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05-05-2019, 12:10   #61
strandroad
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When you become “world renowned” for your work I think the waters get muddied.

A junior employee who no one knows where they are employed is probably fine to spout nonsense but when you’re further up the food chain you’re going to face potential consequences, whether right or wrong.
Yes it's exactly like the Israel Folau situation. They were posting as their named and employer-affiliated selves. He was saying that gays go to hell, she was saying that you can only be what you are born as and no provisions should be made to accommodate you otherwise because you're a threat = the content stigmatised a particular group potentially present among the employers staff and most certainly present among their customer base. They received warnings but continued regardless.
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05-05-2019, 12:13   #62
BattleCorp
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No, because this is true.

However you may be compelled to say that people with a penis are women and people with a vagina are men.
Not transwomen or transmen, but simply women or men.
That is where you cannot be allowed to have divergent thought, it appears.
The definition of true seems to be changing quite a lot these days.
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05-05-2019, 12:14   #63
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Yes it's exactly like the Israel Folau situation. They were posting as their named and employer-affiliated selves. He was saying that gays go to hell, she was saying that you can only be what you are born as and no provisions should be made to accommodate you otherwise because you're a threat = the content stigmatised a particular group potentially present among the employers staff and most certainly present among their customer base. They received warnings but continued regardless.

That is not what she said.
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05-05-2019, 12:16   #64
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Yes it's exactly like the Israel Folau situation. They were posting as their named and employer-affiliated selves. He was saying that gays go to hell, she was saying that you can only be what you are born as and no provisions should be made to accommodate you otherwise because you're a threat = the content stigmatised a particular group potentially present among the employers staff and most certainly present among their customer base. They received warnings but continued regardless.
It's not though. Saying gays go to hell is not the same as saying there needs to be continued open debate about gender ideology and gender self identification especially regarding female only spaces.
Does nobody do nuance anymore?
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05-05-2019, 12:18   #65
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If I say, I believe that people with a penis are men and people with a vagina are women, can my employer sack me - legally?

If so, what next..............

I say I don't like cheese outside of work, can my employer decide they no longer want to employ me? Can they sack me - legally?

I suppose legally it would depend and I'm not too sure. Most companies would have a clause saying if you bring the company in disrepute this can be a sackable offense. So, there might be a struggle with the cheese argument.


Similarly, if I write a blog article saying I hate black people, think they are inferior and prone to committing crime compared to white people and my employer sees it, should they not be allowed do anything? What if the article becomes very popular and it's widely known I work for a certain company? What if I work with a lot of black people?
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05-05-2019, 12:18   #66
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Yes it's exactly like the Israel Folau situation. They were posting as their named and employer-affiliated selves. He was saying that gays go to hell, she was saying that you can only be what you are born as and no provisions should be made to accommodate you otherwise because you're a threat = the content stigmatised a particular group potentially present among the employers staff and most certainly present among their customer base. They received warnings but continued regardless.
I didn’t read that anywhere in her article. In fact I read a lot of this:

Organisations concerned with international development and global social change seek to support a world where universal human rights are protected and where people can influence the decisions which affect their lives. This should include holding open the space to allow people to talk about the meaning of the word “women”, and about how the rights of both women and transgender people can be protected. People should not have to be brave to talk about this.
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05-05-2019, 12:19   #67
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It should be in some cases, in many ways free speech was a mistake.
Franco lives on in El Bee.
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05-05-2019, 12:19   #68
strandroad
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That is not what she said.
It is. She does not accept that you can transition to be of opposite identity and she campaigns to keep them out of shared spaces afterwards.

There are many issues to sort out legally around sports, prisons etc of course. But her answer is to deny access completely and do not recognise the change.
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05-05-2019, 12:20   #69
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The liberals are the true fascist

Are you american? So why are you talking like one?
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05-05-2019, 12:22   #70
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A man cannot turn himself into a woman, no matter what the progressive Taliban types want us to believe.
....and that is the simple FACT of the matter.
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05-05-2019, 12:24   #71
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It is. She does not accept that you can transition to be of opposite identity and she campaigns to keep them out of shared spaces afterwards.

There are many issues to sort out legally around sports, prisons etc of course. But her answer is to deny access completely and do not recognise the change.
Can you quote her saying any of those things?

Now I hope transwomen are not gagging to get into prison at all, but if they are sentenced, given that there have been rapes of women in prison by self ID transwomen, then access should not be allowed. It would be unsafe for transwomen to go to male prison too, so there have to be separate spaces. But do not just dump them in with women, that's not fair at all. Most self ID transwomen prisoners are sex offenders - statistically. There have been rapes in female shelters too.
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05-05-2019, 12:24   #72
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It's not though. Saying gays go to hell is not the same as saying there needs to be continued open debate about gender ideology and gender self identification especially regarding female only spaces.
Does nobody do nuance anymore?

Whatever about nuances, it seems that the ability to read an opinion piece challenging an ideology with reasoned argument is impossible to some, especially when it comes to summarising what was actually said in that opinion piece. I guess that doesn't suit the agenda.

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It is. She does not accept that you can transition to be of opposite identity and she campaigns to keep them out of shared spaces afterwards.

There are many issues to sort out legally around sports, prisons etc of course. But her answer is to deny access completely and do not recognise the change.
Read the article again. If that's what you took out of it, you may need more than glasses. "Accommodating" indeed !
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05-05-2019, 12:27   #73
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"An internationally renowned researcher on tax avoidance is believed to be the first person in Britain to lose her job for saying that transgender women are not women."

If this is as black and white as she put it, it's not a great look. Not sure why some women think it's more acceptable for them to be transphobic just because they're women.
Companies are judged by the staff they keep. It's a tough one. What if you want to disassociate yourself from hateful views, but the one spewing them is an employee? Personally I would've just not renewed her contract to avoid the court case, but I wonder how long she was contracted for...

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....and that is the simple FACT of the matter.
Only if you don't understand the difference between gender and sex.
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05-05-2019, 12:29   #74
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Nah. Irish women reject this exclusionary nonsense https://feministire.com/2018/01/22/a...ts-in-ireland/
A blog that is not known outside of South Dublin cafes is hardly representative of Irish women.

Maybe of a slice of Middle and Upper Class Irish women and even a few working class ones but it is a niche site.
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05-05-2019, 12:30   #75
strandroad
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Can you quote her saying any of those things?
That's her manifesto:

https://medium.com/@MForstater/i-los...ts-2af2186ae84

She does not accept that people who transitioned should be treated according to their new gender. I don't know what she proposes instead though. Some sort of limbo?
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