12 acres. Tree plan.

80sDiesel · 30-11-2018 7:14pm

Accidentally wrote: »

That'll keep you busy. Forgot to ask, what county are you in.

Sure will. The final lot will be 100 mix hazel( majority native but will have to have non-native fiberts/cobnuts for pollination), 25 scots pine and native apple trees.

West Waterford.

Have a couple of night vision motion detection cameras set up to see if any deer/rabbits/trespassers. Only 1 fox so far.

Chisler2 · 01-12-2018 6:00am

JJayoo wrote: »

Haven't noticed a difference between the two to be honest. One thing that has really helped is to prune off a lot of the branches and height when replanting, reduces the demand on the tree/roots in spring and stops the wind from loosening the tree.

All my trees are being planted in fields where sheep are grazed which is a pain as the bastards love to scratch against the trees and posts.

Had problems in the past with sheep and hares skining some trees. Painting on some emulsion stopped the hares. To stop the sheep I had to mix up some sheep sh11te and water and rub some on the bark. This is also how I stopped sheep jumping up to eat the leaves of my small apple trees. You only need a tiny about, imagine if you dipped a paint brush into the misture and flicked it at the tree a few times. It had no negative impact on the trees....except for having sh1it on the lol

PS never let a ram in with trees

I've never heard this before but your advice to use dilute sheep-pooh is interesting. My boundary walls are fieldstone. Heavier stocking by neighbouring sheepfarmers has led to their sheep knocking breaches in my walls which I am repairing bit by bit and at high cost as traditional stonemasons are hard to find. Nevertheless I cannot do the repairs fast enough and have been concerned the sheep would destroy the young trees.

As well as painting my whips with dilute sheep-pooh to keep the feckers (and rabbits, and hares) off, I will try brushing the solution on the neighbours' side of the walls as a deterrant. Worth a try and it will certainly cost less than post-and-wire fencing.

Chisler2 · 01-12-2018 6:08am

tabby aspreme wrote: »

For anybody planting on rough ground here's a picture of a slightly modified spade I use

Thanks for this useful advice. The taper and bar make sense for what I need to dig........stone, shale and rushes.

Accidentally · 01-12-2018 8:03am

80sDiesel wrote: »

Sure will. The final lot will be 200 mix hazel( majority native but will have to have non-native fiberts/cobnuts for pollination), some scots pine and native apple trees.

West Waterford.

Have a couple of night vision motion detection cameras set up to see if any deer/rabbits/trespassers. Only 1 fox so far.

Thanks. You should be able to grow just about anything in that part of the world.

I had hare damage when I first started, but funnily enough, they only snipped oak. Today you would see jays collecting acorns, foxes, pheasant, pine martins and the odd red squirrel. No greys, as I think the pine martins have eaten them or scared them to death.

When you talk about cobs for pollination, can you explain. I've stacks of hazel around here and it self seeds everywhere, probably with some help from the jays.

80sDiesel · 01-12-2018 2:22pm

Accidentally wrote: »

Thanks. You should be able to grow just about anything in that part of the world.

I had hare damage when I first started, but funnily enough, they only snipped oak. Today you would see jays collecting acorns, foxes, pheasant, pine martins and the odd red squirrel. No greys, as I think the pine martins have eaten them or scared them to death.

When you talk about cobs for pollination, can you explain. I've stacks of hazel around here and it self seeds everywhere, probably with some help from the jays.

Do they produce hazel nuts. I was led to believe that Hazel's need cross pollination ( ie it needs to cross breed ) in order to produce crop.

NSAman · 01-12-2018 2:30pm

Fantastic thread.

Nice that the OP has taken the time to do this. Hats off to you sir!

A friend here in the US had a small holding which he wanted to leave his grandchildren something when he passed as a legacy. He has planted 5000 Walnut trees, just to remember him by and also as a means of giving them something financially when he is no longer around.

80sDiesel · 01-12-2018 8:43pm

NSAman wrote: »

Fantastic thread.

Nice that the OP has taken the time to do this. Hats off to you sir!

A friend here in the US had a small holding which he wanted to leave his grandchildren something when he passed as a legacy. He has planted 5000 Walnut trees, just to remember him by and also as a means of giving them something financially when he is no longer around.

Thanks.

Accidentally · 02-12-2018 7:58am

80sDiesel wrote: »

Do they produce hazel nuts. I was led to believe that Hazel's need cross pollination ( ie it needs to cross breed ) in order to produce crop.

Hazels do need other hazels, but I've never seen any requirement for other related types of nut such as cobs.

This year was excellent for hazelnuts, and included first crops on hazels that I would have sown as nuts about 10 years back. Have some beehives this year as well, so that probably helped.

80sDiesel · 02-12-2018 3:19pm

Accidentally wrote: »

Hazels do need other hazels, but I've never seen any requirement for other related types of nut such as cobs.

This year was excellent for hazelnuts, and included first crops on hazels that I would have sown as nuts about 10 years back. Have some beehives this year as well, so that probably helped.

What kind of hazel trees do you have ? Some hazel trees don't need to cross pollinate but I believe Irish hazel does but will do more research.

Accidentally · 03-12-2018 4:54am

80sDiesel wrote: »

What kind of hazel trees do you have ? Some hazel trees don't need to cross pollinate but I believe Irish hazel does but will do more research.

All bog standard Irish hazel as far as I'm aware. Some of them have been through generations of coppicing and must be a hundred years old at least, so I doubt they're anything else.

80sDiesel · 05-12-2018 10:07pm

. thanks

80sDiesel · 08-12-2018 4:59pm

Amended my 2nd Order as i decided to plant more silver Birch

2nd Order

175 Alder. Will create an additional alder grove with the left over
75 D Birch. These will be used with the alder on the wetter boundaries
150 S Birch. They are such a nice tree so will use them now with the oak on the
drier boundary
50 Trembling Poplars
100 Robur Oak
16 W Cherry
16 C Apple
25 Scots Pine
6 Rowan Ash.
10 Goat willow from my own cuttings

Full Total 910.

Decided to leave the hazelnuts/Apple orchard for next year to make sure of where i want to put them.

Now is all i have to do is dig a few holes.

monseiur · 11-12-2018 4:14pm

I'm following this very interesting tread from the beginning. Just wondering - is there any particular reason that no one is planting Ash trees (Fraxinus) Ireland tallest native tree ? It would provide future generations with hurley sticks ! It's being imported at the moment due to a shortage caused by diseases etc.
M.

monseiur · 11-12-2018 4:34pm

Chisler2 wrote: »

Inspired by this thread and the OP's progress and would welcome help from the experienced people here.

First off..........I explored the route of getting a grant and having a forestry outfit plant. I decided to do this myself for full control without encumberances.

I am a townie retired to a 15-acre smallholding in Mayo so forgive my ignorance I am learning fast (I have to!!!) Last February I planted out 140 baby trees (rowan, willow, hazel, hawthorn, whitethorn, blackthorn, five heritage Irish species apple trees and a couple of crab-apple) during "The Beast From the East" using pickaxe and shovel. Btw I am 70 years old 5'0" woman with osteoarthritis in hands and feet so it took some doing.

You should consider getting in one or two Woffers in for a few weeks to plant your trees. You don't have to pay them - just provide living accommodation plus all meals. Almost all are young foreigners wanting to travel the world on the cheap so will work for their lodgings etc. Loads of info. on Google.
With your arthritis, working outdoors in our damp wet climate is not recommended.

Please, please, please in the interest of future generations, do not under any circumstances plant any hawthorn, whitethorn or blackthorn.
M.

Thud · 11-12-2018 4:45pm

monseiur wrote: »

Please, please, please in the interest of future generations, do not under any circumstances plant any hawthorn, whitethorn or blackthorn.
M.

what's your issue with them?

Melodeon · 11-12-2018 4:50pm

monseiur wrote: »

I'm following this very interesting tread from the beginning. Just wondering - is there any particular reason that no one is planting Ash trees (Fraxinus) Ireland tallest native tree ? It would provide future generations with hurley sticks ! It's being imported at the moment due to a shortage caused by diseases etc.
M.

That same fungal disease (Ash Dieback, as caused by Hymenoscyphus fraxineus) is now widespread here in Ireland, and the common ash (Fraxinus excelsior) is no longer supported or approved for any government schemes:
https://www.agriculture.gov.ie/forestservice/treediseases/ashdiebackchalara/

https://www.agriculture.gov.ie/forestservice/treediseases/ashdiebackchalara/#nonplantingash

Non planting of ash
In December 2012 the Department delisted ash as a tree species approved under the afforestation grant schemes and shortly thereafter delisted ash from the trees species approved under the agri-environment options scheme (AEOS, now GLAS). In 2013 the European Commission approved the Department's application to allow farmers participating in the current agri-environment schemes, who had concerns regarding ash plants planted under the schemes showing symptoms of Ash Dieback, to apply to remove the ash plants under force majeure. The National Roads Authority also agreed in 2013 to suspend the use of ash in any roadside/motorway plantings and since then it uses alternative species. Coillte also made a policy decision not to replant with ash.

It's probably a good time to invest in carbon-fibre hurley technology

Accidentally · 11-12-2018 7:42pm

monseiur wrote: »

Please, please, please in the interest of future generations, do not under any circumstances plant any hawthorn, whitethorn or blackthorn.
M.

I can fully understand Blackthorn, but what's your issue with Hawthorn(same as Whitethorn to me)?

80sDiesel · 12-12-2018 8:39pm

monseiur wrote: »

I'm following this very interesting tread from the beginning. Just wondering - is there any particular reason that no one is planting Ash trees (Fraxinus) Ireland tallest native tree ? It would provide future generations with hurley sticks ! It's being imported at the moment due to a shortage caused by diseases etc.
M.

Tnks. I would have loved to include Ash and Wynch Elm but at the most I am trying to establish a boundary. I do intend to plant some later on so if they don't survive it won't be such a setback.

This is the next stage I am looking forward to this summer.
Meadow Maker

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QFbhHHeSXvI

JJayoo · 12-12-2018 10:38pm

Blackthorn can be a nice tree if it's growing in a field that is being grazed by sheep. The sheep will eat the new shoots that spread from the roots and you will just be left with a nice 12/14 foot tree.

But if you have Blackthorn growing with no sheep to keep it in check it will spread and turn into a maze of thorns.

80sDiesel · 20-12-2018 5:30pm

Some Photos:

Trenching the trees. This keeps them all snug.

IMxRvdT_d.jpg?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium

Before

nJ6jtjb_d.jpg?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium

After

lrWphuZ_d.jpg?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium

My favourite trees for planting so far are the Oak , the worst are the Wild Cherries. Damn they have long roots.

I can plant 50 a day. Beyond that i found that my technique suffers and i rush it as the body begins to ache

.
So 150 odd done so far this week. ( Mix of Birch, Oak, Cherry, Crab Apple, Scots Pine )

Will swap over to the wetter fields for the next few days for a change where it will be mostly Alder and D Birch with the odd crab apple/cheery thrown in .

The weather is fantastic so far and the soil is nice and soft with no frost and just the odd light shower.

JJayoo · 20-12-2018 9:15pm

Prune the long roots

80sDiesel · 20-12-2018 9:30pm

JJayoo wrote: »

Prune the long roots

Cheers. Didn't know I could do that.

Thud · 21-12-2018 10:51am

Pics not showing for me

Melodeon · 21-12-2018 10:58am

Thud wrote: »

Pics not showing for me

Me neither

victor8600 · 21-12-2018 12:47pm

Melodeon wrote: »

Me neither

Not me ether. Are those private google drive pictures?

<img src="https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/....." border="0" alt="">

Melodeon · 21-12-2018 2:15pm

Yep, some sort of enormous Google link:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/otVPXFdwi59AlsL5FwVOPa1-TzG8hbrV6ZiCvp84F6zA2H_U_c_bPN1HtqmCxfZFxH7dkTilEcKS_B2ezlHQYrwe_hFKDWKslr7QPSwUgeOMoXlGmcr1WGQSeMMBl6rDegOujpfp0IDoa8uaadaH0NzNoKJZkSJALqtYT1J5j80wBYxK_Rgi-6cAVnsl-HL8OBeYYlSmEoZS7vBsWV4thZOcoqmf9lP6Jbm9o-myLQuBF_I6JC-_kReapSoaa9IMIoInycSyZBp6K5PbpQ-GJeiTMXvFy6mmxIytCN2OzmxbMgK5BjJZqfHyupMe7jJ1-39fCDFcK1RW1Rn_kLVn5adY7inx4Nv1QWbWfkF9Hiy7AsO9W0VulimuVRKktjF9C3ZT25eBdb0sFMjEug7ldkZWjDta1wiRuVGwo-1ithyYOF4esaeefi9cUHe5cJ4T-GejBg3z-y_JKvT9dVtTsF2IhQWscu13gIy-VKXmsvP6MJ_aDRoYuL_6fsDhZypem0ZsyZt7pP4CCdgyAhvH5NiVbqrAF4ZD83CwSMbVx0lUQsCP6lsz_9HmS6kxe4cEh152E5wmOR7eODOJ0GvEis3bs_kaIw=s814-w814-h610-no

80sDiesel · 21-12-2018 6:51pm

Checked and seems to be a problem with Google photo links. Will use a different host...

Should be fixed .

Planted 70 Alder today.
Tomorrow is the day i have been most looking forward to.
Going to plant the trembling poplars. Finally figured out where to put them

greysides · 21-12-2018 8:53pm

Just read all through this. Very interesting so keep us informed as time passes please. It's a project that I wouldn't mind being able to do myself.

80sDiesel · 21-12-2018 9:58pm

greysides wrote: »

Just read all through this. Very interesting so keep us informed as time passes please. It's a project that I wouldn't mind being able to do myself.

Will do.

Accidentally · 22-12-2018 8:17am

80sDiesel wrote: »

Some Photos:

Trenching the trees. This keeps them all snug.

Before

After

My favourite trees for planting so far are the Oak , the worst are the Wild Cherries. Damn they have long roots.

I can plant 50 a day. Beyond that i found that my technique suffers and i rush it as the body begins to ache .
So 150 odd done so far this week. ( Mix of Birch, Oak, Cherry, Crab Apple, Scots Pine )

Will swap over to the wetter fields for the next few days for a change where it will be mostly Alder and D Birch with the odd crab apple/cheery thrown in .

The weather is fantastic so far and the soil is nice and soft with no frost and just the odd light shower.

You're doing a lovely job, but you really don't need to dig a big hole for each tree. Bare root will be quite happy with slit planting, either in a T shape, or just a wedge cut with a spade. You'll get through hundreds in no time, and the results will be exactly the same.

12 acres. Tree plan.

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