Things people go out of their way not to pay for

Errashareesh · 26-08-2020 10:56am

Wanderer78 wrote: »

maybe countries such as germany have better functioning critical public services than our own, which encourages those citizens to behave more so towards the collective

Or maybe their services are better BECAUSE people recognise they're part of a society.

It's not great to be responding to the issue of fly tipping with "well the services need improvement/shouldn't be privatised". The fly tipper is the one at fault, nobody else.

Tabnabs · 26-08-2020 11:06am

crossman47 wrote: »

Its not free but our demand for cheap food is a really bad policy. Meat is being sold at less than the cost of production as supermarkets fight for market share. The result is bad production practices. I have argued with people who thought a piece of salmon was expensive until I pointed out fishermen have to go out, often in bad weather, to catch them.

Salmon is farmed in large sea water enclosures, mainly in Scotland and Norway. We would do much more here in Ireland but Government policy is backward and stymies any growth.

So yeah, cheap salmon is a reasonable ask (compared to other types of fish)

Wanderer78 · 26-08-2020 11:14am

Errashareesh wrote: »

Or maybe their services are better BECAUSE people recognise they're part of a society.

It's not great to be responding to the issue of fly tipping with "well the services need improvement/shouldn't be privatised". The fly tipper is the one at fault, nobody else.

privatization is seen as the most efficient way of running critical societal services, sometimes its just not, as its inefficiencies out-ways the inefficiencies of alternative publicly run services, sometimes, and you will find, some of the most common default positions of such failures is 'personal responsibility', particularly from those that believe in these privatization approaches, when the reality is in fact far more complex

26-08-2020 11:15am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

You don't come off nearly as well as you think you do in that story.

He comes across fine. People pulling that **** are the ones not coming off well.

Bobblehats · 26-08-2020 11:20am

c.p.w.g.w wrote: »

Just look how diluted the whole thing has become...
Virgin Sports
Eir Sports
BT Sport's
Premier Sports
Sky Sports

Ridiculous

Nobody's going out of their way not to pay for those, its just convenient. Internet is as much a subscription as I'm paying

26-08-2020 11:24am

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

He comes across fine. People pulling that **** are the ones not coming off well.

Getting into an argument over a window seat when you're a grown adult isn't a good look. I'm not saying be a walkover, but Jesus, it's just a flight. Why get worked up and cause a scene because you paid a few quid for a window seat. When I get worked up about this sort of thing, and it does happen with traffic where I live, it's usually because I'm already pissed off at something else.

Errashareesh · 26-08-2020 11:27am

Wanderer78 wrote: »

privatization is seen as the most efficient way of running critical societal services, sometimes its just not, as its inefficiencies out-ways the inefficiencies of alternative publicly run services, sometimes, and you will find, some of the most common default positions of such failures is 'personal responsibility', particularly from those that believe in these privatization approaches, when the reality is in fact far more complex

I recognise when there is complexity. But if you dump your mattress any old place you're a selfish individual and there's nothing more to it.

Wanderer78 · 26-08-2020 11:29am

Errashareesh wrote: »

I recognise when there is complexity. But if you dump your mattress any old place you're a selfish individual and there's nothing more to it.

...and id also add, extremely ignorant, noting mattresses seem to be a pain in the hole when they make it to landfill to

26-08-2020 11:30am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Getting into an argument over a window seat when you're a grown adult isn't a good look. I'm not saying be a walkover, but Jesus, it's just a flight. Why get worked up and cause a scene because you paid a few quid for a window seat. When I get worked up about this sort of thing, and it does happen with traffic where I live, it's usually because I'm already pissed off at something else.

You pay for your seat, you get your seat. There should be no argument anyway because it should be empty and the argument is caused by what's making it not empty.

26-08-2020 11:34am

Deleted User wrote: »

Getting into an argument over a window seat when you're a grown adult isn't a good look. I'm not saying be a walkover, but Jesus, it's just a flight. Why get worked up and cause a scene because you paid a few quid for a window seat. When I get worked up about this sort of thing, and it does happen with traffic where I live, it's usually because I'm already pissed off at something else.

What???

He paid for something specific, and someone who didnt pay for it, wants you to give it up, for their convenience. Screw that.
I wouldn't get into an argument over it, as there would be room for debate. It's my seat, stop wasting my time

26-08-2020 11:44am

Deleted User wrote: »

What???

He paid for something specific, and someone who didnt pay for it, wants you to give it up, for their convenience. Screw that.
I wouldn't get into an argument over it, as there would be room for debate. It's my seat, stop wasting my time

Yes, we agree with each other. You get a flight attendant to solve the situation. You don't stand there and get into an argument over it like a child.

JustAThought · 26-08-2020 12:09pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Yes, we agree with each other. You get a flight attendant to solve the situation. You don't stand there and get into an argument over it like a child.

Or arguably you discuss it like men, and din’t go running to an airhostess like a child tugging the skirts of its mammy.

Of course the staff should atip this kind of mullarkey and tell the guy to stop jigging about like a child!

JustAThought · 26-08-2020 12:12pm

Before - in Virgin cimenas /VUe/ whatever its called now - on Parnell St. People just nicking large tubs of popcorn and wandering off with them - when they used to have it pre-boxed and laid out on ahelves as you Q. I can’t understand how you could enjoy popcorn when you had just stolen it or thought it would impress your OH/date. I know its overpriced at a tenner but just man up and py for it or moan and go without.

Wanderer78 · 26-08-2020 12:14pm

JustAThought wrote: »

Before - in Virgin cimenas /VUe/ whatever its called now - on Parnell St. People just nicking large tubs of popcorn and wandering off with them - when they used to have it pre-boxed and laid out on ahelves as you Q. I can’t understand how you could enjoy popcorn when you had just stolen it or thought it would impress your OH/date. I know its overpriced at a tenner but just man up and py for it or moan and go without.

robbing stuff is great, particularly from large corporations, currently doing it here now, feels great

Errashareesh · 26-08-2020 12:24pm

Wanderer78 wrote: »

robbing stuff is great

?

particularly from large corporations, currently doing it here now, feels great

Large corporations have countless ordinary working class people working for them.

Saying "robbing is great" actually betrays having a similar mindset to the greedy, exploitative folks, even if it's on a smaller scale.

I've always thought that though - the self entitled types and the greedy types aren't all that different in terms of having a "me me me" outlook.

Wanderer78 · 26-08-2020 12:31pm

Errashareesh wrote: »

?

Large corporations have countless ordinary working class people working for them.

Saying "robbing is great" actually betrays having a similar mindset to the greedy, exploitative folks, even if it's on a smaller scale.

I've always thought that though - the self entitled types and the greedy types aren't all that different in terms of having a "me me me" outlook.

again its important to realise the negative aspects of allowing large corporations to monopolise some of societies needs, the idea of maximising share holder value is largely failing the majority in society, particularly in relation to wealth redistribution, when in fact a large proportion of the knowledge that these corporations have accumulated, has in fact come from the public sector, via publicly funded institutions etc, upon relishing this reality, you can begin to understand why so many thieve things such as tv viewing rights etc

Errashareesh · 26-08-2020 12:37pm

Wanderer78 wrote: »

again its important to realise the negative aspects of allowing large corporations to monopolise some of societies needs, the idea of maximising share holder value is largely failing the majority in society, particularly in relation to wealth redistribution, when in fact a large proportion of the knowledge that these corporations have accumulated, has in fact come from the public sector, via publicly funded institutions etc, upon relishing this reality, you can begin to understand why so many thieve things such as tv viewing rights etc

Yeah but you've negated anything more lofty when you say "robbing is great" which makes your reasoning seem like just a cover for "I should get free stuff".

Allinall · 26-08-2020 12:37pm

Wanderer78 wrote: »

again its important to realise the negative aspects of allowing large corporations to monopolise some of societies needs, the idea of maximising share holder value is largely failing the majority in society, particularly in relation to wealth redistribution, when in fact a large proportion of the knowledge that these corporations have accumulated, has in fact come from the public sector, via publicly funded institutions etc, upon relishing this reality, you can begin to understand why so many thieve things such as tv viewing rights etc

Tesco are a large corporation. Would you walk out with a litre of milk without paying?

Also- there is no "right" to view tv content.

landofthetree · 26-08-2020 12:40pm

Microsoft office

Wanderer78 · 26-08-2020 12:42pm

Errashareesh wrote: »

Yeah but you've negated anything more lofty when you say "robbing is great" which makes your reasoning seem like just a cover for "I should get free stuff".

believe it or not, large corporations are the ones that are getting more stuff for free than anything, including financial institutions, they effectively can print as much money as they want with activities such as share buy backs and money creation itself

Allinall wrote: »

Tesco are a large corporation. Would you walk out with a litre of milk without paying?

Also- there is no "right" to view tv content.

of course not, but ask the suppliers of the milk how they feel about that whole situation!

large broadcasters acquire tv viewing rights which were once under public ownership, they use their abilities to manipulate these outcomes by any means to do so

26-08-2020 1:00pm

Wanderer78 wrote: »

believe it or not, large corporations are the ones that are getting more stuff for free than anything, including financial institutions, they effectively can print as much money as they want with activities such as share buy backs and money creation itself

Are you thinking of UK banks? Irish banks don't print/create money. I can't fathom what your problem is with share buy backs...

Either way, being opposed to large corporations has no relevance to an argument that people shouldn't have to pay banking fees.

Regardless of the size of the entity, if you're getting a service that people are employed to provide, you should pay for it.

There's a reason most banks are large. The cost of running a bank is expensive, and a small bank would have to pass much more of that cost down to its customers. And people wont pay for banking.

whisky_galore · 26-08-2020 1:10pm

Wanderer78 wrote: »

maybe countries such as germany have better functioning critical public services than our own, which encourages those citizens to behave more so towards the collective

That's like giving a lame excuse to people who litter because there's no bins, bins had they been present would be abused anyhow as some people are too mean to dispose of the rubbish they produce responsibly.

Errashareesh · 26-08-2020 1:13pm

Wanderer78 wrote: »

believe it or not, large corporations are the ones that are getting more stuff for free than anything, including financial institutions, they effectively can print as much money as they want with activities such as share buy backs and money creation itself

of course not, but ask the suppliers of the milk how they feel about that whole situation!

large broadcasters acquire tv viewing rights which were once under public ownership, they use their abilities to manipulate these outcomes by any means to do so

You said robbing is great - which is pretty disgusting. Being a self entitled thief. And screw everyone else who's paying/working hard in those places, and for whom prices may be driven up due to theft. But I bet you think you're really compassionate towards other members of society.

You're just stealing though because somehow you're above paying for things. As individualistic a behaviour as you can get.

Behaviour by large corporations doesn't justify it in the slightest. It's hypocritical actually to condemn them for a behaviour you engage in yourself.

Mad_maxx · 26-08-2020 1:30pm

munsterdevil wrote: »

TV License, it's a mnority, but sizable minority

I don't pay the TV licence, I wont pay to be pummelled daily with leftist propaganda

whisky_galore · 26-08-2020 1:33pm

Mad_maxx wrote: »

I don't pay the TV licence, I wont pay to be pummelled daily with leftist propaganda

Change channel or stream, it's that easy.

Frankie Machine · 26-08-2020 1:36pm

A friend of mine works in a shop/deli/petrol station.

Some locals who come in regularly will buy a coffee, wander over to the magazine rack and bring the mag of choice to the seating area with them.

Put it back on the shelf when they're leaving.

Mad_maxx · 26-08-2020 1:52pm

whisky_galore wrote: »

Change channel or stream, it's that easy.

Of course, just pointing out why I don't pay it

26-08-2020 1:54pm

Frankie Machine wrote: »

Some locals who come in regularly will buy a coffee, wander over to the magazine rack and bring the mag of choice to the seating area with them.

Put it back on the shelf when they're leaving.

Reminds me of my mother - if a letter comes in the door and the stamp hasn't been franked, she'll happily peel it off and reuse it the next time she sends a letter.

She's a very honest woman; she doesn't see it as not paying for a service that other people are providing. She thinks she's basically recycling.

Mad_maxx · 26-08-2020 1:55pm

I sometimes tell the shop attendant in filling station convenience store's that I've only a medium coffee when I clearly have a large, tell them I topped up the medium with water in a large cup " because I don't like it too strong ",coffee is usually poor quality and three twenty for a large so I don't feel guilty about paying 2.70

i_surge · 26-08-2020 2:16pm

Errashareesh wrote: »

Re bank charges:

This'll probably be met with "you big capitalist corporate loving whatnot" (even though I'm nothing of the sort) but I genuinely don't understand when people take issue with it.

If a service is provided, you pay for it. It's that simple. Why should a service be free?

The banks are not just the senior executives. They are the customer service advisors and sales agents on basic wages.

You aren't looking at the whole picture. Current account is a sales funnel for debt products.

Should be free imo

Lillyfae · 26-08-2020 2:22pm

whisky_galore wrote: »

That's like giving a lame excuse to people who litter because there's no bins, bins had they been present would be abused anyhow as some people are too mean to dispose of the rubbish they produce responsibly.

I hate both of these arguments. There aren’t enough bins, definitely. There should be more, and they should be maintained by CoCos- abusing is a ridiculous argument. Enforcement of litter laws is needed.

If there’s no bin, then people should take their rubbish home and dispose of it.

BrianD3 · 26-08-2020 2:29pm

I was getting tyres recently and enquired about part worns for a car that I have off the road. The fitter I was dealing with misunderstood and thought I wanted tyres that he had taken off cars that came into the shop "they'd mostly be f*cked, worn down to the wires" he said. We then got chatting about how people (don't) maintain their cars and how some do come in looking for scrap tyres for free to put on a car that they will drive on the road.

Meanwhile, a woman rolled up in a 2016 BMW 7 series (car would have cost 100 grand new) and starts flirting with one of the other fitters asking about tyres for the car. The demeanour changed dramatically when she heard the price "you must be f*ckin jokin me, f*ckin ripoff I'm not paying that for them, get me the boss now". Tramp.

Wanderer78 · 26-08-2020 2:39pm

true-or-false wrote:

Are you thinking of UK banks? Irish banks don't print/create money. I can't fathom what your problem is with share buy backs...

All commercial banks, including irish banks, creating money in the form of credit, it's the most common method of money creation on this planet.

Share buy backs are a potentially dangerous method of wealth creation, without creating anything of truly effective productive means, it can sometimes be a net job destroyer, also noting, share ownership globally, is heavily skewed, so it only truly benefits a small proportion of society in terms of wealth creation and distribution

26-08-2020 2:51pm

crossman47 wrote: »

Its not free but our demand for cheap food is a really bad policy. Meat is being sold at less than the cost of production as supermarkets fight for market share. The result is bad production practices. I have argued with people who thought a piece of salmon was expensive until I pointed out fishermen have to go out, often in bad weather, to catch them.

The price is low because farmers are subsidised to keep it low so that it remains affordable.

That's a very good system.

Wanderer78 · 26-08-2020 2:53pm

Niner leprauchan wrote:

That's a very good system.

So good, we landfill roughly a third of the food purchased

26-08-2020 2:55pm

Wanderer78 wrote: »

So good, we landfill roughly a third of the food purchased

That's nothing to do with the scheme but we get it, your anti everything

Wanderer78 · 26-08-2020 2:56pm

Niner leprauchan wrote:

That's nothing to do with the scheme but we get it, your anti everything

I'm not actually, but we need to grow up at some stage, and accept, we really are fcuking up things in many ways, including environmentally

un5byh7sqpd2x0 · 26-08-2020 2:57pm

JasonStatham wrote: »

Yeah Ryanair is literally a Dublin Bus with wings. I wouldn't be seen dead on it. Always fly Aer Lingus.

I think you need to look up the definition of literally.

Lundstram · 26-08-2020 8:28pm

Mad_maxx wrote: »

I sometimes tell the shop attendant in filling station convenience store's that I've only a medium coffee when I clearly have a large, tell them I topped up the medium with water in a large cup " because I don't like it too strong ",coffee is usually poor quality and three twenty for a large so I don't feel guilty about paying 2.70

I just say I got tea. Save about a €1. Don't do it too often, though. The cashier probably couldn't give a sh1t anyway.

I refuse to pay for air a petrol stations. No way. Plenty of others have it for free.

JonasBlane · 26-08-2020 9:10pm

People that Dont pay for the Weekly Kick around...Some diseappear like batman.Its 5 Euro

wassie · 28-08-2020 11:54pm

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

The price is low because farmers are subsidised to keep it low so that it remains affordable.

That's a very good system.

Subsidies in the long term reward inefficient practices and do nothing to promote innovation.

ILoveYourVibes · 29-08-2020 2:52am

true-or-false wrote: »

People don't want to pay for anything they need. It seems to me like people think they're entitled to everything they need and that their own money should be reserved for holidays and luxuries.

Back when I worked in retail, people were forever complaining about the prices of things with a cry of "but I need it".

Even transport - "I didn't buy a ticket because I would have missed my train". Oh right, your train is so important you need to be let off paying, but not so important that you could show up on time.

Passports, driver's licences, wifi, even smokes. The list is endless, no one wants to pay for anything, regardless of how much money they have.

i don't think we should have to pay for anything we actually NEED

Optimalprimerib · 29-08-2020 3:32am

Netflix. Try change your password and see how many people decide to "get back in touch" with you.

Also free cancellation on hotels when booking online. It might be a tenner more expensive but I think it is worth it. Especially in this climate.

Tolls as well. In some cases adding hours on the journey just to avoid them.

tjhook · 29-08-2020 9:23am

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

i don't think we should have to pay for anything we actually NEED

If somebody puts effort into producing something (whether it's food or housing or anything else), they'll need to be paid for it, otherwise they won't bother. So it'll end up being paid for one way or another. Those goods/services could be free at point of use and paid through the taxes of those that contribute to the system. But there are other considerations.

Food is essential. But is any *particular* food essential? Should caviar be free? Or should the free food be a small selection of basic but nutritious fare? (e.g. porridge, bread, potatoes, chicken, etc)? Shoes are essential. But hardly Jimmy Choos. Perhaps a basic but sturdy functional shoe of some description? Otherwise it's likely there'd be huge waste and over-consumption.

And if all the essentials of life were free (food, clothing, medical care etc), would that mean that there'd be little need for social welfare? If the essentials are freely available (and paid for through taxes of working people), the implication is that any money would be largely for spending on non-essential things. So easier to justify cutting welfare. the while situation starts sounding a bit Soviet for the people affected. Or somewhat similar to the welfare "food-voucher" system that's not popular in countries where it's tried.

I'm waffling a bit, but my point is that these things can have unintended consequences.

whisky_galore · 29-08-2020 10:05am

Lillyfae wrote: »

I hate both of these arguments. There aren’t enough bins, definitely. There should be more, and they should be maintained by CoCos- abusing is a ridiculous argument. Enforcement of litter laws is needed.

If there’s no bin, then people should take their rubbish home and dispose of it.

Enforcement of litter laws never happens.
You either have to be caught red handed or be such a eejit as to leave your name and address in your rubbish before you have a chance of being charged for it.
It doesnt help when we have fully grown men and women children who have yet to learn how to pick up after themselves not to mind those who drive out at the dead of night with black bags in their car.

29-08-2020 10:09am

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

i don't think we should have to pay for anything we actually NEED

Yup grow your own food?

29-08-2020 10:10am

wassie wrote: »

Subsidies in the long term reward inefficient practices and do nothing to promote innovation.

So stop subsidies and replace it with a better system, but what alternative?

Ash.J.Williams · 29-08-2020 10:24am

people hate paying musicians

gmisk · 29-08-2020 10:25am

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

people hate paying musicians

And most musicians hate paying taxes...

Ash.J.Williams · 29-08-2020 10:27am

BrianD3 wrote: »

I was getting tyres recently and enquired about part worns for a car that I have off the road. The fitter I was dealing with misunderstood and thought I wanted tyres that he had taken off cars that came into the shop "they'd mostly be f*cked, worn down to the wires" he said. We then got chatting about how people (don't) maintain their cars and how some do come in looking for scrap tyres for free to put on a car that they will drive on the road.

Meanwhile, a woman rolled up in a 2016 BMW 7 series (car would have cost 100 grand new) and starts flirting with one of the other fitters asking about tyres for the car. The demeanour changed dramatically when she heard the price "you must be f*ckin jokin me, f*ckin ripoff I'm not paying that for them, get me the boss now". Tramp.

ha love it beamers and mercs are highly affordable 2nd hand for people to look the part but can get an awful shock at running costs

Things people go out of their way not to pay for

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