No boozing on certain trains to the West

elperello · 05-10-2018 9:25pm

fryup wrote: »

is it really necessary to serve alcohol on a train in the first place ?

No not really.

It's just a little extra luxury that people in well ordered societies can indulge in without interference.

biko · 05-10-2018 9:29pm

I have been one of these drunk eejits.
Although we thought we were great craic - in hindsight we were just drunk eejits disturbing everyone else's journey.

OldMrBrennan83 · 05-10-2018 9:31pm

biko wrote: »

I have been one of these drunk eejits.
Although we thought we were great craic - in hindsight we were just drunk eejits disturbing everyone else's journey.

Good love them, I'm sure they were scarred for life.

05-10-2018 9:34pm

Last time I got a train to the West, specifically to Cathair na Mart, there wasn't even a seat for the £38/€38 which I paid. When I asked an Iarnród Éireann guy about it he said, and I quote, 'The ticket doesn't guarantee a seat'.

In this context, the absence of alcohol/drug of choice wouldn't even register when assessing the service.

end of the road · 05-10-2018 10:05pm

Purple Mountain wrote: »

Because drinking isn't served on buses for one.

the train is not the bus though.

Deleted User wrote: »

Last time I got a train to the West, specifically to Cathair na Mart, there wasn't even a seat for the £38/€38 which I paid. When I asked an Iarnród Éireann guy about it he said, and I quote, 'The ticket doesn't guarantee a seat'.

In this context, the absence of alcohol/drug of choice wouldn't even register when assessing the service.

the chap you spoke to is apparently correct, i believe this is mentioned in the terms of travel that a ticket won't guarantee a seat. even a reservation apparently won't guarantee a seat, which if true (whatever about a general ticket) there is no justification for.
realistically it would not always be possible to guarantee everyone a seat on the railway, at least at peak time and on the suburban parts of it. all though the railway can certainly do a hell of a lot better and so can the government in terms of funding it to do so.

Grayson · 05-10-2018 10:18pm

killanena wrote: »

Why ban something out right because a minority of people are causing antisocial behaviour. This small group of people would either cause the same hassle if they were not drinking onboard (because they probably had plenty before they got on the train) or would just ignore the rule and drink anyways.

They would say they would remove these people if they broke this rule.
But my question is why not just remove them in the first place before this stupid rule? Only difference this makes is that respectable people who would like to have a drink on their trip now can't.

Its just another little freedom taken from us by an issue that could be solved without doing so..

How exactly would you remove 20 lads who are locked? You'd have to call the cops and have the train stuck in a station while their being evicted. It's easier just to say no.

Mulbert · 05-10-2018 10:18pm

This type of ban has been on the Waterford line for about 20 yrs.Mainly because of Dublin *****/pricks going to Kilkenny and making for a nightmare journey for those in their company.

Arghus · 05-10-2018 10:22pm

Been on the Friday train to Galway many times and a loud group being "great craic" can make your journey a misery.

Can't say I have a problem with the ban, it's lenient in my view - usually in the moment I want them to drop dead.

elperello · 05-10-2018 10:26pm

Grayson wrote: »

How exactly would you remove 20 lads who are locked? You'd have to call the cops and have the train stuck in a station while their being evicted. It's easier just to say no.

Quite roughly if they put up any argument.

Seriously though it's the only way if we don't want our public services taken over by louts.

If people are obviously rowdy or drunk don't let them on in the first place.

If they cause bother on the train turf them off at the next station.

Spanish Eyes · 05-10-2018 10:30pm

This is hilarious. You cannot find anyone in Irish Rail to sort out someone who is sitting in your pre booked seat. No one on board to monitor anything apart from the odd ticket checker and the guys and girls dishing out the sambos and tea on the trolley.

Barry Kenny is living in cloud cuckoo land if he thinks that every bag brought on board will be checked for alcohol, be like Brexit on the border!

All that will happen is that alcohol will not be sold on the train. That is a challenge for those who will stash the vodka in the seven up bottle and so on.

We need the alcohol Stasi going up and down the carriages and turfing the messers off in the most remote station possible!

Ah I'm only having a laugh.

Pawwed Rig · 05-10-2018 10:39pm

If a group are drinking on board one of these trains what exactly will be done about it?

3DataModem · 05-10-2018 10:44pm

Purple Mountain wrote: »

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.rte.ie/amp/1001158/

IE has banned the carriage on and purchase of alcohol on certain trains to Galway and Westport due to antisocial behaviour by a minority of people of these routes.
They claim it's down to large groups on board at carts in times.
I'm assuming it's stag and hen parties.
Is this a step too far in a nanny state or justified when the majority of other passengers are inflicted with noise and general shenanigans of a drunken group?
Personally I think no one should be allowed bring alcohol on board (no different to a plane) and that if you purchase alcohol on board,.there should be a designated area like the dining car to drink it and for over 18s only.

I agree with the designated area, but it does seem to have been a pretty big problem a few times.

Spanish Eyes · 05-10-2018 10:48pm

Now that people know alcohol will not be sold on board the train, they will bring it in their luggage.

I suppose there will be checks of everyone's baggage before boarding the train so?

This is just lip service and will not solve anything if there is no one on board to monitor anti social behaviour and a private stash of booze will it really?

elperello · 05-10-2018 10:48pm

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

If a group are drinking on board one of these trains what exactly will be done about it?

Probably very little.
Other passengers will blame the drink not the louts and so it goes.
It's all part of our national condition.

Spanish Eyes · 05-10-2018 10:57pm

I often think that Irish drinkers really believe they are entertainment almighty for everyone else sharing their space.

They are not in general, except for themselves and their group.

Ah here, Irish Rail is a monopoly and they will not do anything really to stop this except lose revenue from their drink sales. That is just ridiculous.

Big announcement, no drink will be served on Irish Rail on the following trains.... Great, get the stash in yer bag so!

This is Ireland.

Mulbert · 05-10-2018 11:00pm

elperello wrote: »

Probably very little.
Other passengers will blame the drink not the louts and so it goes.
It's all part of our national condition.

Your right there, people will blame Irish Rail, the government etc not the clowns "on the beer" for the weekend.

I say off you go on the beer. But don't be bothering me going home.

Then you meet the same dick heads going home on Sunday twice as pissed. Jaysus!

Mulbert · 05-10-2018 11:05pm

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

I often think that Irish drinkers really believe they are entertainment almighty for everyone else sharing their space.

They are not in general, except for themselves and their group.

Ah here, Irish Rail is a monopoly and they will not do anything really to stop this except lose revenue from their drink sales. That is just ridiculous.

Big announcement, no drink will be served on Irish Rail on the following trains.... Great, get the stash in yer bag so!

This is Ireland.

Irish Rail don't do the catering on trains anymore. They won't lose out.

elperello · 05-10-2018 11:06pm

There is a certain type that thinks if they raise the volume of their conversation and drink too much it will confer on them the title "character".

Spanish Eyes · 05-10-2018 11:11pm

Mulbert wrote: »

Your right there, people will blame Irish Rail, the government etc not the clowns "on the beer" for the weekend.

I say off you go on the beer. But don't be bothering me going home.

Then you meet the same dick heads going home on Sunday twice as pissed. Jaysus!

Well in fairness, IR needs to have staff on the train monitoring the situation surely? But they have no one on board a train ever to do this. So it will just continue and people will bring on a personal stash of booze anyway and to hell with the other passengers.

I really cannot see how not selling alcohol on a train will stop people drinking and messing if there is no monitoring of the situation at all. And I do think that passengers who want a relatively quiet journey should be looked after.

Of course I am thinking the impossible here!

Spanish Eyes · 05-10-2018 11:16pm

Mulbert wrote: »

Irish Rail don't do the catering on trains anymore. They won't lose out.

Thanks for the information, but IR still have a duty of care to their customers who want to get from A to B without having to listen to the Fields of Athenry or whatever the song du jour happens to be from drunken numpties causing havoc.

On another note, why did Barry Kenny say that alcohol will not be served on certain trains so? I would hazard that the catering companies will not be best pleased at this decision. It is not their fault that IR do not monitor the train carriages for messers is it?

Lip service only IMV.

Smegging hell · 05-10-2018 11:27pm

Alcohol has been banned from the Galway to Dublin train at 1pm on Sundays for quite a while, because stag parties were travelling back to Dublin completely locked. This is just extending that to a few more trains.

elperello · 05-10-2018 11:35pm

Smegging hell wrote: »

Alcohol has been banned from the Galway to Dublin train at 1pm on Sundays for quite a while, because stag parties were travelling back to Dublin completely locked. This is just extending that to a few more trains.

Announcement as train pulls out of Ceannt Station

"One peep of the Fields Of Athenry out of ye and ye will be visiting them."

Spanish Eyes · 05-10-2018 11:37pm

Smegging hell wrote: »

Alcohol has been banned from the Galway to Dublin train at 1pm on Sundays for quite a while, because stag parties were travelling back to Dublin completely locked. This is just extending that to a few more trains.

Did it work out and keep the peace though? Maybe it did on the return when everyone is hungover and wrecked. What about the journey TO Galway :pac:

Mulbert · 05-10-2018 11:37pm

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Well in fairness, IR needs to have staff on the train monitoring the situation surely? But they have no one on board a train ever to do this. So it will just continue and people will bring on a personal stash of booze anyway and to hell with the other passengers.

I really cannot see how not selling alcohol on a train will stop people drinking and messing if there is no monitoring of the situation at all. And I do think that passengers who want a relatively quiet journey should be looked after.

Of course I am thinking the impossible here!

Irish Rail do have staff on trains on Fridays and Sunday for this exact purpose on the Waterford line. And it has worked to an extent.

Spanish Eyes · 05-10-2018 11:46pm

Mulbert wrote: »

Irish Rail do have staff on trains on Fridays and Sunday for this exact purpose on the Waterford line. And it has worked to an extent.

OK but to an extent is not good enough, and what about all other lines?

There should be at least two monitors on all inter city trains at all times at a minimum surely, with instant access to the nearest Garda Station on their Smart phones/walkie talkies etc.

Anyway, I am not having a go, just a regular train traveller with my elderly disabled mother. The amount of times the toilets were disgusting/doors not opening etc. was unreal. But there was no one available to assist for a long wait, and it is degrading really. But there we are.

Mulbert · 05-10-2018 11:50pm

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

OK but to an extent is not good enough, and what about all other lines?

There should be at least two monitors on all inter city trains at all times at a minimum surely, with instant access to the nearest Garda Station on their Smart phones/walkie talkies etc.

Anyway, I am not having a go, just a regular train traveller with my elderly disabled mother. The amount of times the toilets were disgusting/doors not opening etc. was unreal. But there was no one available to assist for a long wait, and it is degrading really. But there we are.

I think u have a beef with Irish Rail for whatever reason, that, or a general hump with society. Hope u get over it. Good luck.

Spanish Eyes · 05-10-2018 11:55pm

Mulbert wrote: »

I think u have a beef with Irish Rail for whatever reason, that, or a general hump with society. Hope u get over it. Good luck.

Ah come on, I think what I have posted is reasonable.

I think you are an IR employee

Arghus · 06-10-2018 12:02am

LOL at all the people suggesting putting guards on every train - in every carriage, I've read a few times, no less!. You do realise that would be a comparatively wasteful spend of money and man hours, when you could just ban the sale of alcohol in the trains in question and have more or less the same result.

Spanish Eyes · 06-10-2018 12:04am

Arghus wrote: »

LOL at all the people suggesting putting guards on every train - in every carriage, I've read a few times, no less!. You do realise that would be a comparatively wasteful spend of money and man hours, when you could just ban the sale of alcohol in the trains in question and have more or less the same result.

That will not stop people bringing their own stash on board once they know there will be no sales of drink on the train though!

killanena · 06-10-2018 12:18am

killanena wrote: »

Why ban something out right because a minority of people are causing antisocial behaviour. This small group of people would either cause the same hassle if they were not drinking onboard (because they probably had plenty before they got on the train) or would just ignore the rule and drink anyways.

They would say they would remove these people if they broke this rule.
But my question is why not just remove them in the first place before this stupid rule? Only difference this makes is that respectable people who would like to have a drink on their trip now can't.

Its just another little freedom taken from us by an issue that could be solved without doing so..

Grayson wrote: »

How exactly would you remove 20 lads who are locked? You'd have to call the cops and have the train stuck in a station while their being evicted. It's easier just to say no.

I didn't say they WOULD be removed, I said thats what they would say they would do in that situation, which we all know they probably wont, so its just redundant to ban drinking for all when these anti-social few will just do it regardless.

Mulbert · 06-10-2018 12:34am

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Ah come on, I think what I have posted is reasonable.

I think you are an IR employee

Do you think Irish Rail should have at least 2 staff to monitor the people boarding trains at places like Thomastown, Athenry, Rathdrum, Ballinasloe, Roscommon, Rosslare Strand, Cahir, Charleville, Longford?

mikemac2 · 06-10-2018 2:51am

Carsanal wrote: »

Put 1-2 Garda on every carriage going forward.
Don't ban the drinking because the minority cause an issue.
15-20 Gardaí throughout the given trains would sort it.

You make it sound like we have thousands of spare gardai in the country

Irish Rail can pay for their own security

OldMrBrennan83 · 06-10-2018 4:44am

Grayson wrote: »

How exactly would you remove 20 lads who are locked? You'd have to call the cops and have the train stuck in a station while their being evicted. It's easier just to say no.

Then nobody learns anything and we all just go further down the road of being the drones they want us to be.

06-10-2018 7:37am

I did see a group removed from the train about 15 years ago. The IÉ guy finally decided to ring ahead to the next station where AGS were waiting to remove the drunk morons in question.

But the rest of us endured a good two hours of the obnoxious clowns before the IÉ employee acted. That needs to change and a zero tolerance message needs to go out. If they are consistently forced off the train it will stop.

elperello · 06-10-2018 11:20am

Deleted User wrote: »

I did see a group removed from the train about 15 years ago. The IÉ guy finally decided to ring ahead to the next station where AGS were waiting to remove the drunk morons in question.

But the rest of us endured a good two hours of the obnoxious clowns before the IÉ employee acted. That needs to change and a zero tolerance message needs to go out. If they are consistently forced off the train it will stop.

It would only take a short sharp shock campaign of say six months to press home the message that drunken messing on trains is not tolerated.
The louts would get the message that ending up halfway to your destination and having to pay for a taxi to get there is not a good start or end to a fun weekend.
With social media and phone in radio programmes the word would get out quickly.

After the initial period the cost of the exercise would drop.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts · 06-10-2018 11:35am

Deleted User wrote: »

Last time I got a train to the West, specifically to Cathair na Mart, there wasn't even a seat for the £38/€38 which I paid. When I asked an Iarnród Éireann guy about it he said, and I quote, 'The ticket doesn't guarantee a seat'.

In this context, the absence of alcohol/drug of choice wouldn't even register when assessing the service.

If you buy the ticket at the station rather than online, you’re not allocated a seat and you might have to stand. You must not get trains too often if you don’t know this. Would you rather they said that they had sold enough tickets to fill the seats and that you’d need to go on a later train? More tickets sold than there are seats = some people having to stand.

OldMrBrennan83 · 06-10-2018 11:38am

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

If you buy the ticket at the station rather than online, you’re not allocated a seat and you might have to stand. You must not get trains too often if you don’t know this. Would you rather they said that they had sold enough tickets to fill the seats and that you’d need to go on a later train? More tickets sold than there are seats = some people having to stand.

Even pre booking a specific seat online doesn't guarantee you a seat because the imbeciles are too inept to get a system right.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts · 06-10-2018 11:41am

Patww79 wrote: »

Even pre booking a specific seat online doesn't guarantee you a seat because the imbeciles are too inept to get a system right.

I’ve never had any issues ousting people from my seat. Just ask.

fryup · 07-10-2018 10:56am

fryup wrote: »

is it really necessary to serve alcohol on a train in the first place ?

elperello wrote: »

No not really.

It's just a little extra luxury that people in well ordered societies can indulge in without interference.

little extra luxury? surely its not going to kill people to go without drink for a couple of hours,

we're not all like Fr Jack are we?

end of the road · 07-10-2018 11:34am

fryup wrote: »

little extra luxury? surely its not going to kill people to go without drink for a couple of hours,

we're not all like Fr Jack are we?

i'd suggest myself that whether it would kill someone or not isn't something that really matters or is relevant. what is relevant and matters are.
1. whether this will have any genuine effect in curtailing the issues.
2. whether alcohol banns are the right and most effective way to deal with said issues.
3. the fact people are being forced to lose out because of others because of the nanny attitudes to alcohol which prevent ireland from becoming an even more responsible nation in relation to alcohol.

OldMrBrennan83 · 07-10-2018 11:36am

Attitudes towards alcohol are getting so dangerous these days as it is, and bans like this are only enforcing it.

Cabaal · 07-10-2018 11:50am

Bottom line, you can't drink on the bus....you shouldn't be drinking on the train.
Its public transport and drinking on public transport makes other people's lives miserable

OldMrBrennan83 · 07-10-2018 11:53am

Cabaal wrote: »

Bottom line, you can't drink on the bus....you shouldn't be drinking on the train.
Its public transport and drinking on public transport makes other people's lives miserable

That's the thing though, it doesn't. That's precisely the dangerous attitude I meant. Drinking doesn't make anyone's lives miserable, unsocial rowdy behaviour while drinking (or, heaven forbid, even when not drinking) is what does. People like you need to take a big step back from the 'ban everything' attitudes and responsibility needs to go back on individuals.

rossie1977 · 07-10-2018 11:57am

Arghus wrote: »

LOL at all the people suggesting putting guards on every train - in every carriage, I've read a few times, no less!. You do realise that would be a comparatively wasteful spend of money and man hours, when you could just ban the sale of alcohol in the trains in question and have more or less the same result.

They had two security guys in each carriage on the football trains home this past summer and pretty sure alcohol wasn't available to buy.

Not saying its necessary every week but it shows Irish rail can do it if they want

Mulbert wrote: »

Do you think Irish Rail should have at least 2 staff to monitor the people boarding trains at places like Thomastown, Athenry, Rathdrum, Ballinasloe, Roscommon, Rosslare Strand, Cahir, Charleville, Longford?

Don't think that would be necessary no. Big groups of drunk folks aren't getting onto the train heading for Westport, Galway or Carrick on Shannon at Roscommon, Longford or Athenry etc.

The places where they are getting on is Heuston, Kildare and sometimes Portarlington (at least as far as the Galway/Westport line).

end of the road · 07-10-2018 12:02pm

Cabaal wrote: »

Bottom line, you can't drink on the bus....you shouldn't be drinking on the train.
Its public transport and drinking on public transport makes other people's lives miserable

the bus is not the train. what rules that exist on the bus should not exist on the train because they exist on the bus. they should exist on their own merrit, not because they exist on another form of transport.
drinking on public transport does not make other people's lives miserable. plenty do it on a daily basis, and cause no issues for anyone. being rowdy on public transport makes people's lives miserable on the other hand, of which sometimes those involved have been drinking, but ultimately it's their nature that they are rowdy, and not the fault of the drink.

fryup · 08-10-2018 9:35am

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

yes, but drink contributes to the rowdy behaviour ...best not to supply them with it

elefant · 08-10-2018 9:49am

Are there silent carriages on Irish trains? On the continent there are specific carriages where even talking is forbidden.

The reserving of specific seats on trains in Ireland could be a complication in arranging this, but perhaps putting everyone who isn't bothered about loud talking, laughing etc. in carriages together, and other people who value peace and quiet in others, could solve some problems.

Nobody wants to hear music played out loud through a phone/speakers on public transport though, that would seem more pertinent to ban than alcohol.

end of the road · 08-10-2018 11:20am

fryup wrote: »

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

yes, but drink contributes to the rowdy behaviour ...best not to supply them with it

they are supplying themselves with it before they board. so in realistic terms an alcohol bann is irrelevant because there will be no actual enforcement of it.

elefant wrote: »

Are there silent carriages on Irish trains? On the continent there are specific carriages where even talking is forbidden.

The reserving of specific seats on trains in Ireland could be a complication in arranging this, but perhaps putting everyone who isn't bothered about loud talking, laughing etc. in carriages together, and other people who value peace and quiet in others, could solve some problems.

Nobody wants to hear music played out loud through a phone/speakers on public transport though, that would seem more pertinent to ban than alcohol.

there is (or was at least) a quiet carriage on some cork services.
for the rest, an increase in rolling stock would be needed to insure all trains are a proper length before they could have one.

starlit · 08-10-2018 11:24am

Think they only banning it for Fridays for Dublin-Galway services and Waterford is it? Only at certain times is that not the case? During the day is a bit much to be allowed a drink they should have some kind of restriction before the afternoon/evening at least and only allow to be served same way pubs are only opened at 12pm/allowed to serve drink from then and restriction with licences though can only buy drink up to 10/10.30pm is it in Tesco?

incentsitive · 08-10-2018 6:12pm

A number to call, and report it to the Gardai at the next station would be game set and match for the loutish behaviour

No boozing on certain trains to the West

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