Storm Hannah : Fri 26 - Sat 27 April 2019

Graces7 · 27-04-2019 11:56am

It is starting to quieten at last... sheer bliss.... just a few short lulls.. we can breathe again..

pauldry · 27-04-2019 11:57am

Certainly think red warnings are warranted if there is uncertainty about how intense the storm may get. Go in for a few hours it wont kill you but ignnoring the warnings will.

Wind gusts of 7 to 8kph off red level are touch n go and indeed extremely dangerous.

Any storm at its peak like this should be treated with respect.

Numerous storms in the 90s I remember were under predicted and caused huge damage. Now we have much better forecasting systems it is best heed them and most people have been in fairness.

Street was fairly empty last night

CB19Kevo · 27-04-2019 12:07pm

Red warning was issued based on the information that was available at the time.
Do some people honestly expect ME to wait until trees are coming down / roof tiles blowing off to then issue a warning.
Lesson's have been learned over the years and the warnings issued yesterday reduced damage and indeed may have saved lives.
Yes it was not as severe as it could have been-Luckily!
But that in no way should be a reason to criticize ME or indeed posters on here.

Wasting my time trying to explain logic...

Still rather windy in South east Kerry at the moment.

sryanbruen · 27-04-2019 12:13pm

CB19Kevo wrote: »

Do some people honestly expect ME to wait until trees are coming down / roof tiles blowing off to then issue a warning.

If they do that then people will moan that they didn’t get warned, just look at Storm Ali which was “only” an orange warning and some said it should have been a red. I can almost guarantee that if it was a red, people would then say it was overhyped and that they had no stormy weather in their backyard.

harr · 27-04-2019 12:33pm

Horrible morning here on the Laois/kildare border ...fairly strong gusts with driving rainfall.
Wasn’t expecting it to be this bad today.. anything kids had planned for today are cancelled or postponed.

Steopo · 27-04-2019 12:43pm

Maybe it's just me but I find it mildly entertaining to read the squabbling over warning systems and always wonder how people can't apply a logic and perspective to the warning systems. Would think the majority of the population understand the general differences between the warnings and take the appropriate precautions which is a far cry from no warning systems and inaccurate forecasts from years ago.

Just to be pedantic the Red warning for wind is not just max gusts >130km/h and also applies to mean winds in excess of 80km/h. Last night Met.ie recorded mean winds of 93km/h in Mace, 91km/h Sherkin Island, 78 km/h Valentia which pretty accurately reflects what they were saying in their Meteorologists Commentary yesterday and I'm sure there were higher numbers in coastal Kerry/Clare where there aren't any Met Eireann stations.

https://www.met.ie/meteorologists-commentary

Thewife · 27-04-2019 12:46pm

I can’t believe what I am reading here !! Are people seriously giving out about warnings issued in certain places because THEY feel it wasn’t warranted? Seriously people ME issued red warnings on the data they had infront Of them . Clare and Kerry are Huge counties , a town in one of these places could have gusts in the red zone but someone else 5 miles away might have only had orange or even yellow level gusts , what is it people expect from ME? It seems people want ME to stay “ there are going to be gusts of a scale red in Killarney but only gusts of a orange in Kenmare” ? Warnings are issued for people to be aware , take action and protect their lives and others around them . Be thankful you are getting warnings , and if it turns out it’s not as bad as expected then praise the lord and enjoy the new day !! I for one am thankful for ME and the experienced posters here for all the warnings we get . After people lost lives in my county of west Waterford when Ophelia was here last year , warnings issued and yet people still were out and about driving around with trees and debris flying around all over the place , I am certainly thankful for all warnings and I like many others take them seriously . And guess what ? If the weather turned out not to warrant the warning , am I annoyed about it ? No I bloody well am not ! I’m thankful I listened and I’m thankful we got through the storm unharmed and without any damage .. we had a orange warning in Waterford and it certainly was warranted at times. Can we stop this moaning about warnings not being warranted , if you want to listen to the warnings then do and if you don’t want to listen to the warnings then don’t , go about your business but if you get into difficulty let it be on your head , don’t put the lives of our wonderful emergency services at risk coming to rescue you when you couldn’t be bothered listening to the warning !!!!

green123 · 27-04-2019 12:49pm

HeidiHeidi wrote: »

You know that now. Hindsight is 20/20. Models in advance were showing the possibility/probability of red-level winds, hence red-level warnings.

Do we have to do this tiresome argument Every. Single. Time?

if they got it right we wouldn't be having this discussion.

The problem is that they keep getting it wrong.

And not just once.

Every. Single. Time

HeidiHeidi · 27-04-2019 12:51pm

green123 wrote: »

if they got it right we wouldn't be having this discussion.

The problem is that they keep getting it wrong.

And not just once.

Every. Single. Time

Again, this is said with the benefit of hindsight. You're soooo clever after the fact.

Another one for the Ignore button.

Thewife · 27-04-2019 12:52pm

Well I’m thankful they are “ getting it wrong “ today in hindsight some will say it was slightly over exaggerated , but I’d rather it be over exaggerated rather then under exaggerated ! We must remember they can only supply us with a forecast based on the models and tools they have available to them . Is work needed to update tools available to weather forecasters ? Most defiantly yes ! Technology is evolving constantly , but this is what we have right now and that’s what they have to work with so they are doing the best they can with the tools they have !

green123 wrote: »

if they got it right we wouldn't be having this discussion.

The problem is that they keep getting it wrong.

And not just once.

Every. Single. Time

27-04-2019 1:01pm

green123 wrote: »

if they got it right we wouldn't be having this discussion.

The problem is that they keep getting it wrong.

And not just once.

Every. Single. Time

How would you come to this opinion unless you continue reading their updates, you're free do do what you want during any weather conditions , ME don't lock down the country, everyone is free to come and go regardless of the weather conditions, it's advice not dictatorship, it's similar to advice re. the wearing of seat belts, speeding etc, some people comply others don't, we all make our own decisions, it's called free will.

Just Saying · 27-04-2019 1:03pm

green123 wrote: »

if they got it right we wouldn't be having this discussion.

The problem is that they keep getting it wrong.

And not just once.

Every. Single. Time

With all due respect green123 they are forecasting...you are "hindcasting"...if there isn't such a word there should be!!!!

nthclare · 27-04-2019 1:08pm

A warning is better than lack of consideration.

Nobody has control over the weather but our personal responsibility is up to ourselves.

There was trees blocking roads all over North Clare and south Galway, plenty of detours and obstruction.

Always remember nature never forgives, but some of us never forget...

Trees will be still falling due to bad sails and disturbance of roots etc....

Be careful

pad199207 · 27-04-2019 1:14pm

Very heavy fall of Hail here in Kildare now. Very gusty still.

Graces7 · 27-04-2019 1:33pm

green123 wrote: »

if they got it right we wouldn't be having this discussion.

The problem is that they keep getting it wrong.

And not just once.

Every. Single. Time

They got nothing wrong; read the posts and learn please. Everything was correctly done for safety.

There is no "discussion"; just a few ..... who have little real idea re forecasting.

green123 · 27-04-2019 1:36pm

I think that the problem is this yellow, orange, red warning system that met Eireann have dreamt up.
It is too simplistic.

We were at the highest warning level yesterday.

The highest warning level should be reserved for total catastrophe, complete destruction.

Maybe we need levels 1 to 5 ?

Yesterday's event should not rate as the worst possible weather event.

The next time they forecast red most people will just say ah sure the last red wasn't all that bad so they will be more likely to ignore red events going forward.

Like the girl who cried wolf, nobody will believe them in future

Anteayer · 27-04-2019 1:36pm

We live on an unsheltered island in the North Atlantic. It's completely reasonable to have these kinds of warnings and to expect the occasional somewhat disruptive wind event.

The red warning was confined to a narrow time frame and a small number of areas and was justified.

The orange warning was also justified and people take simple measures ahead of these events : removing items that are likely to blow around : garden furniture etc. Even just closing and securing shed doors, making sure that windows are shut makes a big difference, moving bins out of harms way and so on is very useful, parking your car away from sources of debris like old trees and so on.

The costs of being unprepared are huge and more disruptive.

road_high · 27-04-2019 1:44pm

pad199207 wrote: »

Very heavy fall of Hail here in Kildare now. Very gusty still.

Same here in Kilkenny- very blustery and showery- storm Hannah is no rush away

JCX BXC · 27-04-2019 1:46pm

Do some people fail to realise that Co.Clare and Kerry, and these counties only, were on a red warning last night.

Do some people fail to realise that basing the max windspeed on an entire county, on a weather station at the far east of said county, is not entirely reflective?

Do some people fail to realise that over 33,000 were without power last night?

Do some people fail to realise that the weather at their location, is not the weather at some other locations miles away?

Strongest storm here in West Clare since Darwin. Moneypoint (just down the road from me) unofficial station recorded 148km/h. Thats, in my view, very well reflective of the extremely nasty gusts we experienced last night. That's also very well within the red warning criteria.

Met Eireann did not get it wrong, and seeing some of the flying debris last night makes me glad that people heeded the warnings and did not head out, or there could be things alot worse than roof damage or power loss to worry about.

Hooter23 · 27-04-2019 1:50pm

How dare anyone question met eireann or climate change on this forum..how dare anyone have their own opinion

Gaoth Laidir · 27-04-2019 1:52pm

JCX BXC wrote: »

Do some people fail to realise that Co.Clare, and Co.Clare only, was on a red warning last night.

Do some people fail to realise that basing the max windspeed on an entire county, on a weather station at the far east of said county, is not entirely reflective?

Do some people fail to realise that over 33,000 were without power last night?

Do some people fail to realise that the weather at their location, is not the weather at some other locations miles away?

Strongest storm here in West Clare since Darwin. Moneypoint (just down the road from me) unofficial station recorded 148km/h. Thats, in my view, very well reflective of the extremely nasty gusts we experienced last night. That's also very well within the red warning criteria.

Met Eireann did not get it wrong, and seeing some of the flying debris last night makes me glad that people heeded the warnings and did not head out, or there could be things alot worse than roof damage or power loss to worry about.

Kerry was on red for two hours too.

What height is the anemometer at Moneypoint? Just curious as it seems way out of whack of other readings (e.g. Cliffs of Moher and the two buoys).

Jimbob1977 · 27-04-2019 2:23pm

Still very blustery in Limerick.

Clonmel1000 · 27-04-2019 2:42pm

I think some of the problem is the amount of weather warnings. I thought last nights were appropriate but it’s these yellow warnings blown up on social media and click bait that take the piss.

uck51js9zml2yt · 27-04-2019 2:48pm

JCX BXC wrote: »

Do some people fail to realise that Co.Clare, and Co.Clare only, was on a red warning last night.

Do some people fail to realise that basing the max windspeed on an entire county, on a weather station at the far east of said county, is not entirely reflective?

Do some people fail to realise that over 33,000 were without power last night?

Do some people fail to realise that the weather at their location, is not the weather at some other locations miles away?

Strongest storm here in West Clare since Darwin. Moneypoint (just down the road from me) unofficial station recorded 148km/h. Thats, in my view, very well reflective of the extremely nasty gusts we experienced last night. That's also very well within the red warning criteria.

Met Eireann did not get it wrong, and seeing some of the flying debris last night makes me glad that people heeded the warnings and did not head out, or there could be things alot worse than roof damage or power loss to worry about.

Err... Kerry was also on red !!! It was entirely justified as someone who can see moneypoint from the drive way.

JCX BXC · 27-04-2019 2:49pm

Emory Flat Belt wrote: »

Err... Kerry was also on red !!!

I knew that! Oops.

EnzoScifo · 27-04-2019 2:50pm

Just Saying wrote: »

With all due respect green123 they are forecasting...you are "hindcasting"...if there isn't such a word there should be!!!!

Hindcasting sounds like a nice synonym for talking out of one's arse.

How apt :pac:

PukkaStukka · 27-04-2019 2:55pm

Still very windy here now in North. County Dublin. We had a power outage just after teatime yesterday that lasted two hours but I have a feeling it wasn't weather related.

Quite windy thereafter but at around 5-5:30am this morning, the most unbelievable squall pushed through. It's a long time since I heard wind and rain like that.

Kermit.de.frog · 27-04-2019 2:55pm

The red warnings were clearly appropriate for the 2 counties.

I don't see what the problem is.

Artane2002 · 27-04-2019 2:57pm

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

The red warnings were clearly appropriate for the 2 counties.

I don't see what the problem is.

People don't understand what the warnings mean... orange is be prepared. Which means you should be ready for things like power outages. Red is take action, that's self explanatory. Yellow is simply be aware.

BarryD2 · 27-04-2019 3:10pm

Clonmel1000 wrote: »

I think some of the problem is the amount of weather warnings. I thought last nights were appropriate but it’s these yellow warnings blown up on social media and click bait that take the piss.

The Status Yellow warnings are daft and counter productive as the public have trouble differentiating them with more serious events. If you're going to be in any sort of situation where a Yellow warning is relevant to safety i.e. say going out for a spot of inshore fishing in a small boat, well you should be capable of looking up an ordinary forecast and assessing the risk. For most day to day living, they have no impact other than to remind people to bring a raincoat or whatever. Met Eireann should drop these Yellow warnings and just give the forecast.

Graces7 · 27-04-2019 3:12pm

green123 wrote: »

I think that the problem is this yellow, orange, red warning system that met Eireann have dreamt up.
It is too simplistic.

The highest warning level should be reserved for total catastrophe, complete destruction.

Maybe we need levels 1 to 5 ?

Yesterday's event should not rate as the worst possible weather event.

The next time they forecast red most people will just say ah sure the last red wasn't all that bad so they will be more likely to ignore red events going forward.

Like the girl who cried wolf, nobody will believe them in future

A small part of the country only. and you need to read what the warnings mean.

They did not cry wolf. They alerted to dangerous weather. Which does not get defined as the worst possible weather event.

Graces7 · 27-04-2019 3:13pm

BarryD2 wrote: »

The Status Yellow warnings are daft and counter productive as the public have trouble differentiating them with more serious events. If you're going to be in any sort of situation where a Yellow warning is relevant to safety i.e. say going out for a spot of inshore fishing in a small boat, well you should be capable of looking up an ordinary forecast and assessing the risk. For most day to day living, they have no impact other than to remind people to bring a raincoat or whatever. Met Eireann should drop these Yellow warnings and just give the forecast.

Operative word is "should"... ane even yellow is more serious than you say

Graces7 · 27-04-2019 3:18pm

green123 wrote: »

I think that the problem is this yellow, orange, red warning system that met Eireann have dreamt up.
It is too simplistic.

We were at the highest warning level yesterday.

The highest warning level should be reserved for total catastrophe, complete destruction.

Maybe we need levels 1 to 5 ?

Yesterday's event should not rate as the worst possible weather event.

The next time they forecast red most people will just say ah sure the last red wasn't all that bad so they will be more likely to ignore red events going forward.

Like the girl who cried wolf, nobody will believe them in future

Oh yes we will as most here respect the professional and expert forecasters. and respect the unpredictable elements as not totally following the forecasts.

BarryD2 · 27-04-2019 3:19pm

Deleted User wrote: »

How would you come to this opinion unless you continue reading their updates, you're free do do what you want during any weather conditions , ME don't lock down the country, everyone is free to come and go regardless of the weather conditions, it's advice not dictatorship, it's similar to advice re. the wearing of seat belts, speeding etc, some people comply others don't, we all make our own decisions, it's called free will.

That's not quite how it works. We live in a country that is increasingly over regulated and it's the inclination of those who have positions of power & influence to try and impose their views. There is social & moral pressure brought to bear on those who prefer to use their own judgements - you'll see and hear them denounced on social & other media and so on.

Whereas we should certainly provide advice but after that let citizens take responsibility for their own actions. E.G. If people are advised not to take a certain road due to snowfall say, well let them decide themselves, but if they get stuck - they should have to extricate themselves by walking out.

BarryD2 · 27-04-2019 3:21pm

Graces7 wrote: »

Operative word is "should"... ane even yellow is more serious than you say

Yes the operative word is 'should'! It's not up to the State to hold everyone's hands in case they hurt themselves.

27-04-2019 3:36pm

BarryD2 wrote: »

Yes the operative word is 'should'! It's not up to the State to hold everyone's hands in case they hurt themselves.

But, can you imagine the uproar if someone got hurt due to weather conditions? Joe Duffy would have a field day!

Darwin · 27-04-2019 3:39pm

@syranbruen, would be very interested to see your table of storms updated with this one (whenever you might get a chance of course).

tiegan · 27-04-2019 4:06pm

Graces7 wrote: »

using hindsight which has no place in forecasting,

Best quote of the day goes to Graces7 - this applies to most of the comments in the aftermath of "Hannah"

Storm 10 · 27-04-2019 4:37pm

Just to show how local a wind gust can be yesterday evening looking out the window at a neighbouring tree about 100 feet away it was bent right over during a squall yet my weather station was showing just 20mph, that was in a small area so you can have Red Warning gusts in one part and just a gentle breeze in another.

Gaoth Laidir · 27-04-2019 4:42pm

BarryD2 wrote: »

The Status Yellow warnings are daft and counter productive as the public have trouble differentiating them with more serious events. If you're going to be in any sort of situation where a Yellow warning is relevant to safety i.e. say going out for a spot of inshore fishing in a small boat, well you should be capable of looking up an ordinary forecast and assessing the risk. For most day to day living, they have no impact other than to remind people to bring a raincoat or whatever. Met Eireann should drop these Yellow warnings and just give the forecast.

Correct. I've said it before, a Yellow is not a warning of anything and should therefore be scrapped. Orange and Red are all that's required.

Anyway, here are the satellite-derived mean 10-metre windspeeds for 18:33Z and 20:58Z yesterday, respectively. 50-55 knots out west earlier on, down slightly to around 50 knots in the later scan. The buoy data tally with the latter. An abrupt ending to a fairly quiet period of weather and one th at could have been worse than it turned out.

SleetAndSnow · 27-04-2019 4:44pm

https://twitter.com/sarahleekiely/status/1122083192788406272

Snow Garden · 27-04-2019 5:53pm

BarryD2 wrote: »

That's not quite how it works. We live in a country that is increasingly over regulated and it's the inclination of those who have positions of power & influence to try and impose their views. There is social & moral pressure brought to bear on those who prefer to use their own judgements - you'll see and hear them denounced on social & other media and so on.

Whereas we should certainly provide advice but after that let citizens take responsibility for their own actions. E.G. If people are advised not to take a certain road due to snowfall say, well let them decide themselves, but if they get stuck - they should have to extricate themselves by walking out.

Yes I agree with these sentiments.

Xenji · 27-04-2019 6:09pm

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

Correct. I've said it before, a Yellow is not a warning of anything and should therefore be scrapped. Orange and Red are all that's required.

I know I have said it before but with Storm Eleanor Mayo had a yellow wind warning and we ended up with an hour worth of severe gusts that ended up with official stations in Knock recording a gust of 155 km/hr and Newport 139 km/hr, this led to large scale power cuts, flooding and felling of a lot of trees.

The gusts hit at the worst time with people heading home from work, but I am sure that at least some people took heed of the warning and headed home a bit earlier. Yes in the West yellow warnings are as good a pointless as we are so used to these events, but as Eleanor proved at least providing a yellow warning made people aware they might incur inclement conditions and take a bit of extra care.

Yellow to me should not be a warning, but just something to make the general public aware of possible difficult conditions they might face but will not be in any danger.

RobertKK · 27-04-2019 6:16pm

I think Met Eireann got it mostly correct.

sryanbruen · 27-04-2019 6:49pm

Darwin wrote: »

@syranbruen, would be very interested to see your table of storms updated with this one (whenever you might get a chance of course).

The problem with this one was that there was some false readings recorded at stations including Shannon Airport and Cork Airport at midnight so I can only go off of the current data I have until next month when they update the historical database with April 2019 data. Fortunately, Met Éireann shared Shannon Airport's actual max gust for the event but I do not have the figure for Cork Airport besides the false reading and there might have been other stations that had false readings but unable to find out until next month. Of course next month I'll be posting the maximum 10-minute mean wind speeds for Hannah in comparison with other storms too as usual.

Here's the table anyway regardless of that false reading at Cork Airport (and other possible ones).

Please no more storms for this year, this table is getting too big

. Removed Carmen (11 November 2010) from this storm comparison table as whilst it was a fairly windy day especially by 2010 standards, I don't think it really compares with other low pressure systems or storms in terms of the maximum wind gusts.

I added Newport Furnace to the stations list on these tables as requested by a poster.

Darwin · 27-04-2019 7:11pm

Brilliant, thanks so much Syran

Gaoth Laidir · 27-04-2019 7:45pm

sryanbruen wrote: »

The problem with this one was that there was some false readings recorded at stations including Shannon Airport and Cork Airport at midnight so I can only go off of the current data I have until next month when they update the historical database with April 2019 data. Fortunately, Met Éireann shared Shannon Airport's actual max gust for the event but I do not have the figure for Cork Airport besides the false reading and there might have been other stations that had false readings but unable to find out until next month. Of course next month I'll be posting the maximum 10-minute mean wind speeds for Hannah in comparison with other storms too as usual.

Here's the table anyway regardless of that false reading at Cork Airport (and other possible ones).

.

What were these false readings? Where were they displayed?

sryanbruen · 27-04-2019 7:51pm

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

What were these false readings? Where were they displayed?

Cork Airport had a max gust of 63 knots around midnight but this was not reported in MÉ's tweet on the highest gusts for Hannah (nor did it match the metars) as well as Shannon Airport's 66 knots for the same timeframe.

Here's the tweet for reference.

https://twitter.com/MetEireann/status/1121999173476388865

Going by this tweet, Roches Point's 119 km/h would be another false reading.

The yesterday's weather page on met.ie reports those "false readings" however.

https://www.met.ie/latest-reports/observations/yesterday

Snow Garden · 27-04-2019 8:12pm

Thanks Sryanbruen.

So Galway (Mace Head) had the highest gust. We definitely need a weather station on the Clare coast. Loop head perhaps.

Ultimate Seduction · 27-04-2019 8:20pm

Snow Garden wrote: »

Thanks Sryanbruen.

So Galway (Mace Head) had the highest gust. We definitely need a weather station on the Clare coast. Loop head perhaps.

Need more in land, there is a station in all coastal counties in the west already.

Storm Hannah : Fri 26 - Sat 27 April 2019

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