Ulster vs. Leinster, Saturday 6th March, 19.35 (Eir Sport 1)

molloyjh · 05-03-2021 2:34pm

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Why don't we wait and see how the game goes, before we clutch our pearls too tight?

You're right about us not missing many players - only McGrath, Herring, Carter, Henderson, Burns, Marshall and Addison that would improve the team.

I dont really think it's pearl clutching at all. No team missing that many players should be winning against half decent opposition. Glasgow are rubbish at the moment but gave us a fright with 14 men. We needed a 2 man advantage to finally close that game out. And Ulster are a better side than Glasgow by a distance, and are certainly more than half-decent opposition.

To be clear, I think Ulster will win. I dont really expect Leinster to at all. I'm more addressing the bookies spread that has Leinster as favourites. We shouldn't be against this Ulster side IMO. It just boggles my mind a bit that we are.

EDIT: And the point wasn't about player development either btw. It was more of a general point about overall competitiveness.

Paul Smeenus · 05-03-2021 2:36pm

bayern wrote: »

Great to see. Shame last week wasn't streamed last tomorrows game.

Yeah - given all the bright eyed, bushy-tailed tech start-ups in Dublin, you'd have thought they could find someone to stream it, but apparently not.

Maybe this lack of interest in A rugby in the Southern capital explains some things.

Paul Smeenus · 05-03-2021 2:38pm

molloyjh wrote: »

I dont really think it's pearl clutching at all. No team missing that many players should be winning against half decent opposition. Glasgow are rubbish at the moment but gave us a fright with 14 men. We needed a 2 man advantage to finally close that game out. And Ulster are a better side than Glasgow by a distance, and are certainly more than half-decent opposition.

To be clear, I think Ulster will win. I dont really expect Leinster to at all. I'm more addressing the bookies spread that has Leinster as favourites. We shouldn't be against this Ulster side IMO. It just boggles my mind a bit that we are.

EDIT: And the point wasn't about player development either btw. It was more of a general point about overall competitiveness.

Bookies gonna book-make. And yeah, the "cyborgs" comment, while pithy, wasn't mine.

bilston · 05-03-2021 2:40pm

Clegg wrote: »

I think we've already seen that there are, or at least hadls been, serious problems with player development in Ireland. Munster haven't developed a home grown starter in almost 10 years. Seems to be improving now but a decade is a long time to go without developing a genuine talent.

Ulster have been a bit better with Stockdale coming through more recently. Although that's just one player too. Lots of talent in their squad, but I'm unsure if they're better than whose currently with Ireland. Probably not tbh.

Ah I think there are a few guys who should be considered by Ireland Clegg.

I think Robert Baloucoune could win a lot of caps. He is a very good finisher and seems to have added a bit of bulk during his rehab, but his defensive nous is really encouraging. I think a year on the 7s circuit has really helped him. But for injury he would probably already be capped.

Tom O'Toole is top class away from the scrum. If he continues to improve at the scrum he could be very good.

Michael Lowry is definitely talented enough, but is he big enough, there is only one way to find out. He has been the difference maker for Ulster on quite a few occasions now, both in the Pro 14 and importantly in Europe. He has ran both Toulouse and Racing ragged in the last couple of years. Without wanting to sound like a bitter Ulster fan, if he was from Leinster or Munster there would be pretty loud calls for his inclusion IMO.

Those are the three young Ulster players who I think could break into the squad in the short term. O'Toole is already there obviously.

bilston · 05-03-2021 2:41pm

molloyjh wrote: »

If Ulster can't beat this Leinster team then not only does Ulster Rugby have problems, but so does Irish rugby. It absolutely shouldn't be the case that a province missing 28+ players can go away from home and win against another province unless that province is badly hit by absences as well. My (limited) knowledge of Ulster would suggest several guys missing, but no more than that. Would that be fair?

Leinster might be missing loads of players, but they still have more internationals on show tomorrow than Ulster.

molloyjh · 05-03-2021 2:41pm

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Bookies gonna book-make. And yeah, the "cyborgs" comment, while pithy, wasn't mine.

Yeah, there were just a couple of comments on development after the post so figured I needed to clarify. I love watching Leinster win and all that but I don't want us to be so dominant that we can still win interpros missing almost 2 full starting teams. That wouldn't be good for Ireland or the other provinces. And I do care a little about the other provinces too!

bilston · 05-03-2021 2:44pm

molloyjh wrote: »

Yeah, there were just a couple of comments on development after the post so figured I needed to clarify. I love watching Leinster win and all that but I don't want us to be so dominant that we can still win interpros missing almost 2 full starting teams. That wouldn't be good for Ireland or the other provinces. And I do care a little about the other provinces too!

I genuinely wonder about that sometimes. I'm not even joking when I asked whether it gets a bit boring being a Leinster fan watching them play in the Pro 14?

Ulster ironically have won as many games this season in the league, but i feels like there is more jeopardy when Ulster play. With Leinster, you just know they're going to win. Its not even close. I think that might get a bit boring after a while.

Paul Smeenus · 05-03-2021 2:49pm

If Leinster and Ulster finished the league on the same points, and Ulster have won one game more than Leinster, would we get the final?

Paul Smeenus · 05-03-2021 2:52pm

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

If Leinster and Ulster finished the league on the same points, and Ulster have won one game more than Leinster, would we get the final?

Just checked - it would. Hmmm...

molloyjh · 05-03-2021 2:53pm

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

If Leinster and Ulster finished the league on the same points, and Ulster have won one game more than Leinster, would we get the final?

Yep. It's points, then games won, then PD, then tries scored, points scored, try difference, suspensions, yellow cards, coin toss.

molloyjh · 05-03-2021 2:58pm

bilston wrote: »

I genuinely wonder about that sometimes. I'm not even joking when I asked whether it gets a bit boring being a Leinster fan watching them play in the Pro 14?

Ulster ironically have won as many games this season in the league, but i feels like there is more jeopardy when Ulster play. With Leinster, you just know they're going to win. Its not even close. I think that might get a bit boring after a while.

I think because we end up seeing so many young lads come through, we have something to enjoy generally. A lot of games feel foregone but I tend to watch player development and then I also enjoy well executed rugby. So I've enjoyed most of it so far. I also recognise that just because we should win a game, doesn't mean that we will. I'll never forget losing to Dragons in the RDS a few years back for example! And even games we aren't expected to win, like that awful SF in 2006, stick in the mind. This won't last forever so I'm enjoying it while I can.

That said, it is different. And I think I noticed it more in the RDS than anywhere. I remember 10-12 years ago when we were a coming force but we still lost our fair share. We felt we were going somewhere but most games were still a real contest. The atmosphere in the RDS was far better. We were more raucous. We had songs we sang or chants about individuals and all that stuff. It's gotten very sedate since then.

arsebiscuits1 · 05-03-2021 2:59pm

molloyjh wrote: »

Yep. It's points, then games won, then PD, then tries scored, points scored, try difference, suspensions, yellow cards, coin toss.

What if the coin lands on its side?

molloyjh · 05-03-2021 3:01pm

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

What if the coin lands on its side?

Then Leinster win.

Paul Smeenus · 05-03-2021 3:03pm

molloyjh wrote: »

Then Leinster win.

Probably mandated by the bloody IRFU.

Dave_The_Sheep · 05-03-2021 3:04pm

molloyjh wrote: »

It's gotten very sedate since then.

It has been very poor the last year or so alright.

I'd echo what Molloy says, yeah there's sometimes a sense of a procession but you're getting to watch a boat load of different players each week, which has it's own appeal.

arsebiscuits1 · 05-03-2021 3:05pm

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Probably mandated by the bloody IRFU.

Don't be daft.

If the IRFU actually had any say it in the criteria would be:

Leinster win, points, then games won, then PD, then tries scored, points scored, try difference, suspensions, yellow cards, coin toss, apocalypse, Cooney getting picked for Ireland, Ulster win

Paul Smeenus · 05-03-2021 3:07pm

Dave_The_Sheep wrote: »

It has been very poor the last year or so alright.

I'd echo what Molloy says, yeah there's sometimes a sense of a procession but you're getting to watch a boat load of different players each week, which has it's own appeal.

Must be exciting, seeing a whirlwind of all sorts of talented new young bucks that are far too good for the Pro14.

Dave_The_Sheep · 05-03-2021 3:08pm

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Must be exciting, seeing a whirlwind of all sorts of talented new young bucks that are far too good for the Pro14.

It's tough alright.

Above international standard, really.

Paul Smeenus · 05-03-2021 3:11pm

World class at restarts one week, hoofing them out on the full the next. It's so fickle and elusive, being world class like that.

arsebiscuits1 · 05-03-2021 3:14pm

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

World class at restarts one week, hoofing them out on the full the next. It's so fickle and elusive, being world class like that.

"World class" isn't about things as trivial as performances and ability.

It's a state of mind.

Paul Smeenus · 05-03-2021 3:15pm

All this joviality aside, I am really looking forward to this. Should be a cracking weekend of interpros. Everyone has something other than pride to fight for (even if it's uphill for us and Connacht).

Although that is just the Irish teams. Have to wonder how much other teams' supporters have enjoyed this season.

Paul Smeenus · 05-03-2021 3:16pm

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

"World class" isn't about things as trivial as performances and ability.

It's a state of mind.

Touche, sir. Touche.

Dave_The_Sheep · 05-03-2021 3:35pm

This is honestly some sickening behaviour for a match thread.

The real victim of Leinster's domanance in the Pro-whatever-it-is-now. No niggle, no bite. We need someone to really get the sparks flying.

Venjur, you're up. No pressure, man.

Paul Smeenus · 05-03-2021 3:38pm

Dave_The_Sheep wrote: »

This is honestly some sickening behaviour for a match thread.

The real victim of Leinster's domanance in the Pro-whatever-it-is-now. No niggle, no bite. We need someone to really get the sparks flying.

Venjur, you're up. No pressure, man.

Shut up, Dave. Your team's rubbish.

Dave_The_Sheep · 05-03-2021 3:45pm

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Shut up, Dave. Your team's rubbish.

My team's rubbish does what?

I'll tell you what my team's rubbish does. It goes to play for ... *checks notes* ... Ulster.

And our players have nicer hair than yours do.

Paul Smeenus · 05-03-2021 3:56pm

Dave_The_Sheep wrote: »

My team's rubbish does what?

I'll tell you what my team's rubbish does. It goes to play for ... *checks notes* ... Ulster.

And our players have nicer hair than yours do.

Whatever about the relative strength of the teams and whose aging players go where, there is simply NO WAY your team has nicer hair.

We took Jordi, an HEC level coiffured backrow while at Leinster, and gave him an above international class hair cut. Andrew, Baloucoune - you just don't match up. Gibson-Park alone ruins any claim you might have.

Ulster are miles out on top of the hair league.

You are better than Munster, who are, of course, last (i'm looking at you, Healy, Casey and Snyman).

Paul Smeenus · 05-03-2021 4:02pm

Bradley Roberts sez: Go home, Dave, you're drunk.

Dave_The_Sheep · 05-03-2021 4:03pm

Magnificent.

arsebiscuits1 · 05-03-2021 4:05pm

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Whatever about the relative strength of the teams and whose aging players go where, there is simply NO WAY your team has nicer hair.

We took Jordi, an HEC level coiffured backrow while at Leinster, and gave him an above international class hair cut. Andrew, Baloucoune - you just don't match up. Gibson-Park alone ruins any claim you might have.

Ulster are miles out on top of the hair league.

You are better than Munster, who are, of course, last (i'm looking at you, Healy, Casey and Snyman).

Are you positive about this?

Squidgy Black · 05-03-2021 4:07pm

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Whatever about the relative strength of the teams and whose aging players go where, there is simply NO WAY your team has nicer hair.

We took Jordi, an HEC level coiffured backrow while at Leinster, and gave him an above international class hair cut. Andrew, Baloucoune - you just don't match up. Gibson-Park alone ruins any claim you might have.

Ulster are miles out on top of the hair league.

You are better than Munster, who are, of course, last (i'm looking at you, Healy, Casey and Snyman).

Pffft Ulster forwards and their feminine outside back hairstyles.

Devin Toner, Rhys Ruddock, Ed Byrne, Scott Fardy, all REAL mens haircuts with their receding hairlines showing their experience and dominance.

Ulster vs. Leinster, Saturday 6th March, 19.35 (Eir Sport 1)

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