But who will look after you when you're old?

whatever99 wrote: »

I should have been clearer...I wouldn’t have kids just to have someone to take care of me in my old age - that’s a terrible reason of course, and my parents don’t expect me to take care of them. I was just chatting about the subject in general. I can see how it would be of some comfort though for people who do have kids, that there is someone there who will potentially help out a bit when they’re older (as opposed to being a full time carer, which no one should ever expect!), but I realise that it’s not guaranteed, for multiple reasons.

Deeec wrote: »

I found myself a reluctant career for my elderly uncle who developed dementia ( by reluctant I mean noone else wanted to assume the role ). I tried as best I could to look after him until he went into a nursing home. I then had to try and piece together what property he owned, did he have any income, what bank accounts he had etc for the fair deal scheme but he was unable to give me any information due to his dementia. I also didnt have access to his house to get bank statements etc. It was a horrible process from start to finish. I couldnt get some of the information because I am not his next of kin - his elderly brother and sisters is seen as his next of kin. I cant sign documents because Im not his next of kin. His next of kin all are elderly and themselves dont have full mental capacity to sign the docs so its a complete mess. Im contacted weekly by the HSE regarding this but they dont seem to realise that I am powerless to sign off on this. After taking legal advice on this it seems the only way around this is to make him 'a ward of court' which means the courts will decide his care needs and organise the sale of his assets after death. I am also personally out of pocket because of all the costs I have faced during this process.

Doingitall wrote: »

Important to note that if u have kids don't assume they'll care for u. I'm in a situation where I work full time away from home, the youngest of 7 kids, middle aged and "live" in same house as my elderly disabled parents. When one of my parents became ill I was asked would i move in. I had no children of my own (still don't) so I said yes. My siblings now use that as an excuse for me being the primary carer, organising and bringing to all medical appointments, shopping , home making etc. Also the hse seem to assume just because I have no dependents of my own and sleep in the family home that I should bear all of the caring. One parent has hse provided home help, the other doesn't ( because I'm in the house). There's a disconnect between what "family" think their responsibilities are and what actually happens. In 90% of cases it's the youngest sibling left to deal with everything and if they don't have their own children it's assumed their life is not as important as those who have.Also the hse seem to assume that if u sleep in the same house as an elderly person you're available 24/7. Which is not the case. My point of the post... Don't assume that children will look afyer the elderly equally. And dont rely on anyone but yourself.

I find a lot of the reactions to this thread very unusual. Myself and my siblings will split the care for my parents when they get elderly. Probably not evenly as they are a bit useless, but a nursing home will be the absolute final option.

Everyone I've had the conversation with is planning on living nearby to elderly parents or have had conversations with their partners about how they'll split time between both sets of parents when it happens etc etc.

There is no guarantee your children will look after you but are there actually children on this thread who are planning on putting their parents in a home and not visiting at the first sign of issues? (Other than cases where they have a very bad relationship with their parents)

I think the vast majority of people will at the very least visit their parents, make sure they're healthy as possible, being them to doctors appointments etc

Perhaps most of the responders are of an age where they haven't seen the care needed when someone hits 80 (or whatever age their body stops working)? I dont mean that condescendingly, I just cant understand why people think they'll be self sufficient with bowel cancer or dementia.

I am child free and I'm quite worried about having nobody in my corner if I'm incapacitated. There's no amount of money you can earn that can protect you if you've no control over your faculties.

Its absolutely not a reason to have children but it's a definite downside of not having them.

Theres a decent age gap between me and my youngest sibling so they're probably my best best if things go very awry. And the hope that assisted suicide will be a thing by then too.

But caring is more than dealing with the hygiene aspect.

Its visiting and spending time with, seeing changes in demeanour or injuries and raising it with the caring staff, advocating with doctors when medication isnt effective...the list goes on and on.

Children may not do any of the hygiene stuff but they're very likely to do the latter.

Who do you think will organise the paid staff?

Who will manage your financial affairs, and submit the Fair Deal (or whatever its called then) application?

I've been watching this thread because the underlying question is important for anyone who is childless, whether by choice or not. Responses so far are disappointing.

@Emma2019 wrote:

I'm not saying definitely, but I'm also not saying "never". I saw my own parents caring for theirs. One grandmother came to live in our house, in a self-contained granny flat. In hindsight it was a nice experience for all involved to have her in the house, but even so she reached a point where her needs became too much to be managed - for everyone's sake - and she was moved to a nursing home. It was local, she still got to see her family on a daily basis, but she had her needs met by qualified professionals in an appropriate setting, rather than as a dependent in a queue of dependents in a busy household.

One grandfather by comparison became very difficult in later years as Parkinsons-based dementia kicked in very strongly. His obstinance and resistance to help only became worse over time, not helped by the fact that some of his children insisted that he was fine in his own home, that they could care for him by dropping down every day.

Ultimately the last few months of his life were underscored with chaos and frequent urgent runs to his house (or other places) to deal with what new madness he had done now, or what injury had happened to him.

I wouldn't want my kids to have to deal with that, and I know that our parents wouldn't want it for us either.

So I'm not saying that I have plans to use a home at the first sign of trouble, but I'm also being pragmatic and acknowledging that the time may come.

Edit: On the topic of the forum, I would indeed strongly advise anyone who is childless to have a plan in place by the time you're in your late 50s/early 60s. You will likely have friends and family that you can rely on, but things can change as you approach the twilight years and suddenly everyone who knows what you want to do, may be gone or otherwise unavailable. Typically you will appoint a solicitor or someone who is not a beneficiary from your estate, to have power of attorney. Unfortunately this is not something you can pre-arrange to kick in at a specific time, but you can have the arrangements drawn up and understood to make them easier to implement when the time comes.

When it's 9pm on Saturday evening, the carer who was due at 7pm hasn't turned up, and there's a real likelihood that you're going to be left to sit in your own excrement at least overnight, possibly until Monday or longer - who are you going to call?

Do you really expect other people's kids to step up to managing your caregivers?

Do you have children? Do you expect them to come around and clean up your excrement when you are old?

If you're at a point where you are in fear of potentially lying in your own waste all night, it might be time to sell up and move in to a care home.

You are assuming that your brothers and sisters will still be alive or still have capacity themselves to deal with your care. You are assuming that your nieces and nephews will still be living close to you and will be able to access everything . None of them may be around or want to deal with this - they may run a mile. You are assuming you will have the capacity ( dementia is a bugger you know) to realise when you need to go to a home yourself ( this may not be the case). You are assuming you will always be able to keep your financial affairs neat and tidy. All these assumptions may be wrong.

In the last year I have been in this position for my uncle who has dementia who went into a care home. I had to do all the work to get his fair deal scheme approved - absolute nightmare process from start to finish ( its even not finished yet). I have to buy his clothes, engage with home constantly to make sure his care needs are met ( which is essential let me tell you or his needs are not met - someone had to advocate for him). I have to pay for certain medications for him not covered otherwise. I have to pay his house insurance and upkeep of his home personally as he cant do this stuff for himself. It would be so much easier if I was his daughter though- as his niece Im irrelevent.

You have to remember you wont always be the person you are now.

+1 for Faith's retirement village, sign me up (in about 40 years!)

Many people have had that business idea. Most fail, because when it comes to it, no one actually wants to pay enough to move in.

Your uncle may have set up legal structures for should he be unable to look after his financial affairs - thats standard stuff. However someone still has to provide the information to the solicitor and someone still has to liaise with the solicitor on your behalf because if you have dementia you cant do this ( you are in your own world ). Your solicitor wont have keys to your house to gather your financial info, your solicitor wont be checking in with you every week to make sure you are not losing your marbles. Also a solicitor will not be calling the nursing home every day to make sure you a being looked after. I dont think a solicitor will go out and buy you underpants and a new jumper when you need them either.

You very much still need someone else to care for you and look out for you - no solicitor will do this they just deal with the legal stuff. Very few children completely abandon their elderly parents. Fact is if you have kids you have someone to look out for you. If I was in your position I would select your chosen person and talk to them about what your wishes are should you become incapacitated - also give them the opportunity to say no and dont hold it against them - they may have to care for their own parents/ inlaws and may have enough on their plate. Im not trying to be annoying Im just pointing out the realities.

They’ll probably start putting us down once we reach a certain age soon enough anyways.

Health care services will only get worse, we can’t afford pensions as it is.

Kids can’t look after themselves, how anyone thinks they’ll look after their invalid parents is laughable.

Thats super for him - but not at all the norm. I would hate when I get older for all decisions regarding my care, my finances and my life to be in the hands of a care home and a solicitor who frankly dont give a damn about me.