Benefits of Public Sector over Private Sector

Sarn · 04-06-2020 11:47am

snoopboggybog wrote: »

Sorry not for sounding dumb but where does that 2500 go?

Into a private pension fund or towards the state pension?

Compulsory pension deductions.

snoopboggybog · 04-06-2020 11:58am

Sarn wrote: »

Compulsory pension deductions.

So justs get taking off you for the state pension?

snoopboggybog · 04-06-2020 12:04pm

Thanks everyone for their insights as well.

From what I can gather the public sector seems to be much better, 22 days holidays versus 30 days is a big plus for me.

Pay Increase for myself.

Better job opportunities.

More chances for promotion.

Planning on a mortgage next year for myself so the extra bump in wages will be huge for me as a single applicant.

I'll do the interview anyway and see what comes of it.

jim o doom · 04-06-2020 12:05pm

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »

Public pensions are guaranteed. Public pensions are calculated as (number of years service / 80) X final salary.

Absenteeism not punished in the same way.

Little or no performance reviews or PIP schemes.

These two are incorrect, I'm not naming departments but I know for a fact that your total lifetime salary is how your pension is now calculated, following the recession, rather than end salary.

Wage increments are witheld for excessive absenteeism, and there are indeed PIP training for managers and official schemes in place. How widely used they are is another matter, I have no figures for that.

There is also goal setting, mid year review and end of year reviews for staff performance, but like any place, if you are friendly with your manager you may get better reviews even with poorer pefeformance.

I know multiple people working in private banks, such as BOI / AIB, and it's the same as the public sector in there. Hard to fire staff, very little in the way of PIP's, there are staff reviews but they generally go well as staff that review badly are hard to move to other sections.

Cyrus · 04-06-2020 12:08pm

snoopboggybog wrote: »

Thanks everyone for their insights as well.

From what I can gather the public sector seems to be much better, 22 days holidays versus 30 days is a big plus for me.

Pay Increase for myself.

Better job opportunities.

More chances for promotion.

Planning on a mortgage next year for myself so the extra bump in wages will be huge for me as a single applicant.

I'll do the interview anyway and see what comes of it.

if its promotion you want the private sector is the place to go for it, public sector progression is slow no matter what you do.

from your earlier posts more holiday and a easier job appears to be as strong a motivation, if thats the case sounds like a good move.

jim o doom · 04-06-2020 12:18pm

Cyrus wrote: »

if its promotion you want the private sector is the place to go for it, public sector progression is slow no matter what you do.

from your earlier posts more holiday and a easier job appears to be as strong a motivation, if thats the case sounds like a good move.

This is not necessarily true - I know people who went from Clerical officer to Higher Executive officer within months (a 2 grade jump) and it was a year after that they got Assistant Principal. Other people try for years.

It's very much down to how many promotional competitions are run, and how well educated and capable you are. If the opportunitues don't arise, you won't get promoted, if they do and you aren't good enough.. same situation.

Given that there's a recession looming, promotions are going to start drying up soon.

In terms of job difficulty, that's down to the department you end up in, and the level of job you are doing. If you are at AP level working in a busy department working on Brexit, or something like that, you are going to be worked to the bone.

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! · 04-06-2020 12:20pm

jim o doom wrote: »

These two are incorrect, I'm not naming departments but I know for a fact that your total lifetime salary is how your pension is now calculated, following the recession, rather than end salary.

Wage increments are witheld for excessive absenteeism, and there are indeed PIP training for managers and official schemes in place. How widely used they are is another matter, I have no figures for that.

There is also goal setting, mid year review and end of year reviews for staff performance, but like any place, if you are friendly with your manager you may get better reviews even with poorer pefeformance.

I know multiple people working in private banks, such as BOI / AIB, and it's the same as the public sector in there. Hard to fire staff, very little in the way of PIP's, there are staff reviews but they generally go well as staff that review badly are hard to move to other sections.

Every day is a school day. I wasn't aware of that.

I heard Public Sector workers don't pay PRSI. So are they not entitled to state pension?

What about optical and dental benefits? Or Job seekers if they're laid off?

Cyrus · 04-06-2020 12:22pm

jim o doom wrote: »

This is not necessarily true - I know people who went from Clerical officer to Higher Executive officer within months (a 2 grade jump) and it was a year after that they got Assistant Principal. Other people try for years.

ok fair enough, that wouldnt be that common though i guess?

i spent some time in one of the more commercial semi states, filled with very capable people but the rate of progression is glacial.

snoopboggybog · 04-06-2020 12:27pm

Can anyone explain to me how the pension works here? I have no clue.

Completely different than the private sector?

jim o doom · 04-06-2020 12:40pm

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »

I heard Public Sector workers don't pay PRSI. So are they not entitled to state pension?

What about optical and dental benefits? Or Job seekers if they're laid off?

So another poster shared taxcalc.ie - if you go on there and input that you are a civil servant you can see what deductions are made, and they do include PRSI they are: civil service pension, USC, PRSI, and PAYE.

Public employees are employees and pay all the same taxes at the same rates.

No optical or dental benefits beyond what is provided for as a normal part of PRSI - aka 1 clean and examination per year for dental and nothing extra, same as everyone else.. unless of course they pay some medical scheme like the Hospital Saturday Fund.

mlem123 · 04-06-2020 12:42pm

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »

Every day is a school day. I wasn't aware of that.

I heard Public Sector workers don't pay PRSI. So are they not entitled to state pension?

What about optical and dental benefits? Or Job seekers if they're laid off?

Where did you hear that?? :pac::pac:

Not true, we pay our PRSI, USC etc plus pension deduction

jim o doom · 04-06-2020 12:43pm

Cyrus wrote: »

ok fair enough, that wouldnt be that common though i guess?

i spent some time in one of the more commercial semi states, filled with very capable people but the rate of progression is glacial.

Not super common, and it very much depends on the economy.. like many jobs. If things are going well, there are a lot of promotion competitions, and once you are good enough to get them, you can fly up the ladder. I know a girl who hit principal officer around 34.

But if there's a recession, there's no promotions and no new hirees for years as the various organisations continually haemorrage staff through retirements and deaths, meaning fewer and fewer people doing more and more work.

Cheeseplant · 04-06-2020 12:48pm

Pkiernan wrote: »

You're right, I grossly underestimated it.

The Paid Sick Leave scheme provides for a maximum of 92 days on full pay in a rolling one year period, followed by a maximum of 91 days on half pay.

This is subject to a maximum of 183 days paid sick leave in a rolling four year period.

For critical illness is it not?

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! · 04-06-2020 1:00pm

mlem123 wrote: »

Where did you hear that?? :pac::pac:

Not true, we pay our PRSI, USC etc plus pension deduction

I heard teachers don't pay PRSI so I assumed it applied to all public workers. I was clearly mistaken :pac:

History Queen · 04-06-2020 1:05pm

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »

I heard teachers don't pay PRSI so I assumed it applied to all public workers. I was clearly mistaken :pac:

Teachers do pay PRSI

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! · 04-06-2020 1:11pm

History Queen wrote: »

Teachers do pay PRSI

I must've had my wires crossed.

I always had it in my head that certain public workers were not entitled to the state pension (they only got their ps pension) and as such were exempt from PRSI.

Technocentral · 04-06-2020 1:12pm

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »

I heard teachers don't pay PRSI so I assumed it applied to all public workers. I was clearly mistaken :pac:

???? Everyone in Ireland pays PRSI!

babaracus · 04-06-2020 1:16pm

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »

I must've had my wires crossed.

I always had it in my head that certain public workers were not entitled to the state pension (they only got their ps pension) and as such were exempt from PRSI.

You are thinking of those recruited prior to 1995 - they pay a much lower rate of PRSI and build up no entitlement to the State contributory pension (old age pension).

All Public and Civil Servants recruited since April 1995 pay the same rate of full PRSI as every other person in the state.

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! · 04-06-2020 1:22pm

babaracus wrote: »

You are thinking of those recruited prior to 1995 - they pay a much lower rate of PRSI and build up no entitlement to the State contributory pension (old age pension).

All Public and Civil Servants recruited since April 1995 pay the same rate of full PRSI as every other person in the state.

I see. The grass is always greener as they say.

What type of deductions are made for unions?

dubrov · 04-06-2020 1:23pm

Don't overrate the pension.
You will be on an average salary pension and have to pay pension contributions and the pension levy.
It is also net of the state pension.

Say your average salary is 60k per year and the state pension is 10k per year.
If you work 40 years you will receive 60*40/80 = 30k a year net of the state pension.
So it is really only worth 20k per year in your pension to you.
That's still pretty good but as I say you have to pay for it.
Personally I would see a private role that contributed 8-10% of your salary to a defined contribution pension as being superior.

Another thing to consider is that when you hit the top of the band, it may be difficult to move up a level.
In many cases it is easier to move to the private sector and return than try and get an internal promotion.

Lastly, don't expect to work with cutting edge technologies.
Risk is the priority, not output so things can be very slow to change

Treppen · 04-06-2020 1:24pm

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »

I see. The grass is always greener as they say.

What type of deductions are made for unions?

Which Union?

snoopboggybog · 04-06-2020 1:28pm

dubrov wrote: »

Don't overrate the pension.
You will be on an average salary pension and have to pay pension contributions and the pension levy.
It is also net of the state pension.

Say your average salary is 60k per year and the state pension is 10k per year.
If you work 40 years you will receive 60*40/80 = 30k a year net of the state pension.
So it is really only worth 20k per year in your pension to you.
That's still pretty good but as I say you have to pay for it.
Personally I would see a private role that contributed 8-10% of your salary to a defined contribution pension as being superior.

Another thing to consider is that when you hit the top of the band, it may be difficult to move up a level.
In many cases it is easier to move to the private sector and return than try and get an internal promotion.

Lastly, don't expect to work with cutting edge technologies.
Risk is the priority, not output so things can be very slow to change

Not too worried about pension money to be honest when house will be paid off, I find people who worry or max out their pension will die with the money in the Bank. If they don't spend it now, they won't spend it in retirement.

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! · 04-06-2020 1:31pm

Treppen wrote: »

Which Union?

I do apologise for my ignorance.
I assumed that NBRU, ASTI, INMO unions would be roughly the same.

Do ps workers get paid on strike?

Certain ps workers have my utmost respect. Bus drivers and nurses are at the top of that list.

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! · 04-06-2020 1:31pm

Treppen wrote: »

Which Union?

I do apologise for my ignorance.
I assumed that NBRU, ASTI, INMO unions would be roughly the same.

Do ps workers get paid on strike?

Certain ps workers have my utmost respect. Bus drivers and nurses are at the top of that list.

babaracus · 04-06-2020 1:34pm

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »

I see. The grass is always greener as they say.

What type of deductions are made for unions?

Union membership is optional. Rates approx 1% of salary

History Queen · 04-06-2020 1:35pm

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »

I do apologise for my ignorance.
I assumed that NBRU, ASTI, INMO unions would be roughly the same.

Do ps workers get paid on strike?

Certain ps workers have my utmost respect. Bus drivers and nurses are at the top of that list.

No we don't get paid when on strike (and rightly so). Can only speak for my own union (TUI) but the amount you pay for membership depends on the amount of hours on your contract, part time workers pay less. I pay approx €30 per month

mcgragger · 04-06-2020 1:36pm

snoopboggybog wrote: »

I have interview in three weeks for a role, obviously salary is better and more holidays but anything i should be aware of like been easier to let go etc.

Has there been ever a huge layoff of public sector staff?

Thanks

I changed from a Private Sector Job to a Public Service job at the end of 2019.

I took a 20k gross paycut. Sounds alot but after deductions and taxes are considered I am down about 6k nett. Luckily I am on a good grade salary in the public sector that I dont miss the 6k. I can still pay my bills and I am not having to do the 60/70 hours a week of work like I was in the private sector.

I do the basic work week now and any extra is counted and I am told to take the time in lieu.
I have 27 days annual leave compared to 22 in my last job.
Pension contributions are 16% compared to 5% in my last job
PLus we have flexitime - can start any time up to 10am. Its magic.

I work hard and the place where I work is very good in general. There are some piss takers but overall I am impressed.

I do miss the perks of corporate days out and the extra cash etc but in general perks are not worth full time private sector stress.

As long as you apply yourself and do your job you should be good in the Public sector.

Sarn · 04-06-2020 1:38pm

snoopboggybog wrote: »

So justs get taking off you for the state pension?

No, PRSI is taken separately to cover that, however, post 95 pensions have the state pension incorporated into the overall pension that is received. So in those cases, the pension deductions and PRSI go towards the final pension. I’m sure others can explain it better than me.

snoopboggybog · 04-06-2020 1:42pm

mcgragger wrote: »

I changed from a Private Sector Job to a Public Service job at the end of 2019.

I took a 20k gross paycut. Sounds alot but after deductions and taxes are considered I am down about 6k nett. Luckily I am on a good grade salary in the public sector that I dont miss the 6k. I can still pay my bills and I am not having to do the 60/70 hours a week of work like I was in the private sector.

I do the basic work week now and any extra is counted and I am told to take the time in lieu.
I have 27 days annual leave compared to 22 in my last job.
Pension contributions are 16% compared to 5% in my last job
PLus we have flexitime - can start any time up to 10am. Its magic.

I work hard and the place where I work is very good in general. There are some piss takers but overall I am impressed.

I do miss the perks of corporate days out and the extra cash etc but in general perks are not worth full time private sector stress.

As long as you apply yourself and do your job you should be good in the Public sector.

Can you explain how the pension works? Do you have to match that 16% or is it automatically paid without matching it?

I'm really confused about how pensions work in it.

I see your entitled to a pension better than the state pension even if you don't contribute anything yourself?

I really like the idea of flexi time, A lot of Fridays I do bolloxed in my current role and wouldn't mind an extra hour in the morning.

EO2019 · 04-06-2020 1:42pm

Sarn wrote: »

No, PRSI is taken separately to cover that, however, post 95 pensions have the state pension incorporated into the overall pension that is received. So in those cases, the pension deductions and PRSI go towards the final pension. I’m sure others can explain it better than me.

If you earn for example €40k then your pension would be €20k (less if your career average is less). Of this just shy of €11k is the state pension so the actual pension you recieve for your contributions is €9k

Benefits of Public Sector over Private Sector

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