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Get your money back from Ryanair, cancelled flights using Small Claims process

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  • 20-04-2020 6:55pm
    #1
    paddy19
    Registered Users Posts: 1,138 ✭✭✭


    If your flight is cancelled you are entitled to a cash refund in 7 days.
    Ryanair's delay until Covid-19 is abated is illegal under EU261.

    Not interested in giving Michael O'Leary an interest free loan
    where he gets to keep your money if you don't follow his crappy voucher's terms and conditions.

    Then the small claims process is the only way to get your money back from Ryanair now.
    It costs €25 which is non refundable and non claimable.

    Chargeback back doesn't work. Visa International have put all Ryanair claims on hold.

    The regulator, the Commission for Aviation Regulation expects you to wait 4 to 6 weeks before registering a claim.
    (I deliberately put them in small letters because they are so lax at protecting consumer rights.)

    The small claims process is no more difficult than creating an account on eBay or Amazon, it is designed to be simple to use. No requirement for a solicitor or legalese.

    Best part is airline must reply within 15 calendar days.
    If they don't reply you win the case.
    Ryanair normally just pay up because they know they will loose.
    If they decide to defend the case they have to retain an expensive solicitor.

    The small claims process is very straight forward:

    https://www.csol.ie/ccms/welcome.html

    1. Create an account.
    2. Open a New Case.
    3. Add Claimant (that's you) details.
    4. Add Respondent details that's either Aer Lingus or Ryanair.
    5. Add Case Details. Keep it very simple, flight cancelled, booking ref
    number, passenger names, flight details and the total cost of the complete booking.

    It's generally intuitive except they have the blue Add Claimant, Add Respondent and Edit Case Details,
    are three quarters way up the page. You if you get stuck check those buttons.

    Critical you get the airlines official titles and CRO number correct.

    CRO Number:
    9215
    Aer Lingus Limited
    Dublin Airport Dublin

    104547
    RYANAIR DESIGNATED ACTIVITY COMPANY
    RYANAIR DUBLIN OFFICE
    AIRSIDE BUSINESS PARK
    SWORDS
    CO. DUBLIN

    The register will check your claim is valid and send you an email link to pay the €25.

    You can track your claim by logging into the online account and watch the 15 day countdown!

    Unlike the airlines they even supply an email address for support sccadmin@courts.ie.

    Be great is people could let us know how they get on with the process and when they get the money!
    Tagged:


«13

Comments

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    #2
    Caranica
    Registered Users Posts: 10,012 ✭✭✭✭Caranica


    You left out that the €25 is non refundable and non claimable. SCC is a great option for flights that cost hundreds. I'm starting with the regulator tomorrow.


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    #3
    paddy19
    Registered Users Posts: 1,138 ✭✭✭paddy19


    Caranica wrote: »
    You left out that the €25 is non refundable and non claimable. SCC is a great option for flights that cost hundreds. I'm starting with the regulator tomorrow.

    Thanks for the input. I added it to my post.

    Be very interested to hear how you get on with the regulator.


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    #4
    Lex Luthor
    Registered Users Posts: 11,220 ✭✭✭✭Lex Luthor


    thanks for the detailed info on this, any chance this could be left as a sticky for a couple of months so people can see it first hand?


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    #5
    Pygmie
    Registered Users Posts: 108 ✭✭Pygmie


    I wonder if you've started the charge back process, could you still try the small claims route?


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    #6
    ted1
    Registered Users Posts: 23,270 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    So rather than waiting a few weeks and give Ryanair an interest free loan when interest rates are less than 1% you are paying 25 euro or 12.5% on a 200 euro flight ?


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    #7
    paddy19
    Registered Users Posts: 1,138 ✭✭✭paddy19


    Pygmie wrote: »
    I wonder if you've started the charge back process, could you still try the small claims route?

    Sure you can, they are two separate processes.

    I don't have any faith that chargeback is going to work from the early feedback.

    The company is obviously very solvent and offering vouchers so bankers will pass.

    I'm pretty sure they don't want to get involved in thousands of chargebacks that are probably going nowhere.

    You can Go SCC for €25 and speed or CAR for free and slow.

    CAR is the Commission for Aviation regulation

    https://secure.aviationreg.ie/eseries/uiid480261345/car450.xsp;jsessionid=86BABC6C7D85BB38FFE4A67D8D3C6682.node1


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    #8
    Pygmie
    Registered Users Posts: 108 ✭✭Pygmie


    paddy19 wrote: »
    Sure you can, they are two separate processes.

    I don't have any faith that chargeback is going to work from the early feedback.

    The company is obviously very solvent and offering vouchers so bankers will pass.

    I'm pretty sure they don't want to get involved in thousands of chargebacks that are probably going nowhere.

    You can Go SCC for €25 and speed or CAR for free and slow.

    Will give it a go! Have flights to the States that I'm trying to get refunded from Aer Lingus for 4 of us, so 25 euro is well worth it!


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    #9
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 3,656 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    paddy19 wrote: »
    Sure you can, they are two separate processes.

    I don't have any faith that chargeback is going to work from the early feedback.

    The company is obviously very solvent and offering vouchers so bankers will pass.

    I'm pretty sure they don't want to get involved in thousands of chargebacks that are probably going nowhere.

    You can Go SCC for €25 and speed or CAR for free and slow.

    What’s CAR???


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    #10
    paddy19
    Registered Users Posts: 1,138 ✭✭✭paddy19


    ted1 wrote: »
    So rather than waiting a few weeks and give Ryanair an interest free loan when interest rates are less than 1% you are paying 25 euro or 12.5% on a 200 euro flight ?

    Valid point the €25 is significant if the fare is low.

    I'm not sure about the "few weeks".... that is dependent on when MOL decides that Covid has abated.

    Could try the regulator, they are free.

    https://secure.aviationreg.ie/eseries/uiid480261345/car450.xsp;jsessionid=86BABC6C7D85BB38FFE4A67D8D3C6682.node1


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    #11
    antietam1
    Registered Users Posts: 356 ✭✭antietam1


    Got an Aer lingus flight back from Lanzarote and came home two weeks early, Ryan air who brought us out in February did nothing for us.
    Not been offered a voucher yet but have an email asking us to bear with them.
    Flew back on the 18th March was supposed to return with Ryan on the 28th of March.
    Thanks for the info.


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    #12
    JimmyVik
    Registered Users Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭JimmyVik


    Thanks. I have requested a refund from Ryanair and they said they will give it when it suits them.

    Given their treatment of customer so far during this crisis I think it more likely they will just change the rules again at a later date to prevent them giving me a refund.

    So I have initiated chargeback on my card.

    If this hasnt worked within a month I will go through the small claims court.

    So thanks for this info.


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    #13
    ted1
    Registered Users Posts: 23,270 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    paddy19 wrote: »
    Valid point the €25 is significant if the fare is low.

    I'm not sure about the "few weeks".... that is dependent on when MOL decides that Covid has abated.

    Could try the regulator, they are free.

    https://secure.aviationreg.ie/eseries/uiid480261345/car450.xsp;jsessionid=86BABC6C7D85BB38FFE4A67D8D3C6682.node1

    I tried the regulator before when Aer Lingus wouldn’t t cough up after cancelling a Business class flight 2 hours before it was due to take off. They were very very slow then. They are going to be even slower now. Especially if people are going to them about silly matters that will be resolved shortly


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    #14
    Caranica
    Registered Users Posts: 10,012 ✭✭✭✭Caranica


    Email from the regulator:

    "I am just writing to confirm that I have received your documents and have initiated the case with the airline.

    Please note that it can often take 3 months to reach an agreement with the airline. However, we will be in touch as soon as we are able to come to a conclusion."

    This is not going to be a quick solution.


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    #15
    paddy19
    Registered Users Posts: 1,138 ✭✭✭paddy19


    ted1 wrote: »
    I tried the regulator before when Aer Lingus wouldn’t t cough up after cancelling a Business class flight 2 hours before it was due to take off. They were very very slow then. They are going to be even slower now. Especially if people are going to them about silly matters that will be resolved shortly

    Covid will be "resolved shortly"..... really....

    I'm glad it's just a silly matter for you but plenty of other folk have no money coming in and need their money now,
    not when Michael O'Leary thinks they should get it.

    The SCC should be faster, the airline has to pay up or respond within 15 Days.


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    #16
    paddy19
    Registered Users Posts: 1,138 ✭✭✭paddy19


    Caranica wrote: »
    Email from the regulator:

    "I am just writing to confirm that I have received your documents and have initiated the case with the airline.

    Please note that it can often take 3 months to reach an agreement with the airline. However, we will be in touch as soon as we are able to come to a conclusion."

    This is not going to be a quick solution.

    This is a template letter to cover all eventualities.

    The cash refund claim is straight forward so they should be faster but obviously be interested to hear peoples experience.

    Small Claims should be faster the airline has to respond within 15 calendar days.


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    #17
    antietam1
    Registered Users Posts: 356 ✭✭antietam1


    paddy19 wrote: »
    Covid will be "resolved shortly"..... really....

    I'm glad it's just a silly matter for you but plenty of other folk have no money coming in and need their money now,
    not when Michael O'Leary thinks they should get it.

    How dare the airlines not give them back their money. Who the hell do they think they are that they can flout the law?

    The arrogance of the airlines knows no bounds.

    A voucher with one year validity would be of no use to me silly matter or not, I expect I will calm down and go with the best value in flights.
    Other than that I hope I never have any dealings with Ruin air.


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    #18
    JimmyVik
    Registered Users Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭JimmyVik


    When filling in that application should you explain that

    You bought a flight with your money. You didnt buy a voucher with it.
    The flight hasnt been provided. You are entitled to the money you paid for it back in cash.


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    #19
    paddy19
    Registered Users Posts: 1,138 ✭✭✭paddy19


    JimmyVik wrote: »
    When filling in that application should you explain that You bought a flight with your money. You didn't buy a voucher with it. The flight hasn't been provided. You are entitled to the money you paid for it back in cash.

    No long explanation required, the Small Claims Register in Swords is well used to dealing with Ryanair claims!

    The voucher is not relevant, it's an voluntary offer by the Ryanair, obviously not a cash refund as required by good old EU261!

    Keep it simple.
    1. Flight cancelled, requested cash refund under EU261, did not receive refund in 7 days.
    2. Flight booking code:
    3. Names on booking
    4. Flight #:
    5. Flight Date:


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    #20
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    I’m not sure that SCC will get you anywhere. Report in the guardian this morning saying ALL airlines and travel companies are intentionally breaking the law and IATA / ABTA, usually the champion of the consumer, are supporting them. If a case is bought to the SCC here, even though it’s small, it could be a precedent, so the likes of Ryanair will bring in their top lawyers and lobby the government to change the law to allow a period of time (couple of years perhaps) to pay.

    There is just no way that travel companies can pay out without going bankrupt. It sucks, but that’s just how it is.


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    #21
    Beersmith
    Registered Users Posts: 1,394 ✭✭✭Beersmith


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    I’m not sure that SCC will get you anywhere. Report in the guardian this morning saying ALL airlines and travel companies are intentionally breaking the law and IATA / ABTA, usually the champion of the consumer, are supporting them. If a case is bought to the SCC here, even though it’s small, it could be a precedent, so the likes of Ryanair will bring in their top lawyers and lobby the government to change the law to allow a period of time (couple of years perhaps) to pay.

    There is just no way that travel companies can pay out without going bankrupt. It sucks, but that’s just how it is.

    They can't retrospectively change the law though can they so they would still need to pay out as it is legal obliged to now.


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    #22
    paddy19
    Registered Users Posts: 1,138 ✭✭✭paddy19


    Beersmith wrote: »
    They can't retrospectively change the law though can they so they would still need to pay out as it is legal obliged to now.

    Sadly, they can do what the Greeks did, make all current consumer debt payable by voucher.

    They are not saying you won't be paid.

    You will be paid in cash in 12 months.

    No retrospection required.


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    #23
    paddy19
    Registered Users Posts: 1,138 ✭✭✭paddy19


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I’m not sure that SCC will get you anywhere. If a case is bought to the SCC here, even though it’s small, it could be a precedent, so the likes of Ryanair will bring in their top lawyers and lobby the government to change the law to allow a period of time (couple of years perhaps) to pay.

    There is just no way that travel companies can pay out without going bankrupt. It sucks, but that’s just how it is.

    SCC gets you a reply from the airline in 15 days or they loose the case automatically.

    Yes definitely Ryanair could fight it in SCC, no better man than MOL to get into a good scrap. But I don't think so. It's absolutely clear that he will loose in the SCC. It's as clear as day.

    Ryanair are not going bankrupt. One of the best balance sheets and cash reserves around.

    Could see him lobbying the government all right.

    Ryanair is not the poster boy for leading the charge to change legislation.

    A nice small loveable family run hotel is the PR front for changing legislation.
    Who would want to throw Johnny and Mary and their three small lovable kids out on the street for refusing to take a grand voucher.


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    #24
    JimmyVik
    Registered Users Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭JimmyVik


    paddy19 wrote: »
    SCC gets you a reply from the airline in 15 days or they loose the case automatically.

    Yes definitely Ryanair could fight it in SCC, no better man than MOL to get into a good scrap. But I don't think so. It's absolutely clear that he will loose in the SCC. It's as clear as day.

    Ryanair are not going bankrupt. One of the best balance sheets and cash reserves around.

    Could see him lobbying the government all right.

    Ryanair is not the poster boy for leading the charge to change legislation.

    A nice small loveable family run hotel is the PR front for changing legislation.
    Who would want to throw Johnny and Mary and their three small lovable kids out on the street for refusing to take a grand voucher.


    Michael has already been in touch with Shane Ross.
    Promised him a photograph with him. Now Shane Ross is going to screw the people of Ireland for that photo op.


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    #25
    Mancomb Seepgood
    Closed Accounts Posts: 417 ✭✭Mancomb Seepgood


    The information on this thread is hugely helpful, thanks to the OP.

    Just a query - when filling out the case details which District Court do you select? Is it your local court or should it be Swords (for Ryanair)?

    I received the voucher this morning so I've only got €25 to lose by following this process..


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    #26
    paddy19
    Registered Users Posts: 1,138 ✭✭✭paddy19


    Mancomb Seepgood wrote: »
    The information on this thread is hugely helpful, thanks to the OP.

    Just a query - when filling out the case details which District Court do you select? Is it your local court or should it be Swords (for Ryanair)?

    I received the voucher this morning so I've only got €25 to lose by following this process..

    The good folks in Swords District Court have the joy of processing Ryanair requests. Never boring I'd say!


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    #27
    Mancomb Seepgood
    Closed Accounts Posts: 417 ✭✭Mancomb Seepgood


    paddy19 wrote: »
    The good folks in Swords District Court have the joy of processing Ryanair requests. Never boring I'd say!


    How fortunate for them! Thanks for all your help paddy19!


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    #28
    JTMan
    Registered Users Posts: 5,537 ✭✭✭JTMan


    I just submit a small claims court action against Aer Lingus after Aer Lingus have given me the runaround and told lots of lies. Had no joy with the regulator yet nor chargeback via Revolut yet so decided to take further action.

    I got an automated email from the court service saying: "Thank you for using the Courts Service Online system. Your application has been received.We will be in contact with you via this email address in due course to let you know if your claim is appropriate for the Small Claims procedure.". They have not taken the 25 EUR off me yet.


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    #29
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    JTMan wrote: »
    I just submit a small claims court action against Aer Lingus after Aer Lingus have given me the runaround and told lots of lies. Had no joy with the regulator yet nor chargeback via Revolut yet so decided to take further action.

    I got an automated email from the court service saying: "Thank you for using the Courts Service Online system. Your application has been received.We will be in contact with you via this email address in due course to let you know if your claim is appropriate for the Small Claims procedure.". They have not taken the 25 EUR off me yet.

    I suspect that they will seek these claims not appropriate. And cite that they are awaiting legal guidance / government advice. Otherwise the SCC will be overwhelmed for months, even years, to come


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    #30
    paddy19
    Registered Users Posts: 1,138 ✭✭✭paddy19


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I suspect that they will seek these claims not appropriate. And cite that they are awaiting legal guidance / government advice. Otherwise the SCC will be overwhelmed for months, even years, to come

    SCC is a court.
    As a court they adjudicate the law.
    They don't decide what is appropriate.
    They don't ever seek government advise.

    The courts are a fully independent arm of the state.

    The small claims process is very simple.
    They don't investigate claims. They just check that respondent is properly identified and the claim has enough detail to be valid that's 2 minutes.
    They send the claim to the Airline.
    The Airline has an online account and responds through that account.

    99% of the time the airline simply pays up because if they contest the case they have to pay to be represented by an expensive solicitor.

    No reason why it can't handle thousands of cases.

    Cancelled flights are a no briner EU261 is clear as day.


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    #31
    paddy19
    Registered Users Posts: 1,138 ✭✭✭paddy19


    JTMan wrote: »
    I just submit a small claims court action against Aer Lingus after Aer Lingus have given me the runaround and told lots of lies. Had no joy with the regulator yet nor chargeback via Revolut yet so decided to take further action.

    I got an automated email from the court service saying: "Thank you for using the Courts Service Online system. Your application has been received.We will be in contact with you via this email address in due course to let you know if your claim is appropriate for the Small Claims procedure.". They have not taken the 25 EUR off me yet.

    Next step the claim is validated and you'll be asked to pay!


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