Spring 2020..... 1.5m Dairy calves.... discuss.

jaymla627 · 07-11-2019 6:06pm

Base price wrote: »

Bord Bia has announced changes to its SDAS (Sustainable Dairy Assurance Scheme) to come into force from the 11th of November. No on farm slaughtering of healthy calves will be allowed from this date - proper order too. There are other rules re welfare but the article doesn't go into detail. All SDAS farmers are to be notified shortly.
https://www.farmersjournal.ie/on-farm-calf-slaughter-banned-506795

The cute lads are transferring calves into a beef mans herd number and then they are sent to slaughter, unless they close this loophole its just a pr excercise

wrangler · 07-11-2019 6:13pm

jaymla627 wrote: »

The cute lads are transferring calves into a beef mans herd number and then they are sent to slaughter, unless they close this loophole its just a pr excercise

You'd need your head examined if you were doing that, talk about bringing trouble on yourself,
If ordering a few extra replacement tags is able to trigger an inspection, what would 100% deaths in your calves do

jaymla627 · 07-11-2019 6:59pm

wrangler wrote: »

You'd need your head examined if you were doing that, talk about bringing trouble on yourself,
If ordering a few extra replacement tags is able to trigger an inspection, what would 100% deaths in your calves do

Dairy farmer is selling live calves to beef farmer( dairy farmer is paying beef farmer ) if beef farmer then decides to slaughter them in a approved department facility as is still perfectly legal their is no rules been broken,

Sheep breeder · 07-11-2019 7:23pm

jaymla627 wrote: »

Dairy farmer is selling live calves to beef farmer( dairy farmer is paying beef farmer ) if beef farmer then decides to slaughter them in a approved department facility as is still perfectly legal their is no rules been broken,

The department have the cmms to track all movements of all stock and have a check in place of movements into and out for dealer purposes and any thing out of the ordinary results in a inspection.

Mooooo · 07-11-2019 7:24pm

Are you just making thus stuff up or what?

Base price · 07-11-2019 7:28pm

jaymla627 wrote: »

Dairy farmer is selling live calves to beef farmer( dairy farmer is paying beef farmer ) if beef farmer then decides to slaughter them in a approved department facility as is still perfectly legal their is no rules been broken,

Neither is the dairy farmer who sends them directly (after 10 days old) to a DAFM slaughter facility breaking any law.
However to date any farmer that had numbers of newborn bull calves euthanised on farm received inspections from DAFM Vets including cross compliance inspections in some cases.

_Brian · 07-11-2019 7:55pm

This carry on is just giving the extremist anti farming groups a huge stick to beat farming with.

Base price · 07-11-2019 8:17pm

_Brian wrote: »

This carry on is just giving the extremist anti farming groups a huge stick to beat farming with.

Brian, public perception and anti farming (vegan) groups are driving the future course of Irish farming whether we like it or not. You have said that you don't like the idea of dairy bull calves been exported to mainland Europe but the reality is that, if and when that outlet is gone, we will have c.200K additional bull calves to deal with.
On a slightly positive note I read earlier that cattle suitable for the Chinese market are non QA bull beef so there maybe some hope for the FR/FRx bull calf.

mf240 · 07-11-2019 8:50pm

Is it not legal to get the Knackeries out to collect calves I thought it was.
Surely with the real extreme calves if lads can't give them away then it's the only option.

Bass Reeves · 07-11-2019 10:05pm

Base price wrote: »

Brian, public perception and anti farming (vegan) groups are driving the future course of Irish farming whether we like it or not. You have said that you don't like the idea of dairy bull calves been exported to mainland Europe but the reality is that, if and when that outlet is gone, we will have c.200K additional bull calves to deal with.
On a slightly positive note I read earlier that cattle suitable for the Chinese market are non QA bull beef so there maybe some hope for the FR/FRx bull calf.

AFAIK the Chinese want U30 month QA beef. Now they may take bulls but it has to be QA. Processors are still not giving any headway on bulls. There may be weight limits in place although they slice and dice everything so I am be of the opinion that carcasse weight would not be a factor.

Bit issue I see with the Chinese market is it is a whit meat market, Pork, Chicken and fish. Unless there demand displaces these meats elsewhere and then the beef is send to those markets.

Base price · 07-11-2019 10:06pm

mf240 wrote: »

Is it not legal to get the Knackeries out to collect calves I thought it was.
Surely with the real extreme calves if lads can't give them away then it's the only option.

Knackeries are the only approved body that can collect dead stock ex farm. There are exceptions where some stock are sent/delivered directly to Universities and used for educational purposes. The Veterinary College in UCD would be an example.

AFAIK it is not illegal to euthanise new born calves but the majority of farmers prefer not to do so - however see my previous post.
There are a number of DAFM approved facilities that have been operating over the years that humanly cater for 10 day old+ dairy bull calves that cannot be sold or given away.

Danzy · 07-11-2019 10:26pm

Bass Reeves wrote: »

AFAIK the Chinese want U30 month QA beef. Now they may take bulls but it has to be QA. Processors are still not giving any headway on bulls. There may be weight limits in place although they slice and dice everything so I am be of the opinion that carcasse weight would not be a factor.

Bit issue I see with the Chinese market is it is a whit meat market, Pork, Chicken and fish. Unless there demand displaces these meats elsewhere and then the beef is send to those markets.

African Swine fever is going to finish off China's pigs.

Half the world's pigs live in China, that's bigger than all beef eaten worldwide.

Roughly twice as much pork eaten as beef globally.

That's before the death of pigs across Asia is taken in to account.

Its hard to grasp the scale but if every head of cattle in Europe and the Americas, North and South died tomorrow, it wouldn't even be close to what is going on.

It'll surely be a 5p bump in price.

mahoney_j · 07-11-2019 11:02pm

Danzy wrote: »

African Swine fever is going to finish off China's pigs.

Half the world's pigs live in China, that's bigger than all beef eaten worldwide.

Roughly twice as much pork eaten as beef globally.

That's before the death of pigs across Asia is taken in to account.

Its hard to grasp the scale but if every head of cattle in Europe and the Americas, North and South died tomorrow, it wouldn't even be close to what is going on.

It'll surely be a 5p bump in price.

The future is bright?The Chinese have killed 200 million pigs (50% of the national herd) and China has 50% of the worlds pigs. They will need to import 20 million tonnes of meat per year to meet their demand starting in 2020. There is only 8 million tonnes of pork traded and 10 million Tonnes of beef traded globally.

mf240 · 07-11-2019 11:34pm

The local Chinese still has pork anyway maybe their pigs were some of the lucky ones

Base price · 07-11-2019 11:37pm

Bass Reeves wrote: »

]AFAIK the Chinese want U30 month QA beef. Now they may take bulls but it has to be QA. Processors are still not giving any headway on bulls. There may be weight limits in place although they slice and dice everything so I am be of the opinion that carcasse weight would not be a factor.

Bit issue I see with the Chinese market is it is a whit meat market, Pork, Chicken and fish. Unless there demand displaces these meats elsewhere and then the beef is send to those markets.

They want under 30 month old cattle but there is no requirement for QA so as I posted previously there is a possible outlet for dairy bull calves coming down the line.

Base price · 07-11-2019 11:52pm

mahoney_j wrote: »

]The future is bright?The Chinese have killed 200 million pigs (50% of the national herd) and China has 50% of the worlds pigs. They will need to import 20 million tonnes of meat per year to meet their demand starting in 2020. There is only 8 million tonnes of pork traded and 10 million Tonnes of beef traded globally.

Unfortunately in this situation one man's loss is another man's gain and Irish pig, poultry and beef producers will gain. Let us not forget that we've been down a simular road in the past when others supported us in our time of need.
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/cork-sculpture-recalls-generosity-of-choctaw-nation-during-famine-1.3118580

Buford T. Justice XIX · 08-11-2019 12:09am

Base price wrote: »

Unfortunately in this situation one man's loss is another man's gain and Irish pig, poultry and beef producers will gain. Let us not forget that we've been down a simular road in the past when others supported us in our time of need.
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/cork-sculpture-recalls-generosity-of-choctaw-nation-during-famine-1.3118580

I doubt there's a chance of famine there, BP. The price of pork especially and other meats will rise but products and types of meat used will change. Poultry and pork will definitely rise and it's well overdue for both sectors. Offal and cheaper beef cuts will be more in demand as well, I'd expect.

tabby aspreme · 08-11-2019 12:24am

Buford T. Justice VI wrote: »

I doubt there's a chance of famine there, BP. The price of pork especially and other meats will rise but products and types of meat used will change. Poultry and pork will definitely rise and it's well overdue for both sectors. Offal and cheaper beef cuts will be more in demand as well, I'd expect.

Pig prices have risen globally 25 - 40% in the last year

Buford T. Justice XIX · 08-11-2019 12:44am

tabby aspreme wrote: »

Pig prices have risen globally 25 - 40% in the last year

And will rise more again. There's a lot of pig units still paying off accumulated losses from the last few years.

Base price · 08-11-2019 3:59am

[QUOTE=Buford T. Justice VI;111715297]I doubt there's a chance of famine there, BP. The price of pork especially and other meats will rise but products and types of meat used will change. Poultry and pork will definitely rise and it's well overdue for both sectors. Offal and cheaper beef cuts will be more in demand as well, I'd expect.[/QUOTE]
AFAIK the Chinese government doesn't have the welfare of their entire population at heart :mad:

wrangler · 08-11-2019 8:52am

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Larry unaffected by the Strike, it seems. 'Irreparable Damage' to the Irish Beef Industry eh....?

https://www.independent.ie/business/irish/abp-buys-its-third-production-facility-in-poland-35135337.html

It looks like he's taking the attitude that if we don't want to supply cheap beef he'll get it somewhere else, it must be him that's bringing the beef into here.

_Brian · 08-11-2019 9:33am

Buford T. Justice VI wrote: »

I doubt there's a chance of famine there, BP. The price of pork especially and other meats will rise but products and types of meat used will change. Poultry and pork will definitely rise and it's well overdue for both sectors. Offal and cheaper beef cuts will be more in demand as well, I'd expect.

I’d say allot of units producing pork in China will quickly switch to chickens and duck which are quick to build numbers and are already readily consumed there.

They will have a government driven move to cover the food gap as quickly as possible so I think any bounce in pig or cattle prices will be short term.

Mooooo · 08-11-2019 9:38am

wrangler wrote: »

It looks like he's taking the attitude that if we don't want to supply cheap beef he'll get it somewhere else, it must be him that's bringing the beef into here.

It's labelling laws that should be protested

wrangler · 08-11-2019 11:16am

Mooooo wrote: »

It's labelling laws that should be protested

I was at the presidential debate last night, according to one of the audience there's 90 containers of beef came into dublin port this week....... processing that is probably slowing up the kill too.

Siamsa Sessions · 08-11-2019 12:21pm

wrangler wrote: »

I was at the presidential debate last night, according to one of the audience there's 90 containers of beef came into dublin port this week....... processing that is probably slowing up the kill too.

What’s the official reason?

How does it pay to ship ice to the arctic? Or sand to the desert?

wrangler · 08-11-2019 12:30pm

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

What’s the official reason?

How does it pay to ship ice to the arctic? Or sand to the desert?

Why are we importing lambs, market control
Apparently 47000 tons polish beef comes in annually, reason is price, 3 mths ago polish beef processors were paying €270/ kg to farmers

Hard Knocks · 08-11-2019 7:39pm

wrangler wrote: »

Why are we importing lambs, market control
Apparently 47000 tons polish beef comes in annually, reason is price, 3 mths ago polish beef processors were paying €270/ kg to farmers

Very true
The problem is it’s labelled Irish and nobody in authority gives a damn
Friends of friends....

Siamsa Sessions · 08-11-2019 9:13pm

wrangler wrote: »

Why are we importing lambs, market control
Apparently 47000 tons polish beef comes in annually, reason is price, 3 mths ago polish beef processors were paying €270/ kg to farmers

Control supply and you control everything. Never was it more important to try find alternative routes to consumers for our produce.

Just read another article in Farming Indo about a Reko Ring set-up in Lahinch. Producers post on a Facebook page what they have for sale and consumers order on the same page. There’s a weekly collection then in a local car park. All done and dusted within 20-30 mins. No trading license needed like a Farmers Market coz all sales are agreed in advance on the Facebook page.

This might not suit the majority of beef and lamb producers but it’s another outlet all the same.

Base price · 10-11-2019 5:44pm

Any thoughts on this article from NZ about rearing 10,000 FR, AA and HE calves on OAD. Reading the article is appears that the average purchase price is $99/hd but they sell at 12/14 weeks of age/100kg liveweight at $800 to $900 per head.

We use a OAD system at 540grms of a 35% skim powder and the bull calves thrive on it. I wonder would $800/900 per head pay to have them flown to NZ :rolleyes:
https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/rearing-10000-calves-with-a-once-a-day-feeding-system-in-new-zealand/

Albert Johnson · 10-11-2019 11:33pm

Base price wrote: »

Any thoughts on this article from NZ about rearing 10,000 FR, AA and HE calves on OAD. Reading the article is appears that the average purchase price is $99/hd but they sell at 12/14 weeks of age/100kg liveweight at $800 to $900 per head.

We use a OAD system at 540grms of a 35% skim powder and the bull calves thrive on it. I wonder would $800/900 per head pay to have them flown to NZ :rolleyes:
https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/rearing-10000-calves-with-a-once-a-day-feeding-system-in-new-zealand/

It's some turnover in a few short weeks, granted this is before costs but still it's some gross margin to work off. They mention contracted customers so perhaps they have access to a market that isn't readily available to competitors although I'm only surmising. Having said that there working at scale and seem very selective as regards calf quality and potential. I'm yet too see a system that makes a silk purse out of a sows ear as it were, the poorer quality calf isn't wanted in this system either.

alps · 11-11-2019 5:41am

Base price wrote: »

Any thoughts on this article from NZ about rearing 10,000 FR, AA and HE calves on OAD. Reading the article is appears that the average purchase price is $99/hd but they sell at 12/14 weeks of age/100kg liveweight at $800 to $900 per head.

We use a OAD system at 540grms of a 35% skim powder and the bull calves thrive on it. I wonder would $800/900 per head pay to have them flown to NZ :rolleyes:
https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/rearing-10000-calves-with-a-once-a-day-feeding-system-in-new-zealand/

I seriously question the accuracy of some of the agriland articles. Some of the reporting can be very slack. $800/900 for a 100kg dairy calf makes absolutely no sense.

Gawddawggonnit · 11-11-2019 7:17am

AFAIK...

In the Eu, the minimum slaughter age is 8mts. This is enforced.

At that age they’d want to be 300+kg live weight or 170+kg carcass.

If you’re lucky a BBx will achieve €4/kg dead weight...more like €3.70/kg atm.

Color of the meat is graded from 1-4.
Conformation graded 1-18.
Fat score 1-4.

Target color 2.5-3.0.
Target conformation 8.5-9.0.
Target fat score 3-3.5.

Like everything else you’d want a fairly large throughput to make a respectable margin, thus BBx are the preferred calf type.

* All prices are +vat.

Bass Reeves · 11-11-2019 10:27am

alps wrote: »

I seriously question the accuracy of some of the agriland articles. Some of the reporting can be very slack. $800/900 for a 100kg dairy calf makes absolutely no sense.

800NZ dollies is 460 euro. Australian beef price is 3.38euro/kg +vat or 3.55/kg on an Irish price. This is a commercial calf rearing operation. I have no price for NZ beef but imagine that it is similar. Like all really commercial operations which this calf rearing operation is it will always insist at a decent margin. These are contracted before the calves are born. Costs can often be higher than you think as bought in rations, hay and straw are often very expensive because of haulage.

In general the farmers there have no wintering costs like us and NZ nearly grows grass all year around. Cattle will be extensively grazed on land unsuitable for tillage or dairying. Sheep which is highly labour intensive are the next option. I would imagine that cattle can be finished off grass. No 30 Month limits no weight limit but maybe bonuses in place for certain carcasse weights and grades. Grading may be targeted towards markets. As well no stocking limits or paperwork.

It interesting that Friesian are the preferred choice of calf. In a grass based system a animal capable of good weight gain/day is better than a good converter. The AA and HE may be like it is going in Ireland too easy calving.

460-500 euro may seem on the high side for a reared calf in an Irish system but in an all grass based system a well reared calf going to grass at 100kgs being mob grazed gaining 900grams/day would hit 350DW after 22months grazing. 750 gross margin . You are more than likely looking at a net margin of 500/head. Even if a 24-28 month turn around finishing 5-600 such cattle on a 1000acre plus farm would be quite doabke

The other choice would be 400 suckker cows

manjou · 11-11-2019 1:54pm

they also have a different grading which pays on meat quality rather than carcass shape. to get a calf to 12 weeks old plus a margin plus cost you wouldn't have much change out of 450. when calf lands he goes straight to grass until slaughter so has no store period and would finish slot quicker than you think when lower carcass weights are taken into account you would make a better margin than 300 kg ch at 900 euro at 7 month's

3 the square · 11-11-2019 2:37pm

Sold 5 fr bulls in the mart 105 each 4 weeks old
Happy enough!

Bass Reeves · 12-11-2019 1:53am

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

AFAIK...

In the Eu, the minimum slaughter age is 8mts. This is enforced.

At that age they’d want to be 300+kg live weight or 170+kg carcass.

If you’re lucky a BBx will achieve €4/kg dead weight...more like €3.70/kg atm.

Color of the meat is graded from 1-4.
Conformation graded 1-18.
Fat score 1-4.

Target color 2.5-3.0.
Target conformation 8.5-9.0.
Target fat score 3-3.5.

Like everything else you’d want a fairly large throughput to make a respectable margin, thus BBx are the preferred calf type.

* All prices are +vat.

I presume this is veal

Gawddawggonnit · 12-11-2019 8:05am

Bass Reeves wrote: »

I presume this is veal

Yes.
I put that up to show just how hard the veal producers are hit. A year ago the best BBx calves would get up to €6/kg dead.
Nobody even noticed, and these are the people who will be buying all those exported Irish calves...!

Processors are helping producers by paying for the milk powder etc. to try and keep them in business. Interesting times.

Ed. The rule of thumb is that you need to finish around 1k calves to earn the basic minimum wage of €19k net.

Bass Reeves · 12-11-2019 9:33am

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

Yes.
I put that up to show just how hard the veal producers are hit. A year ago the best BBx calves would get up to €6/kg dead.
Nobody even noticed, and these are the people who will be buying all those exported Irish calves...!

Processors are helping producers by paying for the milk powder etc. to try and keep them in business. Interesting times.

Ed. The rule of thumb is that you need to finish around 1k calves to earn the basic minimum wage of €19k net.

And there is people in this country trying to promote a veal enterprise.expecting that is the answer or rose veal. It the same as U16 month bill beef, high cost,high output with a very low margin. Lots of people between other farmers and the powers that be have not realized how the margin for lots of farmers have been eroded. They expect this to continue and lads will work there ass off to produce stores or beef.

From what you have posted veal producers are under pressure as well. High input systems will be the first that downsize

wrangler · 12-11-2019 11:55am

Bass Reeves wrote: »

And there is people in this country trying to promote a veal enterprise.expecting that is the answer or rose veal. It the same as U16 month bill beef, high cost,high output with a very low margin. Lots of people between other farmers and the powers that be have not realized how the margin for lots of farmers have been eroded. They expect this to continue and lads will work there ass off to produce stores or beef.

From what you have posted veal producers are under pressure as well. High input systems will be the first that downsize

Majority of farmers are looking for something to eat grass, ie to stock the farm.
If they want an intensive enterprise calves would be a poor choice to convert concentrate to beef

Bass Reeves · 12-11-2019 12:19pm

wrangler wrote: »

Majority of farmers are looking for something to eat grass, ie to stock the farm.
If they want an intensive enterprise calves would be a poor choice to convert concentrate to beef

Grass is the easiest and cheapest feed to produce. But the educated experts want us to produce expensive grass from continual reseeding. Recently saw a dairy farmer reseed about 30 acres that were reseeded less than 5 years ago. I cannot fathom the reason.now virtually all my farm is reseeded but I expect that I will get 15-20 years out of swards.

The economics tell us that we have no margin from any beef produced off anything other than grass. Yet the educated elite are all on about pushing cattle for maximum output. There gra for high cost systems is only begining to be focused on.

But in 3-10 days on this thread some lads will ask again about setting up a veal/rose veal industry in Ireland and in some agri forum some dairy farmer will see s veal industry as the answer to the calf issue

Siamsa Sessions · 12-11-2019 12:30pm

Bass Reeves wrote: »

But in 3-10 days on this thread some lads will ask again about setting up a veal/rose veal industry in Ireland and in some agri forum some dairy farmer will see s veal industry as the answer to the calf issue

Tim Cullinan said at a hustings event last night that Ireland needs to export 500,000 calves next Spring.

Is that "solution" as likely as an Irish veal industry?

Another gem from the three men who want to lead Irish farmers: "All three candidates agreed that the derogation needed to be protected at all costs."

https://www.farmersjournal.ie/meath-ifa-hustings-president-s-position-on-bord-bia-questioned-507841

Bass Reeves · 12-11-2019 12:48pm

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

Tim Cullinan said at a hustings event last night that Ireland needs to export 500,000 calves next Spring.

Is that "solution" as likely as an Irish veal industry?

Another gem from the three men who want to lead Irish farmers: "All three candidates agreed that the derogation needed to be protected at all costs."

https://www.farmersjournal.ie/meath-ifa-hustings-president-s-position-on-bord-bia-questioned-507841

He expects that we can more than double calf exports off what is our highest base every. .....I something wonder where we (sorry the IFA) find these Muppets.

These guys should have there lips sewed together because everything they are spouting is one big delusion after another.

Gawddawggonnit · 12-11-2019 1:33pm

1000 calves produced every year by one person, working a 35hr week, should be able to pay for the investment (buildings etc), and walk with €19k. Is it that bad?

The French equivalent of ICOS are paying for the milk powder, to help veal producers...will they continue to pay when its Irish calves that are being reared??

Teagasc and the IFA etc are pushing high input systems because they’ve no other solutions. Facts are, that farm size in Ireland is small, and often on poor quality land. The derogation is imperative to keep the family dairy farm on its feet.
When the derogation goes, and it will, it’ll push dairy farmers over the edge...ask the Dutch. The Dutch fcuked with the regs, their own environment and their Gov and the EU...they can march all they want, it won’t change a thing!!

I was giving an outline to French farmers a while back about Irish ‘low cost’ dairy production. Nobody agreed that using 1-1.5t/ha of N is low cost. Add in the price of land and conacre...?
Teagasc/IFA (etc) would better serve farmers by getting them ready for when the derogation goes and strict regulations are imposed on N usage...then again they didn’t see the calf crisis coming (?).

Then again 3thesquare got over 100 quid for calves, so all is good...:)

Injuryprone · 12-11-2019 2:14pm

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

1-1.5t/ha of N

???? Where you getting that from?

wrangler · 12-11-2019 5:44pm

Bass Reeves wrote: »

He expects that we can more than double calf exports off what is our highest base every. .....I something wonder where we (sorry the IFA) find these Muppets.

These guys should have there lips sewed together because everything they are spouting is one big delusion after another.

Farmers like you elect them ........
You're just deliberately trolling now....... in one sweep you have belittled 70000 members
What has happened to your posting since the stupid protests, pathetic

Base price · 12-11-2019 7:12pm

wrangler wrote: »

Farmers like you elect them ........
You're just deliberately trolling now....... in one sweep you have belittled 70000 members
What has happened to your posting since the stupid protests, pathetic

Wrangler, in fairness anyone going forward for election to the highest post in our main farming organisation should know better than making a comment like that. We already know that there is probably going to be restricted numbers of calves on export livestock lorries this Spring notwithstanding that the ferry companies (at the moment) are sailing on the same days and there is only so much lairaige in Cherbourg, it beggers belief that a presidential candidate made such a statement without backing it up with a solid solution.

alps · 12-11-2019 7:35pm

Base price wrote: »

Wrangler, in fairness anyone going forward for election to the highest post in our main farming organisation should know better than making a comment like that. We already know that there is probably going to be restricted numbers of calves on export livestock lorries this Spring notwithstanding that the ferry companies (at the moment) are sailing on the same days and there is only so much lairaige in Cherbourg, it beggers belief that a presidential candidate made such a statement without backing it up with a solid solution.

It may just be a sad reflection of the very few we now have who will put up their hand to represent...

Then......when you listen to the vitriol and hatred spouted about anyone who does, it's no surprise that we are left with what we have.

All I can say is well done to anyone who steps up to the plate....they are twice (no..multiples) of the people who always see right to piss in on those inside...

Whatever you think of them....they are all we got..

wrangler · 12-11-2019 7:48pm

Base price wrote: »

Wrangler, in fairness anyone going forward for election to the highest post in our main farming organisation should know better than making a comment like that. We already know that there is probably going to be restricted numbers of calves on export livestock lorries this Spring notwithstanding that the ferry companies (at the moment) are sailing on the same days and there is only so much lairaige in Cherbourg, it beggers belief that a presidential candidate made such a statement without backing it up with a solid solution.

What you're spewing there isn't justified, very few farmers would refer to anyone in those terms, those are personal attacks against people that aren't here to defend themselves. beef plan is full of it, you can vent there if you like.
The position is a poisoned chalice now because of people like you, if you have criticism there's plenty of meetings around the country so man up and do it face to face.

I won't be voting for Tim because like you he supported the protests

_Brian · 12-11-2019 8:10pm

wrangler wrote: »

What you're spewing there isn't justified, very few farmers would refer to anyone in those terms, those are personal attacks against people that aren't here to defend themselves. beef plan is full of it, you can vent there if you like.
The position is a poisoned chalice now because of people like you, if you have criticism there's plenty of meetings around the country so man up and do it face to face.

I won't be voting for Tim because like you he supported the protests

Is there a worse slight for any woman other than being told to “man up” 😂😂

yosemitesam1 · 12-11-2019 8:31pm

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

1000 calves produced every year by one person, working a 35hr week, should be able to pay for the investment (buildings etc), and walk with €19k. Is it that bad?

The French equivalent of ICOS are paying for the milk powder, to help veal producers...will they continue to pay when its Irish calves that are being reared??

Teagasc and the IFA etc are pushing high input systems because they’ve no other solutions. Facts are, that farm size in Ireland is small, and often on poor quality land. The derogation is imperative to keep the family dairy farm on its feet.
When the derogation goes, and it will, it’ll push dairy farmers over the edge...ask the Dutch. The Dutch fcuked with the regs, their own environment and their Gov and the EU...they can march all they want, it won’t change a thing!!

I was giving an outline to French farmers a while back about Irish ‘low cost’ dairy production. Nobody agreed that using 1-1.5t/ha of N is low cost. Add in the price of land and conacre...?
Teagasc/IFA (etc) would better serve farmers by getting them ready for when the derogation goes and strict regulations are imposed on N usage...then again they didn’t see the calf crisis coming (?).

Then again 3thesquare got over 100 quid for calves, so all is good...:)

That sounds like it's better than dairy here. How many farms are actually able to give interest as well as a wage? Would there be two or three batches in the year?

Spring 2020..... 1.5m Dairy calves.... discuss.

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