Planning issues - post them here MOD WARNING post #1

Poor Uncle Tom · 15-09-2018 12:49pm

Ralocon wrote: »

No harm intended.

Likewise.

No internet forum can possible substitute for on-site professional advice. Converting a garage for habitable purposes will depend on so many varients that anyone here couldn't possibly direct you without knowing a lot more information, information you probably don't want on a public forum.

Then you mention "....ways around everything....." where the forum charter here has specific direction in that regard!

BryanF · 15-09-2018 10:16pm

Ralocon wrote: »

First and last on the back of this response. No harm intended.

Planning is possible for what you describe (building regs will make it an expensive renovation)

it would be easier if this was a granny flat connected to the house.- No separate parking/driveway/lower council fees/less onerous regulations

Donald Trump · 18-09-2018 9:59pm

Suppose I have a 20 acre field that has 100m of road frontage. (Or whatever is necessary).

Now if the field only has one gateway onto the road, would I have to use that entrance if I wanted to apply for planning permission (assuming I was otherwise qualified for it)? Or could I apply to have a separate entrance opened up? Or would I apply using the existing gateway for the site and try to apply to open up another gate for the field later?

The existing gateway is the only way into the field and I don't own any adjacent land that I could use to access the rest of the field if I used the gateway for a house.

sydthebeat · 18-09-2018 10:26pm

Donald Trump wrote: »

Suppose I have a 20 acre field that has 100m of road frontage. (Or whatever is necessary).

Now if the field only has one gateway onto the road, would I have to use that entrance if I wanted to apply for planning permission (assuming I was otherwise qualified for it)? Or could I apply to have a separate entrance opened up? Or would I apply using the existing gateway for the site and try to apply to open up another gate for the field later?

The existing gateway is the only way into the field and I don't own any adjacent land that I could use to access the rest of the field if I used the gateway for a house.

the existing entrance makes absolutely no difference at all

Donald Trump · 18-09-2018 10:45pm

sydthebeat wrote: »

the existing entrance makes absolutely no difference at all

Oh,

I thought that if you needed to break a new gateway there was extra complication.

sydthebeat · 19-09-2018 7:07am

Donald Trump wrote: »

Oh,

I thought that if you needed to break a new gateway there was extra complication.

There's a world of difference between an agricultural entrance and a domestic entrance.

The existing agricultural entrance makes no difference at all when applying for a domestic entrance

Big Sis · 29-10-2018 2:24pm

Hi. Mods, I understand if they have to be removed but before finding this thread, I posted on a couple of other threads in this sub-forum looking for info on finding planning consultants here on the boards, and for recommendations for a planning consultant in the Mid-West.
We want to engage expert help in preparing an observation to the council in relation to an (as yet un-submitted) planning application by our neighbour for an un-exempted structure they built without full disclosure to us, that butts up against and in part overshoots the boundary wall, that overlooks our front garden and living room, and totally overshadows our living room window and the garden seating area. As if that wasn't bad enough, the overlooking window oversails our boundary when open.
We also welcome any advice that boards.ie members can give us.
Thanks in advance.

Reputable Rog · 30-10-2018 11:08am

Big Sis wrote: »

Hi. Mods, I understand if they have to be removed but before finding this thread, I posted on a couple of other threads in this sub-forum looking for info on finding planning consultants here on the boards, and for recommendations for a planning consultant in the Mid-West.
We want to engage expert help in preparing an observation to the council in relation to an (as yet un-submitted) planning application by our neighbour for an un-exempted structure they built without full disclosure to us, that butts up against and in part overshoots the boundary wall, that overlooks our front garden and living room, and totally overshadows our living room window and the garden seating area. As if that wasn't bad enough, the overlooking window oversails our boundary when open.
We also welcome any advice that boards.ie members can give us.
Thanks in advance.

If you could be a bit more succinct in your description you might get some comments that may help you.
1) What do you mean by 'butts up and oversails'?
2) How do you know the development is not exempt and what is it any event?
3) If you think an unauthorised development has taken place you can report it to the local planning department, you cannot however comment on an application that has not been submitted.

Big Sis · 30-10-2018 12:55pm

Reputable Rog wrote: »

If you could be a bit more succinct in your description you might get some comments that may help you.
1) What do you mean by 'butts up and oversails'?
2) How do you know the development is not exempt and what is it any event?
3) If you think an unauthorised development has taken place you can report it to the local planning department, you cannot however comment on an application that has not been submitted.

Thank you, Rog. To clarify:

1)
Butts up - touches the boundary wall.
Oversails- breaches the boundary when open.

2)
I researched it and had it confirmed by the council. It is a room extension and veranda style porch to the front of the property. For our issues with the development, see my initial post.

3)
We do; we have; we want to be prepared for when the planning application is submitted.

I hope this has made it more succinct.

Sis.

Reputable Rog · 30-10-2018 1:33pm

So you mean it abuts the boundary wall and it overhangs.
Whilst it would have been polite to consult you they are under no obligation to do so.
Overlooking your front garden is largely irrelevant, the window is an issue and must be removed and obviously as it's to the front in contravenes article 4(1) H of the planning regs.
Have the council issued a warning lettter and have you received a notification of same?
I wouldn't be wasting money on a consultatant if you can clearly explain your concerns in the objection.
It might be worth your while contacting a councillor to make reps on your behalf.
Where in the mid west are you located?

Big Sis · 30-10-2018 11:25pm

Reputable Rog wrote: »

So you mean it abuts the boundary wall and it overhangs.
Whilst it would have been polite to consult you they are under no obligation to do so.
Overlooking your front garden is largely irrelevant, the window is an issue and must be removed and obviously as it's to the front in contravenes article 4(1) H of the planning regs.
Have the council issued a warning lettter and have you received a notification of same?
I wouldn't be wasting money on a consultatant if you can clearly explain your concerns in the objection.
It might be worth your while contacting a councillor to make reps on your behalf.
Where in the mid west are you located?

Hi Rog, thank you for your response.

Yes, that's what I meant.

Woould you mind explaining how the issue of overlooking can be irrelevant yet the window still be a cause for concern?

I have received verbal confirmation from the council that a planning inspector has written to our neighbours informing them that planning must be applied for.

We are not confident that we can put together a clear and comprehensive observation and we believe that it would be wise to engage professional help.

We have spoken with a local councillor.

I would rather not make our specific location public.

Regards,
Sis

Reputable Rog · 30-10-2018 11:44pm

That's not proper procedure, they have to issue a warning letter and you must be furnished with written confirmation of same and alsu any subsequent actin of Inaction in succession to said Warning Letter.
Overlooking is not a Planning matter but a ground floor window must be 1 metre from a party boundary, most development overlooks something or another.

Big Sis · 31-10-2018 10:06am

Reputable Rog wrote: »

That's not proper procedure, they have to issue a warning letter and you must be furnished with written confirmation of same and alsu any subsequent actin of Inaction in succession to said Warning Letter.
Overlooking is not a Planning matter but a ground floor window must be 1 metre from a party boundary, most development overlooks something or another.

Thank You, Rog.
Regards,
Sis

clio_16v · 15-11-2018 8:11pm

Is it true that the "local needs" for planning is abolished or going to be abolished?

sydthebeat · 15-11-2018 9:23pm

clio_16v wrote: »

Is it true that the "local needs" for planning is abolished or going to be abolished?

no

a0sytfq278ejzu · 27-11-2018 4:31pm

hi all

to those in the know, i intend to buy a site for a new build
i am not from the area but the site is in "an area of population decline" am i right in thinking the "locals only rule " does not apply in this instance?

thanks very much

JimmyMW · 27-11-2018 5:07pm

Greta Panicky Armadillo wrote: »

hi all

to those in the know, i intend to buy a site for a new build
i am not from the area but the site is in "an area of population decline" am i right in thinking the "locals only rule " does not apply in this instance?

thanks very much

Very much incorrect to the best of my knowledge, outside the settlement boundaries housing local needs will always apply

sydthebeat · 27-11-2018 5:09pm

Greta Panicky Armadillo wrote: »

hi all

to those in the know, i intend to buy a site for a new build
i am not from the area but the site is in "an area of population decline" am i right in thinking the "locals only rule " does not apply in this instance?

thanks very much

youre most likely correct but you need to check the county development plan to be certain.

I see sheep · 05-02-2019 2:19pm

Hi,

Looking for some advice please.

We had a agreed for the sale of a site but it was objected to and An Bord Pleanala overturned the local council's decision and had refused planning permission.

We are the site owners and a third party had agreed to buy the site depending on getting planning permission but that has fallen through now obviously.

Pretty gutted tbh, we were going to use the money for a deposit on a house, is it worth appealing the decision ourselves now and trying to sell it again after?

If not what do you do with a useless site??

Reason for refusal of permission is they say it is a flood risk. (We disagree).

Planning permission was granted previously in 2004 but the time period to build a house expired that time.

Thanks in advance for any replies.

sydthebeat · 05-02-2019 2:44pm

I see sheep wrote: »

Reason for refusal of permission is they say it is a flood risk. (We disagree).
.

you need to do a lot more than just disagree... you need to prove its not in a flood zone.

the council has access to some very detailed flooding maps so if they say its in a flood zone, then you can take it that it pretty much is.

I see sheep · 05-02-2019 3:06pm

sydthebeat wrote: »

you need to do a lot more than just disagree... you need to prove its not in a flood zone.

the council has access to some very detailed flooding maps so if they say its in a flood zone, then you can take it that it pretty much is.

Thanks for your reply.

I'm just surprised as it had planning permission before and got granted planning permission by the council this time initially before that was appealed.

Only one neighbour had an issue with it.

Any ideas about what we can do with the site now? Cheers

JimmyMW · 05-02-2019 3:11pm

I see sheep wrote: »

Any ideas about what we can do with the site now? Cheers

It all really depends on how much profit is available out of the site, if its a €30-50k site then its questionable if addressing the flood risk via planning is going to be very profitable, however if its a €150k site than thats a different story. Worst case scenario is to sell it as agricultural land id suppose.

I see sheep · 05-02-2019 3:21pm

JimmyMW wrote: »

It all really depends on how much profit is available out of the site, if its a €30-50k site then its questionable if addressing the flood risk via planning is going to be very profitable, however if its a €150k site than thats a different story. Worst case scenario is to sell it as agricultural land id suppose.

Thanks.
It's around 40k.

JimmyMW · 05-02-2019 3:39pm

I see sheep wrote: »

Thanks.
It's around 40k.

Agricultural land id say or try and sell it as a "Site as is" (even thou its not) not subject to planning, for less money say €25k and hopefully someone will think they are getting a bargain and proceed with the sale in the knowledge that they will have big planning issues to deal with.

froggy1985 · 08-02-2019 1:12am

Hopefully someone can give some advice on this, have went through this thread and couldn't find anything similar.

Wife has been gifted land (.75 acre plot) by a relative right next to other family members, local needs should not be an issue hopefully (based on other siblings experience etc)

Issue is that the proposed site does not currently have road frontage, we would need to run a 100m driveway along a tree-lined boundary to our site which is bordered nicely with mature trees on three sides and quite private from the rest of the land. The land owner has no objections to us doing the road in and would happily grant us right of way on any road / drive we build on his land, or gift us the strip of land containing the road, whichever is easier in planning terms.

Would running this length of driveway / road (say 100m to 120m max) be 'frowned' upon in planning terms? Site is in Meath. There is nobody nearby who could reasonably object to the house / road.

We will of course be doing pre-planning meetings / calls but useful to have any insight from others before attending. Thanks

Reati · 08-02-2019 12:14pm

froggy1985 wrote: »

Hopefully someone can give some advice on this, have went through this thread and couldn't find anything similar.

Wife has been gifted land (.75 acre plot) by a relative right next to other family members, local needs should not be an issue hopefully (based on other siblings experience etc)

Issue is that the proposed site does not currently have road frontage, we would need to run a 100m driveway along a tree-lined boundary to our site which is bordered nicely with mature trees on three sides and quite private from the rest of the land. The land owner has no objections to us doing the road in and would happily grant us right of way on any road / drive we build on his land, or gift us the strip of land containing the road, whichever is easier in planning terms.

Would running this length of driveway / road (say 100m to 120m max) be 'frowned' upon in planning terms? Site is in Meath. There is nobody nearby who could reasonably object to the house / road.

We will of course be doing pre-planning meetings / calls but useful to have any insight from others before attending. Thanks

Not likely from the planners as long as it's within the regs.

The bank will be the bigger pain. They will want a few signed contracts and documents to ensure right of want, ownership etc so the land can't end up land locked in the cause of repro.

froggy1985 · 08-02-2019 12:28pm

Reati wrote: »

Not likely from the planners as long as it's within the regs.

The bank will be the bigger pain. They will want a few signed contracts and documents to ensure right of want, ownership etc so the land can't end up land locked in the cause of repro.

Thanks, the gifter of the land in this case is very eager to assist in any way so signing contracts to ensure permanent right of way should not be a problem at all and we would be happy to pay all legal costs etc for same.

The other issue is that the only current access to the field is agricultural access obviously. We have probably around 10m width to work with. Not sure whether to approach the planners with a proposal to split this access in two (say 6 for agriculture / 4 for our driveway or run a shared private lane / road with right of way.... Very rough paint drawing attached!

Reati · 08-02-2019 2:06pm

froggy1985 wrote: »

Thanks, the gifter of the land in this case is very eager to assist in any way so signing contracts to ensure permanent right of way should not be a problem at all and we would be happy to pay all legal costs etc for same.

The other issue is that the only current access to the field is agricultural access obviously. We have probably around 10m width to work with. Not sure whether to approach the planners with a proposal to split this access in two (say 6 for agriculture / 4 for our driveway or run a shared private lane / road with right of way.... Very rough paint drawing attached!

Yeah, you'll need a new driveway on the planning with associated services, sightlines etc.

Shouldn't be a problem if it's within the limits so you don't get a "creates a traffic hazard" reply.

Will access to that field now be shared based on your driveway?

froggy1985 · 08-02-2019 2:19pm

Reati wrote: »

Yeah, you'll need a new driveway on the planning with associated services, sightlines etc.

Shouldn't be a problem if it's within the limits so you don't get a "creates a traffic hazard" reply.

Will access to that field now be shared based on your driveway?

That's the million dollar question. I would prefer that we buy the site and say a 4m strip of land to the road and own our driveway. Access to the field would then be parallel to our driveway but entirely separate. I imagine this would be the best option from a legal point of view (full ownership of site and drive) but I am not sure if the council will be happy with a residential driveway and agricultural access right next to each other? The gap to accommodate the two "driveways" or access points is 9-10m. Another poor paint job attached

Other option is to run a shared private road from our site entrance to the public road, and make a gate / access point to the field off of this.

Sorry if this is confusing!

I intend on trying to work out the option the council would be most happy with, getting some half decent drawings done up and photos etc to go to pre-planning / outline permission but I really haven't a clue what is best here. I spoke unofficially to a planner who suggested I bring a few plans to the council for pre-planning but I would prefer one strong option personally..

7znbd9xmoiupye · 18-02-2019 11:02pm

I saw a planning application online which refers to a representation by a councillor. But only the acknowlegdement is there as far as i can see. Are councillors representations public?

rayjdav · 19-02-2019 3:02pm

Gannon Crooked Rake wrote: »

I saw a planning application online which refers to a representation by a councillor. But only the acknowlegdement is there as far as i can see. Are councillors representations public?

All observations are public. Not all councils upload all documents though. If you want to see what it said go to the coco offices and get the files.

yurtyaherne · 19-02-2019 6:40pm

Gannon Crooked Rake wrote: »

I saw a planning application online which refers to a representation by a councillor. But only the acknowlegdement is there as far as i can see. Are councillors representations public?

Sometimes a representation might not have a document or email behind it, many Councillors use it as a way of being notified of a decision or just been seen to support an application.

7znbd9xmoiupye · 19-02-2019 7:13pm

rayjdav wrote: »

All observations are public. Not all councils upload all documents though. If you want to see what it said go to the coco offices and get the files.

are they not supposed tro upload all of the documents

7znbd9xmoiupye · 19-02-2019 7:14pm

yurtyaherne wrote: »

Sometimes a representation might not have a document or email behind it, many Councillors use it as a way of being notified of a decision or just been seen to support an application.

how would the councillor support the application without saying anything? He got an acknowledgement, surely they cannot acknowledege nothing

yurtyaherne · 20-02-2019 6:44am

Gannon Crooked Rake wrote: »

how would the councillor support the application without saying anything? He got an acknowledgement, surely they cannot acknowledege nothing

Because if they didn't support it why would they make representations?

They can make a submission/observation if they have a problem with it like every other member of the public

rayjdav · 20-02-2019 12:14pm

Gannon Crooked Rake wrote: »

are they not supposed tro upload all of the documents

No obligation to upload docs to view unless the application has an EIS attached. Most do upload details to view but not all.

Squatter · 26-02-2019 3:34pm

Mellor wrote: »

Are you serious, a shame???? The above is a perfect example of whats wrong with this country. I'd have my reservation about how "nice it is", its huge.

He applies for a c.300m house, was refused,
so goes and builds a house approaching 600 sq.m. He deserves everything he gets. 300sq.m is a big house, very comfortable for any sized family. He has 3 children. There was no need to double it.

If he felt he should of been awarded the original planning, he could of appealed. But too go ahead and double its size and build it anyway is idiotic. Tear it down. Its people like this that make it harder for people with legitimate reasons and well designed houses.

"Out of sheer total frustration and desperation, without lodging an appeal against the last refusal, we decided to go ahead and build a house on the land. What was built was larger in proportion to the property for which we had applied and were refused planning permission. We felt at the time this would not have made any difference in any event."

Looks as though the house is still standing, well over a decade after he was told to tear it down - and almost 2 years after the Supreme Court instructed them to demolish it. And the shameless clowns are still pleading to retain it.

http://www.meathchronicle.ie/news/roundup/articles/2018/06/05/4156935-letter-couple-appeal-to-meath-councillors-to-help-stop-demolition-order/

The thicker the neck, the greater the possibility that a chancer can get away with something in Ireland of the Gobsh1te. :mad:

sydthebeat · 26-02-2019 3:45pm

€326,000 demolition costs LOLLLLLLLL !!!!!!!!!

lillycakes2 · 04-04-2019 10:12pm

Is anyone else building near a railway line? we are building with a railway line running behind the site. iarnroid eireann have requested we erect 2.4m fencing the full length of our site. our site is quite big. we have got a quote for how much it would cost to erect the fence. (paladin)- were talking about 10-15000.

has anyone been in a similar situation?
we really don't want an ugly fence at the back of our house. Its not a busy railline at all and is often threatened to close down .

Is there anyway around this

Gumbo · 05-04-2019 11:16am

lillycakes2 wrote: »

Is anyone else building near a railway line? we are building with a railway line running behind the site. iarnroid eireann have requested we erect 2.4m fencing the full length of our site. our site is quite big. we have got a quote for how much it would cost to erect the fence. (paladin)- were talking about 10-15000.

has anyone been in a similar situation?
we really don't want an ugly fence at the back of our house. Its not a busy railline at all and is often threatened to close down .

Is there anyway around this

You can appeal the specific condition to An Board Pleanala. Other than that, no other way to alter or remove a condition that's been issued.

sydthebeat · 05-04-2019 11:17am

lillycakes2 wrote: »

Is anyone else building near a railway line? we are building with a railway line running behind the site. iarnroid eireann have requested we erect 2.4m fencing the full length of our site. our site is quite big. we have got a quote for how much it would cost to erect the fence. (paladin)- were talking about 10-15000.

has anyone been in a similar situation?
we really don't want an ugly fence at the back of our house. Its not a busy railline at all and is often threatened to close down .

Is there anyway around this

show a smaller site?

that requirement is standard where ever boundaries with rail lines are involved.

BryanF · 05-04-2019 1:22pm

sydthebeat wrote: »

show a smaller site?

that requirement is standard where ever boundaries with rail lines are involved.

+1

I’ve done similar in the past

lillycakes2 · 05-04-2019 6:40pm

sydthebeat wrote: »

show a smaller site?

that requirement is standard where ever boundaries with rail lines are involved.

What you mean "show a smaller site"?

The site we bought had to be big,its a long story, but we had to buy it in order to get planning at all. Its right beside my parents house. its such an ugly fence taller than ourselves and there are already trees and shrubs along the boundary. I don't want them to be cut down in order to erect this fence. seems like total nonsense.
like I am walking a few cm to the other field from my home house where there was never a need for a fence, we have nice trees.it seems really annoying to have to erect a tall ugly fence when animals have been grazing in our site for donkeys years with no fence regulations. surely there is less chance of me and my partner running out onto the railway than a cow lets say .

weshtawake · 17-04-2019 2:53pm

I am considering buying a site on the outskirts of Galway (within the city bounds).
There is a large old style galvanised hay shed on the site. My question is will it be easier to get PP by informing the authority that I would be knocking the shed and replacing with a dwelling. Note that this is my first house - I am currently renting.

jay28 · 18-04-2019 10:35pm

So our planning permission has went in once more today having been refused a few months ago.
My wife qualifies for the local needs

The main reason we were rejected was we own our own house and they said our housing needs are me

Has anyone managed to get planning permission who already own a house?

Reputable Rog · 19-04-2019 8:43am

jay28 wrote: »

So if we sell our house and rent, we then have a housing need?
The current house doesn't fulfill "our" housing requirements. Therefore our housing needs are not met.

What do you mean it doesn't fulfill your requirements? Not big enough, can't be seen from everywhere?

jay28 · 19-04-2019 8:46am

Reputable Rog wrote: »

What do you mean it doesn't fulfill your requirements? Not big enough, can't be seen from everywhere?

It's not big enough, we now have 3 children in a 2 bed house. Can't be seen from everywhere? Not sure what you mean by that.

Reputable Rog · 19-04-2019 9:09am

jay28 wrote: »

It's not big enough, we now have 3 children in a 2 bed house. Can't be seen from everywhere? Not sure what you mean by that.

Part of the vanity that goes with one off houses, make sure the house is visible everywhere.
Anyway families with sometimes 10 children were raised in 2 bedroom terraces in the towns and cities and somehow they managed.

jay28 · 19-04-2019 9:11am

Reputable Rog wrote: »

Part of the vanity that goes with one off houses, make sure the house is visible everywhere.
Anyway families with sometimes 10 children were raised in 2 bedroom terraces in the towns and cities and somehow they managed.

Seriously :rolleyes:

Reputable Rog · 19-04-2019 9:28am

jay28 wrote: »

Seriously :rolleyes:

Sell your house and buy a bigger one or extend your house.
Both will be cheaper than a one off.

Planning issues - post them here MOD WARNING post #1

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