunno. I would hope at the very least that there would be some sort of on-screen announcements given. 'Mike' at the helpdesk told me that five, C4 and ITV would be available only to Sky subscribers. Surely the ITC/new OFCOM can/should stop this?? Even if five are in bed with Sky to a large extent, surely thay have the most to lose as their terrestrial coverage in Britain is awful....

Edit : And why the hell have they still been issuing new cards up to this week? Will new-type card holders get a reprieve while poor sods like me suffer??

jez

Yes and it also seemed stupid to be posting out FTV cards as recently as Monday if they're only going to be useful to clear ice off your windscreen next winter...

Maybe only the old cards will die???

carrolls

About two months back I called the FTV number to request a Series 2 card because of the rumour that the Series 1 Solus cards were being switched off.
I was informed by the Sky-monkey that there is no need to upgrade, because the old cards will continue to work indefinately.
Of course I took this re-assurance with a pinch of salt (After all it was a Sky-monkey;) ) so I ordered a Series 2 card from another mate in London just in case, and got it actvated two weeks ago.
There is so many rumours and innuendo coming from various sources and nothing official yet from the Beeb or Sky in terms of press releases.
One thing for certain though. The FTV card era is gone.:(

Darby OGill

I don't understand why some posters are suggesting that old-style FTV cards will die and the newer-style ones might survive?
Why would Sky treat them differently, and who would operate the system for the chosen few, and why would they do it in any case?

Icehouse

Originally posted by Darby O'Gill
I don't understand why some posters are suggesting that old-style FTV cards will die and the newer-style ones might survive?
Why would Sky treat them differently, and who would operate the system for the chosen few, and why would they do it in any case?

Because, according to a post on DigiSpy, and I think maybe repeated in one of the threads on here, Sky told someone in a mail that all type 1 cards were being deactivated. The BBC, going FTA, weren't willing, obviously, to cough up to replace the existing cards that their viewers would no longer need. ITV, Channel 4 and five being commercial channels and tight f**kers were not willing either. Thus we have the unconfirmed situation where newer cards may continue to work and older cards will not, and anyone who doesn't have a newer card already will have no way of getting one except subscribing to Sky.

That said I saw a post on another site today saying that Playboy TV was becoming a standalone channel ( I understand that to mean that one wouldn't have to have a Sky sub to have a Playboy sub?). That may mean that one could sub for a month to Playboy and they would I suppose send a new-type Sky card that may well act as an FTV card as well!!

Darby OGill

OK, Icehouse, I can see why people are suggesting this course of events based on Sky rumours or whatever, but WHY would there be any reason to treat old and newer cards differently?

An FTV card is an FTV card. If I got mine last week, and you got yours a year ago, what's the difference? There's no advantage to Sky or anybody to keep (say) 50,000 new card holders happy and really annoy another 500,000.

Or am I missing the point completely?

jez

BBC FTV Centre just said that they expect ITV,Channel 4/5 to be subscription only with your service provider from around end of July.

So basically folks looks like we have got the Beeb but are losing the rest...Is that a good deal?? Don't think so.

Someone needs to start a thread about "how to get a Sky UK subscription made easy"

Otherwise it looks like we'll being singing the same Chorus again...

Icehouse

Sky felt a need (rumours of a Sky hack true?) to spend lots of £€$ cash on replacing all of the old blue Sky cards and that process is almost complete.

The only cards not replaced are ex-sub cards (which continued to work as FTV) which are it seems gradually being deactivated (I know of several friends who had this happen, and read of others) and FTV cards as the BBC refused to fork out for the changeover and were planning to go FTA.

Thus as has been said it remains to be seen whether ANY FTV cards remain active in the near future.

Darby OGill

Thanks for the replies. Another question though....

I thought I read here previously that ITC (?) rules insisted that all five terrestrial UK services had to be available FREE on satellite to those who wanted to receive it. Hence the FTV scheme. If even a nominal sub is charge for ITV/C4/5 by Sky, is this not a breach of the rules?

Icehouse

Originally posted by Darby O'Gill
Thanks for the replies. Another question though....

I thought I read here previously that ITC (?) rules insisted that all five terrestrial UK services had to be available FREE on satellite to those who wanted to receive it. Hence the FTV scheme. If even a nominal sub is charge for ITV/C4/5 by Sky, is this not a breach of the rules?

Reading this : http://europa.eu.int/ISPO/infosoc/telecompolicy/en/OVUM-mustcarry.pdf
it looks like (at time of writing, 2001)"no UK operator is subject to digital must carry obligations". I presume that the ITC (or soon enough OFCOM) or directly the UK government can impose a must carry clause on Sky.

EDIT: It's still the case: "But his tone was less belligerent than a previous Westminster Media event in February, where the BBC argued unsuccessfully for a "must carry" clause in the communications bill to strengthen its hand in negotiations with BSkyB." from http://media.guardian.co.uk/Print/0,3858,4659922,00.html

Lennoxschips

I assume the cards will have a "deactivation" signal sent to them? In this case, is there a way of blocking this signal (ie disrupting a certain circuit)

Or do the cards time-out anyway, making it pointless to try and block any de-activation signal.

irishgeo

Sky dont use deactivation signals. What they is send out signals which tell the box which channels you watch.

If i dont pay one month and thet stop sending the signal which tells the i have sky world so the box them stops showing them.

i assume it the same with cards.

TVDX

My advice on this issue remains the same as it was when we first heard of "new" Sky cards and the changeover : wait and see.

Theres a lot of stuff going around at the moment about "old" FTV cards being turned off and "new" recent FTV cards being left on.

But to be honest with you, i think that theres 1 chip that equals a "solus" card".

At home i have a "new" FTV card(its faulty) but it has the same chip as my working "old" FTV card.

My "new" sub card however, has a different type of gold chip altogether. Now when you hear the talk of only ex sub FTV users needing to worry about this i tend to believe it.

So i think that a "new" FTV card is nothing more than a new design, i could be totally wrong.

But, if it all goes worng and we lose our FTV cards, can i please just ask members here talking about getting Chorus in?, just dont, youll regret it.

The easy way to do it is get your UK address, get Sky to send you a second hand contract(tell them you have box) etc., give them credit card details, and get your relative to send on the card and hey presto you have a UK sub, im in the process of doing it now, and dont forget as Watty pointed out, if you want, you can cancel your sub and it becomes an FTV card.

The main message : Dont worry YET, but do be PREPARED.

Icehouse

Checked Sky's terms and conditions this morning.

A sub to a Sky package is for a minimum of *1 year*.

Besides, if FTV cards no longer exist, why would a cancelled Sky sub card become one???!

rovingrover

A cancelled Irish sub card is useless so if Sky are not forced by the ITC (or whoever) to provide these channels then they may make future cancelled UK sub cards obsolete as well.

Looks like the BBC FTA move is starting to hurt us and not help us.

fingers crossed that at least new fTV cards will survive.

IPFreely

Got a call from Luke Davy today to say that my FTV card is being posted as he has just got another batch of cards in! Whats are the chances that it will work due to the speculation above?

jez

After having read the comments all day I think that ultimately the new FTV/ ex Sky sub cards will keep working . This makes sense and there ,unfortunately, has to be a phase out of the old cards otherwise why would they have changed them in the first place?

Can you imagine the outrage in the British media if suddenly ITV/Channel 4/5 became sub only channels. Sky's name would be mud. There has been interactive programming on all these channels which could not happen on Freeview, therefore satellite is the best way of transmitting these channels.

I don't think there could be a situation where only two of the five main Brit channels could operate free to air on a particular platform.

As other punters have pointed out the three channels would loose thousands of eager viewers at a stroke.

TVDX

Originally posted by Icehouse
Checked Sky's terms and conditions this morning.

A sub to a Sky package is for a minimum of *1 year*.

Besides, if FTV cards no longer exist, why would a cancelled Sky sub card become one???!

If you have a sky digibox and get a second hand contract you do not have to have the system connected to the phone and you do not have to subscribe for 12 months, if you have bought the digibox outright it isnt subject to these conditions.

Currently and as always has been when you stop subscribing in the UK, your card loses the premium channels, but not the FTV channels.

In the negative blurb going around at the moment they say only "new" FTV cards and "new" ex sub cards will survive.
So sub, un sub after a month and there you go.

jez

Lads, a question on activation of FTV Card

When phoning to activate and you block your number can they establish that you're calling outside the UK? According to a poster on Digispy you can.

Can someone advise what they think before I do it.

BTW Can you get all ITV regions on FTV card??

Thanks a lot

Icehouse

Posted by TVDX:If you have a sky digibox and get a second hand contract you do not have to have the system connected to the phone and you do not have to subscribe for 12 months, if you have bought the digibox outright it isnt subject to these conditions.

I know about not having to have the phone connected, but on Sky's website, the only terms and conditions of contract I could find all say that there is an initial contract of one year. Can you please provide a link to your info, as I may well sub to Sky if I can stop and start as i please. Do they still accept subs by credit card, and if so, can ne pay for say 6 months in advance?

On Topic UPDATE:

http://media.guardian.co.uk/broadcast/story/0,7493,990937,00.html

DMC

R.I.P.

http://media.guardian.co.uk/broadcast/story/0,7493,990937,00.html

irishgeo

Does that mean all FTV cards will go or just new ones. Its not very clear in the article.

DMC

Its clear in the fact that no new cards are going to be distributed, and no replacements will be issued.

And as no one is paying Sky to maintain it from now on, they will be turned off.

carrolls

basically what its saying is if your Solus card doesn't have a picture of a house on it, ITV, Channel 4 and Channel 5 are ultimately living on borrowed time. if your card does have a picture of a house, you should be ok (until BSkyB decide to change the cards again in 5 years time).
Incidentally, since the 1st of July, no more Series 2 Solus cards have been issued. So R.I.P to Solus cards is a correct statement.:(

watty

£12 each? Eh
For something that costs closer to £1

I smell a rat.

I think Sky are creating Fear Doubt and Uncertintanty (FUD) to get either UK Gov or ITV/C4/Five to pay for Solus operation because they make a *WACKING* profit out of it.

I'd imagine Sky reckon that they can't get away with disabling 2nd gen FTV cards but think they can get away with disabling 1st Gen cards..

This is Politics and Marketing of the worst kind. Not technology issues.

Only subsidised installs require phone and 1 year min.

Subscription to get a "new" card on existing box *IS* minimum one month (might in practice work out as two). So there *IS* still a route for FTV cards for Five, C4 and ITV.

Wether the effort is worth what you get to watch is down do personal taste!

Icehouse

>>>Subscription to get a "new" card on existing box *IS* minimum one month (might in practice work out as two). So there *IS* still a route for FTV cards for Five, C4 and ITV.

Watty, If that is so, can I just call them, give my box details, UK address etc. and credit card details or do they insist on direct debit?

**************************************
04/07/03 Channel Four responds to Solus card change
Channel Four has told SDO that their flagship channel will become a part of Sky's monthly package come 10th July. This comes in response to BBC's decision in going Free To Air on Sky Digital from that date onwards. Speaking to the Head of Press at Channel Four, Matt Baker, he also clarified that the channel will NOT be available to Free To Air set top boxes, which is a major blow to viewers' who do not subscribe to a Sky monthly package. The reason for this is because BBC who have been issuing the Solus viewing cards (Free To View) will stop doing so from next week, which means new viewers' who have plans to view the free channels on Sky will miss out on receiving Channel Four, Five and ITV1. Channel Four has also said that it does not have any intentions of distributing Solus cards because of the costs involved. Channel Four has no plans of following the BBC's Free To Air mode just yet, saying that they're "very happy" with how things are at the moment.
News Feed: Raj Baddhan Source: Channel Four News Break: 12:39

watty

They are very keen on Direct Debit. I heard you *CAN* use credit card.. but that may be untrue or out of date. Why not ring and ask?

jez

As regards the Channel 4 issue etc do people think that any P2 Sky Card whether ex Sub or offical FTV will continue to broadcast(ITV/C4/C5) or will those channels assume the status of ITV2.

Comments...

carrolls

Shock! Horror ! I already posted this info in one of the many existing threads on the FTV issue. Me smells pot calling kettle black seeing as you always jump on anyone who starts a new FTV thread! ;op

Apologies people for not scouring all the board to find a match before posting my thread. (which has since been closed),
But i don't accept the claim that I jump down the throat of anyone who duplicates a thread. To my recollection, I have never done this. If Icehouse can point out any instances to the conterary (well I'm 'always' doing it apparently), I will take it on the chin, otherwise an apology is in order and we can get on with proper 'on topic' discussion.

As regards the Channel 4 issue etc do people think that any P2 Sky Card whether ex Sub or offical FTV will continue to broadcast(ITV/C4/C5) or will those channels assume the status of ITV2.

I think any series 2 Solus FTV card will continue to carry Channel 4 as well as ITV and Channel 5 after July 10th. But that is just an opinion. The only one who knows for sure is the person controlling the buttons.

DMC

Right funboys, get a room or stop yer bickering.

I'm not taking sides or refereeing this, (espically searching through posts for examples) but if there is anymore here, they get a week long ban. You have been warned.

I've my ****kicking boots on today for muppetry.

jez

I suppose another factor for C4 to consider is the interactive coverage of Big Brother. If they weren't freely available on satellite they would be wasting a lot of their interactivity skills.

Also ITV is venturing into the interactive world (WWTBAM for instance). Can't imagine most ITV punters subscribing to SKy to get those features....

We await July 10 when we should finally know what the future holds... maybe...

Icehouse

Originally posted by carrolls
Apologies people for not scouring all the board to find a match before posting my thread. (which has since been closed),
But i don't accept the claim that I jump down the throat of anyone who duplicates a thread. To my recollection, I have never done this. If Icehouse can point out any instances to the conterary (well I'm 'always' doing it apparently), I will take it on the chin, otherwise an apology is in order and we can get on with proper 'on topic' discussion.

My comment was in jest Carrolls, but as you obviously weren't the person who I was thinking of you had no way of knowing - sorry - I mixed you up with someone else who has been IMHO a little quick to jump down newbies throats lately (no names this time, as I'm not and wasn't looking for trouble!)

Damo, please feel more than free to remove my original post!

watty

This is clear if depressing...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/reception/dsat_card_index.shtml


If the old "true" FTV cards are disabled in August as seems likely, it is a scandal.

A lot of one month subs to "replace them" with updated cards will occur by the more knowledgeable that want ITV/C4/Five FTV by dish.

Don't forget that in UK "Five" reception is near as bad as TV3 here for coverage.

There is no free lunch.

Expect the "grey importers" of FTV cards to be offering 2 month UK subs. (The card becomes a FTV card after)

If fact if you are on an Irish Family pack and are in the amazing conditon of getting perfect Irish TV via aerial then a permenant UK sub makes more sense (BB interactive etc).

Me, I aim to spend less on pay TV and use the money for DVDs instead.


It is a bit mean on the FTV card viewers (in UK of course) to publicise and confirm this after it is too late to ring up an claim "the dog ate the card send me a new one".

In fairness to Beeb, this is a Sky thingy and Sky have been making it up as they went along to get most advantage out of what is to Sky a disaster.

Lennoxschips

Do the new generation FTV cards give you ITV/C4/C5 on an unmarried box, like with the old ones?

DMC

BOOM!

Its all over. I'm actually shocked how quick all this has happened.

johnnyq

Originally posted by DMC
BOOM!

Its all over. I'm actually shocked how quick all this has happened.

What has happened???

I don't have a FTV card

I feel in the dark:(

DMC

Read a few threads here, and catch up, best advice.

johnnyq

I see now what is going on!

This would be an interesting time to ring the SKY MONKEYS in SCOTLAND to find out about CH4 being available in Ireland !

EKRIUQ

Now that ch4 is going subscription only on the sky system only it may be possible that we will get it in Ireland, we have every other sky subscription channel,

carrolls

Correct me if I'm wrong but.......
Old Solus card: ITV/Channel 4/Channel5 Getting switched off in August.
New Solus Card:ITV/Channel 4/Channel5 Not getting switched off until next encryption change.
Is this what I read from this ambiguous BBC Posting?

DMC

Its far from ambiguous. Its the most clear explanation of what is going on. From any source.

Channel 4 and 5 will be turned off rather soon, a matter of days, from the old cards.

aersat

Would it not be reasonable to assume that if any FTV cards are to be disabled on July 10 as widely speculated, then these viewers would at this stage be receiving an on screen message to contact their broadcaster.
I doubt if SKY would cut off the many hundreds of thousands FTV card holders in one swoop without any warning.
The phone lines would be hopping at the ITC,Sky etc...

Aersat.