6000 landlords a year existing the rental market

22-07-2020 10:10pm

snowcat wrote: »

Yes you wait for threshold to decide on that..6 months to a year later

What? Threshold?

Surely you mean the RTB? Their remit does not extend to holiday lets.

https://www.rtb.ie/register-a-tenancy/is-your-property-exempt-from-registration

redarmyblues · 22-07-2020 10:12pm

Dav010 wrote: »

Just to be clear, the RTA does not cover holiday lets and the emergency legislation does not refer to short/holiday lets either. Airbnb guests do not pay the Host, they pay Airbnb. They can go to Threshold and tell whatever yarn they want, they will still be out on their arses.

But AirBnB are not just for Holiday lets, people use them for work and study. I think AirBnB allows lets up to 90 days and remember all the contracts bewteen AirBnB, the LL and the Renter are inferior to legislation, just saying.

Thierry12 · 22-07-2020 10:12pm

snowcat wrote: »

You would want to be stone cold bonkers to rent an apartment out on a standard lease at the moment.

6 month deposit at minimum

Tenants might cop on then

22-07-2020 10:13pm

redarmyblues wrote: »

But AirBnB are not just for Holiday lets, people use them for work and study. I think AirBnB allows lets up to 90 days and remember all the contracts bewteen AirBnB, the LL and the Renter are inferior to legislation, just saying.

Are you confusing the 90 days and the recent planning law?

redarmyblues · 22-07-2020 10:14pm

Dav010 wrote: »

I don’t see what the problem is you are referring to, are you saying short/holiday lets have some tenancy rights? What are you basing this on?

I am not saying anything, I am masking a hypothetical question

snowcat · 22-07-2020 10:14pm

redarmyblues wrote: »

But AirBnB are not just for Holiday lets, people use them for work and study. I think AirBnB allows lets up to 90 days and remember all the contracts bewteen AirBnB, the LL and the Renter are inferior to legislation, just saying.

So what is the legislation for a 3 month short term stay? just saying?

redarmyblues · 22-07-2020 10:16pm

Dav010 wrote: »

Are you confusing the 90 days and the recent planning law?

No, I am saying that I think AirBnB limits the length of stay up to 90 days

snowcat · 22-07-2020 10:18pm

redarmyblues wrote: »

No, I am saying that I think AirBnB limits the length of stay up to 90 days

And is that an Airbnb regulation or an Irish one?

22-07-2020 10:18pm

redarmyblues wrote: »

No, I am saying that I think AirBnB limits the length of stay up to 90 days

Where do you see that?

redarmyblues · 22-07-2020 10:19pm

snowcat wrote: »

So what is the legislation for a 3 month short term stay? just saying?

In Ireland a 3 month lease is a non Part 4 Tenancy, you will have to look that up yourself.

redarmyblues · 22-07-2020 10:21pm

Dav010 wrote: »

Where do you see that?

I don't see it I think it, what is the max stay you can book on AirBnB, I am willing to be corrected on the 90 days.

snowcat · 22-07-2020 10:22pm

redarmyblues wrote: »

In Ireland a 3 month lease is a non Part 4 Tenancy, you will have to look that up yourself.

So does anything less then a 6 month tenancy need to be registered? So effectively you do not need to register a tenancy until it exceeds 6 months as it may be a short term tenancy?

redarmyblues · 22-07-2020 10:22pm

snowcat wrote: »

And is that an Airbnb regulation or an Irish one?

If it exists it would be an AirBnB one.

snowcat · 22-07-2020 10:24pm

redarmyblues wrote: »

If it exists it would be an AirBnB one.

Well you can tell that one to go back home then as it has no bearing in this country.

mrslancaster · 22-07-2020 10:24pm

the_syco wrote: »

I'd imagine a few hundred (or thousand?) landlords will look at taking a hit to get out of the market, due to COVID.

Could be a while before they can get out of the market. Isn't Darragh O'Brien's new Bill extending the eviction ban until 2021?

He said on radio it will provide measures that are more permanent to protect tenant's rights and it will be better than what is available in other jurisdictions. He's in regular contact with homeless charities in Dublin and across the country and his priority is to protect anyone who is vulnerable but he didn't have a lot to say about landlords.

He said he was concerned that the emergency legislation could be open to challenge and his new Bill will correct that. More new regulations - impossible to keep up with all the changes

redarmyblues · 22-07-2020 10:25pm

snowcat wrote: »

So does anything less then a 6 month tenancy need to be registered? So effectively you do not need to register a tenancy until it exceeds 6 months as it may be a short term tenancy?

Where did I say anything like this.

snowcat · 22-07-2020 10:26pm

redarmyblues wrote: »

Where did I say anything like this.

Someone (or you) needs to clarify what a short term let is.

22-07-2020 10:27pm

redarmyblues wrote: »

I don't see it I think it, what is the max stay you can book on AirBnB, I am willing to be corrected on the 90 days.

Airbnb do not set minimum or maximum lets, that is up to the Host. But the Irish Government introduced legislation that requires anyone that lets their full property to occasional/short lets in excess of 90 days per year, to have planning permission.

redarmyblues · 22-07-2020 10:34pm

snowcat wrote: »

Well you can tell that one to go back home then as it has no bearing in this country.

Listen you have the wrong end of the stick, I asked a genuine question and I will rephrase. I know that AirBnB type type lets are restricted and legislated for but in my mind the restrictions are on the planning side, what would happen if a PBP crowd or whatever took a let in excess of 14 days for the purposes of "work" and subsequently refused to leave and barricaded themselves in and had law act on their behalf?

22-07-2020 10:35pm

redarmyblues wrote: »

Listen you have the wrong end of the stick, I asked a genuine question and I will rephrase. I know that AirBnB type type lets are restricted and legislated for but in my mind the restrictions are on the planning side, what would happen if a PBP crowd or whatever took a let in excess of 14 days for the purposes of "work" and subsequently refused to leave and barricaded themselves in and had law act on their behalf?

How would the law act on their behalf? They are then trespassing.

Idbatterim · 22-07-2020 10:37pm

Rob landlords blind with tax and use it to give away housing to others, great system...

snowcat · 22-07-2020 10:38pm

Dav010 wrote: »

How would the law act on their behalf? They are then trespassing.

How naive. You have never asked the gardai to enforce a trespass obviously.

redarmyblues · 22-07-2020 10:38pm

Dav010 wrote: »

Airbnb do not set minimum or maximum lets, that is up to the Host. But the Irish Government introduced legislation that requires anyone that lets their full property to occasional/short lets in excess of 90 days per year, to have planning permission.

The 90 days for AirBnB was a figure I had in my head for some reason. So if somebody was to let a premises for say 90 days for the purpose of work and at the end of the stay say I have nowhere to live, then again that could be the bullseye, you might get AirBnB rates for a couple of years with no cleaning on the local council until they were rehoused.

redarmyblues · 22-07-2020 10:41pm

snowcat wrote: »

How naive. You have never asked the gardai to enforce a trespass obviously.

There was caravans trespassing near me for about 40 years. Google McGinley Sligo.

snowcat · 22-07-2020 10:43pm

redarmyblues wrote: »

There was caravans trespassing near me for about 40 years. Google McGinley Sligo.

Im sure that went well..40 years..

22-07-2020 10:47pm

snowcat wrote: »

How naive. You have never asked the gardai to enforce a trespass obviously.

The poster said the law would act “on their behalf”, and yes, I would be confident that the Gardai would intervene. If a trespasser does not vacate when ordered to by Gardai, it changes from a public order offence to one that is punishable by a fine or jail time.

snowcat · 22-07-2020 10:49pm

Dav010 wrote: »

The poster said the law would act “on their behalf”, and yes, I would be confident that the Gardai would intervene. If a trespasser does not vacate when ordered to by Gardai, it changes from a public order offence to one that is punishable by a fine or jail time.

Ha Ha ha ha ha hahahhaahahahhahahah

Cuddlesworth · 23-07-2020 9:11am

For the original subject, another 8k private landlords gone in q1 2020.

beauf · 23-07-2020 9:34am

Where you seeing that...

I suspect the Govt muttering about buying AirBnbs is not unconnected..

Cuddlesworth · 23-07-2020 10:03am

https://onestopshop.rtb.ie/research/rtb-registration-statistics/

The number of housing association units coming to market over the last few years has been obfuscating the mass exodus of private landlords.

redarmyblues · 23-07-2020 10:36am

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

For the original subject, another 8k private landlords gone in q1 2020.

That is the full year Q1 2019 to Q1 2020, still a final figure 8K when you round it, I would say the figure for Q2 2020 to Q2 2021 will be horrendous.

rightmove · 23-07-2020 11:30am

redarmyblues wrote: »

That is the full year Q1 2019 to Q1 2020, still a final figure 8K when you round it, I would say the figure for Q2 2020 to Q2 2021 will be horrendous.

last 5-7 years must be mental altogether

Edgware · 23-07-2020 12:06pm

I spoke with a landlord last evening. He spent the time giving out that he cant rent his property because there are so many places on the market. I asked did he know the law of supply and demand and cut the rent being sought. Oh no he wants the "market rent or nothing"
I would think that getting 1400 a month for an occupied property is better than having it empty for months advertised at 1700 but apparently that "would be undermining the market"

JimmyVik · 23-07-2020 12:52pm

Idbatterim wrote: »

Rob landlords blind with tax and use it to give away housing to others, great system...

And legislate to make it so bad for them they have to sell. And be waiting in the wings to buy these properties they forced them to sell.
Seems unfair to me,

JimmyVik · 23-07-2020 12:54pm

redarmyblues wrote: »

That is the full year Q1 2019 to Q1 2020, still a final figure 8K when you round it, I would say the figure for Q2 2020 to Q2 2021 will be horrendous.

Not yet because they cant get out with the eviction ban.
Wait til the eviction ban is over. Big exodus then.

beauf · 23-07-2020 1:14pm

Edgware wrote: »

I spoke with a landlord last evening. He spent the time giving out that he cant rent his property because there are so many places on the market. I asked did he know the law of supply and demand and cut the rent being sought. Oh no he wants the "market rent or nothing"
I would think that getting 1400 a month for an occupied property is better than having it empty for months advertised at 1700 but apparently that "would be undermining the market"

It would be better empty than having it rented, having all the cost and expense, wear and tear and no rent being paid.

rightmove · 23-07-2020 1:24pm

beauf wrote: »

It would be better empty than having it rented, having all the cost and expense, wear and tear and no rent being paid.

totally agree - the asset in the hands of a non paying tenant and not protection from the state for anything

Edgware · 23-07-2020 1:35pm

beauf wrote: »

It would be better empty than having it rented, having all the cost and expense, wear and tear and no rent being paid.

If you have a properly selected tenant in it the rent will be paid. Despite what people think there are thousands of people in well paid jobs working from home , earning good salaries.
Lazy landlords use useless agents and end up with wasters as tenants.

Bass Reeves · 23-07-2020 2:26pm

Edgware wrote: »

I spoke with a landlord last evening. He spent the time giving out that he cant rent his property because there are so many places on the market. I asked did he know the law of supply and demand and cut the rent being sought. Oh no he wants the "market rent or nothing"
I would think that getting 1400 a month for an occupied property is better than having it empty for months advertised at 1700 but apparently that "would be undermining the market"

It is not so much undermining the market but you have the pressure zone rules in play as well. If you discount rent by 20% it will take 7 years to achieve that rent level again if RPZ's stay in place.. Because of this I can understand a landlord reluctance to to reduce rents.

Add in the risk factor associated with renting and the present rules regarding evictions and risk to LL it may make more sense to leave it empty. If I had a place empty I consider revamping as there is tax relief on this until end of 2021 I think.

23-07-2020 2:55pm

Edgware wrote: »

If you have a properly selected tenant in it the rent will be paid. Despite what people think there are thousands of people in well paid jobs working from home , earning good salaries.
Lazy landlords use useless agents and end up with wasters as tenants.

What does a properly selected tenant look like?

beauf · 23-07-2020 3:08pm

Edgware wrote: »

If you have a properly selected tenant in it the rent will be paid. Despite what people think there are thousands of people in well paid jobs working from home , earning good salaries.
Lazy landlords use useless agents and end up with wasters as tenants.

If you are right and it's a low risk profitable venture (if done properly) then more people will be getting into it than leaving it. There will be no problems with supply either.

DubCount · 23-07-2020 4:13pm

Edgware wrote: »

If you have a properly selected tenant in it the rent will be paid. Despite what people think there are thousands of people in well paid jobs working from home , earning good salaries.
Lazy landlords use useless agents and end up with wasters as tenants.

Pity you're not allowed discriminate in favour of people in well paying jobs over social housing tenants without a large fine from the WRC

Cuddlesworth · 23-07-2020 4:42pm

redarmyblues wrote: »

That is the full year Q1 2019 to Q1 2020, still a final figure 8K when you round it, I would say the figure for Q2 2020 to Q2 2021 will be horrendous.

Missed that, thanks.

Pkiernan · 23-07-2020 7:45pm

Dav010 wrote: »

What does a properly selected tenant look like?

Don't mind him...he's victim blaming.

Caquas · 23-07-2020 9:54pm

Bass Reeves wrote: »

It is not so much undermining the market but you have the pressure zone rules in play as well. If you discount rent by 20% it will take 7 years to achieve that rent level again if RPZ's stay in place.. Because of this I can understand a landlord reluctance to to reduce rents.

Add in the risk factor associated with renting and the present rules regarding evictions and risk to LL it may make more sense to leave it empty. If I had a place empty I consider revamping as there is tax relief on this until end of 2021 I think.

The law of unintended consequences strikes again! Rents will stay high in our cities because LLs know they will be fixed with the reduced rent for 7 years. Rents will fall only when LLs are convinced that they “good times” are over. Many will prefer to sell if they can.

23-07-2020 10:12pm

Caquas wrote: »

The law of unintended consequences strikes again! Rents will stay high in our cities because LLs know they will be fixed with the reduced rent for 7 years. Rents will fall only when LLs are convinced that they “good times” are over. Many will prefer to sell if they can.

Post hoc ergo propter hoc

beauf · 23-07-2020 11:35pm

if you had a place sitting empty at the moment. Would you take the risk on renting it with the current rules?

Bass Reeves · 23-07-2020 11:50pm

beauf wrote: »

if you had a place sitting empty at the moment. Would you take the risk on renting it with the current rules?

I would as long as Zi got an economic rent. O be slow to rent it if there was a large rent rate reduction

perfectkama · 24-07-2020 5:50am

beauf wrote: »

if you had a place sitting empty at the moment. Would you take the risk on renting it with the current rules?

no, wouldn't rent in the current climate

JimmyVik · 24-07-2020 7:28am

beauf wrote: »

if you had a place sitting empty at the moment. Would you take the risk on renting it with the current rules?

I actually know people who are leaving them empty while waiting to see what happens next.

6000 landlords a year existing the rental market

Comments