Thread Closed  
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
29-12-2020, 20:41   #46
Vital Transformation
Registered User
 
Vital Transformation's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 381
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrMusician18 View Post
You might be new here so I'll give you the low-down. Reddit is a site with a global audience, while boards.ie is very much focussed on Ireland

In Ireland there are orders of magnitude more parents and people who will desire to be parents at some point than individuals (admittedly growing) who choose to be childless. With this in mind, the front page of the parenting forum has threads where the last posts are over a month old. I haven't counted but I'd say there are less that 30 posts in that forum in the last month, and that month was December, a particularly busy one for parents.

If parenting can barely sustain a living forum, what chance has a niche interest like childless by choice? It would be barely able to sustain a thread imo. Even the OP says it can't even sustain a FB group.

We have enough dead forums on this site. We don't need another.
I've been on boards for 12 years. You seems to have an issue with the size of the site, but it has been that kind of forum for a very long time. If the site has less traffic now than it used to have, I doubt that is the reason. There has always been a vast amount of forums here, more than any discussion website I've seen over the years apart from Reddit.

Boards has always had niche forums; I would consider that a strength of the site, providing a space for discussion aimed at a predominantly Irish audience. By nature some will always be more popular than others. If you do a search you'll see examples of very inactive forums getting closed. It's not like this process doesn't occur already.

From a brief glance, even forums like the LGBT one look pretty dead right now, and I don't think you could question the likes of that forums inclusion on this site, given the amount of people it can potentially cater for.

As it stands it seems the proposed forum has a good bit of support so far. It should be given a chance if that keeps up at least and we can see how it gets on from there. I wouldn't argue against its closure if it becomes as inactive as you predict.
Vital Transformation is offline  
(3) thanks from:
Advertisement
29-12-2020, 20:44   #47
Purple Mountain
Registered User
 
Purple Mountain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 9,358
-1 from me.
Can't see the scope.
Purple Mountain is online now  
29-12-2020, 20:52   #48
eviltwin
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 16,969
Quote:
Originally Posted by Faith View Post
Good questions. I personally wouldn't want it to be exclusionary in nature, so I reckon there's room for both. I'd be a bit surprised if there were many topics on cars and holidays, tbh, because as has been said, the absence of kids doesn't make it harder to buy a car!

Like most, it would probably involve a bit of trial-and-error to get the right balance. I think there's definitely a group of people who'll have had their kids quite young and are now at a phase in life where the kids are basically self-sufficient, but many of their friends will just now be having kids and that would probably feel a bit isolating as well. I suspect that cohort might enjoy a social space that is childfree at times as well. I also imagine there's lots of people who are on the fence about having kids who'd like to have space to explore both sides, who'd also be welcome..
In that case would calling it Child Free not be better?

If you call it child free by choice you are limiting the posting to a small niche group. You exclude parents of adult children and those people who aren’t parents but plan to be someday.

I still don’t understand why a group who choose to remain without kids would want to talk about that in its own forum. Might as well have Pet Free or Car Free forums then.
eviltwin is offline  
Thanks from:
29-12-2020, 20:54   #49
bee06
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,778
+1 from me.
bee06 is offline  
Thanks from:
29-12-2020, 20:57   #50
Galwayguy35
Registered User
 
Galwayguy35's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 13,214
+1 from me
Galwayguy35 is offline  
Thanks from:
Advertisement
29-12-2020, 21:10   #51
Bootsy
Registered User
 
Bootsy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 201
-1 from me, as someone who is childfree. I understand the spirit of the idea but I don't think there's much that would be discussed/asked there that couldn't readily be discussed elsewhere on boards, or irl with friends, as is.
Bootsy is offline  
29-12-2020, 21:25   #52
CelticRambler
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 6,132
There's one phrase that's being used to support the creation of this forum:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Faith View Post
* To chat with like-minded people socially
Quote:
Originally Posted by One eyed Jack View Post
I know that there are plenty enough like-minded people ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by PmMeUrDogs View Post
I'd absolutely love to see a forum of like minded people...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pretzill View Post
I think there are positive ramifications and also questions to be raised within a like minded community.
Here's the thing, though: if the only attribute that defines this like-mindedness is a confirmed desire to have no children, so much so that it weighs on one's everyday life, either (a) that's a very poor basis on which to form a community; or (b) it's an open invitation to the "anti-natalists" to which OneEyeJack refers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by One eyed Jack View Post
it’s almost unheard of as to be looked at as being completely unreasonable, unacceptable. That’s why you don’t see many, or indeed any threads discussing the idea being particularly popular - because often people aren’t comfortable with feeling like they have to justify themselves or their decisions ...
I would say you don't see many threads on the subject because being child-free (by choice or not) is in fact very common; and because for the most part, having or not having children is irrelevant to the vast majority of topics that affect the vast majority of people. The taste of SuperValu sausages? Irrelevant. Ordering from UK Amazon post Brexit? Irrelevant. ITV on Virgin Media? Irrelevant. MS Paint? Irrelevant. Circle K scratch and win? Irrelevant. Liveline? Irrelevant. Leeds Utd Team Talk? Irrelevant.

Amongst several child-free friends, I have one former-work-colleague-become-friend. Over the course of this last week, we have spoken about chainsaws, Christmas decorations, to work or not to work, Brexit, potential new relationships, updates on misc mutual acquaintances, Covid, the weather, gardening, cooking, the practicalities of travelling in continental Europe, music and dance. I think that's more than enough to make us "like minded" ... despite the fact that I'd love to have (more) children and she's become a borderline anti-natalist.

So I'd ask again: what advantage would there be in hiding discussions about the practical problems of real life in a quiet corner of the site, thereby deliberately excluding the people who might have the most relevant experience to contribute?
CelticRambler is offline  
29-12-2020, 21:57   #53
Pygmy Shrew
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 23
+1 here, I'm child free by choice and I feel that it's one area of society where people still don't have a voice. I'm sure I'm not the only person who is sick of the question 'do you have a family?' followed by the awkward silence when you say no. Even worse is the condescending 'oh I'm sorry to hear that',or 'oh, don't worry, you have plenty of time'! Imagine saying that to someone who is gay, transgender or racially different from you!
Pygmy Shrew is offline  
29-12-2020, 22:12   #54
eviltwin
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 16,969
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pygmy Shrew View Post
+1 here, I'm child free by choice and I feel that it's one area of society where people still don't have a voice. I'm sure I'm not the only person who is sick of the question 'do you have a family?' followed by the awkward silence when you say no. Even worse is the condescending 'oh I'm sorry to hear that',or 'oh, don't worry, you have plenty of time'! Imagine saying that to someone who is gay, transgender or racially different from you!
I’m sure that must be very frustrating but I’m not sure it’s enough to merit it’s own forum.
eviltwin is offline  
Advertisement
29-12-2020, 22:15   #55
bertsmom
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 524
Quote:
Originally Posted by HBC08
What about poor Bert?

This made me laugh! I often forget my username when I post. Bert was a beautiful dog and centre of my world. He is two years passed away in January.
My earlier example of why I'd be glad to see the Childfree by choice forum as in travel recommendations etc is really just a quick reaction to the question on further thought I really think it would be a great space to discuss things that come up in life that are affected by the childfree choice. I sometimes feel that in a wider circle unless you have or want children the discussion can (unintentionally) exclude any valid concerns you may have around topics...
bertsmom is offline  
(2) thanks from:
29-12-2020, 22:20   #56
o1s1n
Registered User
 
o1s1n's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 30,369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Akesh View Post
-1 for me. Pretty ridiculous really looking for a forum for this kind of stuff. What next? A forum for like-minded people who don't have pets??

Nonsense.
Not sure what's worse, your likening of having children to having pets or your likening of not having children to not having pets.
o1s1n is offline  
(3) thanks from:
29-12-2020, 22:30   #57
MrMusician18
Registered User
 
MrMusician18's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 3,828
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vital Transformation View Post
I've been on boards for 12 years. You seems to have an issue with the size of the site, but it has been that kind of forum for a very long time. If the site has less traffic now than it used to have, I doubt that is the reason. There has always been a vast amount of forums here, more than any discussion website I've seen over the years apart from Reddit.

Boards has always had niche forums; I would consider that a strength of the site, providing a space for discussion aimed at a predominantly Irish audience. By nature some will always be more popular than others. If you do a search you'll see examples of very inactive forums getting closed. It's not like this process doesn't occur already.

From a brief glance, even forums like the LGBT one look pretty dead right now, and I don't think you could question the likes of that forums inclusion on this site, given the amount of people it can potentially cater for.

As it stands it seems the proposed forum has a good bit of support so far. It should be given a chance if that keeps up at least and we can see how it gets on from there. I wouldn't argue against its closure if it becomes as inactive as you predict.
I've been around boards just as long, from before it's heyday, the hack and to the site we have today. A huge problem the site has is that the structure is for an awful lot more posters than we have anymore. You could compare it to the church, an organization with loads of buildings but fewer and fewer people. All these zombie forums give the impression of a dead site, when what we actually have are although much fewer, but still plenty of posters, all spread thin. When people wander into these zombie forums, they see that the last active threads have a handful of posts and the top threads were last active months ago and don't post. Who would bother posting a question in a dead forum?
On a broader point, sub-forums that have little activity should be quickly closed and merged with a complementary forum. It really doesn't happen fast enough but that's a discussion for another day.

If there is a genuine appetite for this topic I would suggest that it should go in a rebranded humanities and lifestyle forum. The two or three childless by choice "mega threads" could go there as well as discussion on other lifestyle choices.
MrMusician18 is online now  
(2) thanks from:
29-12-2020, 22:36   #58
bubblypop
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 13,187
If people are not interested in this particular forum or sub forum, why vote against it?
If I'm interested I would show my interest, but if I'm not, then I would just not comment.
If someone wanted to start a forum on people who wear cartoon character costumes, I wouldn't have any interest, but I wouldn't actively be against it.

Seems strange to actively vote against it. Maybe I'm missing something?
bubblypop is online now  
29-12-2020, 22:56   #59
One eyed Jack
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 16,704
Quote:
Originally Posted by CelticRambler View Post
There's one phrase that's being used to support the creation of this forum:

Here's the thing, though: if the only attribute that defines this like-mindedness is a confirmed desire to have no children, so much so that it weighs on one's everyday life, either (a) that's a very poor basis on which to form a community; or (b) it's an open invitation to the "anti-natalists" to which OneEyeJack refers.

(a) You don’t explain why, in your opinion, you see it as a very poor basis to form a community, when that’s precisely how any community is formed - they are borne out of shared world views and values and attitudes among people of a similar mindset.

(b) I also mentioned that while it will invariably attract people of that particular mindset, they can be directed to the more appropriate forums if they wish to prosletise their particular ideology.


Quote:
Originally Posted by CelticRambler View Post
I would say you don't see many threads on the subject because being child-free (by choice or not) is in fact very common; and because for the most part, having or not having children is irrelevant to the vast majority of topics that affect the vast majority of people. The taste of SuperValu sausages? Irrelevant. Ordering from UK Amazon post Brexit? Irrelevant. ITV on Virgin Media? Irrelevant. MS Paint? Irrelevant. Circle K scratch and win? Irrelevant. Liveline? Irrelevant. Leeds Utd Team Talk? Irrelevant.

It’s really not that common at all for people who choose not to have children and live their lives accordingly. It’s really not at all as simple as “Don’t want children? Abstain from sex! Easy, job done, end of discussion!”. The decision forms the fundamental basis of a person’s world view and impacts on many or all aspects of their lives to some degree or to one degree or another. They live in a society where they are constantly bombarded with advertising for example that extols the virtues of family values as still being the state of the nuclear family, whereas in Ireland the Family as an institution as it is regarded in the Irish Constitution is not by whether or not one has children, but rather through the institution of Marriage. From the point of view of the State, a married couple is a family, whereas from the point of view of most people in Irish society at least - Family begins when people have children.

It’s not about what is irrelevant to a person or to a community of people, it’s about what is relevant - sure, for you or other people who think like you do, they’re not going to see the relevance of not having children in discussing the topics you mention, but I don’t imagine the forum would be solely restricted to discussing those topics. It’s not even about discussing those topics specifically, the sense of community comes from being able to have discussions that are fundamentally from the point of view of not having children. If you’ll pardon the crudity of the analogy for a minute but it’s the easiest one that comes to mind - I don’t know what it’s like for women that like nothing better than to get home from work in the evening and throw off their bra (I’ve never objected), but I get the idea behind it - that for them it’s liberation from a restriction that they’ve had to put up with all day. While I myself am in possession of a fine pair of moobs (IMO), I don’t imagine I’ll ever need the additional support and restrictions that come from wearing such devices (or more particularly an ill-fitting one that completely defeats the intended purpose). It’s not even interesting to me, but it’s something I know a lot of ladies experience, but don’t talk about in polite society, rather they speak of such issues in hushed tones among themselves. It’s the same with not having children, and when another poster questioned the poster on the rationale of a meet-up group for women only, I figured the simplest explanation is that is it’s intended purpose - a forum or quorum as it were for women who do not wish to have children, they have a commonality which defines their community. There doesn’t have to be any more to it, but there is. I’m not a woman, but I still know of the social pressure that young girls and women experience as motherhood straddles somewhere between an expectation and an obligation - to become what society expects of them, and to fulfill that role in spite of the fact that they may wish to choose a different path in life for themselves. Any girl or woman who deviates from that path is to be immediately viewed with suspicion, if not outright contempt.

That’s why you don’t see many threads where people feel free to admit they do not wish to have children, or where they do not feel embarrassment and humiliation for the fact that they can’t. Merely saying it’s nothing to be embarrassed about, isn’t telling anyone anything they aren’t acutely aware of already.


Quote:
Originally Posted by CelticRambler View Post
Amongst several child-free friends, I have one former-work-colleague-become-friend. Over the course of this last week, we have spoken about chainsaws, Christmas decorations, to work or not to work, Brexit, potential new relationships, updates on misc mutual acquaintances, Covid, the weather, gardening, cooking, the practicalities of travelling in continental Europe, music and dance. I think that's more than enough to make us "like minded" ... despite the fact that I'd love to have (more) children and she's become a borderline anti-natalist.

So I'd ask again: what advantage would there be in hiding discussions about the practical problems of real life in a quiet corner of the site, thereby deliberately excluding the people who might have the most relevant experience to contribute?

Who has suggested hiding discussions away? Isn’t the very fact that this forum specifically is being requested, evidence that the people who support the idea of its creation, don’t want discussion hidden away in one mega thread in Parenting or TLL or TGC or wherever? It’s proposed as a forum in its own right under the Soc category at least, same as all the other forums which exist already pertaining to accommodating the many different facets of society. The people with the most relevant experience to contribute? Not sure exactly who they might be (though priests and nuns invariably spring to mind), but I don’t foresee the forum as intending to exclude anyone when it’s been explicitly stated and reassurances have been given already of the forums intended live and let live ethos (minus the prosletysing of ideologues of course), but as long an everyone is on the same page I could see the forum adding value to what Boards offers to Irish society, by providing a space for more people in the community where they can indeed relax without all the additional stress of not having children.

Last edited by One eyed Jack; 29-12-2020 at 23:30.
One eyed Jack is offline  
(2) thanks from:
29-12-2020, 23:34   #60
Raichu
Registered User
 
Raichu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 893
Quote:
Originally Posted by bubblypop View Post
If people are not interested in this particular forum or sub forum, why vote against it?
If I'm interested I would show my interest, but if I'm not, then I would just not comment.
If someone wanted to start a forum on people who wear cartoon character costumes, I wouldn't have any interest, but I wouldn't actively be against it.

Seems strange to actively vote against it. Maybe I'm missing something?
That’s the way this forum works. You can either vote for or against.

Why it matters whether a forum you’re not interested in exits or not I don’t know.

In any case,

+1 cos why the hell not.
Raichu is offline  
Thread Closed

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search