Applying for an SNA

Cork Trucker · 22-02-2020 7:45pm

glack wrote: »

Not in all schools. We expect to greatly benefit in our school. Old model favours the schools where parents are willing/able to pay for private assessments. New model (if what’s rumoured is true) favours the more disadvantaged schools and looks at the overall profile of the school allocating SNAs in the way that Special Education Teachers have been allocated for the last couple of years.

It’s supposed to cut out the idea that you can “buy” support for your child buy paying for the private assessments rather than waiting to be seen through the HSE/school A school will be told you get X number of SNAs and it’s up to you how you allocate them. Some schools will gain others will lose out.

The school in my son's case is a DEIS school.

Cork Trucker · 22-02-2020 7:49pm

Calhoun wrote: »

The question you will have to answer is do you want to risk your son going into that environment right now when things are unstable.

Also who knows if they will keep things going as they are now we have changed government. Not allot like the NCSE's new proposed policy.

In an ideal world if they become reality it would be perfect, of course this is Ireland.

Gatling · 22-02-2020 8:01pm

Calhoun wrote: »

In all schools because of the new model they are bringing in place. The SENO's are touting it like its the be and end all and will solve world hunger. It will not.

This is part of the problem there is no real thinking goes into these decisions ,
Oh they do this in America and it works only to find out very quickly that no this particular idea does not work , let's go with the Nordic models based off one person spending a weekend in Sweden or Denmark ,no that doesn't work either because the Nordic model education different to us and other countries ,
Let's build sensory rooms in every school ,lets look at theses sensory rooms I've been to about 20 schools with sensory rooms which are nothing more than a mid seized ball pool and a few soft mats , completely inadequate in my opinion ,most asd units are just glorified crèches that eventually kids get moved out of to mainstream clasees whether try are capable of sitting and learning in a mainstream class or not
Now they want to get rid of asd units and special classes and move into to full mainstream classes and restrict SNA to non educational support only (toilet, feeding , dressing ),
There seems to be little support for most SNA's for upskilling ie lamh ,pecs , dealing with poor behaviour or management of poor behaviour and so on ,
I've worked in a room where 2 children used apps to communicate but the teacher puts digital devices in school bags not to be used the same with pecs books then wondering why children are lashing out due to not being able to communicate ,

The system was broke before it started but yet it's still being used under its inclusive ,the current system is wrong and the next bandaid will be the same and the next after that ,

I'm lucky in the sense I see it from both sides of the fence as both a parent of a child with extra needs and as someone who works with children of extra needs

glack · 22-02-2020 8:09pm

Cork Trucker wrote: »

The SENO mentioned something about March alright, it’s a cut off date for applications or something.

My child can take off his own jacket, can eat unassisted, isn’t toilet trained, is a flight risk. They can follow some but not many instructions. Doesn’t wander around the class that I know of. He mixes very well with other children and will sit next to them,

Lots of positives there. But also plenty to work on between now and September. I would still maintain that an extra year in a good preschool is far more preferable than school at his age. However if ye are set on going ahead, you can start now in preparing him.

I would work on the following
-toileting: this is most important and will cause him huge stress. See can you find out from other parents are there toilets in his classroom or will he need to leave the classroom to go to the toilet. Try and create some sort of way he can indicate with his hands his need to use the toilet. One that works well is making a T shape with his hands.

Coat: being able to go get his coat from hook, put it on and zip it up. A simple thing but with 20 kids in the room this process can cause chaos in the room. Noise and chaos is helped greatly by having a system. If he knows how to do this unaided he will be able to stay calm. Being able to do this independently will help greatly. Also unzipping, taking it off and hanging it up without any help.

Lunch box: practice taking it to and from a bag, opening it unaided, eating and putting it away.

School bag: taking things to and from the bag independently. Buy the bag well in advance so you can practice and it becomes familiar. Also practice putting it on his back.

Expose him to loud noisy situations with other children. Rugby, GAA, music classes. Anything with a crowd where they are expected to learn something. Here you can work on the flight risk issues as well as getting a good view of how he is with others.

Calhoun · 22-02-2020 8:09pm

Gatling wrote: »

This is part of the problem there is no real thinking goes into these decisions ,
Oh they do this in America and it works only to find out very quickly that no this particular idea does not work , let's go with the Nordic models based off one person spending a weekend in Sweden or Denmark ,no that doesn't work either because the Nordic model education different to us and other countries ,
Let's build sensory rooms in every school ,lets look at theses sensory rooms I've been to about 20 schools with sensory rooms which are nothing more than a mid seized ball pool and a few soft mats , completely inadequate in my opinion ,most asd units are just glorified crèches that eventually kids get moved out of to mainstream clasees whether try are capable of sitting and learning in a mainstream class or not
Now they want to get rid of asd units and special classes and move into to full mainstream classes and restrict SNA to non educational support only (toilet, feeding , dressing ),
There seems to be little support for most SNA's for upskilling ie lamh ,pecs , dealing with poor behaviour or management of poor behaviour and so on ,
I've worked in a room where 2 children used apps to communicate but the teacher puts digital devices in school bags not to be used the same with pecs books then wondering why children are lashing out due to not being able to communicate ,

The system was broke before it started but yet it's still being used under its inclusive ,the current system is wrong and the next bandaid will be the same and the next after that ,

I'm lucky in the sense I see it from both sides of the fence as both a parent of a child with extra needs and as someone who works with children of extra needs

For sure it really needs allot of joint up thinking. Imagine we still have a scenario where a good chunk of our teachers aren't trained much on special education until they are assigned to a class room.

That teacher sounds quite horrible, you would wonder if she had kids in a wheel chair would she kick them out of it or make them sit on a floor as the wheelchair would be too much of an aid.

The only way the system is going to get unbroken is by people pushing back against it, unfortunately for parents it may mean through the courts. It also means we are on a confrontational footing even with the local schools themselves who for the most part feel they are being forced into the scenario (which they are but not by the parents).

I see it from both sides as well as ironically my wife is a teacher in a unit.

glack · 22-02-2020 8:14pm

Cork Trucker wrote: »

The school in my son's case is a DEIS school.

Have they many SNAs currently? Any idea how many students?

Motherof123 · 22-02-2020 9:24pm

Millem wrote: »

Have you told the preschool that your child will be leaving in June 2020? If so they may have offered his space to another child.
If not I would assume they would need to offer you the second year. Our preschool has an enrolment policy.

In the HT situation I have described the HT does not come to your house....space is no issue. I have worked as a HT and never work in my students’ homes.

There are early intervention playschools in cork that accept HOme tuition but they are full so get his name down for sept 2020 if you want the early intervention it's a ratio of 2/3 children to one adult (I think) you get 20 home tuition so regardless of his ecce you can still avail of the 5 home tuition. The ecce is 15 so you can have 5 home tuition. Ring your seno she will fill in the paperwork for you.
Even if you got one morning a week HT it would help.

You could avail of the July provision it's 10 hours a week for the month of July. They will help with toilet training and some work for school prep. He is entitled to it so look into that for support. He will be finished his ecce.

heldel00 · 22-02-2020 10:38pm

Yes things will get worse for children in my school next September. We have two SNAs. One is just being pulled from pillar to post.
One of our classes had a very short outing to a local hall last week. SNA walked down with 30 children and class teacher, returned immediately to school to work with jun infant that is a risk to himself and others, child with ASD became overwhelmed in the local hall and unintentionally injured the visiting sports teacher, class teacher had to ring up to school for assistance.......child and classmates were beyond frightened. (Another child in school has life threatening condition which requires 1-to-1 care but this SNA is still counted as being available to support all children with additional needs. She is not. She can not leave this child's side.)
I'm not trying to worry you but this is life in irish primary schools in 2020. If your child would be better able to cope with what is ahead after an extra year in playschool then don't let a few aul wagons at the door deny him/her that.

Motherof123 · 22-02-2020 11:13pm

heldel00 wrote: »

Yes things will get worse for children in my school next September. We have two SNAs. One is just being pulled from pillar to post.
One of our classes had a very short outing to a local hall last week. SNA walked down with 30 children and class teacher, returned immediately to school to work with jun infant that is a risk to himself and others, child with ASD became overwhelmed in the local hall and unintentionally injured the visiting sports teacher, class teacher had to ring up to school for assistance.......child and classmates were beyond frightened. (Another child in school has life threatening condition which requires 1-to-1 care but this SNA is still counted as being available to support all children with additional needs. She is not. She can not leave this child's side.)
I'm not trying to worry you but this is life in irish primary schools in 2020. If your child would be better able to cope with what is ahead after an extra year in playschool then don't let a few aul wagons at the door deny him/her that.

I didn't realise the SNA situation was that bad. I thought if a child didn't have one attached at all times it was because there was no need.
One of my older kids is very sensible and she is always asked to take a girl in her class to the bathroom she's only just tagging along maybe to make sure the child comes and goes without hanging around.
She also helps her when the SNA is in the room.
Opening books and lunch box etc.
It's so worrying having a child with special needs and it dosent stop even when they are at school.
Getting School places in ASD classrooms for kids with special needs is a disaster because there are not enough schools with qualified staff to accommodate.

It's been like this for years they have the funding they are not spending it wisely.
What about the amount of money they spend on transport shipping kids miles away it's totally understandable for children who may need wheelchair accessible transport but I'd love for my child to be able to go local and walk him to and from school.
Instead of the transport my seno told me apply to all the schools I'm in cork city and some schools on the list are bantry! I don't drive what if he's sick and I have to go get him.

The money that goes on home tuition could go to a special school.
The Aims money for an extra member of staff is a joke coz that child doesn't get any extra help! You can not compare a playschool with Aims to an early intervention preschool.
I was hoping my child would cope with Aims in ecce but they couldn't even do that for him!
Home tuition is great but there is so much red tape that not all Creche's will allow a home tutor on site.
For now we are doing home tuition and aiming for early intervention 2 years and start school at 6. My other kids were 5 and 5 months starting so the extra few months for maturity is fine by me.
I'm not in any rush because we won't get a place anyway.
And having to fight for that alone is a disgrace.

irishgirl19 · 23-02-2020 1:22am

Motherof123 wrote: »

There are early intervention playschools in cork that accept HOme tuition but they are full so get his name down for sept 2020 if you want the early intervention it's a ratio of 2/3 children to one adult (I think) you get 20 home tuition so regardless of his ecce you can still avail of the 5 home tuition. The ecce is 15 so you can have 5 home tuition. Ring your seno she will fill in the paperwork for you.
Even if you got one morning a week HT it would help.

You could avail of the July provision it's 10 hours a week for the month of July. They will help with toilet training and some work for school prep. He is entitled to it so look into that for support. He will be finished his ecce.

Careful with this. SENOs can and do regularly refuse home tuition grant applications if there is an available school place. In this case the SENO is obviously aware of a school place offer in mainstream school.
I'd discuss with the SENO first to see if he/she would be willing to approve this.

glack · 23-02-2020 9:42am

irishgirl19 wrote: »

Careful with this. SENOs can and do regularly refuse home tuition grant applications if there is an available school place. In this case the SENO is obviously aware of a school place offer in mainstream school.
I'd discuss with the SENO first to see if he/she would be willing to approve this.

It would be extremely unlikely based on the child’s age in this case I would imagine surely? Genuinely think the OP is simply at his wits end with the preschool and feels school is the best option. Without knowing details of the case, I would argue that school is not the best place for any child (special needs or not) at barely 4. Times have changed and most children are over 4.5 years when starting school. A child with special needs would benefit from every advantage they can get and being at the older end (if not the oldest) of the class is far more desirable.

We’ve had a situation in the recent past where a child was refused SNA support as they were so young and their reports clearly identified that they needed to complete their second preschool year. They were in an early intervention placement though so circumstances are different.

Cork Trucker · 23-02-2020 9:59am

glack wrote: »

It would be extremely unlikely based on the child’s age in this case I would imagine surely? Genuinely think the OP is simply at his wits end with the preschool and feels school is the best option. Without knowing details of the case, I would argue that school is not the best place for any child (special needs or not) at barely 4. Times have changed and most children are over 4.5 years when starting school. A child with special needs would benefit from every advantage they can get and being at the older end (if not the oldest) of the class is far more desirable.

We’ve had a situation in the recent past where a child was refused SNA support as they were so young and their reports clearly identified that they needed to complete their second preschool year. They were in an early intervention placement though so circumstances are different.

You're correct, i am at my wits end in a big big way. The issue i have here is as follows, if for example i did wait another year, his fifth birthday, and there is no change or very very little, from his second to third birthday the only difference is he can say all his ABC's and count 1-10, will the school then turn around and tell me "oh he'd benefit from another year in preschool and you can get an exemption for that", this is my issue, The next nearest preschool is right next door to where the school in question is, so i'm thinking if i have to travel there then why not just chance it. What i cannot understand, and you might know this? Is why are the department of education advocating 2 years of preschool and have left the minimum school entry age at 4? I feel many people are being brainwashed by the system and what's on offer (2 preschool years) is a effectively a carrot to entice people in. I started school at 5 in the 1980's and i still have a major issue about it as it cost me a year on the other end, this is perhaps clouding my judgement of it all i admit.

Calhoun · 23-02-2020 3:11pm

Cork Trucker wrote: »

You're correct, i am at my wits end in a big big way. The issue i have here is as follows, if for example i did wait another year, his fifth birthday, and there is no change or very very little, from his second to third birthday the only difference is he can say all his ABC's and count 1-10, will the school then turn around and tell me "oh he'd benefit from another year in preschool and you can get an exemption for that", this is my issue, The next nearest preschool is right next door to where the school in question is, so i'm thinking if i have to travel there then why not just chance it. What i cannot understand, and you might know this? Is why are the department of education advocating 2 years of preschool and have left the minimum school entry age at 4? I feel many people are being brainwashed by the system and what's on offer (2 preschool years) is a effectively a carrot to entice people in. I started school at 5 in the 1980's and i still have a major issue about it as it cost me a year on the other end, this is perhaps clouding my judgement of it all i admit.

To speak plainly I think you need to put the hangup on what year they enter to the side. Unfortunately our kids will not walk the same path as neurotypical children, it doesn't mean they will have worse outcomes just they need a bit more TLC.

What you need to decide when everything stacks up is where is the best place for your son that he can learn and grow. For us we took the two years ECCE because we had aims assistance. We also had the SENO push to get us a spot in an ASD pre-school if we wanted.

One thing to consider that you might not have is the ability for your son to achieve in a meaningful way. As your son moves from junior, senior then on through 1st to 6th class the gap between him and his peers more than likely will widen. That will have an impact on his ability to learn as he will be allot more demotivated than his peers. This can also negatively impact on development as it can cause anxiety for them.

Anyway I don't envy your decision, its a hard one and you will need to fight and hold people to account but just consider is this the right battle for your son at this time.

jlm29 · 23-02-2020 3:43pm

Cork Trucker wrote: »

Is why are the department of education advocating 2 years of preschool and have left the minimum school entry age at 4?

They’ve left it at age 4 for the kids who turn 5 earlier in the school year. My eldest is a November baby, so turned 5 two months after starting. I know the law says that they can start once they turn 4 that September, but the legal minimum isn’t the same as the optimal. My November boy is one of the youngest in his class. I think that in the class of 24, there’s only 3 or 4 younger than him. Any of them with birthdays from feb or March onwards were kept until 5 to start school. Our primary school will prioritise places for the older kids, they’d only offer places to the younger kids if they couldn’t fill them with older ones, regardless of when they go on the list.

glack · 23-02-2020 7:03pm

Cork Trucker wrote: »

You're correct, i am at my wits end in a big big way. The issue i have here is as follows, if for example i did wait another year, his fifth birthday, and there is no change or very very little, from his second to third birthday the only difference is he can say all his ABC's and count 1-10, will the school then turn around and tell me "oh he'd benefit from another year in preschool and you can get an exemption for that", this is my issue, The next nearest preschool is right next door to where the school in question is, so i'm thinking if i have to travel there then why not just chance it. What i cannot understand, and you might know this? Is why are the department of education advocating 2 years of preschool and have left the minimum school entry age at 4? I feel many people are being brainwashed by the system and what's on offer (2 preschool years) is a effectively a carrot to entice people in. I started school at 5 in the 1980's and i still have a major issue about it as it cost me a year on the other end, this is perhaps clouding my judgement of it all i admit.

Times have changed and the norm is now to wait to send your child until at least 4 and a half, ideally 5 even leaving those just turned 4 at a huge disadvantage. Children who turn 4 from March/April onwards generally all wait until 5. Thought process is they are better prepared for school, more mature and can cope with the emotional challenges better. And you can see the younger children right through primary school - academically they can be fine but the older children succeed more easily in every other way. School is about much more than academics.

If I was you, sending my child to school would be my very last resort. Chase every avenue for a better placement for your child. Contact the school, the SENO. See can you find a more specialised preschool placement or a playschool that can accommodate home tuition. Make all the preparations you can. These next couple of years are vital in the development of your child-you want to get the best advice so you can make the best choice. Try not to rush into a decision.

byhookorbycrook · 24-02-2020 9:11pm

Cork Trucker wrote: »

The school in my son's case is a DEIS school.

Having DEIS status doesn’t mean extra SNAs.

byhookorbycrook · 24-02-2020 9:16pm

Motherof123 wrote: »

I didn't realise the SNA situation was that bad. I thought if a child didn't have one attached at all times it was because there was no need.
One of my older kids is very sensible and she is always asked to take a girl in her class to the bathroom she's only just tagging along maybe to make sure the child comes and goes without hanging around.
She also helps her when the SNA is in the room.
Opening books and lunch box etc.
It's so worrying having a child with special needs and it dosent stop even when they are at school.
Getting School places in ASD classrooms for kids with special needs is a disaster because there are not enough schools with qualified staff to accommodate.

It's been like this for years they have the funding they are not spending it wisely.
What about the amount of money they spend on transport shipping kids miles away it's totally understandable for children who may need wheelchair accessible transport but I'd love for my child to be able to go local and walk him to and from school.
Instead of the transport my seno told me apply to all the schools I'm in cork city and some schools on the list are bantry! I don't drive what if he's sick and I have to go get him.

The money that goes on home tuition could go to a special school.
The Aims money for an extra member of staff is a joke coz that child doesn't get any extra help! You can not compare a playschool with Aims to an early intervention preschool.
I was hoping my child would cope with Aims in ecce but they couldn't even do that for him!
Home tuition is great but there is so much red tape that not all Creche's will allow a home tutor on site.
For now we are doing home tuition and aiming for early intervention 2 years and start school at 6. My other kids were 5 and 5 months starting so the extra few months for maturity is fine by me.
I'm not in any rush because we won't get a place anyway.
And having to fight for that alone is a disgrace.

Whilst it’s truly lovely that your older child is so kind and helpful, it’s not up to her to be a “mini-SNA. “ I’m all for kindness, helping each other etc. but she needs her time too-it shouldn’t all fall to her .

glack · 24-02-2020 9:44pm

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

Having DEIS status doesn’t mean extra SNAs.

But having DEIS status has meant an increase in Special Education Teachers. If the new SNA model (as yet only not published) follows a similar model as is expected, it's not crazy to predict the possibility of a slightly higher allocation in DEIS schools next year.

When it came out in 2017, many DEIS schools benefited greatly from increased SET hours. The intention with this was to rebalance the inequality where children whose parents were in a position to pay for a private assessment they had greater opportunities to benefit from resource hours. Also, research shows a higher incidence of special needs in areas of disadvantage.

heldel00 · 24-02-2020 9:47pm

^^^ yes I have seen children take on a "caring" role that can have a detrimental effect on the "carer". Some can feel under pressure that it is their job to mind them and their own friendships/ playtime can suffer.
A very admirable quality but make sure your child is happy and not missing out.

Calhoun · 24-02-2020 10:09pm

There in lies the rub its a bit of a balance, its also nice when it does happen at times as a little bit of friendship in a fairly hostile environment goes a long way. At the same time there needs to be steps to make sure that the child helping isn't overburdened.

The SNA and teachers i would assume would watch for that.

Motherof123 · 24-02-2020 10:46pm

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

Whilst it’s truly lovely that your older child is so kind and helpful, it’s not up to her to be a “mini-SNA. “ I’m all for kindness, helping each other etc. but she needs her time too-it shouldn’t all fall to her .

I know she was sat beside that child for 8 weeks I'd say the sna did that so she could rely on my child I think she's a shared sna.
Every other child in the class change seats once a month and they didn't change my daughter for 2 months.
Then when she was changed the one who took her place used to give out to the child which is unfair also.
Life can be cruel I truly believe kids with any additional needs should get a lot more I think someone mentioned it already on this post TLC.
I'm having an awful time at the moment with my child who was diagnosed hes 3.
He's off form wakes very grumpy takes a lot of work to snap him out of it. A lot of humouring was mentioned to put him on a sensory diet I didn't even know there was such a thing!
To regulate him.
I mentioned to someone else how the day goes and was told leave him cry tho.
And don't do this for him and don't do that. Leave him wait.
I thought ok but isn't that like making him worse.
The whole autism diagnosis is so overwhelming and then you don't even know if your doing the right thing because so much conflicting information!
Can anyone recommend any good books? I really need to get my head in a book about dealing with autism so I can stay on the right track.

Motherof123 · 24-02-2020 10:53pm

heldel00 wrote: »

^^^ yes I have seen children take on a "caring" role that can have a detrimental effect on the "carer". Some can feel under pressure that it is their job to mind them and their own friendships/ playtime can suffer.
A very admirable quality but make sure your child is happy and not missing out.

She was moved after 8 weeks and now she's just told take that girl to the bathroom every day! I must check in with her again and ask her is it just her being given that job! Today someone vomited 3 times and she was told walk her to the office to be collected by a parent when I heard that I thought ah seriously She's only 8.
She's such a caring child but she's also very quiet herself and she would never complain. They told me when she was in juniors she's beyond her years and she's not in any way like an old woman it's more her nature she sits and does her work.
She's amazing with her own brother she is a natural she steps back and follows his lead and he loves her. Other sister then would be a little less patient with him and he won't leave her near him.
All the classrooms possibly get kids to help out I suppose it creates inclusion and friendships but it should not be to replace an sna

Motherof123 · 24-02-2020 11:01pm

Calhoun wrote: »

There in lies the rub its a bit of a balance, its also nice when it does happen at times as a little bit of friendship in a fairly hostile environment goes a long way. At the same time there needs to be steps to make sure that the child helping isn't overburdened.

The SNA and teachers i would assume would watch for that.

Yeah I would hope so to be honest that the teacher would watch for that.
She's so kind natured which is lovely but she wouldn't be assertive.
My other daughter gets sent on jobs too. Someone had an accident she went. But I'd say they get other kids to do jobs too we just wouldn't hear about those ones. Maybe the teachers aren't allowed assist kids to the bathroom?

Motherof123 · 24-02-2020 11:03pm

irishgirl19 wrote: »

Careful with this. SENOs can and do regularly refuse home tuition grant applications if there is an available school place. In this case the SENO is obviously aware of a school place offer in mainstream school.
I'd discuss with the SENO first to see if he/she would be willing to approve this.

They cannot refuse July provision that's the extra learning
the child will have some learning and to not regress before sept

irishgirl19 · 24-02-2020 11:17pm

Motherof123 wrote: »

They cannot refuse July provision that's the extra learning
the child will have some learning and to not regress before sept

Not July Provision but they'll refuse funding for an ASD preschool funded by home tuition scheme if they want to.

Motherof123 · 24-02-2020 11:30pm

irishgirl19 wrote: »

Not July Provision but they'll refuse funding for an ASD preschool funded by home tuition scheme if they want to.

Oh yeah. There is only two playschools early intervention that I'm aware of in cork that accept home tuition.
And I suppose that would be last resort if the ones on the tiny early intervention list had no spaces.
I heard great things then about preschool ones that accept home tuition.

Motherof123 · 24-02-2020 11:33pm

irishgirl19 wrote: »

Not July Provision but they'll refuse funding for an ASD preschool funded by home tuition scheme if they want to.

I rang one place that accept home tuition and they said apply In August for it so I guess surely if a school place was available you woukdnt need the home tuition one.
I was also told Transport would be provided for the ones on the list.
Not the home tuition ones.

irishgirl19 · 24-02-2020 11:52pm

Motherof123 wrote: »

I rang one place that accept home tuition and they said apply In August for it so I guess surely if a school place was available you woukdnt need the home tuition one.
I was also told Transport would be provided for the ones on the list.
Not the home tuition ones.

Our SENO told us last year not to worry she'd approve home tuition for a second preschool year. She didn't tell us that she was off the whole month of August though.
Got it approved eventually after some rigmarole

Calhoun · 24-02-2020 11:57pm

irishgirl19 wrote: »

Our SENO told us last year not to worry she'd approve home tuition for a second preschool year. She didn't tell us that she was off the whole month of August though.
Got it approved eventually after some rigmarole

Valuable lesson in this you always try get stuff in writing. I would say that was a stressful month.

irishgirl19 · 25-02-2020 8:43am

Calhoun wrote: »

Valuable lesson in this you always try get stuff in writing. I would say that was a stressful month.

Very. My SENOs manager said he'd sign it if I got x, y and z sent in. I got a letter from her EIT psychologist recommending that particular type of preschool.
In the end it was just left of my SENOS desk for her to sign when she got back.

byhookorbycrook · 25-02-2020 2:29pm

glack wrote: »

But having DEIS status has meant an increase in Special Education Teachers. If the new SNA model (as yet only not published) follows a similar model as is expected, it's not crazy to predict the possibility of a slightly higher allocation in DEIS schools next year.

When it came out in 2017, many DEIS schools benefited greatly from increased SET hours. The intention with this was to rebalance the inequality where children whose parents were in a position to pay for a private assessment they had greater opportunities to benefit from resource hours. Also, research shows a higher incidence of special needs in areas of disadvantage.

Sadly, it has meant that no matter what new needs come to light in a school, no extra hours have been added,so DEIS schools have been re-disadvantaged - if I can use that term, I wouldn't hold too much hope for "extra" SNAS, numbers of full time posts have actually fallen but DES spin mentions "extra SNAs, which are in fact fragment of posts.

byhookorbycrook · 25-02-2020 10:15pm

Motherof123 wrote: »

Yeah I would hope so to be honest that the teacher would watch for that.
She's so kind natured which is lovely but she wouldn't be assertive.
My other daughter gets sent on jobs too. Someone had an accident she went. But I'd say they get other kids to do jobs too we just wouldn't hear about those ones. Maybe the teachers aren't allowed assist kids to the bathroom?

A reliable child with good common sense probably gets a few more “ jobs” than others , but in terms of jobs , I mean collecting photocopying from the office , taking a note to another teacher etc. But shouldn’t be doing the work of an SNA .

Gatling · 25-02-2020 10:19pm

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

A reliable child with good common sense probably gets a few more “ jobs” than others , but in terms of jobs , I mean collecting photocopying from the office , taking a note to another teacher etc. But shouldn’t be doing the work of an SNA .

Totally agree if I was that child's parent I wouldn't be happy at that kind of situation ,as an sna I'd be embarrassed that a child is doing part of my job ,
I've seen older kids maybe holding the hand of a child with extra needs in a line or sitting beside each other but not doing anything that would be hands on stuff an SNA should be doing

Aveen · 29-02-2020 9:26am

So I just received diagnosis of ASD, this week. My shock was he required a asd unit, mainly because of language delay, no learning difficult.

I tried all schools in area for place in unit but no luck. SENO PUT it back to us parent to find a place. We have place in mainstream but because nothing about mainstream was mention he not get SNA support. It be 6 th is December so he has to go to school

What do I do?

Motherof123 · 01-03-2020 1:19am

Aveen wrote: »

So I just received diagnosis of ASD, this week. My shock was he required a asd unit, mainly because of language delay, no learning difficult.

I tried all schools in area for place in unit but no luck. SENO PUT it back to us parent to find a place. We have place in mainstream but because nothing about mainstream was mention he not get SNA support. It be 6 th is December so he has to go to school

What do I do?

It's really difficult to process it all and deal with all the paper work side of it which needs to be done ASAP.
So your child is 5?
My child got on his report that it was recommended that he attend a unit in a mainstream.
Early intervention also recommended and Slt and OT and the HSE have nothing to offer us. My child is 3.5
We paid for a multidisciplinary team to asses him as the HSE waiting list for the AON was too long.
Can you get your son into a mainstream with a unit attached until a space becomes available.
Maybe he will be ok in mainstream did he manage ok in playschool?

I'm sorry I cannot offer any school advice as my child is waiting on an early intervention playschool. We haven't got to that stage yet even tho I have put applications in for primary hoping he will get a space in sept 2022!

The seno cannot offwe much from my own experience only fill in paper work for the home tuition which we are availing of at the moment until a space becomes available.
There aren't enough schools to accommodate the children with special needs and that's the main problem here!
I hope you find a solution.
Did they offer any Slt that might assist the child to work on before sept 2020.

Calhoun · 01-03-2020 1:24am

Aveen wrote: »

So I just received diagnosis of ASD, this week. My shock was he required a asd unit, mainly because of language delay, no learning difficult.

I tried all schools in area for place in unit but no luck. SENO PUT it back to us parent to find a place. We have place in mainstream but because nothing about mainstream was mention he not get SNA support. It be 6 th is December so he has to go to school

What do I do?

You need to get back on to the SENO, has he been accepted in anywhere yet locally? If he gets accepted locally then its up to the SENO and the school to supply the SNA.

heldel00 · 01-03-2020 5:19pm

Calhoun wrote: »

You need to get back on to the SENO, has he been accepted in anywhere yet locally? If he gets accepted locally then its up to the SENO and the school to supply the SNA.

Supply "access" to the SNA. So important to remember this. This could mean anything from hours of support to minutes depending on severity of your child's needs and needs of others in mainstream.

Very wrong that you should have to do all this running around and be left with such uncertainty. If child had to have tonsils removed would GP say "ok he needs tonsillectomy now away you go and find a hospital willing to take him",

Calhoun · 01-03-2020 8:17pm

heldel00 wrote: »

Supply "access" to the SNA. So important to remember this. This could mean anything from hours of support to minutes depending on severity of your child's needs and needs of others in mainstream.

Very wrong that you should have to do all this running around and be left with such uncertainty. If child had to have tonsils removed would GP say "ok he needs tonsillectomy now away you go and find a hospital willing to take him",

Yes but that's how it works and legally once they have been discharged to the school it's up to the school and seno to make sure the educationplan in place works.

If it doesn't and the child's needs aren't been met well it will leave them in a situation where it could be exposed legally very easily.

I am not trying to be contrary but you have to play the game their way and use the law to your advantage.

Applying for an SNA

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