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NPPR has not been declared

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    #62
    Daintydoll1
    Registered Users Posts: 34 ✭Daintydoll1


    Arbiter of Good Taste wrote: »
    What did your engagement letter with your old accountant say. I would be looking for compensation for his wrong advice

    The advice re nppr was verbal unfortunately so no recourse there...he brought it up when I was settling that years revenue bill, established that I owned no other property in Ireland + told me I had no liability.
    Like I say, I accept it was my responsibility + error but a fine of 3.2k on a bill of 1k is astronomical and tbh causing a lot of financial pressure on me...it's completely wiping me out. I rang LA to see if I could appeal the fine and was told no, as nppr doesn't exist anymore there's no way to appeal it/ no dept dealing with it.
    So I'd be interested to know of any challenges + how people are challenging it.


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    #63
    Sadler32
    Registered Users Posts: 90 ✭✭Sadler32


    This has been a nightmare for me.
    I bought my house in 2009. Its the only house I own and is my primary residence. Recently I decided to sell it as I am moving away.
    That was fine until I was told by my solicitor that I required an NPPR exemption certificate.
    Then the "fun" began.
    How do you get a certificate? Well first I rang the council and they said to submit electricity bills and that would be enough. I did and got an email from them saying the bills were too low and it couldnt be my primary residence. I work away and lived on my own, I also conserve energy when I can, so my bills will always be lower then the average.
    Anyway it took nearly 2 months for them to believe it was my primary residence. I ended up sending them bank statements (without the financials or account number), car tax records, car insurance records, every bill i ever got, tv licenses.
    Eventually I got it sorted, so cant imagine how people would deal with it if it is their second or 3rd house.

    Also what happens when people get married, and now the couple technically own 2 houses?????


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    #64
    Arbiter of Good Taste
    Registered Users Posts: 2,200 ✭✭✭Arbiter of Good Taste


    Daintydoll1 wrote: »
    The advice re nppr was verbal unfortunately so no recourse there...he brought it up when I was settling that years revenue bill, established that I owned no other property in Ireland + told me I had no liability.
    Like I say, I accept it was my responsibility + error but a fine of 3.2k on a bill of 1k is astronomical and tbh causing a lot of financial pressure on me...it's completely wiping me out. I rang LA to see if I could appeal the fine and was told no, as nppr doesn't exist anymore there's no way to appeal it/ no dept dealing with it.
    So I'd be interested to know of any challenges + how people are challenging it.

    The other side of the coin is, if the department doesn't exist, then how can they enforce.

    Unfortunately according to the letter of the law you are liable. I really feel for you as you had the good sense to have an accountant and look where it got you. Seriously, I would make an appointment with a solicitor and see if you gave any comeback.


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    #65
    MouseTail
    Registered Users Posts: 1,663 ✭✭✭MouseTail


    I would seek legal advice too daintydoll, that is some shoddy accountant that did not know something so basic, if he prepared your return, and was aware of the facts of your case, he was negligent. Did you contact LA before deadline, as that froze the penalties?


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    #66
    Daintydoll1
    Registered Users Posts: 34 ✭Daintydoll1


    Yeah I contacted them just to ensure I was compliant because as the nppr deadline approached and it was getting more airtime I began to doubt the accountants advice. So I am "fortunate" that my fine was 3.2k...had I waited it out the fine would now be 6k ish. On top of the 4or 5 years liability.
    I'm really kicking myself that I took the accountants word for it at the time + didn't get his confirmation in writing. Without that from a legal perspective it's his word against mine really. An expensive lesson to learn.


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    #67
    Sadler32
    Registered Users Posts: 90 ✭✭Sadler32


    On a slightly different note, it is worth check everything accountants tell you.
    I am self assessed.
    As I am not an accountant, I employed an accountant to do my returns. Everything was fine until one day I got a letter from revenue about something. I rang my accountant, but he was away and I couldnt get hold of him.
    So I rang revenue, and found out that there was no accountant attached to my account, but checked and everything was up to date. Strange, but from then on I kept a close eye on things...
    Anyway I decided that filing my tax return myself wasnt that difficult, as I knew the ins and outs by now, the only thing I didnt do was file it.
    So I went to file online, and I couldnt quite get their auto fill to match my calculations, so I rang revenue. They were very helpful, and said they would send me out the previous years return. They thought it was strange I didnt have it on file. When I said my accountant does it, the same response of " There is no accountant attached to this file". Strange....
    Anyway when the previous years return, arrived, everything made sense. And it turned out that the accoountant had been filling the return as me, forgeing my signature instead of filling out the part of the form as a "fileing accountant".

    The guy I used was well respected, well known and cost alot. So my advice is to question everything and get written proof of everything. Doesnt matter who they are.....


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    #68
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,279 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    I had a similar experience with a local accountant- not in regard the NPPR- but with respect of income which should have been tax free (forestry grants) that the accountant consistently over a 5 year period declared as taxable income at the marginal rate on my tax return. Revenue would only revisit 4 years- so I was down about 6k. The accountant- well his comment was 'I'm an accountant, not a tax consultant'......... I was going to bring an action against him- when he hospitalised himself for stress (or something similar). The bollox is still practicing- and appears to be held in reasonably high regard locally. Obviously hes not my accountant anymore- I use a firm who also run a tax consultancy- its more expensive- but they're good- and they haven't screwed up.

    You're unlikely to get anywhere chasing your accountant- unless its a copper fast case- which doesn't appear to be the case.


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    #69
    Arbiter of Good Taste
    Registered Users Posts: 2,200 ✭✭✭Arbiter of Good Taste


    The_Conductor wrote: »
    I had a similar experience with a local accountant- not in regard the NPPR- but with respect of income which should have been tax free (forestry grants) that the accountant consistently over a 5 year period declared as taxable income at the marginal rate on my tax return. Revenue would only revisit 4 years- so I was down about 6k. The accountant- well his comment was 'I'm an accountant, not a tax consultant'......... I was going to bring an action against him- when he hospitalised himself for stress (or something similar). The bollox is still practicing- and appears to be held in reasonably high regard locally. Obviously hes not my accountant anymore- I use a firm who also run a tax consultancy- its more expensive- but they're good- and they haven't screwed up.

    You're unlikely to get anywhere chasing your accountant- unless its a copper fast case- which doesn't appear to be the case.

    You've hit the nail on the head. Your average accountant is not a tax advisor. I cringe every time I hear someone say that their accountant is doing their tax return. There are plenty of good tax advisors out there who are reasonably priced - some of them big 4 trained who went out on their own.


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    #70
    Sadler32
    Registered Users Posts: 90 ✭✭Sadler32


    Thats it, I agree there are.
    The worrying thing is, In my case I specifically choose someone who was a tax consultant, due to the fact I work away at sea, and it can be abit messy. He still managed to blatantly managed to do things wrong.
    I was lucky that the figures were all correct and I didnt end up oweing.

    I do it all myself now and is pretty straight forward...


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    #71
    muggles
    Registered Users Posts: 332 ✭✭muggles


    Arbiter of Good Taste wrote: »
    You've hit the nail on the head. Your average accountant is not a tax advisor. I cringe every time I hear someone say that their accountant is doing their tax return. There are plenty of good tax advisors out there who are reasonably priced - some of them big 4 trained who went out on their own.

    But they have some brass neck then taking on engagements in areas in which they are clearly incompetent....and charging for it!! :eek: Taxing that grant was a really stupid error. I've trained in tax and work as a corporate accountant. I wouldn't have the cheek to offer to do anyone else's accounts or tax returns, bar my own, because the areas in which I trained and practice in have absolutely zero relevancy to personal taxation.


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    #72
    Arbiter of Good Taste
    Registered Users Posts: 2,200 ✭✭✭Arbiter of Good Taste


    muggles wrote: »
    But they have some brass neck then taking on engagements in areas in which they are clearly incompetent....and charging for it!! :eek: Taxing that grant was a really stupid error. I've trained in tax and work as a corporate accountant. I wouldn't have the cheek to offer to do anyone else's accounts or tax returns, bar my own, because the areas in which I trained and practice in have absolutely zero relevancy to personal taxation.

    See the problem is a lot of accountants think tax is simple. I am a tax advisor with nearly 20 years experience in corporate tax. I would never try and advise an individual on their personal - non-corporate- tax affairs unless it was fairly straightforward. The problem is, unlike auditing, you actually don't need a formal qualification in order to call yourself a tax advisor.

    I say to anyone looking for a tax advisor to make sure they have the AITI qualification to be safe. Or there are a couple of trustworthy former colleagues I recommend.


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