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What should be the Churches response to Covid19 See Mod Warning in post 1

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  • 15-03-2020 6:41pm
    #1
    uck51js9zml2yt
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,268 ✭✭✭✭


    It surprised me that the Christians have had nothing to say about Covid 19.

    What's going on?

    I've been reading, praying, meeting with the Saints and we've been seeking the mind of God in this matter.

    We met together this morning, albeit in reduced numbers. We kept the kids at home and as a result some of the adults.
    We streamed the meeting to include those who are part of us worldwide in what God was saying. We need to be sensible in these things.

    It seems Gods been speaking to a number of us individually that this is from His Hand and is His judgement on the nation's.
    Those who've dismissed God, saying He doesn't exist or if He does, we'll ignore His statutes anyway.

    This is an opportunity for people to repent and turn back to God. Some will, many won't and will pass up this opportunity. We'll probably get a vaccine and claim how wonderful mankind is but God won't be mocked.
    This is His kindness and His opportunity for repentance and a turning back to Him.

    People are in fear and people are fearing other people's fear (Isaiah 8) but we who know Him need to return to Him, allow God be God in our lives and trust Him. We have a message of hope to a world that has lost control and fearing death.

    Psalm 31 refers to us being in a city under siege but yet God extends His loving kindness

    He says " O love the LORD, all ye his saints: for the LORD preserveth the faithful, and plentifully rewardeth the proud doer.
    Be of good courage, and he shall strengthen your heart, all ye that hope in the LORD"

    This thread is not a debate with those who don't believe in God. His existence isn't up for debate. You're response however is. But it's primarily for those who love the Lord and serve Him.
    It's not a theological debate.

    What's God saying in the the Church of the Redeemed Ones? To those who love Him and His appearing.
    If He's not saying anything to you, then maybe you need to re-evaluate your relationship with God.
    I speak to my children, God is no different, if we have ears.

    I'm encouraged. God's hand is in this. He has allowed it. It wouldn't have happened if He hadn't. He's still sitting on His throne. He's still in control.

    Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right. Will He find any righteous?



    Mod Warning: All Covid discussion is limited to this thread and the other specific threads here listed in the Coronavirus directory. Any promotion of illegal activities, or soapboxing, will result in sanctions.


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    #2
    Leroy42
    Registered Users Posts: 15,482 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    So is this like HIV? Or babies that die?

    Your God is certainly a vengeful thing. And why no give the people a warning?

    The deal was, I thought, follow his path or go to hell. The rules seemed to have changed to now judgement can arrive at any time.

    But wait a minute. Doesn't this fundamentally go against the whole idea of free will? If god is 8indeed able to introduce this virus in order to get people to refocus on him, why didn't he do something similar for,saying, the Nazi's?

    You really mean to tell me you and a group of Christians sat around to talk about a global pandemic, and your conclusion was that it was the peoples own fault?

    To believe any of that you have to ignore pretty much all your other beliefs in God.

    In terms of what the church should do, which you appear not to have any ideas on, the church should use it considerable resources to help in the fight.

    Care for the sick, reach out to those left isolated, open up the properties to care for those left stranded.

    Use their far reaching pulpit to get the right message out, the message of the experts. Help those left in hardship, through organising food banks, sourcing essentials like toilet paper, children's medicine.

    Check on those left isolated to see if they need help. Be a source of compassion and empathy.


    Maybe stay away from the smug, 'it's your own fault and my God is more powerful than yours' would be a start


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    #3
    endacl
    Registered Users Posts: 22,233 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    wbMnKM5iWzJF.gif


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    #4
    NIMAN
    Registered Users Posts: 32,993 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    Once they removed the so-called Holy Water I knew it was all a scam.
    Surely Holy Water wouldn't allow the spread of the virus!!


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    #5
    uck51js9zml2yt
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,268 ✭✭✭✭uck51js9zml2yt


    Leroy42 wrote: »
    So is this like HIV? Or babies that die?

    Your God is certainly a vengeful thing. And why no give the people a warning?

    The deal was, I thought, follow his path or go to hell. The rules seemed to have changed to now judgement can arrive at any time.

    But wait a minute. Doesn't this fundamentally go against the whole idea of free will? If god is 8indeed able to introduce this virus in order to get people to refocus on him, why didn't he do something similar for,saying, the Nazi's?

    You really mean to tell me you and a group of Christians sat around to talk about a global pandemic, and your conclusion was that it was the peoples own fault?

    To believe any of that you have to ignore pretty much all your other beliefs in God.

    In terms of what the church should do, which you appear not to have any ideas on, the church should use it considerable resources to help in the fight.

    Care for the sick, reach out to those left isolated, open up the properties to care for those left stranded.

    Use their far reaching pulpit to get the right message out, the message of the experts. Help those left in hardship, through organising food banks, sourcing essentials like toilet paper, children's medicine.

    Check on those left isolated to see if they need help. Be a source of compassion and empathy.


    Maybe stay away from the smug, 'it's your own fault and my God is more powerful than yours' would be a start

    If you want to discuss social issues, there are more suitable threads elsewhere on boards.


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    #6
    eviltwin
    Registered Users Posts: 17,495 ✭✭✭✭eviltwin


    People will thank science because ultimately it will be science that solves this. All the praying in the world won't change that.


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    #7
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,708 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    Mod warning: @NIMAN and @endacl, please keep it constructive and on-topic noting that this is not the forum to have a go at the faithful. Thanks for your attention.


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    #8
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,708 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    Reid Repulsive Gristle wrote: »
    We met together this morning, albeit in reduced numbers. We kept the kids at home and as a result some of the adults.

    In my opinion the churches response should be responsible and encourage social distancing and that meetings such as the above should be done over skype or similar. Possibly worth keeping in mind that in this country the elderly make up a large part of the demographic that are regular church goers and are a high risk group.

    As per Leroy43's post, I think what most good people are doing at this point is looking to see how they can help out with those at risk in their own communities.


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    #9
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,708 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    eviltwin wrote: »
    People will thank science because ultimately it will be science that solves this. All the praying in the world won't change that.

    Not only science though. Individual and collective responsibility as part of a cohesive and compassionate society also plays a vital role here.


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    #10
    ruwithme
    Registered Users Posts: 1,183 ✭✭✭ruwithme


    Atheists hanging around the Christianity forum! Strange thing to say the least

    i suppose idle hands are the devil's playthings.
    Enjoy


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    #11
    uck51js9zml2yt
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,268 ✭✭✭✭uck51js9zml2yt


    smacl wrote: »
    In my opinion the churches response should be responsible and encourage social distancing and that meetings such as the above should be done over skype or similar. Possibly worth keeping in mind that in this country the elderly make up a large part of the demographic that are regular church goers and are a high risk group.

    As per Leroy43's post, I think what most good people are doing at this point is looking to see how they can help out with those at risk in their own communities.

    While we can assist socially, our primary response I would believe should be towards God.
    If this is indeed His Judgement on a people who have rejected Him then there needs to be an appropriate response to Him.

    We are talking about many thousands passing Into another phase of eternity without Him.

    I know a lot of people think " The Church" is a particular denomination. Scripture refers to The Church as those who are His and who have been Redeemed by Him and know Him.


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    #12
    Mancomb Seepgood
    Closed Accounts Posts: 417 ✭✭Mancomb Seepgood


    smacl wrote: »
    In my opinion the churches response should be responsible and encourage social distancing and that meetings such as the above should be done over skype or similar. Possibly worth keeping in mind that in this country the elderly make up a large part of the demographic that are regular church goers and are a high risk group.

    As per Leroy43's post, I think what most good people are doing at this point is looking to see how they can help out with those at risk in their own communities.

    This. And to be fair,churches have by and large been behaving responsibly in moving services online and implementing social distancing measures. I know it's difficult for a lot of people, particularly the older generation for whom attending services has been part of the daily/weekly rhythm of their lives for decades.

    I know this has been a reminder to me to pray for leaders,scientists,medial professionals,the suffering and the lonely. It's difficult to find meaning in these things but I'm extremely wary of interpretations that make this out to be some sort of divine punishment on humanity, that's getting into Westboro Baptist Church territory and reduces God to a bungling serial killer.


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    #13
    uck51js9zml2yt
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,268 ✭✭✭✭uck51js9zml2yt


    Mancomb Seepgood wrote: »
    This. And to be fair,churches have by and large been behaving responsibly in moving services online and implementing social distancing measures. I know it's difficult for a lot of people, particularly the older generation for whom attending services has been part of the daily/weekly rhythm of their lives for decades.

    I know this has been a reminder to me to pray for leaders,scientists,medial professionals,the suffering and the lonely. It's difficult to find meaning in these things but I'm extremely wary of interpretations that make this out to be some sort of divine punishment on humanity, that's getting into Westboro Baptist Church territory and reduces God to a bungling serial killer.

    The Bible has many references to God punishing humanity. What's your point?

    But since my question was regards what's God saying to the Churches, your post has no relevance to the OP.


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    #14
    Nick Park
    Registered Users Posts: 1,573 ✭✭✭Nick Park


    https://eaiseanchai.wordpress.com/2020/03/13/response-to-escalation-of-coronavirus-crisis-covid-19-and-the-local-church/

    Following up on this. Today, I shared in our online church service that perfect love casts out fear (1 John 4:18)

    Fear-based responses harm others and will hinder the fight against the coronavirus. Think of panic buying - forcing the more vulnerable elderly people to go from shop to shop to find their basic necessities, and thereby increasing their exposure to risk. Or think of those in locked-down areas trying to flee, and spreading the virus into other regions.

    Love-based responses protect others. That is why our church has cancelled all our meetings and gatherings, not just the ones with more than 100 people. We love people too much to provide an environment where we might cause transmission of the virus.

    Love, not fear, will overcome the coronavirus. We need to practice social responsibility, and reduce panic. The church, in my opinion, has a huge role to play in this.


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    #15
    Leroy42
    Registered Users Posts: 15,482 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    Reid Repulsive Gristle wrote: »
    If you want to discuss social issues, there are more suitable threads elsewhere on boards.

    You asked what the church should do. If you meant purely from a selfish point if view tiy should have been clearer.

    So, about thatcqhike free will thingy. You think god has actually done this to punish the world? So are scientists working on a cure going against God?

    Are Christians immune from the virus if they really believe and can we take it that anyone that contracts is thus not a true believer?

    And when this new rule come in? Not 9only are we judged after death but now apparently even whilst alive.

    What if I contract it but then turn to God, will I be cured?

    So many questions. And of course you will have no actual answers because you haven't thought about the contradictory position you have put yourself in. You are in such a rush to use this as a proof of your god that you don't even worry that it actually does the opposite.

    And maybe you should be more concerned about social issues, you know your fellow man, than sitting around agreeing with your mates that you are the special ones.


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    #16
    uck51js9zml2yt
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,268 ✭✭✭✭uck51js9zml2yt


    Leroy, I asked a question in my OP.

    Looks like God's saying nothing to the Churches whose members come on here.

    Social responsibility in the face of Covid 19 is a whole different issue. Feel free to start your own thread in the subject.

    You've spent years on this sub forum arguing about Christianity. Your only interest in Christianity is to put it down.
    I've no interest in debating it with you.


    @Nick, it's grand saying Love casts out fear, and it does, but people need to come into relationship with Him who is Love first otherwise it's unattainable and unknowable.


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    #17
    hinault
    Registered Users Posts: 5,932 ✭✭✭hinault


    I see the thread title on the front page.

    There is only one Church, namely the Catholic Church.
    There aren't Churches.


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    #18
    Die Hard 2019
    Closed Accounts Posts: 362 ✭✭Die Hard 2019


    hinault wrote: »
    I see the thread title on the front page.

    There is only one Church, namely the Catholic Church.
    There aren't Churches.

    What about the Church of Ireland?


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    #19
    uck51js9zml2yt
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,268 ✭✭✭✭uck51js9zml2yt


    hinault wrote: »
    I see the thread title on the front page.

    There is only one Church, namely the Catholic Church.
    There aren't Churches.

    And yet Revelation refers to churches.

    Agreed, there is only one Catholic Church, ....but that's a different debate for a different thread


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    #20
    uck51js9zml2yt
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,268 ✭✭✭✭uck51js9zml2yt


    Die Hard 2019 wrote: »
    What about the Church of Ireland?

    My post refers to those who belong to the Church of Jesus Christ. The church of the firstborn.
    We all know hinaults view on the ",true"church. It has no place in my OP.

    I'll report anyone who derails the thread.


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    #21
    Peregrinus
    Registered Users Posts: 26,056 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    Reid Repulsive Gristle wrote: »
    Leroy, I asked a question in my OP.

    Looks like God's saying nothing to the Churches whose members come on here.

    Social responsibility in the face of Covid 19 is a whole different issue . . .
    Maybe it's not a whole different issue, though. Maybe it's right at the heart of what God is saying to us.

    I note that:
    Reid Repulsive Gristle wrote: »
    . . . Gods been speaking to a number of us individually that this is from His Hand and is His judgement on the nation's . . .
    Is He also saying that social responsibility is a whole different issue, or are you just assuming that His judgment has nothing to do with social responsibility?


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    #22
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,708 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    Reid Repulsive Gristle wrote: »
    I'll report anyone who derails the thread.

    Mod warning: Please do not threaten other posters in this manner. Report as you see fit anything you feel is in breach of the forum charter. Leave other moderation to the moderators. Thanks for your attention.


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    #23
    nthclare
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,316 ✭✭✭nthclare


    I think any response from the church to a crisis is going to be in line with the response of any organisation, be it satanic gatherings, pagan gatherings, schools, clubs, yoga, drama societies and so on.

    There's nothing really anything the church can do other than the obvious.


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    #24
    theological
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,831 ✭✭✭theological


    I went to church yesterday happily. The attendance was only slightly diminished. I intend to keep doing so. I'm working remotely during the week with limited exposure to the public so I'm pretty low risk.

    Obviously those who are ill should stay at home but at the moment I see no reason why we shouldn't go as normal yet. In the coming weeks it looks like over 70s may go into isolation in the UK. I'd like to think about how I could help when that happens by offering to bring food.

    Our vicar did a good kids talk on how God is our rock in times of panic and how we ought to love our neighbours by not thinking only of self in panic buying but how we should love and consider the needs of others.

    At times like this we need to be reaching out to God in prayer together. I respect other Christians who disagree. The Irish advice is also different to the UK advice. The limit on 100 in Ireland limits a lot of churches.


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    #25
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,708 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    nthclare wrote: »
    I think any response from the church to a crisis is going to be in line with the response of any organisation, be it satanic gatherings, pagan gatherings, schools, clubs, yoga, drama societies and so on.

    There's nothing really anything the church can do other than the obvious.

    I don't think the larger church(es) can reasonably be compared to relatively tiny minority faith groups, as the much larger organisations wield significant influence over their large membership. A church with membership in the tens or hundreds of thousands telling its membership to practise their beliefs from home via streamed service has a positive effect on broader society through social distancing. Conversely, a church that remains open and encourages groups to convene indoors has the opposite negative effect. Schools don't have that option as they've been mandated to close. Most other smaller groupings are taking the responsible decision to do this themselves before being told to do so. No idea what the satanists and pagans are at but any yoga and drama classes I'm aware of have stopped for now and some are also going online.


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    #26
    uck51js9zml2yt
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,268 ✭✭✭✭uck51js9zml2yt


    So none of the Churches are hearing from God on the subject and it's all been reduced to nice sermons and social distancing and social responsibility(which are good things) but it's nothing different to what the unbelievers are doing so doesn't differentiate the Redeemed Ones from anyone else. They being the ones who should be hearing from the Throne.

    It feels like 2kings 6. Those who should be able to see, can't.

    Anyway, it seems the atheists have more to say in the Christianity forum than the Christians so I'll leave it to them and make my exit.


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    #27
    Peregrinus
    Registered Users Posts: 26,056 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    That seems a bit presumptuous, Tat. Your perception, and that of those who think like you, about what you are hearing from God is authentic and reliable, but if others perceive themselves to be hearing something from God that doesn't align with your expectations that is inauthentic and wrong and they are not hearing from God at all?

    Have you considered the possibility that God's purpose here might not be limited to "differentiating Redeemed Ones from anyone else", and indeed might not include that at all? That others might, in fact, be discerning His purpose as faithfully as, or more faithfully than, you?


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    #28
    biko
    Registered Users Posts: 81,223 ✭✭✭✭biko


    hinault wrote: »
    I see the thread title on the front page.

    There is only one Church, namely the Catholic Church.
    There aren't Churches.
    OP can't spell "Church's"


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    #29
    Nick Park
    Registered Users Posts: 1,573 ✭✭✭Nick Park


    Reid Repulsive Gristle wrote: »
    So none of the Churches are hearing from God on the subject

    Not at all. The churches are hearing from God on the subject, but what they are hearing is not the apocalyptic stuff some would like them to be hearing.

    I believe the message of social responsibility, and the necessity of faith and love rather than fear, is very much a message of God.

    Btw, a number of churches are asking their members to set aside times for prayer in their homes tomorrow (St Patrick's Day). The message is that what is often seen as a 'Big Day Out' should become a 'Big Day In' and that prayer is a powerful weapon against coronavirus.


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    #30
    Salary Negotiator
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,148 ✭✭✭Salary Negotiator


    If this is god’s judgement then it seems awful cuńtish to target the elderly and infirm.


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    #31
    nthclare
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,316 ✭✭✭nthclare


    Salary Negotiator wrote: »
    If this is god’s judgement then it seems awful cuńtish to target the elderly and infirm.

    That's why I don't believe in the Abrahamic god as a savior, if you're spiritual or leaning that way paganism and atheism is more practical and comforting in times of crisis.

    Because we don't have to think about being saved or what will happen to us when we die.

    An atheist accepts they'll fade into oblivion, pagans have a different idea.

    But Christians have a lot more fear especially catholics they worry about judgement and pearly gates.

    They should give themselves more slack.

    We're all in this together :)


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