FF/FG/Green Government - part 2

Truthvader · 12-10-2020 9:47am

FrancieBrady wrote: »

We can play that game all day if you wish to waste time Truth. What about over paid bankers or TD's?

Like Dessie Ellis and Angus?

Have yet to see a proposal from Sinn Fein that involves paying for anything

FrancieBrady · 12-10-2020 9:55am

The cohort out today with their fantasy republic game.

Another week another smokescreen

christy c · 12-10-2020 9:56am

Truthvader wrote: »

Have yet to see a proposal from Sinn Fein that involves paying for anything

Step 1 is to drive the multinationals out of the country with their childish approach to corporate tax outlined in the first pages of this thread. Not sure of the intricacies of how they will replace that lost tax income but it involves shouting "FAIRNESS" repeatedly.

Step 2 is to increase tax on those earning over €140,000. The fact that some of these are working in the companies mentioned above seems to have been missed, but something again about fairness.

smurgen · 12-10-2020 10:19am

christy c wrote: »

Step 1 is to drive the multinationals out of the country with their childish approach to corporate tax outlined in the first pages of this thread. Not sure of the intricacies of how they will replace that lost tax income but it involves shouting "FAIRNESS" repeatedly.

Step 2 is to increase tax on those earning over €140,000. The fact that some of these are working in the companies mentioned above seems to have been missed, but something again about fairness.

FG pandemic response :

1. Remove tax resident restrictions:. "Catherine Murphy described Revenue’s decision to allow non-residents in Ireland to avoid paying tax if they’ve been prevented from leaving the country due to Covid-19 as “tone deaf”.

https://www.thejournal.ie/tax-exiles-revenue-relaxation-catherine-murphy-5067420-Apr2020/

2. Give hundreds of millions to hotel and private hospital owners. For maximum benefit to tax exiles see step 1.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/ireland/hse-stuck-with-contract-for-citywest-covid-unit-for-14-residents-qknqv38kw

3. Take a holiday.

4. Hire dozens of advisors.

5. Ignore warnings or high risk sectors. Resulting in hundreds of deaths.

"We view it as a failure by the minister that we have to keep endlessly pursuing him as this crisis escalates hour-by-hour, day-by-day,” said Nursing Home Ireland chief executive, Tadhg Daly.

“Given the large cohort of people in the nursing home sector, it beggars belief that he (Mr Harris) has not even picked up the phone to ring us.

“We have sent at least five letters and emails over the last four weeks requesting engagement directly with Mr Harris but what we got is the standard civil service reply - that the matter was receiving attention."

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-30990134.html%3ftype=amp

christy c · 12-10-2020 10:29am

smurgen wrote: »

FG pandemic response :

1. Remove tax resident restrictions:. "Catherine Murphy described Revenue’s decision to allow non-residents in Ireland to avoid paying tax if they’ve been prevented from leaving the country due to Covid-19 as “tone deaf”.

https://www.thejournal.ie/tax-exiles-revenue-relaxation-catherine-murphy-5067420-Apr2020/

2. Give hundreds of millions to hotel and private hospital owners. For maximum benefit to tax exiles see step 1.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/ireland/hse-stuck-with-contract-for-citywest-covid-unit-for-14-residents-qknqv38kw

3. Take a holiday.

4. Hire dozens of advisors.

5. Ignore warnings or high risk sectors. Resulting in hundreds of deaths.

"We view it as a failure by the minister that we have to keep endlessly pursuing him as this crisis escalates hour-by-hour, day-by-day,” said Nursing Home Ireland chief executive, Tadhg Daly.

“Given the large cohort of people in the nursing home sector, it beggars belief that he (Mr Harris) has not even picked up the phone to ring us.

“We have sent at least five letters and emails over the last four weeks requesting engagement directly with Mr Harris but what we got is the standard civil service reply - that the matter was receiving attention."

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-30990134.html%3ftype=amp

Yep, no defence of SF's stupidity as I thought.

1. Not sure of the details, from the outside I wouldn't have thought it necessary.

2. Hospitals were rented as it was feared scenes in Italy and Spain would be repeated here. The fact that some of your boogeymen were involved and winds you up is a bonus.

3. Childish rubbish. You meant the Dail didn't sit?

4. Of course advisors are needed, populist nonsense to suggest otherwise.

5. Mistakes were made unfortunately. At least they were not stupid enough to think Boris Johnson was making them look bad (you might remember that gem you came out with).

dundalkfc10 · 12-10-2020 10:41am

christy c wrote: »

Yep, no defence of SF's stupidity as I thought.

1. Not sure of the details, from the outside I wouldn't have thought it necessary.

2. Hospitals were rented as it was feared scenes in Italy and Spain would be repeated here. The fact that some of your boogeymen were involved and winds you up is a bonus.

3. Childish rubbish. You meant the Dail didn't sit?

4. Of course advisors are needed, populist nonsense to suggest otherwise.

5. Mistakes were made unfortunately. At least they were not stupid enough to think Boris Johnson was making them look bad (you might remember that gem you came out with).

Mistakes are still being made, over 1 week since they ignored NHEPT

Leo saying 1 thing yesterday morning, MM saying another at lunchtime

christy c · 12-10-2020 10:46am

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

[/B]

Mistakes are still being made, over 1 week since they ignored NHEPT

Leo saying 1 thing yesterday morning, MM saying another at lunchtime

Yep fairly chaotic, although very difficult circumstances. Depressing this is the best we could come up with.

dundalkfc10 · 12-10-2020 10:57am

christy c wrote: »

Yep fairly chaotic, although very difficult circumstances. Depressing this is the best we could come up with.

Not to mention the fact Gardai were out on roads all week delaying people getting to work but somehow hundreds are allowed gather in Dublin to protest.

A shambles

smurgen · 12-10-2020 10:59am

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Not to mention the fact Gardai were out on roads all week delaying people getting to work but somehow hundreds are allowed gather in Dublin to protest.

A shambles

These lads are brainwashed. They're the equivalent of the die-hard MAGA crowd.

FrancieBrady · 12-10-2020 11:16am

christy c wrote: »

Yep fairly chaotic, although very difficult circumstances. Depressing this is the best we could come up with.

What's difficult about clear and concise messaging and communication?

What's difficult about telling a rogue Tanaiste to stfu and wait until there is a clear message to put out?

dundalkfc10 · 12-10-2020 11:19am

smurgen wrote: »

These lads are brainwashed. They're the equivalent of the die-hard MAGA crowd.

The Gardai or the protestors?

grayzer75 · 12-10-2020 11:24am

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

The Gardai or the protestors?

Both. I blame China and 5G

christy c · 12-10-2020 11:48am

FrancieBrady wrote: »

What's difficult about clear and concise messaging and communication?

What's difficult about telling a rogue Tanaiste to stfu and wait until there is a clear message to put out?

Completely missed my point, not surprising. I acknowledged the chaos

FrancieBrady · 12-10-2020 12:01pm

christy c wrote: »

Completely missed my point, not surprising. I acknowledged the chaos

No, I didn't miss a thing
'Difficult circumstances' is no excuse for what is going on.

A budget will be announced tomorrow in 'difficult circumstances' is it going to be a haphazard chaotic mess as the messaging on Covid has been?

Will Leo be out on the airwaves tomorrow evening briefing a different story than the MoF?

dundalkfc10 · 12-10-2020 12:02pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

No, I didn't miss a thing
'Difficult circumstances' is no excuse for what is going on.

A budget will be announced tomorrow in 'difficult circumstances' is it going to be a haphazard chaotic mess as the messaging on Covid has been?

Will Leo be out on the airwaves tomorrow evening briefing a different story than the MoF?

What do you think?

christy c · 12-10-2020 12:11pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

No, I didn't miss a thing
'Difficult circumstances' is no excuse for what is going on.

A budget will be announced tomorrow in 'difficult circumstances' is it going to be a haphazard chaotic mess as the messaging on Covid has been?

Will Leo be out on the airwaves tomorrow evening briefing a different story than the MoF?

Yes you did miss something. I acknowledged the chaos, which is added to by the pandemic.

I think the budget will be similar to previous FG budgets, giving more to scroungers than people who work. Plus plenty of other sh1te. And I will be critical of that as I have been in the past. I saw some parties budget proposals which I would definitely describe as a "haphazard chaotic mess", but that escapes your attention or the head goes back in to the sand.

Don't know what Leo will be doing, it's usually Pascal that does most of the briefings on budget day IIRC.

blanch152 · 12-10-2020 12:15pm

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

We have the lowest corporation tax rate in the EU. They can’t go anywhere that they’ll pay less

More lies, the corporate taxation rate in Hungary is 9%.

Wanderer78 · 12-10-2020 12:16pm

Kasey_Don wrote: »

Budget tomorrow is another kick in the teeth of middle income workers.

Really, it's better to be poor or rich, having a little bit of money is the worst.

Carbon tax going up for me. That money is going to people on the dole who already get housing, medical cards, grants etc.

VRT going up - cars being made more expensive.

Help to buy scheme being expanded to prop up property prices. Literally impossible for me to every buy a new place. 2 bed apartments where I live are going for 380k.

How much of taxpayers money that is going to have to be paid back through higher taxes is being pumped into businesses? The money thrown at them is disgusting.

You don't get rewarded for working anymore.

i couldnt imagine the poor are doing all that great at the moment

Wanderer78 · 12-10-2020 12:23pm

Kasey_Don wrote:

How are they not?

Their actual needs have never been met

grayzer75 · 12-10-2020 12:29pm

blanch152 wrote: »

More lies, the corporate taxation rate in Hungary is 9%.

Double Irish with a Dutch sandwich anybody?

Wanderer78 · 12-10-2020 12:30pm

grayzer75 wrote: »

Double Irish with a Dutch sandwich anybody?

tis gone now

grayzer75 · 12-10-2020 12:36pm

Wanderer78 wrote: »

tis gone now

Help the big ones avoid paying tax on $100 billion a year up until it closed. Not very fair on the Irish companies who were honest and paid their way.......

FrancieBrady · 12-10-2020 12:37pm

christy c wrote: »

Yes you did miss something. I acknowledged the chaos, which is added to by the pandemic.

I think the budget will be similar to previous FG budgets, giving more to scroungers than people who work. Plus plenty of other sh1te. And I will be critical of that as I have been in the past. I saw some parties budget proposals which I would definitely describe as a "haphazard chaotic mess", but that escapes your attention or the head goes back in to the sand.

Don't know what Leo will be doing, it's usually Pascal that does most of the briefings on budget day IIRC.

You might remember that this 'SF bot' is not in agreement with SF economic policy and doesn't think SF are ready yet to run the country on it's own.

You'll see that in my posting history if you take your head out of that sand.

My point was that pandemic or not...getting a simple, on point message out is not beyond the wit of a government who have other things to do. Stopping somebody briefing in a contradictory fashion should not be hard to do if somebody has the cahona's. Clearly nobody has.

Wanderer78 · 12-10-2020 12:38pm

grayzer75 wrote: »

Help the big ones avoid paying tax on $100 billion a year up until it closed. Not very fair on the Irish companies who were honest and paid their way.......

ah shur the so called free market is truly all about dishonesty

christy c · 12-10-2020 12:44pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You might remember that this 'SF bot' is not in agreement with SF economic policy and doesn't think SF are ready yet to run the country on it's own.

You'll see that in my posting history if you take your head out of that sand.

My point was that pandemic or not...getting a simple, on point message out is not beyond the wit of a government who have other things to do. Stopping somebody briefing in a contradictory fashion should not be hard to do if somebody has the cahona's. Clearly nobody has.

I didn't call you a bot. Which part of SF economic policy do you not agree with? I recall you sayingthat before but did not provide any details. You had a number of posts last night defending the SF nonsense with regards to corporate tax. Plus seeing nothing wrong with someone thinking the demographics would look after themselves would indicate that you at least support the main points.

I already acknowledged the chaos more than once.

FrancieBrady · 12-10-2020 12:58pm

christy c wrote: »

I didn't call you a bot. Which part of SF economic policy do you not agree with? I recall you sayingthat before but did not provide any details. You had a number of posts last night defending the SF nonsense with regards to corporate tax. Plus seeing nothing wrong with someone thinking the demographics would look after themselves would indicate that you at least support the main points.

I already acknowledged the chaos more than once.

Funny...another poster (an avowed member of FG) said I was in disagreement with SF on corporation tax.

You acknowledged and EXCUSED the chaos. When the government are quite capable of delivering in other areas there really is no excuse for failing to deliver clear and concise messages on Covid

christy c · 12-10-2020 1:02pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Funny...another poster (an avowed member of FG) said I was in disagreement with SF on corporation tax.

You acknowledged and EXCUSED the chaos. When the government are quite capable of delivering in other areas there really is no excuse for failing to deliver clear and concise messages on Covid

Good for them. So provide details on what exactly you disagree with please and explain how being in coalition would improve that.

Well my point was that there was chaos, and it is added to by the pandemic. No excuse there. All clear now or will it take another 20 posts before it sinks in?

FrancieBrady · 12-10-2020 1:37pm

christy c wrote: »

Good for them. So provide details on what exactly you disagree with please and explain how being in coalition would improve that.

Well my point was that there was chaos, and it is added to by the pandemic. No excuse there. All clear now or will it take another 20 posts before it sinks in?

No christy, this was your point..a 'fairly' chaotic situation with an excuse for that tacked on to it = 'although' very difficult circumstances.

Yep fairly chaotic, although very difficult circumstances.

The topic of the thread is FF/FG/Green goverment - not SF economic policy or a trial of my opinions.

James Brown · 12-10-2020 1:41pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

And that, dear friends, explains it in a nutshell.

Do you want thousands of people working, earning good salaries, paying millions into the government coffers, living the good life, mortgages, etc., or do you want the same thousands of people dependent on state handouts in the form of Dole?

Simples.

Japers. What country are you posting from? What about the working tax payers depending on welfare to make rent?

James Brown · 12-10-2020 1:42pm

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Why do men (always men) who spend so much of the day posting about politics know so very, very little about how it actually works?

:eek:

Sinn Fein something?

christy c wrote: »

Well in fairness, Mary Lou Mcdonald is female and the leader of the opposition and seems to know even less.

Ahhh....

James Brown · 12-10-2020 1:47pm

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Still waiting for your evidence of leo lying.

Yawn.

All night we can do this and you won't produce it.

Lied about Debenhams having no money for workers.

christy c · 12-10-2020 1:53pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

No christy, this was your point..a 'fairly' chaotic situation with an excuse for that tacked on to it = 'although' very difficult circumstances.

The topic of the thread is FF/FG/Green goverment - not SF economic policy or a trial of my opinions.

So you are going for option 2, another 20 posts on the topic.

And no answer on what you disagree with SF on, sounds like something you just say during an election.

blanch152 · 12-10-2020 2:01pm

Bowie wrote: »

Lied about Debenhams having no money for workers.

Another made-up fantasy in your head about Leo.

(1) Leo didn't say that "Debenhams have no money for workers"

(2) There is no way he could know the inside financial situation in Debenhams to the detail required to say that.

FrancieBrady · 12-10-2020 2:13pm

christy c wrote: »

So you are going for option 2, another 20 posts on the topic.

And no answer on what you disagree with SF on, sounds like something you just say during an election.

You excused the mixrd messaging. Then you just hurled invective at me for pointing it our.

Choose your wording carefully and you wont be misunderstood. Using 'although' is diminishing fault or excusing.

christy c · 12-10-2020 2:18pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You excused the mixrd messaging. Then you just hurled invective at me for pointing it our.

Choose your wording carefully and you wont be misunderstood. Using 'although' is diminishing fault or excusing.

No excuse, I acknowledged the chaos and said the pandemic added to it. I thought that should have clarified but is it another 18 posts required now?

Truthvader · 12-10-2020 2:20pm

blanch152 wrote: »

Another made-up fantasy in your head about Leo.

(1) Leo didn't say that "Debenhams have no money for workers"

(2) There is no way he could know the inside financial situation in Debenhams to the detail required to say that.

Been round the houses with Bowie on this one and had to give up. He either simply does not understand the liquidation process or is wilfully repeating something he knows to be untrue

FrancieBrady · 12-10-2020 2:26pm

christy c wrote: »

No excuse, I acknowledged the chaos and said the pandemic added to it. I thought that should have clarified but is it another 18 posts required now?

We can keep this going for 18 posts or until you acknowledge that you used an excusatory word, which is what I reacted to 'although' you may be too stubborn to do that.

christy c · 12-10-2020 2:27pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

We can keep this going for 18 posts or until you acknowledge that you used an excusatory word, which is what I reacted to 'although' you may be too stubborn to do that.

You reacted to something which I later clarified, 17 more posts.

FrancieBrady · 12-10-2020 2:38pm

christy c wrote: »

You reacted to something which I later clarified, 17 more posts.

You are in a subsequent post still excusing christy me boy. The pandemic didn't 'add chaos', the immature political grandstanding of a rogue Tanaiste added to the chaos for which he is being criticised.

Stop using the pandemic to excuse this please.

christy c · 12-10-2020 2:42pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You are in a subsequent post still excusing christy me boy. The pandemic didn't 'add chaos', the immature political grandstanding of a rogue Tanaiste added to the chaos for which he is being criticised.

Stop using the pandemic to excuse this please.

I am not excusing anything, 16 more posts? This is pathetic.

FrancieBrady · 12-10-2020 2:46pm

christy c wrote: »

I am not excusing anything, 16 more posts? This is pathetic.

Stating that the pandemic is responsible for the chaos that a Tanaiste is actually responsible for is an excuse christy. Jesus!

What was it about the 'pandemnic' that made him have a pop at the CMO and to brief totally differently to his Taoiseach on a 'circuit breaker'.
I await with bated breath for the connection to the pandemic.

christy c · 12-10-2020 2:51pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Stating that the pandemic is responsible for the chaos that a Tanaiste is actually responsible for is an excuse christy. Jesus!

What was it about the 'pandemnic' that made him have a pop at the CMO and to brief totally differently to his Taoiseach on a 'circuit breaker'.
I await with bated breath for the connection to the pandemic.

You'll be waiting, because I clarified what I meant and if you are still having difficulty please copy and paste my previous post the required number of times until it sinks in.

FrancieBrady · 12-10-2020 3:01pm

christy c wrote: »

You'll be waiting, because I clarified what I meant and if you are still having difficulty please copy and paste my previous post the required number of times until it sinks in.

So tell us christy how the pandemic made Leo do it? :rolleyes:

christy c · 12-10-2020 3:04pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

So tell us christy how the pandemic made Leo do it? :rolleyes:

Haha

blanch152 · 12-10-2020 4:17pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Stating that the pandemic is responsible for the chaos that a Tanaiste is actually responsible for is an excuse christy. Jesus!

What was it about the 'pandemnic' that made him have a pop at the CMO and to brief totally differently to his Taoiseach on a 'circuit breaker'.
I await with bated breath for the connection to the pandemic.

How come the Tanaiste in Ireland is responsible for the chaos of having Covid-19 cases one-third the rate of Northern Ireland, where there is no chaos and the Deputy Leader is completely blameless for the runaway rates of Covid-19?

Your twisting takes some unravelling initially, but when you actually pick at it, it falls to pieces.

FrancieBrady · 12-10-2020 4:27pm

blanch152 wrote: »

How come the Tanaiste in Ireland is responsible for the chaos of having Covid-19 cases one-third the rate of Northern Ireland, where there is no chaos and the Deputy Leader is completely blameless for the runaway rates of Covid-19?

Your twisting takes some unravelling initially, but when you actually pick at it, it falls to pieces.

Wot?

You are so desperate to deflect to the Shinners you aren't making sense anymore.

dundalkfc10 · 12-10-2020 4:33pm

blanch152 wrote: »

How come the Tanaiste in Ireland is responsible for the chaos of having Covid-19 cases one-third the rate of Northern Ireland, where there is no chaos and the Deputy Leader is completely blameless for the runaway rates of Covid-19?

Your twisting takes some unravelling initially, but when you actually pick at it, it falls to pieces.

Ah the old, we have lost control of the Virus down here and are going against NHEPT advice, guess what we can do to make it look good, point up North and say look they are worse

blanch152 · 12-10-2020 4:39pm

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Ah the old, we have lost control of the Virus down here and are going against NHEPT advice, guess what we can do to make it look good, point up North and say look they are worse

https://www.rte.ie/news/2020/1012/1170892-coronavirus-ireland/

Three highest rates in Ireland are in Donegal, Cavan and Monaghan. No surprise to see the border counties in trouble with the chaotic mess overseen by Sinn Fein going on in Northern Ireland where they have the highest rates in Europe.

Not looking up North to say they are worse, looking up North to point out that the incompetents up there are making things much more difficult down here.

FrancieBrady · 12-10-2020 4:45pm

blanch152 wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/2020/1012/1170892-coronavirus-ireland/

Three highest rates in Ireland are in Donegal, Cavan and Monaghan. No surprise to see the border counties in trouble with the chaotic mess overseen by Sinn Fein going on in Northern Ireland where they have the highest rates in Europe.

Not looking up North to say they are worse, looking up North to point out that the incompetents up there are making things much more difficult down here.

Which has nothing to do with Leo going off the range on solo runs,

Brendan Bendar · 12-10-2020 4:52pm

blanch152 wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/2020/1012/1170892-coronavirus-ireland/

Three highest rates in Ireland are in Donegal, Cavan and Monaghan. No surprise to see the border counties in trouble with the chaotic mess overseen by Sinn Fein going on in Northern Ireland where they have the highest rates in Europe.

Not looking up North to say they are worse, looking up North to point out that the incompetents up there are making things much more difficult down here.

No surprise there Blanch, these lads are bending over backwards to try to keep the complete mess the Shinners are making of things where they are in power out of this thread.

What they want is to have carte Blanche to attack those in power down here whilst trying to hide the unholy mess the same party are making of their jurisdiction.

How can any sensible person have confidence in that bunch of incompetents.

FF/FG/Green Government - part 2

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