The difference between opposing the MMR vaccine and opposing the HPV vaccine.

political analyst · 24-05-2019 5:31pm #1

https://www.thejournal.ie/simon-harris-mandatory-vaccines-4608031-Apr2019/

Scaremongering and misinformation on social media has led to a dramatic drop off in the uptake rate of vaccines including the MMR and the HPV vaccines. The HSE launched a campaign to fight back against the disinformation on social media in relation to the HPV vaccine, which led to an increase in the uptake rate.Scaremongering and misinformation on social media has led to a dramatic drop off in the uptake rate of vaccines including the MMR and the HPV vaccines. The HSE launched a campaign to fight back against the disinformation on social media in relation to the HPV vaccine, which led to an increase in the uptake rate.

Why is the impression given by some journalists in the Irish media that the MMR and HPV vaccines are equally important?

Mandatory MMR vaccination would be justified because measles, mumps and rubella are very contagious and have caused deaths or brain damage.

However, HPV is a sexually-transmitted virus. Many sexually-active adults have HPV but the number of cases in which it leads to cancer is small. If a woman who has never had sex before has sex with a man who has never had sex before then she won't contract HPV and so she won't have cervical cancer.

The impression is being given that there's a possibility that secondary school pupils would be given the HPV vaccine against their will. I hope I'm wrong.

endacl · 24-05-2019 5:33pm

Vaccines save lives.

End of discussion.

TheValeyard · 24-05-2019 5:36pm

Ffs. Just get vaccinated. Stop taking chances.

hatrickpatrick · 24-05-2019 5:37pm

political analyst wrote: »

https://www.thejournal.ie/simon-harris-mandatory-vaccines-4608031-Apr2019/

Why is the impression given by some journalists in the Irish media that the MMR and HPV vaccines are equally important?

Mandatory MMR vaccination would be justified because measles, mumps and rubella are very contagious and have caused deaths or brain damage.

However, HPV is a sexually-transmitted virus. Many sexually-active adults have HPV but the number of cases in which it leads to cancer is small. If a woman who has never had sex before has sex with a man who has never had sex before then she won't contract HPV and so she won't have cervical cancer.

Teenagers experiment. Always have done, always will do, and there's (a) nothing wrong with it, and (b) nothing anyone can do to stop it. HPV passes from one person to another from more than just intercourse - any form of oral sex, for example, which is generally what teens get into before they go for the full package, can cause a HPV infection which leads to neck or throat cancer. I believe this is actually feared more by doctors as a HPV-caused cancer than cervical cancer - at least that's the impression one gets from the media. I suspect, if this is the case, that government bodies and other mainstream voices focus on cervical cancer due to the high proportion of idiots out there who have a moral problem with oral sex and naively assume that their innocent darlings aren't interested in anything that "gross".

The impression is being given that there's a possibility that secondary school pupils would be given the HPV vaccine against their will. I hope I'm wrong.

I don't think there's any suggestion of that. Personally I'd very much support a move to allowing teens to get it without parental consent though.

Literally the only reason the HPV vaccine is so controversial stems from right wing Republicans in the US who have a very thinly veiled world view that (a) the threat of getting cervical cancer is a useful tool in preventing "immoral" (ugh) behaviour among young people, and (b) that those who to contract STDs of any kind deserve it. The worst of these loopers are those who believe STDs to be a punishment from God.

It's no coincidence that one of the primary voices behind the anti-vaccine movement here with regard to HPV is Fidelma "fornication is a legitimate concept in the 21st century" Healy Eames. F*ck the lot of them.

political analyst · 24-05-2019 5:42pm

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Teenagers experiment. Always have done, always will do, and there's (a) nothing wrong with it, and (b) nothing anyone can do to stop it. HPV passes from one person to another from more than just intercourse - any form of oral sex, for example, which is generally what teens get into before they go for the full package, can cause a HPV infection which leads to neck or throat cancer. I believe this is actually feared more by doctors as a HPV-caused cancer than cervical cancer - at least that's the impression one gets from the media. I suspect, if this is the case, that government bodies and other mainstream voices focus on cervical cancer due to the high proportion of idiots out there who have a moral problem with oral sex and naively assume that their innocent darlings aren't interested in anything that "gross".

The idea that a girl would enjoy having a boy put his penis into her mouth and (if he doesn't wear a condom) ejaculate into her mouth doesn't make sense to me.

dudara · 24-05-2019 5:43pm

political analyst wrote: »

However, HPV is a sexually-transmitted virus. Many sexually-active adults have HPV but the number of cases in which it leads to cancer is small. If a woman who has never had sex before has sex with a man who has never had sex before then she won't contract HPV and so she won't have cervical cancer.

Are you trying to say that women who have sex get what they deserve?

You know that men can also develop cancer from HPV? And given that the vast majority of us will have sex in our lifetime, it makes sense to get the vaccination.

TheValeyard · 24-05-2019 5:46pm

political analyst wrote: »

The idea that a girl would enjoy having a boy put his penis into her mouth and (if he doesn't wear a condom) ejaculate into her mouth doesn't make sense to me.

Once a legal age and consenting who gives a fcuk.

political analyst · 24-05-2019 5:48pm

dudara wrote: »

Are you trying to say that women who have sex get what they deserve?

No - and don't put words in my mouth!

dudara wrote: »

You know that men can also develop cancer from HPV? And given that the vast majority of us will have sex in our lifetime, it makes sense to get the vaccination.

In my OP I mentioned the issue of secondary school pupils (a gender-neutral term, obviously!) receiving the HPV vaccine.

I mentioned the idea of a woman who has never had sex before having sex with a man who has never had sex before only because cervical cancer is the effect of HPV that is most discussed in public.

hatrickpatrick · 24-05-2019 5:49pm

political analyst wrote: »

The idea that a girl would enjoy having a boy put his penis into her mouth and (if he doesn't wear a condom) ejaculate into her mouth doesn't make sense to me.

What about if it's the other way around? Going down on a woman is one of the sexiest experiences known to mankind. Lad can still potentially get throat cancer from it if one of them isn't vaccinated.

political analyst · 24-05-2019 5:49pm

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

Once a legal age and consenting who gives a fcuk.

But most girls would say, "Urrrrrgggghhhh, gross!" to the idea of letting penises be put in their mouths, wouldn't they?!

political analyst · 24-05-2019 5:50pm

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

What about if it's the other way around? Going down on a woman is one of the sexiest experiences known to mankind. Lad can still potentially get throat cancer from it if one of them isn't vaccinated.

I find it hard to believe a lad would enjoy "going down" either, whether it's on a woman or on another lad - unless he's Michael Douglas, of course!

amcalester · 24-05-2019 5:55pm

What’s your issue? That people enjoy sex or that school children are being encouraged to get vaccined against HPV?

political analyst · 24-05-2019 5:57pm

amcalester wrote: »

What’s your issue? That people enjoy sex or that school children are being encouraged to get vaccined against HPV?

Well, hatrickpatrick mentioned oral sex. So it is relevant to the OP.

kneemos · 24-05-2019 6:01pm

I'm gonna put some chicken in my mouth very shortly.

hatrickpatrick · 24-05-2019 6:02pm

political analyst wrote: »

I find it hard to believe a lad would enjoy "going down" either, whether it's on a woman or on another lad - unless he's Michael Douglas, of course!

No idea which gender you are, but if you're a lad and you've never had your face between a woman's thighs, get off Boards and get thee to Coppers tonight. You're missing out, lad.

Outlaw Pete · 24-05-2019 6:02pm

endacl wrote: »

Vaccines save lives.

End of discussion.

Yeah, that's the attitude. Make the the topic yet another sacred cow.

Gimme A Pound · 24-05-2019 6:20pm

political analyst wrote: »

The idea that a girl would enjoy having a boy put his penis into her mouth and (if he doesn't wear a condom) ejaculate into her mouth doesn't make sense to me.

Absolutely. You can be sure plenty of them do it because they feel they have to or they'll be called frigid or whatever.

dudara wrote: »

Are you trying to say that women who have sex get what they deserve?.

FFS they said no such thing.

amcalester wrote: »

What’s your issue? That people enjoy sex or that school children are being encouraged to get vaccined against HPV?

They've made their opinion clear - that they don't view each vaccine to be of equal importance due to probability/numbers. I think they are though OP - while I see what you're saying, a risk is a risk.

Wesser · 24-05-2019 6:39pm

whats your point?
Are you saying that because HPV is sexually transmitted it should not be vaccinated against?

by the way... you exist because your mother had sex....

kowloon · 24-05-2019 6:40pm

political analyst wrote: »

The idea that a girl would enjoy having a boy put his penis into her mouth and (if he doesn't wear a condom) ejaculate into her mouth doesn't make sense to me.

Have you ever tried it?

LirW · 24-05-2019 6:41pm

HPV can even be passed on to your baby via blood stream or during vaginal birth.

Anything that can minimise the risk from high risk HPV strains is good. The virus spreads easily, there needs to be more awareness that pretty much every sexually active person will get in contact with it at some point in their lives and while many infections clear up themselves and go without symptoms it's still there.
If you've ever been to a CervialCheck clinic you realise how incredibly common harmful cell changes are and it can hit every woman from every social background at every age.

Timberrrrrrrr · 24-05-2019 6:45pm

Things i have learned from this thread

1. OP has never had a blow job

/list

eviltwin · 24-05-2019 6:49pm

Anything that reduces the chances of a woman developing cervical cancer is a good thing.

meeeeh · 24-05-2019 7:18pm

Not to contribute to op's nonsense but there is a difference between the two vaccinations. HPV vaccine mainly protect the person vaccinated, mmr is much more vicious and vaccine is needed for herd immunity. Those not getting hpv are mostly increasing the chances of getting cancer themselves, those who don't get mmr vaccine can cause outbreaks and do a lot more damage.

People should get both but I also believe that mmr should be mandatory and given even without parental consent. They should have no right to endanger lives of their own kids and the lives other children. It's despicable.

So no I don't believe both vaccines are equally important but I want my kids (boy and a girl) to get both.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts · 24-05-2019 7:21pm

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

What about if it's the other way around? Going down on a woman is one of the sexiest experiences known to mankind. Lad can still potentially get throat cancer from it if one of them isn't vaccinated.

They can also get chewing gum in their pubis!*

*Please, please, somebody get the reference.

ILoveYourVibes · 24-05-2019 7:29pm

I'm getting the HPV vaccine.

Lots of people don't seem to realize you can get it into your 20s.

One eyed Jack · 24-05-2019 7:30pm

political analyst wrote: »

https://www.thejournal.ie/simon-harris-mandatory-vaccines-4608031-Apr2019/

Why is the impression given by some journalists in the Irish media that the MMR and HPV vaccines are equally important?

Because they imagine scaremongering works.

However, HPV is a sexually-transmitted virus. Many sexually-active adults have HPV but the number of cases in which it leads to cancer is small. If a woman who has never had sex before has sex with a man who has never had sex before then she won't contract HPV and so she won't have cervical cancer.

The first part is true, the second part in bold is a bit more complex than that.

The impression is being given that there's a possibility that secondary school pupils would be given the HPV vaccine against their will. I hope I'm wrong.

You’re not entirely wrong. Nobody will be given vaccines against their will, nor against their parents wishes. What Simon Harris appears to be advocating for is denying parents public services if they refuse to have their children vaccinated. Simon Harris knows well that such a policy actually has the opposite effect, but hey - more votes, because his report card as Minister for Health is nothing to write home about.

ILoveYourVibes · 24-05-2019 7:31pm

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

What about if it's the other way around? Going down on a woman is one of the sexiest experiences known to mankind. Lad can still potentially get throat cancer from it if one of them isn't vaccinated.

Men and boys can get the vaccine too. They should

meeeeh · 24-05-2019 7:33pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I'm getting the HPV vaccine.

Lots of people don't seem to realize you can get it into your 20s.

You can but it's more likely than not too late.

endacl · 24-05-2019 7:43pm

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Yeah, that's the attitude. Make the the topic yet another sacred cow.

It’s hardly a ‘sacred cow’. The numbers don’t lie, and facts are facts.

Discussion lends an apparent credibility to the possibility of an alternative view. There isn’t one.

hatrickpatrick · 24-05-2019 7:47pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Men and boys can get the vaccine too. They should

Oh I'm aware, I was replying to a poster who said s/he couldn't imagine any girl or woman actually enjoying giving head, to which I replied that when we talk about teens engaging in oral sex, it's not just f -> m oral sex we're talking about.

That same poster balked at the mere idea of anyone enjoying giving cunnilingus so I'm forced to conclude that s/he has lived a life devoid one of the finer pleasures

ILoveYourVibes · 24-05-2019 7:51pm

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Oh I'm aware, I was replying to a poster who said s/he couldn't imagine any girl or woman actually enjoying giving head, to which I replied that when we talk about teens engaging in oral sex, it's not just f -> m oral sex we're talking about.

That same poster balked at the mere idea of anyone enjoying giving cunnilingus so I'm forced to conclude that s/he has lived a life devoid one of the finer pleasures

Agreed ! :P

The difference between opposing the MMR vaccine and opposing the HPV vaccine.

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