End Irish anthem at GAA matches, demands DUP minister

#15 wrote: »

Thats not what I'm saying.

Promoting Irish culture is fine.

So is promoting nationalism.

But they cannot claim to be inclusive if they remain a nationalist organisation. It is their right to promote nationalism and Irish culture, and to fly the tricolour.
But they can hardly complain when unionists want no part of it, as the flag and the anthem of this country are (unfortunately) seen as symbols of militant republicanism by unionists.

Unionists cannot ''appreciate'' the GAA in that context, the same way that any republican in NI could not ''appreciate'' soccer or rugby if it promoted unionism, played GSTQ before every match, flew the Union flag and named stadiums after loyalist killers.

Lux23 wrote: »

some loyalists are willing to take an interest in our culture and its about time nationalists did the same..

#15 wrote: »

Agree. But that ethos is in conflict with unionism. So why are people complaining if unionists do not like the sport?

possinbly because theyre annoyed at the state of society in general in which a national ethos comes into direct conflict with a British ethos which views an Irish national ethos as a threat to the political status quo ie the states legitimacy being questioned . I didnt claim the complaints were actually logically thought out , i pointed to the case that such a conflict is inevitable in a scenario of a partitioned Ireland , an abnormal political situation

The GAA were just as bad with their ban on foreign games, etc.

Both sides commited wrong. Theres no point in criticising just one side.

the GAA bans on foreign games extended only to GAA players . They didnt disrupt other sports and interfere with the activity of non members . GAA also had a yearly congress in which the membership of the organisation could freely opt to overturn the ban on themselves playing foreign sports . The reason for the ban on foreign games was quite logical , in a society in which a foreign governemnt in concert with native political and religious instituions had come together and suceeded in eradicating the Irish language and many outward expressions of the national culture and psyche in the space of only a few decades , from the 1840s to the 1880s . Both the catholic church and the Irish nationalist political class such as Daniel OConnell were as guilty as anyone else for this , indeed were instrumental in it by deriding irish ways and language as backward while effectively beating the Irish language and the old ways and customs out of the kids and silencing their parents by reading their names out at the pulpit for being backward and disobeying the church .

In truth it was protestant academics who were to the fore in attempts to not only preserve but revive them . The GAA was part of this revival movement .
Ireland faced cultural genocide and the GAA was launched in response to that . The ban was integral to that position of reversing the horrendous cultural damage inflicted on the country by conserving native culture in the face of threats to its existence by much more powerful political , economic and cultural forces .

Absolutely disgusting behaviour alright. But I'm presuming it occurred pre-GFA?
In which case, there were many other disgusting acts committed by all sides.

I'm not trying to belittle your experiences mate, but members of your own community were doing wrong also.

Its no use complaining about just one side IMO.

Im not just complaining about one side . The issue however is edwin poots opposition to the GAA and his partys track record in this regard , which is lengthy , bitter and substantial . But its not just edwin poots fault . He ws led to believe northern nationalists had opted to accept the legitimacy of the northern state , indeed the norths political leaders signed a treaty to that effect . He is then confronted with a tradition and ethos which opts to show outward allegiance to a 32 county republic as opposed to British institutions in Ireland as opposed to the state which he seeks to secure . An ethos which just happens to be the biggest sporting organisation in the north . This presents him with a political difficulty , forcing him as someone who demands the staus quo is upheld to attack that ethos . The only manner in which this situation can be resolved is either within a united political entity of all 32 counties or by forcing the GAA to abandon its core ethos , that of an Irish nation . Effectively sterilising it . Its highly unlikely GAA stalwarts and even caual supporters in the north will abandon notions of nationhood on the basis of edwin poots demands . I dont believe Gerry Adams Martin McGuinness and the pope combined could manage that one .
Therefore an abnormal political situation will continue to produce conflict on one level or another .

I would suggest a fundamental change in the attitudes of both communities

sadly i would suggest that in a partitioned society normal politics will only function on the surface and paper over the cracks until the next crises arrives . In such a scenario different ethos' will continually and inevitably come into confrontation due to the abnormality of the situation . while the gfa has managed to cobble together an agreement between professional politicians it has had the added effect of reinforcing tribalism on both sides . Whilst institutionalised sectarianism thrives within mainstream politics abnormality will continue . To change that requires fundamental change which the existing constitutional arrangements cannot deliver , and indeed actively prevent .