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So what happened at this years Eng Soc Mystery tour?

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    #62
    x43r0
    Registered Users Posts: 4,277 ✭✭✭x43r0


    Welcome to Boards

    You put forward a well spoken argument. I only have a problem with the below quote
    BCox wrote: »
    As for the report, the guild should never have published the report and the fact that they did it so openly on facebook shows a serious lack of common sense. This should have always been a behind-closed-doors situation. The open publication of the report and the clear over-reaction to it now result in yet more bad publicity for UCC, in the form of todays Echo frontpage.


    Having worked on the Guild for two years, I would say one of the top complaints they get is lack of transparency. When student money is being handled, people always scream for transparency and clean records, and the Guild has been making steps to provide this historically.

    I would put the publication of the report down to this factor rather lack of common sense.


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    #63
    BCox
    Registered Users Posts: 8 ✭BCox


    x43r0 wrote: »
    Having worked on the Guild for two years, I would say one of the top complaints they get is lack of transparency. When student money is being handled, people always scream for transparency and clean records, and the Guild has been making steps to provide this historically.

    I would put the publication of the report down to this factor rather lack of common sense.

    If that is the case then the guild ultimately had two choices. Face complaints about lack of transparency while keeping this whole situation a private matter. Or publish the report and face complaints from the myriad of concerned housewives reading yesterdays Echo. Not only that but also landing the university in yet more hot water over their students behaving "like animals", to quote the report. I stand by my initial point that the publication of the report lacked common sense. I'd also like to add that it lacked a serious amount of foresight. Through the guild's actions, this blemish against the university's reputation has turned into something much greater and it baffles me that nobody had the sense to predict it.


    Today, The Irish Examiner, a national paper, covered the story. Complaints about lack of transparency would be a whole lot easier for the university at this stage.


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    #64
    keepkeyyellow
    Registered Users Posts: 705 ✭✭✭keepkeyyellow


    BCox wrote: »

    If the university doesn't want any more attention for the behaviour of its students then why are they are letting their own paper publish hyperbolic stories about an event that happened almost a month ago? I have no doubt that the publication in the Express led to the Echo covering the story. It seems as though we are really flogging a dead horse.

    The UCC Express has editorial independence from the college and the union and therefore can publish whatever the hell they like. How dare you suggest starving the paper of their only real news story for the whole year....


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    #65
    rebel girl 15
    Registered Users, Moderators, Education Moderators, Sports Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 15,247 Mod ✭✭✭✭rebel girl 15


    BCox wrote: »
    If that is the case then the guild ultimately had two choices. Face complaints about lack of transparency while keeping this whole situation a private matter. Or publish the report and face complaints from the myriad of concerned housewives reading yesterdays Echo. Not only that but also landing the university in yet more hot water over their students behaving "like animals", to quote the report. I stand by my initial point that the publication of the report lacked common sense. I'd also like to add that it lacked a serious amount of foresight. Through the guild's actions, this blemish against the university's reputation has turned into something much greater and it baffles me that nobody had the sense to predict it.


    Today, The Irish Examiner, a national paper, covered the story. Complaints about lack of transparency would be a whole lot easier for the university at this stage.

    As far as I'm concerned the more papers that publish it the better, it might shame the college into putting sanctions on students that act like that at any event that is under the UCC umbrella. Some of action towards the safety officers can be considered assault - and students should have been charged, I don't care if drink was involved or not. I'm delighted to see it on the front page of the Echo and in the Examiner - and if you had read the Echo yesterday, you would have seen where the Echo journalist read the report, and it wasn't in the Express. And it is not at all surprising to me that the Examiner picked it up, given that the two papers are in the same building!

    As for the same sorts of things happening outside Hillbillys on a night out - its not relevant, this happened on a UCC society mystery tour, not on a night out

    Just be careful of your tone when posting here please, I for one take offense at your statement "myriad of concerned housewives reading yesterdays Echo" as I buy the Echo most days - so please watch what you post


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    #66
    rebel girl 15
    Registered Users, Moderators, Education Moderators, Sports Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 15,247 Mod ✭✭✭✭rebel girl 15


    keepkeyyellow wrote: »
    The UCC Express has editorial independence from the college and the union and therefore can publish whatever the hell they like. How dare you suggest starving the paper of their only real news story for the whole year....

    I can tell you now it wasn't - having read the article in question, the Echo sourced the report from "an online discussion forum"


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    #67
    BCox
    Registered Users Posts: 8 ✭BCox


    rebel girl 15 wrote: »
    As far as I'm concerned the more papers that publish it the better, it might shame the college into putting sanctions on students that act like that at any event that is under the UCC umbrella. Some of action towards the safety officers can be considered assault - and students should have been charged, I don't care if drink was involved or not. I'm delighted to see it on the front page of the Echo and in the Examiner - and if you had read the Echo yesterday, you would have seen where the Echo journalist read the report, and it wasn't in the Express. And it is not at all surprising to me that the Examiner picked it up, given that the two papers are in the same building!

    So you are happy that your college is making into national papers for all the wrong reasons? A more tarnished reputation, the better as long as students are reprimanded for their actions? Well, from day one, plans were in place to discipline the students involved. And as far as I'm aware, the students have already been sanctioned, or have at least been given dates for disciplinary hearings. A front page on the Echo wasn't needed to "shame" the college into doing so. The college doesn't need, nor want, this type of publicity so your delight in it is surprising and, frankly, shocking.

    As for the Examiner's coverage; just because the Echo covers a story, doesn't mean the Examiner does. The story itself is hardly news worthy to begin with. And I can confidently say that had the Express not covered the story, I doubt the Echo would have. Which again brings up why the report was ever even published in the first place.

    rebel girl 15 wrote: »
    As for the same sorts of things happening outside Hillbillys on a night out - its not relevant, this happened on a UCC society mystery tour, not on a night out

    It's entirely relevant to my argument. Some or all of these things happen on most UCC events such as mystery tours. As I've said, the report paints a pretty standard picture of student excess. It's unfortunate but true. There's nothing extraordinary about the report. I've witnessed fighting, spitting, indecent exposure and all other types of this carry on at UCC events. From balls right down to quiz nights. It's terrible, yes. Is it acceptable? Of course not. Will it continue into the future? I have no doubt that it will. The huge fiasco at the moment is completely unnecessary and things are being completely blown out of proportion.
    rebel girl 15 wrote: »
    Just be careful of your tone when posting here please, I for one take offense at your statement "myriad of concerned housewives reading yesterdays Echo" as I buy the Echo most days - so please watch what you post

    I don't get what you mean.


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    #68
    Cian92
    Registered Users Posts: 827 ✭✭✭Cian92


    BCox wrote: »
    The open publication of the report and the clear over-reaction to it now result in yet more bad publicity for UCC, in the form of todays Echo frontpage.

    I wouldn't worry about it being on the Echo too much, a newspaper with so many spelling mistakes can't do much damage.


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    #69
    Schorpio
    Registered Users Posts: 1,227 ✭✭✭Schorpio


    I don't think BCox meant to offend Echo readers when he said ""myriad of concerned housewives reading yesterdays Echo"....I think he mearly meant that UCC will now be contacted by disgusted parents who will demand sanctions be put in place when in actual fact it's some of their children causing the problem.

    But otherwise I completely agree with BCox. The story really isn't newsworthy. Let alone front page newsworthy - especially given the amount of time that has passed. Had no report been circulated there would be no media attention. Fact. The general consensus seems to be that last years engineering mystery tour was worse but there was no report and UCC's reputation wasn't dragged through the dirt.

    The story was always going to make the front of the express. One of the safety officers who contributed to the report once held a prominent post for the Express.

    I also don't like the way the story is being reported by all outlets. Everyone is treating this report as is it's a fair and unbiased perspective on what happened - like it or not, it isn't! It was written by people directly involved. Nobody from EngSoc has written their side of the story - and when the Echo contacted the bar owner. he said that the students were well behaved!


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    #70
    J.M
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1 ✭J.M


    I completely agree with everything BCox has said. Rebelgirl, the Echo did source the report from "an online discussion forum" but its safe to assume the article in the express brought the incident to their attention. The express didn't print the report, they merely printed quotes from the report so of course the Echo could only have gotten the complete report elsewhere! People are not debating where they got the report, but how they knew of its existence in the first place.

    As BCox stated disciplinary proceedings were in motion before the UCC express published the story so they obviously had no effect in UCC's decision to follow up the matter. Quite why you want national papers to shame your college is a mystery. Nothing positive has been achieved by papers reporting this story. A journalist in the express may be satisfied he has made a name for himself, even if he doesn't care it is at the expense of UCC's reputation. Yes the incidents on the tour should never have happened but the college was dealing with this internally. I repeat nothing positive has come from the publication of the story in the papers.


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    #71
    rebel girl 15
    Registered Users, Moderators, Education Moderators, Sports Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 15,247 Mod ✭✭✭✭rebel girl 15


    Schorpio wrote: »
    I also don't like the way the story is being reported by all outlets. Everyone is treating this report as is it's a fair and unbiased perspective on what happened - like it or not, it isn't! It was written by people directly involved. Nobody from EngSoc has written their side of the story - and when the Echo contacted the bar owner. he said that the students were well behaved!

    UCC spokesperson was contacted and gave a quote on the record - very simply if they didn't want disgusted parents contacting the college, a very simple line of "there is an investigation ongoing and there will be serious sanctions for the students involved" solves that and also saves the reputation of the college. It looks now like its a coverup by the college imo by just saying there is an investigation ongoing. And for complete transparancy, I'd like to know what sanctions are put in place for those students.

    I'd like to know BCox, how you know that there are sanctions in place for those students - if you prefer not to post it on here, please PM me. I can understand where you are coming from, but I think this sort of disgraceful behaviour by students is more and more being classed as "normal" which it most certainly shouldn't be, but that is a discussion for another thread!


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    #72
    Knifey Spoony
    Registered Users Posts: 1,557 ✭✭✭Knifey Spoony


    rebel girl 15 wrote: »
    I'd like to know BCox, how you know that there are sanctions in place for those students

    If it is any use, I know that there are sanctions being put in place for some students. From what I have heard, the guards seem to have taken student cards off some of the people messing on the buses and these people had been contacted before The Express published the story last week. But, I have no idea how these people are going to be punished.

    On a side note, the Eng Ball was meant to be last Thursday and it isn't looking good for something else being organised. Just kinda sad that in our final year we won't have our own ball to remember :(.


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    #73
    rebel girl 15
    Registered Users, Moderators, Education Moderators, Sports Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 15,247 Mod ✭✭✭✭rebel girl 15


    Knifey Spoony wrote: »
    If it is any use, I know that there are sanctions being put in place for some students. From what I have heard, the guards seem to have taken student cards off some of the people messing on the buses and these people had been contacted before The Express published the story last week. But, I have no idea how these people are going to be punished.

    On a side note, the Eng Ball was meant to be last Thursday and it isn't looking good for something else being organised. Just kinda sad that in our final year we won't have our own ball to remember :(.

    Why the UCC spokesperson couldn't have said that still baffles me - its a unfortunate situation for you and the rest of your classmates that you won't have a final year ball


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