Remote working public servants not entitled to take flexi time.

HartsHat · 25-10-2020 9:28pm

How is this thread still going?

OP, given the amount of civil and public sector workers who have told you to get a grip and get on with things, surely you have realised you are way out of line on this?

Hundreds of colleagues have contracted this disease in the line of duty. Some have even died from this virus in the course of their work.

Others have watched their parents funerals from abroad because they couldn't get home from posting. More again have consistenly worked crazy hours, into the early morning, trying to get to grips with this national emergency.

And you're moaning about flexi.

Come on.

horsebox7 · 25-10-2020 9:33pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Yes I have.

NEITHER are specific to the Civil or Public Service.

The RTE article is generic to all WFH, including the private sector.

The Law Society report is also a set of generic guidelines for any employer who is considering allowing flexi time and WFH (not those who already have implemented them) and does NOT support your argument that REMOTE workers should be allowed accrue hours for flexi leave.

Final word - you fail to understand that flexible working hours are a privilege, not an entitlement, and your employer can change the terms of those conditions - including withdraw them - at any time.

As you continue to ignore straightforward questions, I am now out.

Untrue.

horsebox7 · 25-10-2020 9:34pm

HartsHat wrote: »

How is this thread still going?

OP, given the amount of civil and public sector workers who have told you to get a grip and get on with things, surely you have realised you are way out of line on this?

I don't think so

never_mind · 25-10-2020 9:40pm

horsebox7 wrote: »

I don't think so

Sorry, I'm new here to this thread but flexi time is great when you are in the office and doing overtime. If you are working from home and you are that unhappy with it do your main hours and refuse OT.

Again. You have an incremental, pensionable job, grin and bear. I am very lucky to have a job when so many are now surviving on 350 or less a week.

HartsHat · 25-10-2020 9:45pm

horsebox7 wrote: »

I don't think so

Literally no one has agreed with you.

horsebox7 · 25-10-2020 9:48pm

HartsHat wrote: »

Literally no one has agreed with you.

Untrue

horsebox7 · 25-10-2020 9:49pm

HartsHat wrote: »

Literally no one has agreed with you.

Untrue

noodler · 25-10-2020 9:56pm

horsebox7 wrote: »

Yes perhaps. The law society report clearly states that staff should be credited in time for extra hours worked. The same should apply to civil service

What does it say about the difficulty in verifying these hours have taken place?

Start/finish times action quite flexible when wfh.

Have you actually worked additional hours?

Has your line manager refused a local arrangement?

never_mind · 25-10-2020 10:21pm

noodler wrote: »

What does it say about the difficulty in verifying these hours have taken place?

Start/finish times action quite flexible when wfh.

Have you actually worked additional hours?

Has your line manager refused a local arrangement?

IMO, work from home IS as flexible as flexi. You don’t get the over time bonus points but your life, by its very nature, is more flexible now.

Karlos77 · 25-10-2020 11:00pm

horsebox7 wrote: »

Untrue

You are an absolute tosser ..

KaneToad · 25-10-2020 11:08pm

never_mind wrote: »

IMO, work from home IS as flexible as flexi. You don’t get the over time bonus points but your life, by its very nature, is more flexible now.

My understanding of Flexi time is that you can work up time during a 4 week period and take up to 1.5 days off in the following 4 week period? Correct me if I'm wrong.

This gives, approximately 19 additional days leave in a calendar year. ( Not technically leave because you will have worked the extra 19 days...)

I can see why it would be annoying to lose this due to WFH. Your employer is basically saying I can't trust you to work additional hours unless you are physically in the office. A sign of bad management.

Karlos77 · 25-10-2020 11:16pm

KaneToad wrote: »

My understanding of Flexi time is that you can work up time during a 4 week period and take up to 1.5 days off in the following 4 week period? Correct me if I'm wrong.

This gives, approximately 19 additional days leave in a calendar year. ( Not technically leave because you will have worked the extra 19 days...)

I can see why it would be annoying to lose this due to WFH. Your employer is basically saying I can't trust you to work additional hours unless you are physically in the office. A sign of bad management.

No one on boards.ie trusts Horsebox7

greenfield21 · 25-10-2020 11:17pm

KaneToad wrote: »

My understanding of Flexi time is that you can work up time during a 4 week period and take up to 1.5 days off in the following 4 week period? Correct me if I'm wrong.

This gives, approximately 19 additional days leave in a calendar year. ( Not technically leave because you will have worked the extra 19 days...)

I can see why it would be annoying to lose this due to WFH. Your employer is basically saying I can't trust you to work additional hours unless you are physically in the office. A sign of bad management.

1 day, so you will get 12 days in a year.

McCrack · 25-10-2020 11:21pm

horsebox7 wrote: »

Due to unprecedented cv19 arrangements public servants including those working in the local authority sector are not entitled to take flexi leave while those who are office based are entitled to take flexi leave which is unfair.

Tell it to the union

relax carry on · 25-10-2020 11:32pm

horsebox7 wrote: »

Should remote working staff have different conditions to office staff?

I'm sorry but repeating the same posts over and over isn't going to get you anywhere. You are just going to have to understand whatever perceived gripe you have seems to be yours alone. If working the role you have is causing you issues which no one else seems to share, then it's time to reconsider your career.

never_mind · 25-10-2020 11:54pm

KaneToad wrote: »

My understanding of Flexi time is that you can work up time during a 4 week period and take up to 1.5 days off in the following 4 week period? Correct me if I'm wrong.

This gives, approximately 19 additional days leave in a calendar year. ( Not technically leave because you will have worked the extra 19 days...)

I can see why it would be annoying to lose this due to WFH. Your employer is basically saying I can't trust you to work additional hours unless you are physically in the office. A sign of bad management.

Hmmm.. I don’t think that’s the case. Working from home already lends itself to flexible life which is why it’s there. If it’s a case that someone can’t do overtime they inform their line manager. In the CS they would get away with saying no in most cases which is why it’s so attractive to work there.

From my personal experience a lot of people build up hours by presenterism rather than actual value of work done. Since managers can’t be as hands on, due to the nature of WFH, flexi time is forcing people to work their contractual hours (insane!).

This is a lot of BS IMO. Do your job, do your hours, and move into the private sector if you want better pay but longer hours and rarely flexi time!

famagusta · 26-10-2020 12:23am

greenfield21 wrote:

1 day, so you will get 12 days in a year.

13 actually, its per 4 week period, not per month

the explorer · 26-10-2020 1:47am

Quick off topic question: I was a CO for a few years and went from point 3 to 5 on the scale. I am now an EO on point 1, will I go from 3 to 5 again or was that a once off?

Xenji · 26-10-2020 1:53am

the explorer wrote: »

Quick off topic question: I was a CO for a few years and went from point 3 to 5 on the scale. I am now an EO on point 1, will I go from 3 to 5 again or was that a once off?

It's only for entry positions, you are not entitled to it after promotion.

26-10-2020 1:58am

Sultan of Bling wrote: »

Well go work somewhere else if you feel so hard done by.

And the race to the bottom begins. If we all adopted this attitude, there wouldn't be anywhere better because we would be getting screwed. If those before us didn't stage work protests and form unions you and I wouldn't enjoy half the perks or rights we currently do.

I dont have flexi time or leave but at the end of the day, it's part of their terms and conditions of employment so they are entitled to it. The civil service didn't cause covid19

Nekarsulm · 26-10-2020 2:01am

Work as a CO in a Govt. Dept.
Flexi (and Clocking) discontinued back in March.
I didn't want to work from home, so have been in every day.
Due to maintaining distances between workers while in the office, most are on shorter hours.
I get in about 8.15am, and am out the door by 2.00pm
This allows others coming in at 2.00pm to be at their desk and not have me less than 3 metres away., and be there till 7pm.
So I'm doing about 30 hours a week but still getting paid.
How bad is that?
Swiped the clock last week out of curiosity, I owe the Dept over 900 hours....
Can see pay changes coming next year, and not for the better...

26-10-2020 2:03am

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

I dont have flexi time or leave but at the end of the day, it's part of their terms and conditions of employment so they are entitled to it. The civil service didn't cause covid19

Completely incorrect.

Flexi time is not part of the terms and conditions of employment of the civil service.

They are a privilege, not an entitlement. Not every office operates flexible working hours, and not every grade is allowed to work flexible hours.

26-10-2020 2:04am

never_mind wrote: »

Hmmm.. I don’t think that’s the case. Working from home already lends itself to flexible life which is why it’s there. If it’s a case that someone can’t do overtime they inform their line manager. In the CS they would get away with saying no in most cases which is why it’s so attractive to work there.

From my personal experience a lot of people build up hours by presenterism rather than actual value of work done. Since managers can’t be as hands on, due to the nature of WFH, flexi time is forcing people to work their contractual hours (insane!).

This is a lot of BS IMO. Do your job, do your hours, and move into the private sector if you want better pay but longer hours and rarely flexi time!

Longer hours? The average working week is less in the private sector.

Think logically, there's far more zero hour contracts and part time staff in the private sector. I and a lot of public sector staff work more than 40 hours as standard. 42 hours is my working week for example. I worked 40 in the private sector albeit with unpaid overtime (salaried position, not hourly) and from what I can see there's a lot of places now offering 30 to 35 as 'full-time'.

Same with flexi time, it's becoming more and more common. Most of the large tech companies staff are on it.

Lastly, they are doing their hours. They are taking time off in leu of payment for extra hours worked aka overtime.

Again, it's a condition of the employment. Why should they just give it up?

never_mind · 26-10-2020 2:05am

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

And the race to the bottom begins. If we all adopted this attitude, there wouldn't be anywhere better because we would be getting screwed. If those before us didn't stage work protests and form unions you and I wouldn't enjoy half the perks or rights we currently do.

I dont have flexi time or leave but at the end of the day, it's part of their terms and conditions of employment so they are entitled to it. The civil service didn't cause covid19

You don’t have leave? Ok, cool.

never_mind · 26-10-2020 2:07am

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Longer hours? The average working week is less in the private sector.

Think logically, there's far more zero hour contracts and part time staff in the private sector. I and a lot of public sector staff work more than 40 hours as standard. 42 hours is my working week for example. I worked 40 in the private sector albeit with unpaid overtime (salaried position, not hourly) and from what I can see there's a lot of places now offering 30 to 35 as 'full-time'.

Ha ha! Yeah right. I’m in PS as well. It’s 37.5 at the higher scale. Most private sector workers I know work 50+ a week. Contractually, I could do a lot less than I do but I put in the work and don’t go begging dor a day off because I earned my salary.

26-10-2020 2:09am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Completely incorrect.

Flexi time is not part of the terms and conditions of employment of the civil service.

They are a privilege, not an entitlement. Not every office operates flexible working hours, and not every grade is allowed to work flexible hours.

I didn't say flexi time and the op didn't either. You have just inserted that.

Every single department of the public sector allows time off in leu of payment for overtime. What is referred to depends. Flexi leave in the op. Toil where I am

the explorer · 26-10-2020 2:11am

Xenji wrote: »

It's only for entry positions, you are not entitled to it after promotion.

I got the EO in an open competition, would that make a difference?

never_mind · 26-10-2020 2:13am

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

I didn't say flexi time and the op didn't either. You have just inserted that.

Every single department of the public sector allows time off in leu of payment for overtime. What is referred to depends. Flexi leave in the op. Toil where I am

Untrue. I’m PS and don’t have flexi.

never_mind · 26-10-2020 2:15am

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

I didn't say flexi time and the op didn't either. You have just inserted that.

Every single department of the public sector allows time off in leu of payment for overtime. What is referred to depends. Flexi leave in the op. Toil where I am

Untrue. I’m PS and don’t have flexi.

26-10-2020 2:18am

never_mind wrote: »

Ha ha! Yeah right. I’m in PS as well. It’s 37.5 at the higher scale. Most private sector workers I know work 50+ a week. Contractually, I could do a lot less than I do but I put in the work and don’t go begging dor a day off because I earned my salary.

You do realise the difference between PUBLIC SECTOR and CIVIL SERVICE, yes?

Civil service is 37.5 minimum fulltime hours depending on contract. Road cleaners, Gardai, prisons, fire fighters, customs, etc all work 40 minimum.

Semi state, if you choose to include them are also 40.

Your friends are either on overtime or in breach of the law, take your pick. Personally I don't know anyone in the private sector working 50+ a week except my brother in law. He earns a lot more than any civil servant does in return and guess what? I'm not trying to drag him down.

never_mind wrote: »

Untrue. I’m PS and don’t have flexi.

Then I suggest you speak with management or your union because it's there in some manner.

However your comments are fairly wild so I'm not sure what sector your coming from.

Xenji · 26-10-2020 2:24am

the explorer wrote: »

I got the EO in an open competition, would that make a difference?

It's one of those grey areas, but if you had a break in service and prior service was not taken into account then technically you are starting a fresh into a entry position and you would be entitled to skipping the points.

never_mind · 26-10-2020 2:27am

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

You do realise the difference between PUBLIC SECTOR and CIVIL SERVICE, yes?

Civil service is 37.5 minimum fulltime hours depending on contract. Road cleaners, Gardai, prisons, fire fighters, customs, etc all work 40 minimum.

Semi state, if you choose to include them are also 40.

Your friends are either on overtime or in breach of the law, take your pick. Personally I don't know anyone in the private sector working 50+ a week except my brother in law. He earns a lot more than any civil servant does in return and guess what? I'm not trying to drag him down.

Then I suggest you speak with management or your union because it's there in some manner.

However your comments are fairly wild so I'm not sure what sector your coming from.

Are teachers not PS? They’re not on flexi.

Firemen also work far longer hours than 37.5 but are compensated with winter leave. They also don’t have flexi - they get more AL. Teachers, however, don’t.

In breach of the law for working over 50 hours a week? Yeah, most definitely. A reality? Yeah, most definitely.

never_mind · 26-10-2020 2:33am

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

You do realise the difference between PUBLIC SECTOR and CIVIL SERVICE, yes?

Civil service is 37.5 minimum fulltime hours depending on contract. Road cleaners, Gardai, prisons, fire fighters, customs, etc all work 40 minimum.

Semi state, if you choose to include them are also 40.

Your friends are either on overtime or in breach of the law, take your pick. Personally I don't know anyone in the private sector working 50+ a week except my brother in law. He earns a lot more than any civil servant does in return and guess what? I'm not trying to drag him down.

Then I suggest you speak with management or your union because it's there in some manner.

However your comments are fairly wild so I'm not sure what sector your coming from.

Also, you’re straying from the point. We’re taking about flexi time here.

26-10-2020 2:36am

never_mind wrote: »

Are teachers not PS? They’re not on flexi.

Firemen also work far longer hours than 37.5 but are compensated with winter leave. They also don’t have flexi - they get more AL. Teachers, however, don’t.

In breach of the law for working over 50 hours a week? Yeah, most definitely. A reality? Yeah, most definitely.

Teachers are. They don't all come and go at the same time but I take your point regarding their schedules so yes, they may be an exception. They however don't work holidays so I'm unsure where you get the idea they don't have more time off and they do work more than 37 hours.

Firemen is proving my point, not yours and they 100% have toil facilities. Again you are confusing flexi TIME with flexi LEAVE. Neither myself or the op said flexi time.

Flexi time is explained here as is the working week hours: https://hr.per.gov.ie/supports/flexible-work-arrangements/#

Flexi leave is say for example you work Monday to Friday. Your average civil servant. But something comes up and you need to also work the weekend as a once off. Now that may be on overtime pay but it can also be used as time off elsewhere. That's flexi leave or as I said, toil.

How the hours are calculated depends on your sector. Again I dunno yours. Are you a teacher?

As for your friends, I'm not sure what your point is. That we should all be grateful our bosses aren't breaking the law by making us work 50 hours a week or that we should be working 50 hours a week? Surely it would be better for everyone if their company was forced to obey the law and your friends had a better work / life balance?

Ah I see you posted again,

never_mind wrote: »

Also, you’re straying from the point. We’re taking about flexi time here.

That's the issue. No, we aren't talking about flexi time. I'm talking about flexi LEAVE add was the op. Perhaps other users strayed?

26-10-2020 2:42am

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

I didn't say flexi time and the op didn't either. You have just inserted that.

Every single department of the public sector allows time off in leu of payment for overtime. What is referred to depends. Flexi leave in the op. Toil where I am

"Flexi time" and "flexible working hours" are the same thing - both terms are used to describe flexible working hours.

You said this forms part of the terms and conditions of employment of the civil service, and that as such there is an entitlement to it - and that is completely incorrect. There is NO entitlement to work flexible hours, whatever you want to call it.

Time-in-lieu is also NOT part of flexible working hours, and is only granted in very specific circumstances, must be accrued outside of the flexible working bands of 8am to 7pm and must be agreed and pre-approved in advance.

The fact is, Flexible working hours are still operating - the only thing that has been changed is the right for those working remotely to accrue flexi leave, and the OP is a whiner who makes civil servants who actually care about doing a good job, rather then their clock balance, look bad.

never_mind · 26-10-2020 2:45am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

"Flexi time" and "flexible working hours" are the same thing - both terms are used to describe flexible working hours.

You said this forms part of the terms and conditions of employment of the civil service, and that as such there is an entitlement to it - and that is completely incorrect. There is NO entitlement to work flexible hours, whatever you want to call it.

Time-in-lieu is also NOT part of flexible working hours, and is only granted in very specific circumstances, must be accrued outside of the flexible working bands of 8am to 7pm and must be agreed and pre-approved in advance.

The fact is, Flexible working hours are still operating - the only thing that has been changed is the right for those working remotely to accrue flexi leave, and the OP is a whiner who makes civil servants who actually care about doing a good job, rather then their clock balance, look bad.

This.

26-10-2020 2:56am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

"Flexi time" and "flexible working hours" are the same thing - both terms are used to describe flexible working hours.

You said this forms part of the terms and conditions of employment of the civil service, and that as such there is an entitlement to it - and that is completely incorrect. There is NO entitlement to work flexible hours, whatever you want to call it.

Time-in-lieu is also NOT part of flexible working hours, and is only granted in very specific circumstances, must be accrued outside of the flexible working bands of 8am to 7pm and must be agreed and pre-approved in advance.

There's no "whatever you want to call it".

Ok, let's try again

A, flexi time. The ability to start and finish at varied times.

B, flexi leave. The ability to turn overtime into time off.

A exists but it's not a right. In my first post I quoted both terms. that's on me, I caused that confusion.

B also exists and is a right in all departments where overtime operates. Most places would of course require pre approval of overtime and of course the time off needs to be sanctioned just like any time off. I didn't claim different. Multiple users have made this point and construed the op comments as this. Yup obviously didn't.

There's absolutely no need to insult the op for requesting equal treatment as per their agreed practice. Did the op request to work from home?

None of this changes the race to the bottom that seems to always come from these threads. We should be aspiring up, not dragging down and certainly not expecting people to just accept any old treatment. Do you also support the two weeks forced leave after all travel including essential?

26-10-2020 3:15am

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

There's no "whatever you want to call it".

Ok, let's try again

A, flexi time. The ability to start and finish at varied times.

B, flexi leave. The ability to turn overtime into time off.

A exists but it's not a right. In my first post I quoted both terms, that's on me.

B also exists and is a right in all departments where overtime operates. Most places would of course require pre approval of overtime and of course the time off needs to be sanctioned just like any time off. I didn't claim different

B is Wrong.

"Overtime" is not part of flexible working hours.

Leave in Lieu is treated seperately, and much more strictly then flexitime. Leave in lieu is generally granted for extra hours worked where it has been agreed in advance for a business need, and it also goes to HR.

For the purpose of this discussion the OP is referring to flexi leave, not leave in lieu or overtime.

There is no entitlement to work extra hours and then try to claim leave-in-lieu.

26-10-2020 3:24am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

B is Wrong.

"Overtime" is not part of flexible working hours.

Leave in Lieu is treated seperately, and much more strictly then flexitime. Leave in lieu is generally granted for extra hours worked where it has been agreed in advance for a business need, and it also goes to HR.

For the purpose of this discussion the OP is referring to flexi leave, not leave in lieu or overtime.

There is no entitlement to work extra hours and then try to claim leave-in-lieu.

My understanding was from the op and the post from John hutton underneath it which refers to overtime bring taken as time off

26-10-2020 3:26am

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

There's no "whatever you want to call it".

Ok, let's try again

A, flexi time. The ability to start and finish at varied times.

B, flexi leave. The ability to turn overtime into time off.

A exists but it's not a right. In my first post I quoted both terms. that's on me, I caused that confusion.

B also exists and is a right in all departments where overtime operates. Most places would of course require pre approval of overtime and of course the time off needs to be sanctioned just like any time off. I didn't claim different. Multiple users have made this point and construed the op comments as this. Yup obviously didn't.

There's absolutely no need to insult the op for requesting equal treatment as per their agreed practice. Did the op request to work from home?

None of this changes the race to the bottom that seems to always come from these threads. We should be aspiring up, not dragging down and certainly not expecting people to just accept any old treatment. Do you also support the two weeks forced leave after all travel including essential?

Having been an administrative grade civil servant in various government departments for decades now, I know what to call it. You're the one who is confusing terms, and schemes.

i think you should look up the OPs prior posting history before jumping to be their defender. No, they did not request to work from home - but none of us did. It was a government decision to close our buildings. In fact the OP originally tried to use this to refuse to do any work at all.

I think you should also look at the opinion of every single civil servant on the thread who disagrees with the OP, and ask yourself why is it their own colleagues are not supportive of their stance? I'll answer that, its because we know its unreasonable.

I am genuinely glad I am not the unfortunate manager who has to manage this person on a daily basis.

The two weeks enforced unpaid leave after travel has nothing to do with this thread, please do not muddy the waters.

26-10-2020 3:40am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Having been an administrative grade civil servant in various government departments for nearly three decades now, I know what to call it. You are the one who is confusing terms, and schemes.

i think you should look up the OPs prior posting history before jumping to be their defender. No, they did not request to work from home - none of us did - it was a government decision to close our buildings. In fact they originally tried to refuse to do any work at all.

I think you should also look at the opinion of every single civil servant on the thread who disagrees with the OP , and ask yourself why is it their own colleagues are not supportive of their stance? I'll answer that, its because we know its unreasonable.

I am genuinely glad I am not the unfortunate manager who has to manage this person on a daily basis.

The two weeks enforced unpaid leave after travel has NOTHING to do with this thread, please do not muddy the waters.

People have agreed with the op though and again, if the op was told to work from home then it's unreasonable for the employer to change agreed conditions. Should the op have refused and insisted on going in?

Unpaid leave is relevant as it's another condition thrown at us in response to covid. One that is unfair. Give an inch, they take a mile.

26-10-2020 4:23am

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

People have agreed with the op though and again, if the op was told to work from home then it's unreasonable for the employer to change agreed conditions. Should the op have refused and insisted on going in?

Unpaid leave is relevant as it's another condition thrown at us in response to covid. One that is unfair. Give an inch, they take a mile.

Civil servants haven't. In what, nearly 16 pages of replies? Does that not tell you something?

It has been part of the government guidelines since March that all workers who can work from home, must do so. The only exception is essential workers, so the OP cannot just "refuse and insist on going in". Lets not waste time over what was not an option.

Flexible working hours were never suspended. On April 9, DPER paused the ability to accrue further credit towards flexi leave. All credit on the clock up to April 9 is still on the clock and will be available to use when the full flexi system is reinstated.

On 24 August, DPER reinstated the ability to accrue credit on the clock for any worker who had to return to office based work. The OP is not one of those, and they have consistently ignored any questions about their own work pattern.

Yes, I did agree with the requirement to use unpaid leave on return from foreign travel. Travelling during covid remains optional, so if you choose to do it, then you accept you need to self-isolate on return, at your own expense.

KaneToad · 26-10-2020 10:20am

greenfield21 wrote: »

1 day, so you will get 12 days in a year.

Just checked with my civil servant source. They can accrue 1.5 days per 4 week period. Leading to approximately 19 additional days* leave a year. Is this peculiar to their specific govt department only (they are a CO in Revenue) ?? What is your source for the 1 day info?

( *they will have worked 19 days worth of additional hours to achieve this)

SouthWesterly · 26-10-2020 10:24am

KaneToad wrote: »

Just checked with my civil servant source. They can accrue 1.5 days per 4 week period. Leading to approximately 19 additional days* leave a year. Is this peculiar to their specific govt department only (they are a CO in Revenue) ?? What is your source for the 1 day info?

( *they will have worked 19 days worth of additional hours to achieve this)

I was in a council. I got 1 day flexi per period.
Had to be in by 9 on certain days. I also had to take lunch as certain times.

wench · 26-10-2020 10:30am

KaneToad wrote: »

Just checked with my civil servant source. They can accrue 1.5 days per 4 week period. Leading to approximately 19 additional days* leave a year. Is this peculiar to their specific govt department only (they are a CO in Revenue) ?? What is your source for the 1 day info?

( *they will have worked 19 days worth of additional hours to achieve this)

It used to be 1.5 days, but was reduced to 1 day in 2014 as part of the increased basic hours.
I believe in the last year or two that there was a trial in certain offices/grades of bringing it back to 1.5 days, but I don't think it was rolled out to everyone.

Circular 11/2013 is still in force as far as I can tell.

Sultan of Bling · 26-10-2020 10:37am

Niner leprauchan wrote:

And the race to the bottom begins. If we all adopted this attitude, there wouldn't be anywhere better because we would be getting screwed. If those before us didn't stage work protests and form unions you and I wouldn't enjoy half the perks or rights we currently do.

Niner leprauchan wrote:

I dont have flexi time or leave but at the end of the day, it's part of their terms and conditions of employment so they are entitled to it. The civil service didn't cause covid19

Race to the bottom? In what way?

I'm finding my work and home life a lot more balanced now that I don't have core working hours anymore, no commute and all for the same salary.

kathleen37 · 26-10-2020 12:28pm

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Did the op request to work from home?

Had you read the OP's original thread from April linked further up, you would have seen that they originally wanted to be off work receiving full pay.

They didn't seem keen to work from home, but wanted to do that rather than travel in to the office, which was an option for them. So it would appear that yes, they did request to work from home rather than travelling into the office.

kathleen37 · 26-10-2020 12:35pm

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

There's absolutely no need to insult the op for requesting equal treatment as per their agreed practice.

I completely agree there is no need to insult the OP.

The issue is that the OP *is* receiving equal treatment as per their agreed practice in relation to the COVID pandemic.

It appears TOIL has been stopped for the duration of the pandemic for ALL of the OP's colleagues that are working from home.

As TOIL does not appear to be contractual and a work practice, then this is up to the employer in regards to how they implement it.

Luckily though, should the OP wish to continue to accrue TOIL, they have the option of returning to the office to work.

kathleen37 · 26-10-2020 12:54pm

You know I don't think there is anything anyone can say that will change the OP's mind. Pandemic or not.

So, OP, I would strongly suggest you lodge a grievance with your HR department.

You can also file a complaint with The Workplace Relations Commission

https://www.workplacerelations.ie/en/publications_forms/procedures_employment_and_equality_complaints.pdf

I think you're wrong and would be wasting your time, but please, let us know how you get on and what response you get.

Take care of yourself.

26-10-2020 1:31pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Yes, I did agree with the requirement to use unpaid leave on return from foreign travel. Travelling during covid remains optional, so if you choose to do it, then you accept you need to self-isolate on return, at your own expense.

tells me all I need to know. Look after yourself and **** the rest.

First off, theres no rules against travelling, The government very specifically states that in the high court. Secodnly, your employer has no right to interfere with your movements off duty outside of the law and lastly, plenty of people have found themselves needing to get on planes for absolutely essential reasons.

Remote working public servants not entitled to take flexi time.

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