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Cocaine

12357…17

Comments

  • #202
    Thelonious Monk
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,478 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    tuxy wrote: »
    How sure am I that most of the people that used head shop would have preferred the more well documented and researched mainstream drugs?
    I'm fairly sure. However there were a small minority that loved drugs like mephedrone from these shops.

    Mephedrone was a good buzz and very easily available during the halycon head shop days, you felt really awful the next day though. It was a fraction of the price of coke too, and you didn't need to worry about the quality.


  • #203
    Princess Consuela Bananahammock
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,635 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    tuxy wrote: »
    How sure am I that most of the people that used head shop would have preferred the more well documented and researched mainstream drugs?
    I'm fairly sure. However there were a small minority that loved drugs like mephedrone from these shops.

    No, how sure are you of the claims you made in your previous post, obviously. They was pretty specific and I'm guessing you can't back then up.

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



  • #204
    tuxy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    Doctor Nick wrote: »
    They were nasty. Especially mephedrone. A lot of addicts used to IV it and lost a lot of limbs. Of course, there is the argument they should never have IV'd it in the first place. Lots of it around even after the head shops closed although probably mixed with even nastier stuff.

    While heroin addiction is awful it's reasonable safe if you get a known quantity of it with little adulterants.

    Many took mephedrone in place of MDMA also, it's a more dangerous substance and the users definitely would have preferred to have MD.
    People also don't want to deal with scummy dealers and that was part of the attraction of the headshops even though many of them were scummy in their own way.

    You can still get mephedrone even though it's illegal but it's rare enough as not many people like it over other substances.


  • #205
    tuxy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »
    No, how sure are you of the claims you made in your previous post, obviously. They was pretty specific and I'm guessing you can't back then up.

    I can easily back up the claim that prohibition is not working.


  • #206
    Doctor Nick
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,506 ✭✭✭Doctor Nick


    tuxy wrote: »
    While heroin addiction is awful it's reasonable safe if you get a known quantity of it with little adulterants.

    Many took mephedrone in place of MDMA also, it's a more dangerous substance and the users definitely would have preferred to have MD.
    People so don't want to deal with scummy dealers and that was part of the attraction of the headshops even though many of them were scummy in their own way.

    You can still get mephedrone even though it's illegal but it's rare enough has not many people like it more than other substances.

    Mephedrone screwed me up big time and led to me dabbling with gear. I used to leave work and run to a head shop for a gram, in and out of the loo all day. Became a daily habit which proved very expensive. Destroyed inside of my nose too.

    I realise above was down to my own inability to control my intake and others could use only recreationly.


  • #207
    Raconteuse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,817 ✭✭✭Raconteuse


    I don't do cocaine but things are getting out of control with it. I don't see how decriminalisation/legalisation can be ruled out as a solution. With this could come regulation of how much is sold, and a reduction in the crazy violence. I mean I know people are hesitant because it would normalise it, but it's already quite normalised.

    I know people think comparison with alcohol is whataboutery too, but alcohol is a very potent and damaging substance that leads to violence. The two are comparable.


  • #208
    tuxy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    Raconteuse wrote: »

    I know people think comparison with alcohol is whataboutery too, but alcohol is a very potent and damaging substance that leads to violence. The two are comparable.

    I'm not big into drugs but I've done some in the past. Alcohol is only one that came close to killing me. And not just once but a number of times.
    It's a very potent drug and the difference between having a good time and putting yourself in a dangerous situation is small.


  • #209
    Princess Consuela Bananahammock
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,635 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    tuxy wrote: »
    I can easily back up the claim that prohibition is not working.

    I'll bet you can. Wasn't what you was claimed in the initial post though, was it?

    Anyway, two strawmans prove my point, and we're done here. Good night.

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



  • #210
    tuxy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »
    I'll bet you can. Wasn't what you was claimed in the initial post though, was it?

    Actually it was

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=112275344&postcount=2


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  • #211
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    If the government were to legalise cocaine, maybe some other drugs, who exactly would sell it?
    Where would the sellers buy it?
    Would there be quotas of how much people could buy?
    What's to stop dealers from other countries coming here & buying in bulk?


  • #212
    Doctor Nick
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,506 ✭✭✭Doctor Nick


    Alcohol, along with Benzodiazepines, are the two worst substances to withdraw from and can be fatal if not done under supervision in a residential treatment centre. Cocaine withdrawal is uncomfortable but not fatal. Small number of deaths with cold turkey opiate withdrawal as a result of dehydration due to vomiting and diarrhoea.

    Of above, I would say there are more people with alcohol dependancy than any of the others (maybe not benzos). I honestly believe the articles I've read (can't remember where) saying if alcohol were only discovered today it would be a Class A drug.


  • #213
    fash
    Registered Users Posts: 2,275 ✭✭✭fash


    A question for those in favour of legalization: what do you think of pregnant women doing the legalized drugs under your preference?


  • #214
    Deebles McBeebles
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,865 ✭✭✭Deebles McBeebles


    tuxy wrote: »
    How sure am I that most of the people that used head shop would have preferred the more well documented and researched mainstream drugs?
    I'm fairly sure. However there were a small minority that loved drugs like mephedrone from these shops.


    Absolutely. There was a time where going to the headshop after a few pints in the pub was the norm. Easier than having to arrange coke or whatever drug. A few of my friends have lasting side effects from that time, anxiety attacks etc.


  • #215
    tuxy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    bubblypop wrote: »
    If the government were to legalise cocaine, maybe some other drugs, who exactly would sell it?
    Where would the sellers buy it?
    Would there be quotas of how much people could buy?
    What's to stop dealers from other countries coming here & buying in bulk?

    Unfortunately I don't think it's possible when it is illegal globally.
    The shift in drug legislation would need to be an effort from many countries cooperating.

    Cocaine could be sold with the same kind of supply as coffee only with the sale to consumers age restricted.
    fash wrote: »
    A question for those in favour of legalization: what do you think of pregnant women doing the legalized drugs under your preference?

    The idea of that disgusts me as much as a pregnant woman drinking alcohol. Why do you ask?


  • #216
    Doctor Nick
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,506 ✭✭✭Doctor Nick


    Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

    two strawman prove my point, and we're done here. Good night.

    Eh, does this refer to me? I'm only speaking of my own experience and said as much.


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  • #217
    Deebles McBeebles
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,865 ✭✭✭Deebles McBeebles


    fash wrote: »
    A question for those in favour of legalization: what do you think of pregnant women doing the legalized drugs under your preference?

    The same as I think of a pregnant woman drinking or smoking.


  • #218
    Raconteuse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,817 ✭✭✭Raconteuse


    fash wrote: »
    A question for those in favour of legalization: what do you think of pregnant women doing the legalized drugs under your preference?
    Brilliant. Love the idea.


  • #219
    tuxy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    Doctor Nick wrote: »
    Eh, does this refer to me? I'm only speaking of my own experience and said as much.

    I'd ignore him, he can't even acknowledge that the head shops sold unscheduled drugs and that drugs scheduling is a result of prohibition.


  • #220
    tdf7187
    Registered Users Posts: 1,597 ✭✭✭tdf7187


    Deebles McBeebles wrote: »
    Absolutely. There was a time where going to the headshop after a few pints in the pub was the norm. Easier than having to arrange coke or whatever drug. A few of my friends have lasting side effects from that time, anxiety attacks etc.

    I didn't realise this. Naively I thought the headshops were selling comparatively harmless stuff and were threatened out of business by heavy duty drug dealers. Sounds like the heavy duty drug dealers for once did society a favour.


  • #221
    tdf7187
    Registered Users Posts: 1,597 ✭✭✭tdf7187


    I have been in rehab for booze and I found the other patients who were in for coke addiction sound. Sounder than the alcies, some of who were utter tossers to be frank. (takes one to know one, lol). Now granted, I wasn't seeing them under the influence of the stuff but the stereotype of the out-of-control monster isn't necessarily true. I have never had any interest in cocaine, I always feared it due to my addictive personality.


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  • #222
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    Potential-Monke wrote: »
    Would you like to expand on your fancy words?

    They form a phrase commonly used as a pejorative to criticize the use of clever, but unsound reasoning, especially in relation to moral questions. So go figure.


  • #223
    Deebles McBeebles
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,865 ✭✭✭Deebles McBeebles


    tdf7187 wrote: »
    I didn't realise this. Naively I thought the headshops were selling comparatively harmless stuff and were threatened out of business by heavy duty drug dealers. Sounds like the heavy duty drug dealers for once did society a favour.

    It was more the change in law that put headshops out of business afaik. Weirdly, they had only made magic mushrooms illegal a few years before the headshop drugs rose to prominence. The law of the land was slower to catch up to the more harmful drugs than they were to a naturally occurring mushroom.

    Its as if they were trying to get rid of a certain class of people or at least start them on the road to heroin.


  • #224
    mr_fegelien
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,483 ✭✭✭mr_fegelien


    I've heard anyone who takes cocaine and says it's a strong cup of coffee is taking 20% coke and 80% ****e (lidocaine, prilocaine).

    There was a girl I knew in a PLC class that claimed to be immune from addiction. She took cocaine, benzos, etc... and thought they were mild. Then she went to South America on a backpacking expidition and took some pure coke there. She quickly got hooked.

    Came back, got addicted to strong stimulants as the coke here was ****e and lost her job.


  • #225
    tuxy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    tdf7187 wrote: »
    I didn't realise this. Naively I thought the headshops were selling comparatively harmless stuff and were threatened out of business by heavy duty drug dealers. Sounds like the heavy duty drug dealers for once did society a favour.

    What they sold was anything that was unscheduled by law.
    So some obscured things. Synthetic cannabinoids were popular but these were often more potent and induced more anxiety than regular weed.
    There were also lots of stimulants, similar to speed but with the chemical structure changed enough to make them legal. Also substances that tried to mimic LSD, again just changed enough to make them legal.

    Some of the drugs were more potent than the illegal ones and some less so but many had worse side effects. And Some of them were actually fairly harmless and others were very dangerous and because of how new these substances were the user had less understanding of what they were taking.
    Unfortunately the main goal with these head shop drugs was to make them legal, the safety of the user was a lesser concern.

    Now there is a blanket ban on all psychoactive substances so people have gone back to the drugs they know best.


  • #226
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    mr_fegelien wrote: »
    I've heard anyone who takes cocaine and says it's a strong cup of coffee is taking 20% coke and 80% ****e (lidocaine, prilocaine).

    There was a girl I knew in a PLC class that claimed to be immune from addiction. She took cocaine, benzos, etc... and thought they were mild. Then she went to South America on a backpacking expidition and took some pure coke there. She quickly got hooked.

    Came back, got addicted to strong stimulants as the coke here was ****e and lost her job.

    You hear the strangest bits and bobs don't you? And as for all these characters you seem to have known...……..


  • #227
    Doctor Nick
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,506 ✭✭✭Doctor Nick


    mr_fegelien wrote: »
    I've heard anyone who takes cocaine and says it's a strong cup of coffee is taking 20% coke and 80% ****e (lidocaine, prilocaine).

    There was a girl I knew in a PLC class that claimed to be immune from addiction. She took cocaine, benzos, etc... and thought they were mild. Then she went to South America on a backpacking expidition and took some pure coke there. She quickly got hooked.

    Came back, got addicted to strong stimulants as the coke here was ****e and lost her job.

    I've never heard of Cocaine being described as a strong cup of coffee.


  • #228
    Arrival
    Closed Accounts Posts: 779 ✭✭✭Arrival


    fash wrote: »
    A question for those in favour of legalization: what do you think of pregnant women doing the legalized drugs under your preference?

    Big brain strawman


  • #229
    Cody montana
    Registered Users Posts: 5,391 ✭✭✭Cody montana


    Very addictive.

    Not worth it the next day.


  • #230
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,028 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    Cody montana wrote: »
    Very addictive.

    Not worth it the next day.

    That’s a contradiction


  • #231
    JP Liz V1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 87,517 ✭✭✭✭JP Liz V1


    The age of ones on it gets younger and younger
    https://forumofgames.com/




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  • #232
    dartboardio
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,436 ✭✭✭dartboardio


    The cocaine is so **** in ireland and probably 20% of the real thing in an actual bag like a pp said.

    Id be more worried about the likes of people taking ecstasy and MDMA, that's where the real danger lies. Not to mention how messed up it makes you and the way you look when you take too much. And the comedown/skag will literally physically drain your body the next day or two are completely wrote off.

    Cocaine is different, you can happily get up the next day and feel energized, your taste buds are fine, your head is not melted.


  • #233
    Cody montana
    Registered Users Posts: 5,391 ✭✭✭Cody montana


    SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »
    That’s a contradiction

    How so?


  • #234
    Raconteuse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,817 ✭✭✭Raconteuse


    Imo MDMA is pretty benign compared to cocaine when you consider the effects on behaviour, the potential for addiction and the links to criminality.


  • #235
    Madeleine Numerous Scatterbrain
    Posts: 0 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Madeleine Numerous Scatterbrain


    Is this actually a thing. I must be off in my own land


  • #236
    RobertKK
    Registered Users Posts: 33,752 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    Well it is funding crime, so one can't take cocaine and pretend they have no responsibility to society when it comes to these drug gangs and the actions they take. It is not nice for a person who takes cocaine to think this, but they are driving the demand and the demand leads to very serious criminal acts to be committed by the gangs.


  • #237
    Deebles McBeebles
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,865 ✭✭✭Deebles McBeebles


    This is a very circular conversation. A bit like how it feels to chat on coke.


  • #238
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,028 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    Raconteuse wrote: »
    Imo MDMA is pretty benign compared to cocaine when you consider the effects on behaviour, the potential for addiction and the links to criminality.


    E you go home deflated when it runs out

    The other **** you would step over your mother to top up

    Nasty little drug


  • #239
    MrMusician18
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,597 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    Deebles McBeebles wrote: »
    This is a very circular conversation. A bit like how it feels to chat on coke.

    The poll had been interesting though, since it's been relatively stable at between 2 and 3 to 1 agreeing with the Garda that uses are at least partially responsible for the horrific violence we are seeing. The level against has actually surprised me since I can see just how prevalent coke use is in the country - it wouldn't surprise me if over 50% of 20-35 year olds (the main demographic here, although that had been getting older too) have at least had a small sniff.

    That said there are clearly a few users who enjoy coke that have posted on the thread and do not accept that they are participating and driving the chaos. I guess their good time matters more...


  • #240
    akelly02
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,135 ✭✭✭akelly02


    Bita Coke to keep ya awake for the mcgregor fight


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  • #241
    chicorytip
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,168 ✭✭✭chicorytip


    The use of crack cocaine in Ireland is increasing particularly in the regional cities. It is far more addictive than the powdered form therefore leading to habitual usage rather than occasional.


  • #242
    Always Tired
    Closed Accounts Posts: 945 ✭✭✭Always Tired


    Drinkers are then of course also responsible for all the deaths caused by it, drunk driving etc.

    And a lot of those killed werent involved in criminal gangs, innocent passengers or drivers in other cars.

    Cocaine is bad for you and super addictive so that should be enough to put you off but this whole thing is a reach put out by clueless cops.


  • #243
    Ash.J.Williams
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,170 ✭✭✭✭Ash.J.Williams


    akelly02 wrote: »
    Bita Coke to keep ya awake for the mcgregor fight

    I bet that's why the cops shut down a few functions tonight:)


  • #244
    Ash.J.Williams
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,170 ✭✭✭✭Ash.J.Williams


    I'd say the construction sector dwarfs the banking sector these days in coke use and it seems to more GAA than rugby 😂


  • #245
    simongurnick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,919 ✭✭✭simongurnick


    dartboardio wrote: »
    The cocaine is so **** in ireland and probably 20% of the real thing in an actual bag like a pp said.

    Id be more worried about the likes of people taking ecstasy and MDMA, that's where the real danger lies. Not to mention how messed up it makes you and the way you look when you take too much. And the comedown/skag will literally physically drain your body the next day or two are completely wrote off.

    Cocaine is different, you can happily get up the next day and feel energized, your taste buds are fine, your head is not melted.

    Did e for years. Worst next day feeling i ever had was from drink. Skagged you can just smoke a j and feel grand


  • #246
    wonderboysam
    Registered Users Posts: 1,000 ✭✭✭wonderboysam


    Do people that buy diamonds have blood on their hands?

    Are people that buy clothes from Penneys responsible for sweat shops?

    If you drink non fair trade coffee do you participate in slavery?

    Are people that buy apple products guilty of violating human rights?


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  • #247
    Raconteuse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,817 ✭✭✭Raconteuse


    wonderboysam wrote: »
    Do people that buy diamonds have blood on their hands?

    Are people that buy clothes from Penneys responsible for sweat shops?

    If you drink non fair trade coffee do you participate in slavery?

    Are people that buy apple products guilty violators of human rights?
    Aye, it's hard to be completely ethical.

    As mentioned, the types who are all about the ethical sourcing of things and then hoover a hill of coke up their snouts at weekends are hilarious.

    There is some difference though - the things you mention are still jobs in their communities. Jobs with awful, immoral conditions but the folk need them - this has been said by development workers. An improvement in their work conditions is what is needed.

    With cocaine though, it is a potentially harmful substance (and I know alcohol is too), it can have terrible effects on behaviour (again, alcohol - same) and look at the surge in violence and criminal activity. So I see your point, but I don't think it's totally comparing like with like.

    I'm of the opinion it should be decriminalised/legalised to try and regulate it.


  • #248
    chrissb8
    Registered Users Posts: 1,181 ✭✭✭chrissb8


    Raconteuse wrote: »
    Aye, it's hard to be completely ethical.

    As mentioned, the types who are all about the ethical sourcing of things and then hoover a hill of coke up their snouts at weekends are hilarious.

    There is some difference though - the things you mention are still jobs in their communities. Jobs with awful, immoral conditions but the folk need them - this has been said by development workers. An improvement in their work conditions is what is needed.

    With cocaine though, it is a potentially harmful substance (and I know alcohol is too), it can have terrible effects on behaviour (again, alcohol - same) and look at the surge in violence and criminal activity. So I see your point, but I don't think it's totally comparing like with like.

    I'm of the opinion it should be decriminalised/legalised to try and regulate it.

    Fair point and a good insight into it. I think it's more to do with the patronising outlook on those who do coke, and with ethical sourcing in mind, we're all just hypocrites really. Especially the convenient ignoring for a convenient life.

    If we (not just Ireland of course) were to boycott products made in foreign lands with terrible working conditions you could also be sure said companies would shape up in that regard as well.

    Then also if the goings-on in some of these factories were on Irish shores I'm sure we would see a boycott on those products made in those factories too. But out of sight out of mind, kind of like the drug trade really.

    The solution of decriminalisation is staring us in the face.


  • #249
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Raconteuse wrote: »
    There is some difference though - the things you mention are still jobs in their communities. Jobs with awful, immoral conditions but the folk need them - this has been said by development workers. An improvement in their work conditions is what is needed.

    To be fair, the production of cocaine is often in countries where the poor have few options for employment, and in some cases, are pushed into it's preparation prior to exportation.

    The point remains that it's extremely difficult to be ethical about one and not be about the other... which is why I find those talking about hypocrisy are often displaying it themselves.

    Whereas those who acknowledge that there's little to be done, and accept that it really doesn't matter where it comes from, are being more honest.
    I'm of the opinion it should be decriminalised/legalised to try and regulate it.

    Agreed. It's not the perfect solution but it means safer sources for users, and diminishes the income for criminals. It would depend on whether the government would tax it to pieces like they've done with cigarettes, which would negate most benefits from the change. It also means a revenue that can be used to increase research and development to mitigate the risks within the drug and reduce dependencies.


  • #250
    Potential-Monke
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,283 ✭✭✭✭Potential-Monke


    dartboardio wrote: »
    Id be more worried about the likes of people taking ecstasy and MDMA, that's where the real danger lies. Not to mention how messed up it makes you and the way you look when you take too much. And the comedown/skag will literally physically drain your body the next day or two are completely wrote off.

    Id me more worried about he likes of people drinking alcohol, that's where the real danger lies. Not to mention how messed up it makes you and the way you look when you drink too much. And the hangover will literally physically drain your body the next day or tow are completely wrote off.

    Also, my experience of MDMA/ecstasy is far, far better than alcohol. But it still comes with the same caveat, you need to know how much to take. In my heyday, the most I would take in a night was 3 "yokes". There were people doing 20+ in the same time and I never understood it, and I'd imagine they're the ones you're referring to. And in fairness, you can't help the gurning at times! But, and maybe I'm blessed, while others were dying the next day, I'd wake up and eat a fry and be grand, compared to alcohol making a mess of me for up to 2 days with depression and feeling sick.
    Ash.J.Williams wrote: »
    I'd say the construction sector dwarfs the banking sector these days in coke use and it seems to more GAA than rugby ��

    I'd imagine the medical sector is giving them a run for their money!
    Raconteuse wrote: »
    There is some difference though - the things you mention are still jobs in their communities.

    As klaz has mentioned, growing the coca plant is the most lucrative business for poor farmers. The government has tried to get them to grow other crops, but when it's a choice between feeding your family due to coca plants or staving due to smaller sales of legal crops, many pick the coca plant.


  • #251
    BeerWolf
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,122 ✭✭✭BeerWolf


    Absolutely, but the sad reality is they don't give a ****.


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