What would you have done?

SmartinMartin wrote: »

Unfortunately I didn't use enough to refer to you.
Jesus Christ people, get involved. Help where it's needed, protect the vulnerable.
If you are too self-centred or afraid to do it how are your children going to learn a sense of community, a sense of worth?.

They aren't going to learn about community or helping others. They are going to learn, from the hard lessons of other men, that its just not worth helping, that the risks to personal reputation are just too high. This message will be reinforced by media campaigns and society generally.

Yes, it will lead to further individualization, and atomization of society, but that's seemingly what we want. If you get into a bind that makes you vulnerable, you are pretty much on your own.

Being the good samaritan is dead.

Kraftwerk wrote: »

What are people afraid of happening if they asked her if she was OK? If she takes it the wrong way or is uncomfortable she'll ignore you or say she's grand or something. She's not going to start blowing a rape whistle at the side of the road because someone asked if she was ok.
More than likely she'd either say she's OK, take the lift or ask to use your phone to call someone to pick her up.
A worse thing would be to carry on, do nothing and hear something happened to her. That'd worry me more than accidentally looking like a perv.

How do you know? in that state, you wouldnt know what or how they'd remember any interaction and if anyone saw genuine help being offered, you wouldn't know how they would interpret it or what they would say they saw or thought they saw.

Tell me how wrote: »

I would have put my phone on audio record and asked he was she ok or did she need assistance.
If the answers concerned me, I'd have then called the Gardai.

If someone I cared about was in such a situation, I'd like to think someone would be good willed enough to help them.

I'd like to think they wouldn't get into that state, now I did in my younger years and women I knew got me into and left me in precarious situations that I had to defuse or defend against, it's different now, even worse, I will be advising my son to stay well clear, call for help from a distance if need be, if none is forthcoming, then it's not his problem, because if he helped there are people willing to interpret a situation how they want, a false accusation as serious as that is might be the least thing to be concerned about.

SmartinMartin wrote: »

SNIP

Well, if she is, then its a reflection on you and your parenting, no ones responsibility to fix that for you and deal with whatever the outcome might be.

SmartinMartin wrote: »

Bull****. It is that black and white. If her condition is such that it alarms you enough to think you should stop, you should fu¢kin well stop. Dealing with what happens next is up to you, when it happens, but this opt-out crap I'm seeing on here is just awful.

Nooo, it is not black and white at all, I dont want to say the T word, becuase I think you genuinely seem to believe what you are saying.

pinktoe wrote: »

Most cars have dash cams at this stage. Pull in behind her and ask if you can call someone for her. Let her wait in your car alone while someone picks her. You wait at front of the car on camera.
Better than hearing her getting attacked or killed by another motorist.
If an allegation is made against you take legal action

NEVER let a stranger in that condition in your car, you think a dashcam is going to protect you. That is naive nonsense, wait at the front of your own car while they sit down inside! you're having a larf, assuming they don't barf all over the place, or they dont claim to be injured (might claim or sue), assuming they dont slice open your car to hoist her out.
ANd thats all assuming they don't claim or think you did anything else,

Someone gets in that state, they are responsible for themselves, maybe call from a distance, but any help 999 for being drunk out of your mind should be an unsubsidised bill for the cost of the ambulance even if they are so drunk they decline.

SmartinMartin wrote: »

I don't want anything from you, but if my post makes you think about your civic duty hopefully it just might help someone you come across in the future.

There is no civic duty to assist some so drunk out of their mind that you should stop and endanger yourself. Whiteknights are idiots/maybe even want to row in to help/need to/maybe even want something, world of trouble waiting for a genuine person

SmartinMartin wrote: »

I know what you're saying, but if people just fall in with this train of thought what is going to happen to society? Fu¢k that, keep a sense of decency, look out for others, try and help where you can.

It has already happened

Silentcorner wrote: »

Which is why I mentioned the two recent and very public incidents...this is not a figment of anyone's imagination.

You'd want to be blind or willfully ignorant not to notice the noxious message being pumped into women that men are toxic beings that pose a risk...as pointed out already, they are running ads on tv to the same effect!!!

Men are not creating any hysteria, they are quiet rightly reacting to it!!!!

Approaching a drunk young women on a street is madness...are you going to lay a hand on her if she needs physical assistance?

I dont have a tv account, could you enlighten me (genuine request). I guess these are far worse than the ads from the 90's that portray men as bumbling idiots who cant wash their own jeans without it being a drama.

SmartinMartin wrote: »

Unfortunately I didn't use enough to refer to you.
Jesus Christ people, get involved. Help where it's needed, protect the vulnerable.
If you are too self-centred or afraid to do it how are your children going to learn a sense of community, a sense of worth?.

Vulnerable, riiiight, well how about personal responsibility, don't make yourself vulnerable by getting drunk out their minds.

1874 wrote: »

I'd like to think they wouldn't get into that state, now I did in my younger years and women I knew got me into and left me in precarious situations that I had to defuse or defend against, it's different now, even worse, I will be advising my son to stay well clear, call for help from a distance if need be, if none is forthcoming, then it's not his problem, because if he helped there are people willing to interpret a situation how they want, a false accusation as serious as that is might be the least thing to be concerned about.

What will you be telling your daughter were she to end up in such a situation?

(Please don't say she won't or anything similar, the instances of girls drinks being spiked I would think are much more likely to occur than an instance of false accusation which you are so concerned about)

SmartinMartin wrote: »

1874 and gervais08......


What a pair of di¢kheads. Hopefully your spawn have brains.

You know when you are dealing with someone of this level, can't manage to give a half decent reply, resort to insults and cant take on board/refuses to listen to reason in the replies by others that highlight the risks for anyone intervening.
I think the poster genuinely believe someone else should clean up after their mess (parenting), poster seems to think or know his daughter would be in this state.

Would you poster? give the same advice for your daughter if the drunk person was a guy? add to that a middle aged guy?

SmartinMartin wrote: »

It's far easier to walk on.

Christ. Get a grip people and contribute to your environs.

Sadly that's the way society is. Intervening to help in any situation costs you time, and drags you into said situation in a way you most likely could do without.

Few people want to bring hassle on themselves.

It is always easier to walk on. I never said it was right to.

Kraftwerk wrote: »

It's kind of ironic to talk about the toxic message being fed to women that all men are evil in a thread where the prevailing opinion is don't help any women in distress because they'll probably accuse you of sexual harassment and ruin your life.

It's 100% hysteria based on a couple of incidents.

No, it's not that they'll probably accuse you. In all likelihood they won't, but, they might. Why should a stranger take that risk? Being an upstanding specimen of humanity is no longer a good enough reason.

One thing I had to laugh here is that the good samaritan should take steps to protect themselves from a false accusation. If I have to take such steps, then really should I be, voluntarily, getting involved at all?

A year ago I was driving home late & came across 3 teenagers out of their heads falling up the motorway trying to get home post teenage disco circa 2am. I went back for them thinking they’d be killed on the motorway & offered a lift. One refused to get in but wanted to give me a fiver for helping their friends. I refused it - but their drunk friend took it. They stumbled off - now ai had broken up the group and one was off up the motorway by themself. Two females were left. I insisted on rolling the back seat windows all they way down & telling them to tell me to stop anytime & I’d let them out immediately. They lived about 40 minute drive away & I had NO idea how to get to or from it - I followed M50 signs & the slightly less drunk girl gave vague directions to her house & then got out. Other girl was comatose and could not remember where she lived. After about half an hour of driving around panicing her friend called & I took the phone & ended up letting her out at a chipper allegedly close to where she lived. It was a total nightmare of a drive, I then had zero idea of how to get home & my nerves were gone. I’ve no idea what happened the third one ( never get into a car with a stranger) & between one thing & the next I doubt I’ll ever do it again.

That I assume was drink - but with drugs nowadays thrown into the mix you have no idea of how they might be or turn on you. Some mixes make people volatile and violent & people can turn on you in a instant. Not to mention being left explaining someone OD or with injuries got elsewhere (or worse) that you are seen lumping out of your car. People here are expecting a lot from strangers - how about parents pick up their own children so they know they are safe or what they are up to. There is a lot of risk and personal accountability and responsibility in this - how about that working both ways - the drunk child & the parent, or the person drinking or taking drugs to their max .

I was horrified at the night wore on at what I had got into. I didn’t have battery left on my phone & put myself and the 3rd friend in a terrible spot. I was only lucky they didn’t puke up all over my car instead of outside - nobody needs or wants that let alone life changing accusations or claims that could easily ensue

And - as anyone who has ever called will know, ringing for an ambulance the operator has your number & insists at you to stay with them and absolutely guilts you over & over if you don’t want to be involved or were just passing by and spotted them drunk/unconscious - it’s not the 1950’s anymore when ambulances are available or even arrive for a drunk person in any kind of timely way. I know - I’ve been that person too making the call. If only God forbid there were police on the street who would arrive or intervene - but they are too cute for that too - and are inevitably buttoned up in their station or ‘no car is available’, or they are on another call and will be quite a while.. every excuse - and you are now responsible and holding the can and a moving target for anything that goes wrong or in the confused/deluded persons mind. you really need a good drinking buddy or an exit plan home before you get too messy...

JustAThought wrote: »

yeah right - ever tried that? In dublin? We do not provide a taxi service for drunks - standard reply, along with others already quoted.

Twice I've done this in the last 10 years, and twice the guards dealt with it. What's your point?

SmartinMartin wrote: »

Twice I've done this in the last 10 years, and twice the guards dealt with it. What's your point?

That they refuse point blank. But your world is different. Your gaurds come & are better than ours, you expect other people to look after and drive your drunk daughter home, etc.

Tell me how wrote: »

What will you be telling your daughter were she to end up in such a situation?

(Please don't say she won't or anything similar, the instances of girls drinks being spiked I would think are much more likely to occur than an instance of false accusation which you are so concerned about)

I dont have a daughter, but If I did, Id be encouraging her to be involved in other things from much earlier on and not think getting drunk or even drinking at all is the be all and end all and if they did, certainly not getting so blotto that they cant handle themselves or to go off on their own, Id definitely be highlighting potential of spiking of drinks.

we are talking about men driving women home who are found falling down drunk at the side
of the road after a long night out.

Tell me how wrote: »

But the logic you are proposing is to never get involved in helping someone out.

your daughter could have a flat tire on the side of the road, she might be feeling faint from illness, she might indeed have been attacked or assaulted. You, if I understand you correctly, are suggesting a bystander should never look to help such a person out for fear of being accused of something.

If I had a daughter, Id expect her to be well trained to change a wheel, that is a completely different situation to what was suggested in the OP, again, I think women mostly either are able to deal with that themselves by being capable of changing the wheel/having someone they know and trust to help/or better still having a paid service to do so which is commonplace in insurance policies, rather than relying on random helpers to turn up at all.

That said, I didnt say not call for help, so you are misquoting me, possibly intentionally, possibly by assuming so, unless you can show me where I said that?
If I suggested anything, it is that I wouldnt get personally involved, in particular in response to if the person was what I would consider obviously drunk and this has been the main suggestion, that the person was legless, also I just replied stating where I did get involved in a scenario. Public drunkenness, less likely, but thats different to someone appearing to being ill or assaulted, I would still only stay in proximity to call for help before wading in, my experience says its sensible not to, so I'll do as I please whether you like it or not.

Tell me how wrote: »

Confused as to how discussions work I see.

Ok, carry on, I've seen enough.

You seem to be confused,
You misrepresented what I have said, I have corrected that in reply.
You appear to be insisting on carrying on with that tack because I corrected that and you cant accept it? or because I disagree with your assertion? or what? you want an argument? because you seem to have ignored that.

A discussion is a two way thing, if you dont like what you hear, I cant help that. Its you that backed out without answering in any meaningful way.
You obviously couldn't or dont want to answer or dont like or agree with what you hear.
What Ive heard in the thread is, a number of posters say that they consider there is a risk in assisting someone, in particular this was about a young woman being drunk.



I even gave an example of where I did intervene, you seem to be ignoring that and continuing on as if I have not replied, but the OP was about public drunkeness of a young woman. Not imo about all other possible scenarios, having said that, the risk suggested could apply to any scenario, does a guy risk getting involved to help someone where there may be problems because of that?



Your refusal to listen because it seems you disagree and instead just reply with what you did, doesnt add anything to the discussion.
So, whether you agree or like it or not, I'll do as I see fit at any occasion if it occurs, I am outright stating that, thats my perogative. I will assess the risk myself, thank you very much. I have zero intention of getting involved personally where I determine there is unnecessary risk, it doesnt mean I wont call for help/an ambulance (which I already stated).
If you want to do otherwise, thats your decision.

Kraftwerk wrote: »

What are people afraid of happening if they asked her if she was OK?

Someone could be waiting to jump you. She could have been groped by someone else ...or drugged by someone else. And think its you.

Also ITS NOT a good idea to tell women its safe to let random men help them. Nor is it safe for men

Reynard Sinaga was a guy who waited for drunk guys to pass ..he would offer to help them if they were wasted ..he would offer them water or a drink but it was drugged he would them rape them.

He raped TWO HUNDRED MEN and recorded it on his phone.

He is now in prison for 88 life sentences.
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/jan/25/friends-flatmates-reynhard-sinaga

You should not offer a drunk girl help. Try and get a woman to help her ...or ring the guards ...

Its not a good idea to make women think its OK to accept help from random men. Its just not.

That is the world we live in ...

Its not good for anyone.

TRUST me its better for you ..its better for her.

And for all you know she/he isn't drunk and its a scam.

I was walking down the road and this drunk guy started to follow me. I started screaming at him to **** off.....he then stood up straight and it was clear he hadn't been drunk at all. But was TRYING to catch me off guard. He then said ok ...calm down im going. And then he left. Perfectly lucid. You don't know

I wouldn't want a guy i didn't know coming up to me if i was drunk. I WOULD want him to call the guards.


You are protecting everyone by letting pros handle it. Not everything has to be politicized.

In France it’s a crime not to offer assistance to a person in danger.
Looks like Ireland needs something similar.

Ha ha, you'd have to think twice to engage in this thread ..no mind picking up a plastered yang one

It just reminded me of an female yank friend as we drove throught Washington St. in Cork one night many years ago around 3am. It was like a drunken high heeled mini skirted apocalypse.
And she said "if this was the states .. they'd all be raped"
I thought it was a bit much but she seemed adamant.