Buying bitcoins

MyPeopleDrankTheSoup · 03-04-2013 12:23am

Amberman wrote: »

Im not saying it isn't going to correct somewhat from here. I think it will...no asset goes up in a straight line.

The global savings rate (especially the Western savings rate) is low compared to historical norms, and savings alone don't cause currency appreciation...so you can safely ignore the Economist.

Agreed that anyone putting all their savings into one vehicle is lunacy.

What happens if there is no crash? Space your purchases out over time to mitigate this risk and smooth returns. I am not selling my Bitcoins, sorry. They're making me a fantastic return. If anything, I'm buying more shortly.

Do you wanna share how much you bought originally and when, did you cash out on any and how much you have left?! Just out of curiosity, I'm sure you won't want to answer.

Yeah, it's so hard to buy at the moment. When someone finally cracks how to sell them online and accept paypal/credit cards without risk of chargebacks, it'll be real interesting.

pH · 03-04-2013 12:29am

georgiecasey wrote: »

Do you wanna share how much you bought originally and when, did you cash out on any and how much you have left?! Just out of curiosity, I'm sure you won't want to answer.

Yeah, it's so hard to buy at the moment. When someone finally cracks how to sell them online and accept paypal/credit cards without risk of chargebacks, it'll be real interesting.

There's a relatively safe site called :

http://localbitcoins.com/

You need to buy with cash by meeting someone - but it has a safe transfer mechanism.
You agree to a deal on the site - the site gives you a code (that you keep to yourself)
You meet up, hand over the cash they seller does some magic - the seller will only be shown the code once they have actually transferred the bitcoins.

So if the seller can provide a code that matches yours then you can be confident that the transfer has happened.

I'm not suggesting anyone takes thousands of euros, but if someone wanted a couple of hundred euros worth of bitcoin it's no more risky than handing over cash to buy anything you've ordered on the net.

MyPeopleDrankTheSoup · 03-04-2013 12:32am

pH wrote: »

There's a relatively safe site called :

http://localbitcoins.com/

You need to buy with cash by meeting someone - but it has a safe transfer mechanism.
You agree to a deal on the site - the site gives you a code (that you keep to yourself)
You meet up, hand over the cash they seller does some magic - the seller will only be shown the code once they have actually transferred the bitcoins.

So if the seller can provide a code that matches yours then you can be confident that the transfer has happened.

I'm not suggesting anyone takes thousands of euros, but if someone wanted a couple of hundred euros worth of bitcoin it's no more risky than handing over cash to buy anything you've ordered on the net.

Yeah, I came across that site but it means I've to get off my arse

There's a few selling in Galway and Limerick but nobody in Ennis, where I am. I might pick some up the next time I'm in Dublin.

Amberman · 03-04-2013 12:50am

georgiecasey wrote: »

Do you wanna share how much you bought originally and when, did you cash out on any and how much you have left?! Just out of curiosity, I'm sure you won't want to answer.

Good guess.

georgiecasey wrote: »

Yeah, it's so hard to buy at the moment. When someone finally cracks how to sell them online and accept paypal/credit cards without risk of chargebacks, it'll be real interesting.

The fact that there cant be charge backs is a feature of the network, not a bug. I don't think that credit cards or paypal will ever be suitable for buying bitcoins.

theroomisonfire · 03-04-2013 7:39am

I just saw that 1BTC is now trading at €103 on Mtgox. madness!

martyoo · 03-04-2013 8:47am

nothing in Google news about a hack. Seems it's down for maintenance and has cleared out its wallets as a precaution as far as I can tell.

It's on their website.

We have detected a security breach. Services are temporarily suspended until we have thoroughly investigated the situation. We will resume services as soon as possible.

So while the Bitcoin protocol may be secure (for now) your computer and someones website are not.

Amberman · 03-04-2013 10:38am

theroomisonfire wrote: »

I just saw that 1BTC is now trading at €103 on Mtgox. madness!

Bitcoins are now almost $145! :eek:

As soon as they get to $100,000, Im selling. Looks like Tuesday fortnight should be payday at this rate.

Amberman · 03-04-2013 10:45am

martyoo wrote: »

So while the Bitcoin protocol may be secure (for now) your computer and someones website are not.

Shouldn't keep your key on your computer. Definitely agree with that.

A tiny proportion of poker accounts got emptied in the early days too until they got their act together...didn't stop the growth there either.

Judging by the price action, people are more scared of their governments than they are of the chances of being hacked. The chances of being hacked, even if you are tech-retarded, are still very slim.

Amberman · 03-04-2013 10:49am

Amberman wrote: »

Bitcoins are now almost $145! :eek:

As soon as they get to $100,000, Im selling. Looks like Tuesday fortnight should be payday at this rate.

lol...20 minutes later...$130 and falling fast. :rolleyes:

Gotta love the excitement!

DaveDaRave · 03-04-2013 12:25pm

that feel when i was gonna get 1000 euro worth from my friend when it was $12 in the hopes of making a few hundred euro. but he didnt hook me up.

all that money ;(

gonna buy in now coz the regret is driving me nuts.

Roonbox · 03-04-2013 4:49pm

http://www.cnbc.com/id/100609853

Squeaky the Squirrel · 03-04-2013 8:31pm

http://blog.maschinenraum.tk/2012/07/15/bitcoin-vending-machine-exchange-euro-coins-for-bitcoin-wallets/

FINCEN: Bitcoin Users Not Regulated, Exchanges Are

First bit of regulation for them, wasn't mentioned on Thread yet.

Roonbox · 04-04-2013 4:34pm

this doesnt inspire confidence -

Bitcoin Hacked: Price Stumbles After Buying Frenzy

Online currency bitcoin had 20 percent knocked off its price overnight on Thursday as one of its major exchanges became the victim of a hacking attack leading to a sell-off in the virtual currency after reaching an all-time high.

Uncertainty over other currencies, turmoil in Cyprus and media interest are just some of the reasons commentators are citing for the 360 percent rise in bitcoin prices over the last month. The frenzied interest in bitcoins piled over onto the social media site Twitter and led to a spike in Google searches on the topic.

(Read More: What Is Bitcoin?)

But by Thursday morning bitcoin prices had fallen to $132 from Wednesday's record price of $147.

The most popular bitcoin exchange, Tokyo-based Mt.Gox announced overnight that it had been the victim of a hacking attack after experiencing a severe lag with its systems. The complications meant the price quickly sank to below $115 before regaining ground to $130 by 6.00 a.m. London time on Thursday, according to Bitcoincharts.com.

(Read More: Bitcoin Bubble: How 'Geeks' Sent Prices Parabolic)

"There are many who will try to take advantage of the system. The past few days were a reminder of this sad truth," it said in a press release on its Facebook site.

The exchange blamed a type of hacking attack called a distributed denial-of-service attack (DDoS).

More than 80 percent of all bitcoin-USD trades and more than 70 percent of all bitcoin currency trades are done on Mt.Gox's servers, according to the company, making it is a major target for anyone wanting to take down bitcoin trading.

(Read More: Bitcoin Showing 'Aggressive Bubble' Behavior: SocGen)

"Attackers wait until the price of bitcoins reaches a certain value, sell, destabilize the exchange, wait for everybody to panic-sell their bitcoins, wait for the price to drop to a certain amount, then stop the attack and start buying as much as they can. Repeat this two or three times like we saw over the past few days and they profit," Mt.Gox said.

"There is pretty much nothing that can be done. Large companies are frequently victims of these kinds of attacks. Even though we are using one of the best companies to help us fight against these DDoS attacks, we are still being affected."

Bitcoin is a virtual currency allowing users to exchange online credits for goods and services. There are currently nearly 11 million bitcoins in circulation but the currency is capped at 21 million coins. While there is no central bank that issues them, new bitcoins can be created online by using a computer to complete difficult tasks, a process known as mining.

(Read More: Bitcoin Boom? An ATM for Virtual Currency in the Works)

The total value of all bitcoins has now surpassed $1.4 billion. But these latest revelations may go some way to reinforce criticisms of its instability and price volatility. Mt. Gox had to temporarily suspend deposits on March 12 as a newly mined block of bitcoin went unrecognized by the system which caused a short sell-off.

Another bitcoin associated company Instawallet - an online storage service - was hacked earlier this week and its service was suspended indefinitely.

"Our database was fraudulently accessed, due to the very nature of Instawallet it is impossible to reopen the service as-is," it said on its website.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/100615508

srsly78 · 04-04-2013 4:41pm

Bitcoin didn't get hacked, the article is sensationalist. One of the exchanges is suffering under all the extra load is all.

zonEEE · 04-04-2013 5:46pm

"The exchange blamed a type of hacking attack called a distributed denial-of-service attack (DDoS)."

Bitcoin hacked ?

A ddos on an exchange and cnn comes out with that bullsh1t.

Guess thats CNN for ya....

Pity the fools who take their word for gospel

Roonbox · 04-04-2013 6:23pm

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-04-04/visualizing-bitcoin-encryption-standard

a proper breakdown

Roonbox · 04-04-2013 6:27pm

I am loving peoples blind enthusiasm on this.. its exciting.

I don't buy it for one second as a viable alternative but I am tempted to take a ride on the mania train for a while if I get an opportunity to get in cheap.

pH · 04-04-2013 6:36pm

Roonbox wrote: »

I am loving peoples blind enthusiasm on this.. its exciting.

I don't buy it for one second as a viable alternative but I am tempted to take a ride on the mania train for a while if I get an opportunity to get in cheap.

A "computer currency" like bitcoin is incredibly exciting - the possibilities are endless - it does to money and value what the www has already done to information. This is apart from any reasons to jump on a bubble - having "value" that's secure, anonymous and tradable easily by computers on the net is the next big evolution of cyberspace.

Selik · 05-04-2013 12:28am

Anybody seen this site?

https://www.casascius.com

Very interesting!

milltown · 05-04-2013 1:19am

zonEEE wrote: »

"The exchange blamed a type of hacking attack called a distributed denial-of-service attack (DDoS)."

Bitcoin hacked ?

A ddos on an exchange and cnn comes out with that bullsh1t.

Guess thats CNN for ya....

Pity the fools who take their word for gospel

Exactly.
DDOS is, to me, the exact opposite of hacking.
Hacking implies somebody with specific skills attacking a system to a specific end. Justin Bieber could orchestrate a DDOS attack over Twitter by tweeting "all my fans should take a look at this page http://www.ghey4biebz.org".

At $150 I'd love a physical bitcoin for posterity, even though it would be a bit like having a CD with an early MP3 burnt onto it, almost completely missing the point. Will keep an eye to see what sort of money a 1Btc coin ends up going for.

OU812 · 05-04-2013 1:24am

Giles wrote: »

Anybody seen this site?

https://www.casascius.com

Very interesting!

Does that not defeat the entire point of them?

spix · 05-04-2013 2:37am

Just started bitcoining a couple of hours ago

Earned 25c so far less 8c electricity.

I'll be rich in no time.

fergalr · 05-04-2013 3:10am

Cavehill Red wrote: »

You just need to shut access to the network. That can be done through regulation, which is likely imminent, or through hacking an exchange, as has happened already.

zonEEE wrote: »

For you to bring down the network you would have to shut access to the internet for every single person in the world, Each person is a node. This is impossible.

zonEEE wrote: »

I got an awful funny mental image in my head : Gardai using "major network shutting GUI" shutting the internet down.

srsly78 wrote: »

Cavehill Red your criticisms are off the mark, you clearly do not understand the basic technical stuff behind this. Indeed you should not invest in something you have no idea about.

srsly78 and zonEEE, I thought you were pretty hard on Cavehill there.

My understanding is that Cavehill says there's significant downside risk, in the event that a nation (e.g. USA) decides to regulate and legislate against Bitcoin, and attempt to shutdown the network.

You dismiss Cavehill's claims, and say its not possible to shutdown the network.

I would be very interested in some sort of technical explanation for why you guys think that nation-state level resources couldn't shut down the Bitcoin network?

Amberman · 05-04-2013 4:23am

fergalr wrote: »

srsly78 and zonEEE, I thought you were pretty hard on Cavehill there.

My understanding is that Cavehill says there's significant downside risk, in the event that a nation (e.g. USA) decides to regulate and legislate against Bitcoin,

The bitcoin markets are already regulated. Most of the big ones like mt.gox already comply with US anti-money laundering regulations.

and attempt to shutdown the network.

You dismiss Cavehill's claims, and say its not possible to shutdown the network.

It really isnt. There isn't a head on the beast which you can chop off. Its a distributed peer to peer network.

I would be very interested in some sort of technical explanation for why you guys think that nation-state level resources couldn't shut down the Bitcoin network?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peer-to-peer

xertpo · 05-04-2013 10:32am

Nice article on the commodity v currency argument

https://medium.com/money-banking/2b5ef79482cb

hfallada · 05-04-2013 10:39am

Bitcoin was on the front of the FT this week saying its only spiking being of the cyprus situation. Also if the bitcoin currency grows very big the US government will shut it down. I seen some man in the middle of nowhere made like $5 million of his own currency in the US and was put in prison for 25 years. The US government may force them to close it. They have successful banned( some people obviously still do it but a majority dont) internet gambling probably because it was a threat to US casinos

srsly78 · 05-04-2013 10:42am

A majority don't gamble online in america? Sure, but they probably could if they wanted to. Can hardly call the ban successful if everyone still does it anyway. Bitcoin is a big way american gamblers fund their play nowadays.

Successful like the war on drugs I suppose?

Amberman · 05-04-2013 10:45am

hfallada wrote: »

Bitcoin was on the front of the FT this week saying its only spiking being of the cyprus situation. Also if the bitcoin currency grows very big the US government will shut it down. I seen some man in the middle of nowhere made like $5 million of his own currency in the US and was put in prison for 25 years. The US government may force them to close it. They have successful banned( some people obviously still do it but a majority dont) internet gambling probably because it was a threat to US casinos

Don't suppose the FT elaborated on HOW the US govt could shut down BTC?

FYI, LOADS of poker players from the US continued to play poker during the internet poker ban.

They have these things called proxy servers and offshore bank accounts these days. :cool:

Amberman · 05-04-2013 11:09am

srsly78 wrote: »

Successful like the war on drugs I suppose?

LOL...I can see it now..."The war on Bitcoin" ... its a matter of natioanl security and anyone who uses it is a terrorist.

**** OFF America!

Roonbox · 05-04-2013 5:18pm

Amberman wrote: »

LOL...I can see it now..."The war on Bitcoin" ... its a matter of natioanl security and anyone who uses it is a terrorist.

**** OFF America!

You cant be swayed. If you find yourself completely and totally on one side of a trade and don't even consider that you may be incorrect, that is usually not a good sign.

Bitcoins have a lot of issues, the main one for me being that the general public will not adopt a currency that is this volatile.

Buying bitcoins

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