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Smoke Pollution in Urban Areas

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  • 29-11-2020 2:14pm
    #1
    salonfire
    Registered Users Posts: 3,078 ✭✭✭


    Our towns and cities are destroyed with smoke from solid fuel burning stoves, ranges and fireplaces.

    On a cold, still night every second chimney has smoke billowing from it that just lingers for the night.

    Go outside and you come home stinking of smoke.

    The sale of stoves of stoves should be banned and active night-time enforcement with heavy fines for any household allowing smoke escape their chimney.


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    #2
    ted1
    Registered Users Posts: 23,279 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    salonfire wrote: »
    Our towns and cities are destroyed with smoke from solid fuel burning stoves, ranges and fireplaces.

    On a cold, still night every second chimney has smoke billowing from it that just lingers for the night.

    Go outside and you come home stinking of smoke.

    The sale of stoves of stoves should be banned and active night-time enforcement with heavy fines for any household allowing smoke escape their chimney.

    What city are you in. Very little being burnt n Dublin


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    #3
    B.A._Baracus
    Registered Users Posts: 11,173 ✭✭✭✭B.A._Baracus


    Accordingly the smoke was mental back in the day before central heating became a common thing in Ireland. I do believe that's where the name "big smoke" for Dublin came about.

    But policing people who warm themselves and their families in their own home ... You didn't think that one through did you op :p


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    #4
    1o059k7ewrqj3n
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,779 ✭✭✭1o059k7ewrqj3n


    ted1 wrote: »
    What city are you in. Very little being burnt n Dublin

    Wasn't there a ban on smoky fuels (coal etc) in Dublin in the 80s due to smog? It wasn't anything like Victorian era London but it was fairly dire at times.


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    #5
    Dubmany
    Registered Users Posts: 29 ✭Dubmany


    What made a big difference in reducing smoke levels in Dublin and other cities was the introduction of the smoky coal ban (you can burn smokeless coal instead). That ban was extended to towns over 10,000 people this September. The problem is that it hasn't fed through or isn't being enforced.


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    #6
    Graces7
    Registered Users Posts: 32,634 ✭✭✭✭Graces7


    Dubmany wrote: »
    What made a big difference in reducing smoke levels in Dublin and other cities was the introduction of the smoky coal ban (you can burn smokeless coal instead). That ban was extended to towns over 10,000 people this September. The problem is that it hasn't fed through or isn't being enforced.

    Smokeless eggs is all I can get locally out here; west mayo. and a bit of turf of course.


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    #7
    Thelonious Monk
    Registered Users Posts: 13,785 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    Haven't noticed it in Dublin, apparently it's bad in some smaller towns, Letterkenny for e.g. sometimes has worse air quality than New Delhi!

    https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-30971995.html


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    #8
    Stovepipe
    Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭Stovepipe


    On a cold, still night.....blame God(insert name of favourite deity here). He/she/it is allegedly in charge of the weather. It's called high pressure. Ask Met Eireann....


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    #9
    gozunda
    Registered Users Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    Heres the current map of Ireland re Air Quality.

    Looks like worst areas atm are Dublin and Areas in Northern Ireland along the border

    https://aqicn.org/map/ireland/

    Snapshot of current conditions


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    #10
    3d4life
    Registered Users Posts: 814 ✭✭✭3d4life


    salonfire wrote: »
    Our towns and cities are destroyed with smoke from solid fuel burning stoves, ranges and fireplaces.

    On a cold, still night every second chimney has smoke billowing from it that just lingers for the night.

    Go outside and you come home stinking of smoke.

    The sale of stoves of stoves should be banned and active night-time enforcement with heavy fines for any household allowing smoke escape their chimney.

    Exactly this

    Around here it is due to smoke from wood burning stoves.

    One local installer of same was telling me that he has 80 customers expecting him to install a stove before christmas

    There is a need for control but by who ? L.A. or EPA or other ?


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    #11
    Harry Palmr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 40,061 ✭✭✭✭Harry Palmr


    I reckon most of it is from wet wood these days.

    When the air inverts you will always get noxious fumes settling at ground level be it from vehicles, open fires/stoves or central heating.


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    #12
    LuasSimon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,208 ✭✭✭LuasSimon


    I’ll give up my fire when I get a nice social housing central heated apartment in Rathgar and I want gym membership as well !


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    #13
    Clareman
    Moderators, Sports Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators Posts: 23,924 Mod ✭✭✭✭Clareman


    Big problem is that people are burning everything not just the stuff they are buying so a lot of rubbish is being burnt which is making everything worse.


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    #14
    3d4life
    Registered Users Posts: 814 ✭✭✭3d4life


    ted1 wrote: »
    What city are you in. Very little being burnt n Dublin


    Where I am used to be rural, is now suburban due to many ( 50+ ) upmarket houses having been built nearby in the last 7 years ( A or B rated - minimal heating required )

    B.A._Baracus wrote: »
    ..But policing people who warm themselves and their families in their own home ... You didn't think that one through did you op :p

    Houses around me have elaborate heating arrangements - mostly involving heat pumps and MHRV systems. There is no need to be burning stuff to heat them

    Steyr 556 wrote: »
    Wasn't there a ban on smoky fuels (coal etc) in Dublin in the 80s due to smog? It wasn't anything like Victorian era London but it was fairly dire at times.
    Its nothing to do with smoky coal. Nearly all the stoves are burning wood.


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    #15
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,611 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    gozunda wrote: »
    Heres the current map of Ireland re Air Quality.

    Looks like worst areas atm are Dublin and Areas in Northern Ireland along the border

    https://aqicn.org/map/ireland/

    Snapshot of current conditions
    Cash for ash.


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    #16
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,427 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    Harry Palmr wrote: »
    I reckon most of it is from wet wood these days.
    This is a hell of a lot to do with it. The key is getting the burn good and hot. Wet wood or an open fire drastically reduce heat and efficiency and result in much more smoke.

    When our stove is up to temp, a passerby would be hard pressed to spot any smoke coming out of the chimney. Only seasoned hardwood used in it.


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    #17
    Harry Palmr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 40,061 ✭✭✭✭Harry Palmr


    gozunda wrote: »
    Heres the current map of Ireland re Air Quality.

    Looks like worst areas atm are Dublin and Areas in Northern Ireland along the border

    https://aqicn.org/map/ireland/

    Snapshot of current conditions

    Interesting to a point - that point being the extent of the monitoring equipment in use which seems to be mainly around greater Dublin


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    #18
    Ubbquittious
    Registered Users Posts: 6,182 ✭✭✭Ubbquittious


    Never had any problems with air quality in Ireland. Maybe the smoke lingers in some towns on a windstill day but we don't get many windstill days especially on the west coast.

    I don't know where the notion to ban stoves is coming from. Perhaps uneducated an Taisce rabble rousers. Miserable streaks of piss the lot of them


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    #19
    grassylawn
    Registered Users Posts: 489 ✭✭grassylawn


    It's generally worse in towns that are outside the areas covered by the smoky coal ban.
    Wexford and Enniscorthy are particularly bad, as I understand it, thanks to the geography combined with coal burning.


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    #20
    gourcuff
    Registered Users Posts: 295 ✭✭gourcuff


    its pretty toxic in dublin...

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/dublin-air-pollution-breaching-eu-limits-epa-warns-1.3950575#:~:text=Many%20areas%20of%20Dublin%20are,according%20to%20an%20EPA%20warning.


    especially bad when cycling when your breathing rate increases...


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    #21
    Ubbquittious
    Registered Users Posts: 6,182 ✭✭✭Ubbquittious


    3d4life wrote: »
    Where I am used to be rural, is now suburban due to many ( 50+ ) upmarket houses having been built nearby in the last 7 years ( A or B rated - minimal heating required )




    Houses around me have elaborate heating arrangements - mostly involving heat pumps and MHRV systems. There is no need to be burning stuff to heat them



    Its nothing to do with smoky coal. Nearly all the stoves are burning wood.

    Heat pumps are pretty much powered by burning gas off site.


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    #22
    Victor
    Registered Users Posts: 78,266 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    B.A._Baracus wrote: »
    Accordingly the smoke was mental back in the day before central heating became a common thing in Ireland.

    I remember back around 1987 crossing the street and I couldn't quite see the other footpath.

    However, while the smoke is less visible these days, it is much more nefarious - the small particles get further into the lungs an cause more problems.
    Ubbquittious wrote: »
    Never had any problems with air quality in Ireland. Maybe the smoke lingers in some towns on a windstill day but we don't get many windstill days especially on the west coast.
    In towns, on the east coast and during still weather it can be bad.

    I was passed by a car the other days an even though I was wearing a mask, it smelt like I was sharing a phone box with someone smoking a cigarette.


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    #23
    3d4life
    Registered Users Posts: 814 ✭✭✭3d4life


    Ubbquittious wrote: »
    Heat pumps are pretty much powered by burning gas off site.


    Well I never !


    Tell us now, how much smoke is produced when gas is burnt to produce electricity ?


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    #24
    Atlantic Dawn
    Registered Users Posts: 81,243 ✭✭✭✭Atlantic Dawn
    M


    RTE had one of those Eco Eye shows on recently and a house had €80k spent on it including getting 50% of this in grants yet included a wood burning stove in a densely populated area of Dublin, you couldn't make it up, these crooked shows encouraging these practices need to be called out...

    https://www.rte.ie/player/series/eco-eye/SI0000000494?epguid=AI000002951


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    #25
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,427 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    gourcuff wrote: »
    especially bad when cycling when your breathing rate increases...
    it's actually worse to be in a car, than on a bike or on foot. pollution levels are higher in cars typically.


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    #26
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,427 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    3d4life wrote: »
    Well I never !


    Tell us now, how much smoke is produced when gas is burnt to produce electricity ?
    have you ever seen smoke coming out of a gas boiler? burning natural gas (unless the boiler is malfunctioning) produces H20 and CO2.


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    #27
    gozunda
    Registered Users Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    Harry Palmr wrote: »
    Interesting to a point - that point being the extent of the monitoring equipment in use which seems to be mainly around greater Dublin

    Not quite. Certainly Dublin has a much higher density of population than elsewhere.

    List of Air Quality monitoring stations here - located around the country

    https://airquality.ie/stations


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    #28
    gozunda
    Registered Users Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    magicbastarder wrote: »
    have you ever seen smoke coming out of a gas boiler? burning natural gas (unless the boiler is malfunctioning) produces H20 and CO2.

    But don't heat pumps work by collecting ambient heat from soil and water? Wheres the gas come into it?


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    #29
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,427 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    i assumed the question was related to the electricity generation required to run the pumps.


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    #30
    The Tetrarch
    Registered Users Posts: 2,092 ✭✭✭The Tetrarch


    A bit of power and the Greens are running amok.


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    #31
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,427 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    why? what have they done?


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