Arlene Foster at it again...

Odhinn · 01-12-2020 1:52am

walshb wrote: »

Utter bull..

.

Nope, the paras were unleashed upon the nationalist population of the north,m with all their attendant brutality. What they got was what they deserved.

Gervais08 · 01-12-2020 1:58am

Odhinn wrote: »

Nope, the paras were unleashed upon the nationalist population of the north,m with all their attendant brutality. What they got was what they deserved.

My dad may God rest his soul did his national service with the Paras in the 50s, guys who either were at Arhhem e.g. or served with them - spoke highly of them.

Fast forward 15 years and he sees the same regiment on the streets of our country and he couldn’t believe it was the same people. Hated them the rest of his life - whatever honour they may have displayed has gone and yeah, any of them here did deserve all they got.

UDAWINNER · 01-12-2020 2:17am

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You are a nationalist who made a big deal about how you would call out anyone who did something like this and weren't able to show where you had done this.

A nationalist who only calls out the wrongs of nationalists...hmmmm

Not buying that one quite yet.

I'm not hardline in the slightest...I'm looking for solutions to this, because it isn't just about a tweet and it's not going to be found in hypocritical high moral grounding either.

might be what they call a bangor catholic

flanna01 · 01-12-2020 2:21am

Christ... How can people still keep digging up the past?

What's done, is done.

Move forward.. Embrace each other.

You'll never go forward, if you keep looking back.

I spent time in the Summer on both sides of the divide. The Shankill and Falls Road.

Both sides were welcoming, both sides were hospitable towards me (and the Mrs). I couldn't pick a fault with either 'side'.

The lack of trust comes out unintentionally during general conversation, but apart from that, great people.

Both sides must learn to live in harmony, which can be achieved. To do this, the next generation must be free from the hate instilled by their forefathers.

Incidentally, I learnt this year that Catholic boys are now courting Protestant girls and viceversa..

Is this the wind of change that Northern Ireland so desperately needs..?

UDAWINNER · 01-12-2020 2:30am

flanna01 wrote: »

Christ... How can people still keep digging up the past?

What's done, is done.

Move forward.. Embrace each other.

You'll never go forward, if you keep looking back.

I spent time in the Summer on both sides of the divide. The Shankill and Falls Road.

Both sides were welcoming, both sides were hospitable towards me (and the Mrs). I couldn't pick a fault with either 'side'.

The lack of trust comes out unintentionally during general conversation, but apart from that, great people.

Both sides must learn to live in harmony, which can be achieved. To do this, the next generation must be free from the hate instilled by their forefathers.

Incidentally, I learnt this year that Catholic boys are now courting Protestant girls and viceversa..

Is this the wind of change that Northern Ireland so desperately needs..?

A lot of it is done in the republic to stop SF from getting support to go into govt from the usual FF FG fanboys. Wouldn't dare call the DUP out on anything.
Look at last month for example where Micheal Martin could not go the centenary do in cork but rather ran up to eniskillen with his feckin poppy which ironically celebrates the murder of irish people.

blanch152 · 01-12-2020 12:17pm

walshb wrote: »

Like I said. Any threads about Unionists/loyalists wrongs?

I have no issue condemning..

Those threads pop up from time to time. They tend to be short as everyone who posts in those threads condemns the Unionist/loyalist wrong. There is nobody in there denying reality and making Stanleyesque posts glorifying the wrong.

blanch152 · 01-12-2020 12:19pm

UDAWINNER wrote: »

A lot of it is done in the republic to stop SF from getting support to go into govt from the usual FF FG fanboys. Wouldn't dare call the DUP out on anything.
Look at last month for example where Micheal Martin could not go the centenary do in cork but rather ran up to eniskillen with his feckin poppy which ironically celebrates the murder of irish people.

The Sinn Fein victim mentality is getting tiresome. Time they got on with behaving normally.

daithi7 · 01-12-2020 12:30pm

'Arlene Foster at it again..."

Phew, that's a relief, when I saw that headline I thought there might be visual evidence of much more graphic behaviour from Arlene here.... and tbh that could put me off my lunch!!

FrancieBrady · 01-12-2020 12:33pm

blanch152 wrote: »

Those threads pop up from time to time. They tend to be short as everyone who posts in those threads condemns the Unionist/loyalist wrong. There is nobody in there denying reality and making Stanleyesque posts glorifying the wrong.

Have you started any blanch? Posted in many?

walshb made a big deal about his/her evenhandedness, when asked to link to proof of that, he/she came up rather short.

blanch152 · 01-12-2020 1:41pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Have you started any blanch? Posted in many?

walshb made a big deal about his/her evenhandedness, when asked to link to proof of that, he/she came up rather short.

The next time I see someone defending the indefensible in a thread on a unionist atrocity, I will call them out and point out what they are doing.

The thing is, it just doesn't happen.

FrancieBrady · 01-12-2020 2:04pm

blanch152 wrote: »

The next time I see someone defending the indefensible in a thread on a unionist atrocity, I will call them out and point out what they are doing.

The thing is, it just doesn't happen.

Good man.
Thing is, it's a bit late to be claiming even handedness as walshb claimed he/she was. But a word of caution, what seems 'indefensible' to you may be perfectly defendable to somebody else.
You aren't the 'oracle' on such matters just as I am not either.

blanch152 · 01-12-2020 2:08pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Good man.
Thing is, it's a bit late to be claiming even handedness as walshb claimed he/she was. But a word of caution, what seems 'indefensible' to you may be perfectly defendable to somebody else.
You aren't the 'oracle' on such matters just as I am not either.

There is no opportunity to display even-handedness. There aren't any posters defending the UDA or the UVF, suggesting that what they did was normal.

#notanormalparty

walshb · 01-12-2020 2:12pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Good man.
Thing is, it's a bit late to be claiming even handedness as walshb claimed he/she was. But a word of caution, what seems 'indefensible' to you may be perfectly defendable to somebody else.
You aren't the 'oracle' on such matters just as I am not either.

Francie, what are you expecting?

People to start calling Unionists out to please you?

If they warrant calling out, they will be. Certainly by me.....

You are coming across very immature here...

The thread relates to a complaint made about a SF tweet.

To me, that tweet was incredibly insensitive and wrong. Your response is the usual deflection: But what about this and that and the other....

FFS, even SF have acknowledged this, in their own way.....the author had to take it down.

Some great people, like Martin and Gerry, they themselves have shown the compassion and respect to the other side for loss of life....

Plenty other great republican and SF people the same...

You come across as too callous here.....always wanting to Brit bash and Unionist bash....that's the way it comes across, and I am sorry, that doesn't make you any more Irish than me...

I can't stand the wanting to Brit bash....I want us to rise above this and welcome our neighbors and work with them to continue building peace...

And tweets like the other day do the cause no good, and same for Unionists who are having their say and swipes against nationalists.

Always a competition with you...

Deal with the facts: If you want people to Unionist bash, set a thread up of their wrongdoings and we can discuss..

FrancieBrady · 01-12-2020 2:17pm

blanch152 wrote: »

There is no opportunity to display even-handedness. There aren't any posters defending the UDA or the UVF, suggesting that what they did was normal.

#notanormalparty

Well, yes there is...right now on the Pat Finucane thread. Defending the British assassinating him.

walshb · 01-12-2020 2:21pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Well, yes there is...right now on the Pat Finucane thread. Defending the British assassinating him.

The murder of that man by loyalists and British state collusion was abhorrent...

Add this to my list, please....

It is beyond defending for me

But, as always , works both ways....

Loyalists and Unionists will say some IRA killings are beyond defending.

FrancieBrady · 01-12-2020 2:22pm

walshb wrote: »

Francie, what are you expecting?

People to start calling Unionists out to please you?

If they warrant calling out, they will be. Certainly by me.....

You are coming across very immature here...

The thread relates to a complaint made about a SF tweet.

To me, that tweet was incredibly insensitive and wrong. Your response is the usual deflection: But what about this and that and the other....

FFS, even SF have acknowledged this, in their own way.....the author had to take it down.

Some great people, like Martin and Gerry, they themselves have shown the compassion and respect to the other side for loss of life....

Plenty other great republican and SF people the same...

You come across as too callous here.....always wanting to Brit bash and Unionist bash....that's the way it comes across, and I am sorry, that doesn't make you any more Irish than me...

I can't stand the wanting to Brit bash....I want us to rise above this and welcome our neighbors and work with them to continue building peace...

And tweets like the other day do the cause no good, and same for Unionists who are having their say go against nationalists.

Always a competition with you...

Deal with the facts: If you want people to Unionist bash, set a thread up of their wrongdoings and we can discuss..

Ditto walshb. You come across as disingenuous. I asked you to link to where you had as you said yourself, challenged this insensitivity from the other side, and you couldn't do that.

I did it after trying to engage with you in a discussion on what you saw as a solution. You wouldn't engage on that either. Your preferred solution is to silence or censor and ban.
I explained to you that wasn't going to work in relation to triumphalism, which is what the 12th is about.
You accused me of deflecting.

I want a society were we can all remember with respect, were each can remember their dead. If that is 'callous', fair enough.

FrancieBrady · 01-12-2020 2:23pm

walshb wrote: »

The murder of that man by loyalists and British state collusion was abhorrent...

Add this to my list, please....

It is beyond defending for me

But, as always , works both ways....

Loyalists and Unionists will say some IRA killings are beyond defending.

The thread were it is being defended is that way >>>>

walshb · 01-12-2020 2:27pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Ditto walshb. You come across as disingenuous. I asked you to link to where you had as you said yourself, challenged this insensitivity from the other side, and you couldn't do that.

I did it after trying to engage with you in a discussion on what you saw as a solution. You wouldn't engage on that either. Your preferred solution is to silence or censor and ban.
I explained to you that wasn't going to work in relation to triumphalism, which is what the 12th is about.
You accused me of deflecting.

I want a society were we can all remember with respect, were each can remember their dead. If that is 'callous', fair enough.

I have over 40000 posts on boards

And I know a few definitely have come out strongly against Loyalists up North for their wrongs

Anyway, it's just plain odd that you are looking for it......

It's so childish......

I think the tweet was very wrong....end of.....you take this and then start moaning because I am not giving out about Unionists.....?

As regards a solution: That is fooking simple: Both sides to come together and embrace....

Not to be antagonizing and stoking and causing offense to each other with insensitive comments and tweets about the loss of life on BOTH sides...

FrancieBrady · 01-12-2020 2:30pm

walshb wrote: »

I have over 40000 posts on boards

And I know a few definitely have come out strongly against Loyalists up North for their wrongs

Anyway, it's just plain odd that you are looking for it......

It's so childish......

I think the tweet was very wrong....end of.....you take this and then start moaning because I am not giving out about Unionists.....?

I am not moaning. It was you who calimed to be evenhanded. You aren't here on boards.ie. End of. That's your own affair.

There are now two posters on the Finucane thread, condoning his killing. No sign of you or blanch.

walshb · 01-12-2020 2:33pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I am not moaning. It was you who calimed to be evenhanded. You aren't here on boards.ie. End of. That's your own affair.

There are now two posters on the Finucane thread, condoning his killing. No sign of you or blanch.

FFS, I didn't even know this Finucane thread existed till you said it...

And for the umpteenth time, I have called out loyalists and Unionists.....I have done so a few times on this thread alone...

FrancieBrady · 01-12-2020 2:42pm

walshb wrote: »

FFS, I didn't even know this Finucane thread existed till you said it...

And for the umpteenth time, I have called out loyalists and Unionists.....I have done so a few times on this thread alone...

YOU claimed you were evenhanded in your criticism:

I will simply call out what I believe to be wrong from either side..

'Simply' put, you haven't called out what you believe to be wrong from either side in 40,000 posts since 2005.

I'll leave it at that, just repeating stuff here.

Cluedo Monopoly · 01-12-2020 2:46pm

walshb wrote: »

I have over 40000 posts on boards

Any good ones?

walshb · 01-12-2020 2:46pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

YOU claimed you were evenhanded in your criticism:

'Simply' put, you haven't called out what you believe to be wrong from either side in 40,000 posts since 2005.

I'll leave it at that, just repeating stuff here.

Yes, we will

So you have read all 40000 posts and not one is relating to me calling out wrongdoings by Loyalists-Unionists....?

We'll ignore the few in this thread alone....so the almost 40000 other posts.....?

walshb · 01-12-2020 2:47pm

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

Any good ones?

Sh1t loads!

FrancieBrady · 01-12-2020 2:58pm

walshb wrote: »

Yes, we will

So you have read all 40000 posts and not one is relating to me calling out wrongdoings by Loyalists-Unionists....?

We'll ignore the few in this thread alone....so the almost 40000 other posts.....?

It's not up to me to back up things YOU say. I asked you to back up

I will simply call out what I believe to be wrong from either side

where you had done that previous to this thread and you didn't.

Fair enough, we'll leave it at that.

walshb · 01-12-2020 3:01pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

It's not up to me to back up things YOU say. I asked you to back up where you had done that previous to this thread and you didn't.

Fair enough, we'll leave it at that.

Let's leave it

I need to back up nothing....you made the claim.....

Get your excel sheet ready and post all my posts to prove your claim..

I don't have to provide you with anything....you started it, made the claim.

I know well that some of my 40000 posts on boards show me calling out the wrongs of loyalists and Unionists...

blanch152 · 01-12-2020 3:37pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Well, yes there is...right now on the Pat Finucane thread. Defending the British assassinating him.

Stop telling lies. I just had a look at the last page of that thread (I could have gone back further but you say right now at 13:17, and that covers the last four hours back to 10:54).

There are people defending the decision not to hold an enquiry (and there is an argument, whether acceptable or not, that it would be a waste of time) but I don't see people right now defending the British assassinating him. There was one earlier defending it and they got correctly threadbanned.

On the other hand, on every single page of every single Sinn Fein thread, there is someone defending them night and day.

#notanormalparty

FrancieBrady · 01-12-2020 3:45pm

blanch152 wrote: »

Stop telling lies. I just had a look at the last page of that thread (I could have gone back further but you say right now at 13:17, and that covers the last four hours back to 10:54).

There are people defending the decision not to hold an enquiry (and there is an argument, whether acceptable or not, that it would be a waste of time) but I don't see people right now defending the British assassinating him. There was one earlier defending it and they got correctly threadbanned.

On the other hand, on every single page of every single Sinn Fein thread, there is someone defending them night and day.

#notanormalparty

In a war anyone who is an enemy or collaborates with the enemy has to expect death.
It didn't matter if a soldier is in uniform on armed patrol on the Falls Road or having pints in a pub in Birmingham.
It didn't matter if a republican was sitting at home watching TV with his kids or armed with a gun attacking an RUC station.
Pat Finucane was getting republicans off scot free who were going back to war as soon as they came out of prison.
Too bad

P.S. I didn't know there was a time limit on objecting to this kind of stuff and being 'evenhanded' in your criticism.

If you object to what Stanley said, you would be on the post above objecting to it as well. If you were being evenhanded that is.
That post says Finucane was a legitimate target of the state.

Dyr · 01-12-2020 3:47pm

walshb wrote: »

Wrong that.

So post a thread on unionist issues and we’ll log in and condemn..

This thread could concerns the SF tweet..

I'm pretty sure if I looked back over your post history, there wouldnt be many posts about Sammy, the bould Lord Kilcooley and the rest but plenty about shinners

Both sides, doesnt really work when you have to go "oh yeah, them too"

walshb · 01-12-2020 3:50pm

Look at the Finucane killing for the loyalists side..

To them he was as legitimate a target as some who died from IRA killings..

I personally think his murder was terrorism that the British Army/State were involved in

It’s the usual back and forth from both sides here..

walshb · 01-12-2020 3:53pm

Bambi wrote: »

I'm pretty sure if I looked back over your post history, there wouldnt be many posts about Sammy, the bould Lord Kilcooley and the rest but plenty about shinners

Both sides, doesnt really work when you have to go "oh yeah, them too"

And plenty about republicans and nationalist in praise..

I have always had respect and admiration and support for republicans and nationalists up North who have had to fight for their lives to exist.

I have also made the claim that there would be no peace without the IRA. They were very important in bringing about a peace..

Now, this is the 21sr century: we need to move on from the past and embrace togetherness and inclusiveness and friendship. It is the only way.

So, if either side clearly stray from this, they deserve to be criticised..

RandomViewer · 01-12-2020 3:53pm

walshb wrote: »

Look at the Finucane killing for the loyalists side..

To them he was as legitimate a target as some who died from IRA killings..

I personally think his murder was terrorism that the British Army/State were involved in

It’s the usual back and forth from both sides here..

How do you stand on the possible Garda collusion in the loyalist murder of Eddie Fullerton?

walshb · 01-12-2020 3:56pm

RandomViewer wrote: »

How do you stand on the possible Garda collusion in the loyalist murder of Eddie Fullerton?

I haven’t read up on that.

blanch152 · 01-12-2020 4:01pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

P.S. I didn't know there was a time limit on objecting to this kind of stuff and being 'evenhanded' in your criticism.

If you object to what Stanley said, you would be on the post above objecting to it as well. If you were being evenhanded that is.
That post says Finucane was a legitimate target of the state.

You said that right now (13:17), there were people over on the thread defending the British assassination.

I went over and looked - there were none.

Previously, there was one poster defending it - they got threadbanned.

There is a second poster who is ironically taking the line that it was a war (I assume you agree with that) and that made Finucane a legitimate target (maybe Finucane's brother he was thinking of). I don't agree that it is a war, but I am not rehashing that argument in that thread, so I didn't respond.

If they threadbanned immediately all those who defend terrorist actions, we would be here all day.

FrancieBrady · 01-12-2020 4:32pm

blanch152 wrote: »

You said that right now (13:17), there were people over on the thread defending the British assassination.

I went over and looked - there were none.

Previously, there was one poster defending it - they got threadbanned.

There is a second poster who is ironically taking the line that it was a war (I assume you agree with that) and that made Finucane a legitimate target (maybe Finucane's brother he was thinking of). I don't agree that it is a war, but I am not rehashing that argument in that thread, so I didn't respond.

If they threadbanned immediately all those who defend terrorist actions, we would be here all day.

As wishy washy defences go that takes some beating. Your lack of 'evenhandedness' is dependent on me using a turn of phrase 'right now'?

And you don't want to 'rehash' arguments?

I think we are done here on the 'we are even handed in our condemnation' claims.

c.p.w.g.w · 01-12-2020 4:50pm

walshb wrote: »

Look at the Finucane killing for the loyalists side..

To them he was as legitimate a target as some who died from IRA killings..

I personally think his murder was terrorism that the British Army/State were involved in

It’s the usual back and forth from both sides here..

When Sovereign states commit crimes they aren't deemed terrorist acts, sovereign states are supposed to be held to higher standards...

Pat Finucane's murder could be deemed a war crime, a sovereign state murdering a man, his blood and the blood of many killed at the hands of the Brits stains HRM in Buckingham Palace

Sam Quentin · 01-12-2020 4:53pm

LollipopJimmy wrote: »

Sinn Fein are a pox and an embarrassment. They hadn't got the balls to run enough candidates to win the election outright, proving they don't want to be in government. Then they have idiots like this fella, McElduff posing with a kingsmill loaf on his head and that other thick in the South East singing about the 'RA' when he got elected.

Sinn Fein have been the biggest opposition party for some time now and have let this government away with murder because they're all fart and no ****e. No balls to step up and no workable policies, only guff and bluster trying to keep us in the 70s

You voted Sinn Féin.. Didn't Yaaaaaaa!?

walshb · 01-12-2020 4:55pm

c.p.w.g.w wrote: »

When Sovereign states commit crimes they aren't deemed terrorist acts, sovereign states are supposed to be held to higher standards...

Pat Finucane's murder could be deemed a war crime, a sovereign state murdering a man, his blood and the blood of many killed at the hands of the Brits stains HRM in Buckingham Palace

War crime, terrorist act....whatever words...It was state collusion and absolutely abhorrent.

blanch152 · 01-12-2020 6:05pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

As wishy washy defences go that takes some beating. Your lack of 'evenhandedness' is dependent on me using a turn of phrase 'right now'?

And you don't want to 'rehash' arguments?

I think we are done here on the 'we are even handed in our condemnation' claims.

I didn't use the phrase "right now" to exaggerate my claim - you did, and I called you out on it.

Apart from the one person who was threadbanned, you still haven't produced anything to back up your statement that right now (13:17), there were people over on the thread defending the British assassination.

It doesn't happen on unionist threads, the only posters who defend terrorist acts are on Sinn Fein threads.

FrancieBrady · 01-12-2020 6:10pm

blanch152 wrote: »

I didn't use the phrase "right now" to exaggerate my claim - you did, and I called you out on it.

Apart from the one person who was threadbanned, you still haven't produced anything to back up your statement that right now (13:17), there were people over on the thread defending the British assassination.

It doesn't happen on unionist threads, the only posters who defend terrorist acts are on Sinn Fein threads.

You have somebody legitimising the killibg of a solicitor.
Not a peep out of you.

You can be pedantic ss much as you wish.

c.p.w.g.w · 01-12-2020 6:12pm

walshb wrote: »

War crime, terrorist act....whatever words...It was state collusion and absolutely abhorrent.

Oh I agree, my point was that a sovereign state is supposed to be held to higher standard

blanch152 · 01-12-2020 6:36pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You have somebody legitimising the killibg of a solicitor.
Not a peep out of you.

You can be pedantic ss much as you wish.

The poster was reported and threadbanned, what more do you want?

FrancieBrady · 01-12-2020 6:40pm

blanch152 wrote: »

The poster was reported and threadbanned, what more do you want?

costacorta was. The poster I quoted has not been.

blanch152 · 01-12-2020 9:42pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

costacorta was. The poster I quoted has not been.

From my perspective, that poster was engaged in parody at your expense, calling the conflict a war (which it wasn't but which you proclaim night and day on here) and that as a participant on one side, Finucane can have no complaints. Perhaps I got that wrong and he is genuinely defending it, but you certainly can't criticise him when you have engaged in the exact same thing from the opposite perspective.

He was calling out your hypocrisy in my opinion.

FrancieBrady · 01-12-2020 9:45pm

blanch152 wrote: »

From my perspective, that poster was engaged in parody at your expense, calling the conflict a war (which it wasn't but which you proclaim night and day on here) and that as a participant on one side, Finucane can have no complaints. Perhaps I got that wrong and he is genuinely defending it, but you certainly can't criticise him when you have engaged in the exact same thing from the opposite perspective.

He was calling out your hypocrisy in my opinion.

Sure he was blanch.

You showed your true colours blanch. You couldn't care less about Loyalist/British violence, one agenda and one only.

walshb · 01-12-2020 9:48pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Sure he was blanch.

You showed your true colours blanch. You couldn't care less about Loyalist/British violence, one agenda and one only.

Francie,

These type posts only show desperation..

Calling out issues a poster has with SF or the IRA seems to be bugging you to the point of these type immature replies from you..

Nowhere is it at all obvious or clear, or even implied that blanch either couldn’t care about loyalist atrocities or is excusing them..

But because the poster has pointed out his/her issues with SF, you are resorting to this silliness.

FrancieBrady · 01-12-2020 9:57pm

walshb wrote: »

Francie,

These type posts only show desperation..

Calling out issues a poster has with SF or the IRA seems to be bugging you to the point of these type immature replies from you..

Nowhere is it at all obvious or clear, or even implied that blanch either couldn’t care about loyalist atrocities or is excusing them..

But because the poster has pointed out his/her issues with SF, you are resorting to this silliness.

Don't claim evenhandedness if you aren't - simple.

If you say you call it out on both sides, there should be plenty of evidence. There isn't...not even today when posters where legitimising killing by the British state.

walshb · 01-12-2020 9:58pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Don't claim evenhandedness if you aren't - simple.

If you say you call it out on both sides, there should be plenty of evidence. There isn't...not even today when posters where legitimising killing by the British state.

Where was blanch legitimising-excusing loyalist wrongdoings/atrocities?

FrancieBrady · 01-12-2020 10:02pm

walshb wrote: »

Where was blanch legitimising-excusing loyalist wrongdoings/atrocities?

What?

walshb · 01-12-2020 10:03pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

What?

Ok,

So he/she wasn’t..

Leave it there!

Arlene Foster at it again...

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