Stallions

tryfix · 16-04-2012 12:53am

myfeelings wrote: »

Akeed Mofeed is by Dubawi not Dylan Thomas. As for Galileo being an excellent sire of sires that is very early to say as New Approach's are only starting to race and Teo's are only 3 this season and we're only at the start of it.

Correct I was mistaken about Akeed Mofeed. Galileo has made a great start as a sire of Sires, Heliostatic managed to sire a GP 3 winner, Teofilo is looking like the real deal and his stablemate New Approach looks a similar type. Sixties Icon has 2 two year old winners on the board already. It's a very promising start and will give a boost to his progenies chances at stud, nothing succeeds like success.

myfeelings · 16-04-2012 2:35pm

Unless Heliostatic gets the numbers this year he won't amount to much because when he was in Ireland he got very few mares. Upgrades his mares which is a good thing but needs numbers. Sixties Icons should be 3 year olds before they start winning for me its a worry that their rushing them out winning selling stakes, i think that shows they have limited ability. A son of Galileos that a saw some nice foals by last year in France was Soldier of Fortune he has the numbers so should do very well. I just think its a tad early to say he is a sire of sires, more than likely he will be a success with his sons.

tryfix · 17-04-2012 12:39pm

I see that Heliostatic has joined his full brother Soldier Of Fortune in France. Heliostatic @ €3,000 and Soldier Of Fortune @ €10,000. Their close relative the GP 1 winner producing sire Sholokhov is standing in Germany @ €6,000. Which one is the best value for money?

UrbanSea · 17-04-2012 12:43pm

Heliostatic- Sholokhov has just produced one group 1 winner

tryfix · 17-04-2012 1:17pm

UrbanSea wrote: »

Heliostatic- Sholokhov has just produced one group 1 winner

2 Grp 3 and 5 listed as well, Intense Focus from the same family with Giants Causeway and Danehill in the pedigree @ €5,500 is interesting and they'll probably sell well.

sting60 · 21-04-2012 6:22pm

Sixties Icon champion sprinting sire by a mile.Watch Mick Channons.

tryfix · 28-04-2012 3:56pm

Another GP1 winner for Galileo in 2012 with Niwot in Australiia. That's 2 so far this year for him, with South African Champion filly Igugu already winning in January.

He's on course to beat his his 2011 total of 11 individual GP1 winners.

http://www.racingpost.com/horses/result_home.sd?race_id=554589&r_date=2012-04-28&popup=yes#results_top_tabs=re_&results_bottom_tabs=ANALYSIS

http://www.racingpost.com/horses/result_home.sd?race_id=547444&r_date=2012-01-28&popup=yes#results_top_tabs=re_&results_bottom_tabs=ANALYSIS

tryfix · 30-04-2012 10:07am

So You Think, Australian fee announced as €52,275.

Fastnet Rock is now standing at €174,252 in Australia. Increasing from A$132,000 to A$220,000.

http://bloodstock.racingpost.com/news/bloodstock/fastnet-rock-fee-rise-makes-fastnet-dearest-sire-in-australia/1023853/top/

shy-tall-knight · 30-04-2012 10:41am

UrbanSea wrote: »

I stand by Court Cave and Gold Well. Think they're going to be very popular over the years,I read today Court Cave covered something like 140 mares last year or is booked to this year

Was a nice winner for Gold Well at Punchestown on tuesday with Grand Jesture in the bumper, later that evening who buys him only Alan Potts for 200k.
Definitely a stallion to watch out for in the NH game for the next few years. I've been backing plenty of his runners in bumpers but missed that one unfortunately, 25/1 darn

sting60 · 30-04-2012 12:00pm

tryfix wrote: »

So You Think, Australian fee announced as €52,275.

Fastnet Rock is now standing at €174,252 in Australia. Increasing from A$132,000 to A$220,000.

http://bloodstock.racingpost.com/news/bloodstock/fastnet-rock-fee-rise-makes-fastnet-dearest-sire-in-australia/1023853/top/

Im sure it was the plan from when Coolmore part purchased him,or was it.His sire High Chaparral has gone from 88,000Ad in 2010 to 77,000Ad in 2012.So You Think regressed when joining Ballydoyle according to ratings.He joined of a mark 126 went to a high of 127 and then was well beaten by horses rated 104 or less.The emphasis in Australia when breeding is on stamina as most if not all top value races are 1 1/2 miles and further.His breeding suggests stamina with Saddlers Wells /Darshan mare cross.With at least 1 pattern race every day in the continent that is Australia it is hard to evaluate what Fastnet Rock has achieved but the PR team at Ballydoyle will certainly overplay it.According to Ballydoyle web site SYT is standing at 66,000Ad .He may well in time join Rodrigo De Triano,Johannesburg[his son Scat Daddy has joined Ballydoyle USA],etc in Japan.

tryfix · 30-04-2012 1:37pm

sting60 wrote: »

Im sure it was the plan from when Coolmore part purchased him,or was it.His sire High Chaparral has gone from 88,000Ad in 2010 to 77,000Ad in 2012.So You Think regressed when joining Ballydoyle according to ratings.He joined of a mark 126 went to a high of 127 and then was well beaten by horses rated 104 or less.The emphasis in Australia when breeding is on stamina as most if not all top value races are 1 1/2 miles and further.His breeding suggests stamina with Saddlers Wells /Darshan mare cross.With at least 1 pattern race every day in the continent that is Australia it is hard to evaluate what Fastnet Rock has achieved but the PR team at Ballydoyle will certainly overplay it.According to Ballydoyle web site SYT is standing at 66,000Ad .He may well in time join Rodrigo De Triano,Johannesburg[his son Scat Daddy has joined Ballydoyle USA],etc in Japan.

I reckon Fastnet Rock is the real deal, his stock have speed and class. He covered 150 mares in Ireland last year, anyone who got on at €30,000 a pop should be looking at making a nice profit at the sales.

So You Think had it all to do in trying to translate Top Australian middle distance form into Top European middle distance form. He was impressive in the early part of the season, I loved the way he knuckled down and took the Eclipse after Workforce got first run. He seems to have gone down hill since the Arc and Champion stakes, but his runs since were on the dirt and he may not be that well suited to it. I'd still give him another chance in the top summer races if he was a reasonable price. He's not exactly an exciting stallion prospect, I doubt there'd be much interest in him here if he stands as a dual hemisphere stallion, but the Aussies will keep the faith with him.

There's a good article in this link about the European middle distance horses recent dominance of Australia's Top Middle distance races.

http://www.racingpost.com/news/horse-racing/former-euros-continue-australian-middle-distance-domination-april-9/1012725/#newsArchiveTabs=last7DaysNews

UrbanSea · 06-05-2012 11:57pm

Dylan Thomas' 3 year olds are looking good. They've trained on really well. Type to do better with time just like he was

tryfix · 07-05-2012 12:50pm

Roderick O'Connor to shuttle to Brazil.

http://bloodstock.racingpost.com/news/bloodstock/roderic-oconnor-to-shuttle-to-brazil/1028628/top/

UrbanSea · 20-05-2012 2:29pm

Would I be right in saying that Civil War in the 3.35 at Navan is the first runner by Scorpion on the track?

Edit think it's the second

faoile@n · 20-05-2012 6:15pm

Very good win by Cristoforo Colombo (half brother to Crusade), Henrythenavigators 2nd winner. Looks Ascot bound.

Really looking forward to Afonso De Sousa being a half brother to Big Brown (Kentucky Derby winner).

Exciting stallion prospect.

sting60 · 20-05-2012 8:25pm

faoile@n wrote: »

Very good win by Cristoforo Colombo (half brother to Crusade), Henrythenavigators 2nd winner. Looks Ascot bound.

Really looking forward to Afonso De Sousa being a half brother to Big Brown (Kentucky Derby winner).

Exciting stallion prospect.

Because the Irish form is so poor in relation [no inward investmemt to other stables] the English form has to have 6lb.

faoile@n · 21-05-2012 10:17am

sting60 wrote: »

Because the Irish form is so poor in relation [no inward investmemt to other stables] the English form has to have 6lb.

I'm not sure how this is relevant to me post

MyStubbleItches · 21-05-2012 1:24pm

Just watching Monday Review on ATR and JOB reckons that HenryTheNavigator has a couple of 2-yo that are well above the average.

Colonel Sanders · 21-05-2012 1:43pm

I think sons of Kingmambo have a very mixed record at stud, maybe Henry will buck that trend

UrbanSea · 21-05-2012 3:42pm

I thought the same Colonel but I had a quick look at King's Best. Henry will be getting some nice mares with good Saddler's Wells bloodline, two of King's Best's top colts were by Saddlers' Wells mares in Workforce and Creachadoir

myfeelings · 21-05-2012 4:51pm

Hardly will get Sadlers Wells mares considering he's out of one and one of the best of them at that, although with some matings i see these days who knows. Kingmambo can be a source of stamina which might be a worry when he has SW as his grandsire. It did look like a good maiden on paper but would need to improve for a crack at the coventry

UrbanSea · 21-05-2012 5:51pm

I was thinking the same it's close but when you see daughters of Galileo going to Sea the Stars I really wouldn't be surprised.

What I should have said was some with SW bloodline, maybe a daughter of a SW mare

Edit: I did say bloodline, I didn't explain myself too well

faoile@n · 26-05-2012 9:52am

Infanta Branca runs in the 2.40 at the Curragh for Henrythenavigator. She'll have to reverse the form with Liberatng but has a win under her belt since they last raced in Cork and I'm sure like all ballydoyle horses she will have come on a tonne from debut.

http://www.coolmore.tv/farm/usa/44

UrbanSea · 19-06-2012 3:58am

What would be the official relation between New Approach and Was e.g 3 parts siblings etc

marc96 · 19-06-2012 11:36am

IGUGU is a class filly by Galileo,on her way to Dubai for the carnival.
another one from M. De Kock which i like and is a mare from motjeu is Gorongoza,who has won 6 from last 7

Colonel Sanders · 22-06-2012 2:46pm

That's 2 Royal Ascot winners for New Approach

Colonel Sanders · 23-06-2012 2:43pm

Colonel Sanders wrote: »

That's 2 Royal Ascot winners for New Approach

Make that 3

2nd and 3rd were for 1st season sires too. Sixties Icon & Raven's Pass respectively

klairondavis · 23-06-2012 3:15pm

Early days but Sixties Icon has been something of a surprise package. Wouldn't have thought he'd get many forward 2yos given that he didn't race himself until 3.

Galileo looks like he may well become a good sire of sires, something Montjeu hasn't really done so far.

Nulty · 23-06-2012 3:20pm

klairondavis wrote: »

Early days but Sixties Icon has been something of a surprise package. Wouldn't have thought he'd get many forward 2yos given that he didn't race himself until 3.

Galileo looks like he may well become a good sire of sires, something Montjeu hasn't really done so far.

Mick Channon is a massive fan of that one

tryfix · 19-07-2012 4:45pm

JimDeChamp wrote: »

Trust me thier the two best in Ballydoyle...! Maybe and power in my opinion have to many miles on the clock, astrology will make a savage jumper, he's a giant...! Right wadings pedigree is extremely good and to be honest urban sea could of went to a shetland pony stallion and prob would of still produced a champion... Any body know what happens to the urban sea mare that Coolmore sold to France...?

JimDeChamp wrote: »

Her name is melikah she was by lammtarra...

She produced three runners that I can trace, Masterstroke by Monsun who won a listed race in France today and the promising Valedictory by Dubai Destination that won by 5l on his debut and never raced again. Lunar Landscape by Giants Causeway was the other one, a 55 rated horse that ran 10 times and only won a few thousand in prize money.

kksaints · 21-07-2012 7:11pm

Any Info on a mare called Hathrah? She was trained by John Dunlop and finished 3rd to Attraction in the 2000 guineas. Any info on any of her offspring?

tryfix · 22-07-2012 2:15am

kksaints wrote: »

Any Info on a mare called Hathrah? She was trained by John Dunlop and finished 3rd to Attraction in the 2000 guineas. Any info on any of her offspring?

She's the Dam of an unraced 2 yo called Wannaan by Pivotal. A very modest John Hammond 3yo called Mustakshif by Dansili. A once raced 5yo called Naasef by Pivotal trained by John Dunlop. A 6yo called Itlaaq by Alhaarth who's in training with mick Easterby.

A fairly useless Dam so far but there's hope for her yet, she visited Sea The Stars in 2011.

andyman · 23-07-2012 7:20pm

Speaking of Sea The Stars, have we heard of any names for his first crop yet?

UrbanSea · 11-08-2012 2:18am

Just looking through some pics of Sea the Stars' yearlings that were sold last back end.

Thought this was a lovely looker, filly out of Finsceal Beo

There's also a half brother to Creachadoir and Youmzain. Looked big for a yearling.

Gallery here

http://photos.racingpost.com/app/WebObjects/RPShop.woa/wa/p?cl=n_60wDYKON62WTw3yH4j2w..a&ts=f6hU4qdXRhdpqssRfIdMyQ..a

UrbanSea · 12-08-2012 3:49am

Something I really don't understand. Dam of Hurricane Run has a filly by Kandahar Run. Why would you send that mare to that stallion??

tryfix · 12-08-2012 1:06pm

UrbanSea wrote: »

Something I really don't understand. Dam of Hurricane Run has a filly by Kandahar Run. Why would you send that mare to that stallion??

Kandahar Run is owned by Gestut Ammerland, the owner/breeder of Hurricane Run, he's just supporting his own stallion by sending one of his best Broodmares to him.

He also sent Hurricane Run's dam Hold On and Hurricane Run's half sisters Heather Rose, Hold Off, and High Fidelity to his own stallion Lope De Vega ( Shamardal x Lady Vettori ), a horse he bred out of revenge for Hurricane Run's short head defeat by Shamardal in the Prix Du Jockey Club just before he sold Hurricane Run to Coolmore.
.

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/How+Lope+De+Vega's+Classic+victory+was+born+of+sweet+revenge.-a0226608595

The result was Lope De Vega, who on Sunday avenged Hurricane Run's French Classic defeat by storming to victory in the Poule d'Essai des Poulains. Both horses carried Ammerland's increasingly familiar red and green silks and were saddled by Andre Fabre.

"I have always liked Shamardal," says von Boetticher. "He stole the Jockey-Club from Hurricane Run - our horse came just too late and with a few extra strides would have won. From that moment I began to plot my revenge!

Hold On, a daughter of von Boetticher's first broodmare purchase, the Belgian-raced Sharpen Up mare Hone, was covered by Hurricane Run's sire Montjeu and his stellar Coolmore stud mate Galileo in the past two seasons, but this year she is visiting Kandahar Run, who was trained by Henry Cecil to win the Newmarket Stakes for von Boetticher and retired to stand at Ammerland this year - at a fee of just EUR500.

What a difference, going from Montjeu and Galileo to the €500 sire Kandahar Run.

UrbanSea · 12-08-2012 3:38pm

Interesting. Lope De Vega was a really nice horse, think I backed him in the Arc.

Been looking at some American stallions while I'm here. No stallion has had more than 2 group 1 winners all season, are the top stallions really worth their fee over here?? http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred-breeding/sire-lists

tryfix · 12-08-2012 4:09pm

A nice soft ground GP1 win by Pedro The Great today, a great boost for Henry The Navigator's Stallion career.

It'll be interesting to see what kind of three year olds they'll make.

tryfix · 12-08-2012 4:59pm

UrbanSea wrote: »

Interesting. Lope De Vega was a really nice horse, think I backed him in the Arc.

Been looking at some American stallions while I'm here. No stallion has had more than 2 group 1 winners all season, are the top stallions really worth their fee over here?? http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred-breeding/sire-lists

I'm not too impressed by the US stallions, they don't seem to translate too well into Europe. Dynaformer has had a few nice types, Street Cry tends to get hype horses over here that don't deliver when push comes to shove.

Is there a superstar stallion over there like Galileo here or Fastnet Rock in Austrailia?

Giants Causeway has been fairly quite over here since the initial promise of Shamardal and the likes of Ghanaati.

I think there's a golden generation of sires in Europe at the moment. Apart from the Coolmore machine, there's all the nice Juddmonte horses like Oasis Dream and Dansili with Frankel coming down the line.

Even Darley have Dubawi, New Approach, Exceed and Excel and a host of promising young sires.

There's any amount of new blood like Sea The Stars coming down the line, a heap of them by Galileo who's looking like like a sire of sires.

It's time to start sending some top sires stateside, we're up to our eyes in quality sires in Europe.

UrbanSea · 12-08-2012 11:45pm

I'm not convinced by a lot of American ones. The top fee stallions are both Darley in Street Cry and Bernardini. Bernardini is only in about his third set of 2 year olds I believe but is yet to have a gr.1 winner this year while Street Cry has had one. Dynaformer was a really good one I didn't realise he wasn't even a gr.1 winner himself, I know next to nothing about American grade 1's apart from the big ones in the last couple of years.

Giant's Causeway was standing at 300k and he hasn't even produced an american classic winner to date. I'm a huge fan of War Front, and Awesome Again is very good value at 50k compared to some of the others I think.

Interesting how Cape Blanco's will do over there, first son of Galileo. Think it's about time they had one

Sorry I forgot to answer, I suppose the superstars would be considered the three named above. Don't think any come close to Storm Cat. Think Scat Daddy is going to be a really good sire too. Got off to a good start with Daddy Long Legs and he has probably the best 3 year old filly in training over here in Lady of Shamrock, won the American Oaks last month, both in his first crop. Was only 10k last year, 17.5 this year, he's leading first crop sire, can see him only getting better.

Edit: They're also selling seriously well. 2 year old colt went for 575k in May, another filly this year went for 250, very good for quite a low fee. I think the stallions over here are seriously over priced

Nulty · 13-08-2012 1:37am

UrbanSea wrote: »

I'm not convinced by a lot of American ones. The top fee stallions are both Darley in Street Cry and Bernardini. Bernardini is only in about his third set of 2 year olds I believe but is yet to have a gr.1 winner this year while Street Cry has had one. Dynaformer was a really good one I didn't realise he wasn't even a gr.1 winner himself, I know next to nothing about American grade 1's apart from the big ones in the last couple of years.

Giant's Causeway was standing at 300k and he hasn't even produced an american classic winner to date. I'm a huge fan of War Front, and Awesome Again is very good value at 50k compared to some of the others I think.

Interesting how Cape Blanco's will do over there, first son of Galileo. Think it's about time they had one

Sorry I forgot to answer, I suppose the superstars would be considered the three named above. Don't think any come close to Storm Cat. Think Scat Daddy is going to be a really good sire too. Got off to a good start with Daddy Long Legs and he has probably the best 3 year old filly in training over here in Lady of Shamrock, won the American Oaks last month, both in his first crop. Was only 10k last year, 17.5 this year, he's leading first crop sire, can see him only getting better.

Edit: They're also selling seriously well. 2 year old colt went for 575k in May, another filly this year went for 250, very good for quite a low fee. I think the stallions over here are seriously over priced

The purses are much bigger over there though aren't they? Maybe not proportionally but makes up for some of the distortion

UrbanSea · 15-08-2012 6:51pm

Prize money is very good, some claimers go up to about 40 thousand dollars, maidens can be the same. Though I still think they're overpriced considering the current fees are after huge reductions in recent years. For example Giant's Causeway was 300k at one stage, Kingmambo was the same. Giant's Causeway stood for 100k in Irish punts his first year when he stood in Tipp,that must be the greatest rip off for an unproven stallion ever

faoile@n · 20-08-2012 11:58am

How do people think Sea the Stars will do as a stallion?

The list mares that were sent to him were pretty impressive so there will be no excuses if he doesn't produce.

Does Cape Cross have any other sons as stallions?

UrbanSea · 21-08-2012 2:30am

No excuses at all. Think he should do well, Cape cross doesn't have any but Invincible Spirit is by Green Desert and I do think Lawman has started off well so hopefully he can be a sire of sires.

Lady of Shamrock won another grade 1 for Scat Daddy, she is very good filly

Nulty · 30-09-2012 2:48pm

Steeler makes Raven's Pass stamp on breeding prospects. Can't make any incisive insights on this my self but would like to hear you opinions on it.

UrbanSea · 06-10-2012 1:40am

Surprised Steeler is such a good two year old, his dam won the Park Hill stakes at 3 so he should be even better next season, but Darshaan is an excellent broodmare sire too.

Raven's Pass wouldn't have had any excuses if he failed, he got some very nice mares. Was a vintage year though between him,New Approach and Henrythenavigator

Mgoraf · 10-10-2012 10:31pm

Dunno if this is the right thread but..full sister to Was sold for 1.5mil at the Tattersalls sales today.

Some pics...
Sea The Stars colt sold for 575k

Another Sea The Stars - 550k

This is the one sold for 1.5mil

Sea The Stars 430k

Galileo Filly 925k

Galileo filly 1.3mil

Nulty · 10-10-2012 11:15pm

Mgoraf wrote: »

Dunno if this is the right thread but..full sister to Was sold for 1.5mil at the Tattersalls sales today.

Some pics..

Absolute legend! Post anymore you can get! Thanks!

Mgoraf · 10-10-2012 11:37pm

Sea The Stars / Infallible. 260k

Teofilo / Love Excelling. 600k

Sea The Stars / Love To Dance 280k

Sea The Stars / Multicolour Wave 475k

Sea The Stars / Musical Treat. 500k

Dansili / Neartica. 550k

Ravens Pass / Nightime. 800k

Montjeu / Lucina 700k

Galileo / Ouija Board. 550k

New Approach / Waaat. 400k

Montjeu / Wanna. 725k

"He has the pedigree, the looks & is by such a good sire who sadly is no longer with us," "He's as good as any I have seen by the sire," - Michael Goodbody

Galileo / Witch Of Fire 900k

Galileo / Aleandrer Goldrun 950k

Sea The Stars / Alleluia. 550k

ArmaniJeanss · 10-10-2012 11:37pm

Any idea who the buyers of the STS yearlings are? Also what sort of prices have the Tsui's been willing to pay?

Stallions

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