DART+ (DART Expansion)

dowlingm · 22-12-2009 5:51pm

The 2600s are cleared on Howth so they could take over the shuttle if there were no safety issues with retaining the connection so that they could run to Drogheda for service.

Looking at the area between Howth J and Grange Road there doesn't seem to be any protection for 4 tracking - houses right up against the alignment. Sadly Bing runs out at that point so have to rely on the sat rather than the aerial shots.

murphaph · 22-12-2009 11:43pm

The OSI website has aerial imagery from 2005 for the whole country, if that's any use.

dowlingm · 23-12-2009 5:35am

Already had a look but the resolution is about the same.

Cool Mo D · 29-12-2009 3:46pm

dowlingm wrote: »

Already had a look but the resolution is about the same.

The simplest way might be to electrify the entire Dublin - Belfast line, which would probably be viable, as there are intercity and commuter trains running nearly the whole length of it. Then a single bore, dual track tunnel could be built from Connolly to Grange road, for intercity and express trains. This would not need to be even close to the cost of the interconnector, or metro north, as there would be no stations, and only a single bore. It would be comparable to half the port tunnel. But it would require an electric enterprise, or a much more expensive tunnel, with ventilation for diesel trains would be required - prob not a cost effective option.

Eventually, quad track to Drogheda is what is needed, as the enterprise is would be very badly hampered by Northern commuter trains between Drogheda and Dublin, if they were increased in frequency.

And, on an off-topic point, I seem to remember IE promising express, non-stop morning and evening enterprise services a few years ago - 90 minutes non-stop. Has anyone heard more about this?

Chris_533976 · 29-12-2009 7:20pm

Absolutely awful report on RTE 601 tonight about this, pandering solely to the NIMBYism of the Inchicore residents and saying nothing AT ALL about the benefits of this. The Inchicore residents want another public inquiry.

ilovegermany · 30-12-2009 11:31am

murphaph wrote: »

It's already identified for 4 tracking. IE are idiots but they aren't about to build a billion+ euro tunnel and 4 track to within a few hundred yards of it. They know 100% that 4 tracking all the way into the tunnel is what's going to happen.

I'll eat my hat if the Interconnector doesn't open with 2 dedicated DART tracks all the way from Hazelhatch, throught he tunnel to Spencer Dock. After that who knows.

I'm still worried that when we look at those application drawings next year there will still be a mile of 4 track missing past Inchicore - why didnt they just include this when they were extending the tunnel out to Inchicore in the first place?

Re: impact on the Northern Line - I remember being at a public consultation in April 2009 for the Interconnector and when i asked how it would impact on the Enterprise Service to Belfast I was told that it would have "no discernable impact at all due to better signalling".
Give me a break!!!

miss no stars · 01-01-2010 10:01pm

Aard wrote: »

I have often thought of the viability of the Howth branch. Would it be possible to have a shuttle service from HJ/D to Howth, just going back and forth with no contact with the mainline? Last time I took the Dart there, the train was quite empty.

dowlingm wrote: »

A busway with artic buses would probably do fine, or LUASification at a pinch. Howth Stn catchment is 50% water 40% golf course FFS.

If MetroWest was converted to LUASWest (as it should be) the Howth alignment could be its eastern terminus after a run through Coolock and over/under the Northern Line.

Obviously neither of you have been on the dart to/from Howth at rush hour so!
I'd say that in the mornings the trains are about a third full before they even leave Howth.

Now someone PLEASE tell me why they can't have every second dart going on the usual track and every second dart going on the proposed line? Because as I see it, sitting here in Howth, I won't be able to get to Connolly or Tara without a transfer or backtracking. What about the (literally) hundreds of kids in the morning that get the dart into Connolly and Tara to get to Belvedere and get off at Connolly or Tara? What if, god forbid, I might actually want to go to the north side of the city centre? Why should I have to go to the southside first and trek all the way over or change darts, or go all the way out to the docklands and somehow get in from there? There are much better alternatives that could have been explored. For instance, why not send a tunnel under Connolly? OR!!! Why not (wait for it!!!!!) Stop having trains (commuter mostly) sitting around in Connolly in excess of 60 seconds?

murphaph · 01-01-2010 10:32pm

miss no stars wrote: »

Obviously neither of you have been on the dart to/from Howth at rush hour so!
I'd say that in the mornings the trains are about a third full before they even leave Howth.

Now someone PLEASE tell me why they can't have every second dart going on the usual track and every second dart going on the proposed line? Because as I see it, sitting here in Howth, I won't be able to get to Connolly or Tara without a transfer or backtracking. What about the (literally) hundreds of kids in the morning that get the dart into Connolly and Tara to get to Belvedere and get off at Connolly or Tara? What if, god forbid, I might actually want to go to the north side of the city centre? Why should I have to go to the southside first and trek all the way over or change darts, or go all the way out to the docklands and somehow get in from there? There are much better alternatives that could have been explored. For instance, why not send a tunnel under Connolly? OR!!! Why not (wait for it!!!!!) Stop having trains (commuter mostly) sitting around in Connolly in excess of 60 seconds?

Many more folks will benefit from the Interconnector than the tiny minority it will inconvenience. Backtracking to Tara (one stop FFS, talk about exaggerating) or Connoly is what happens in any developed network every day right across Europe. Most people coming in from the Northside will be delighted to be dropped directly at St. Stephen's Green tbh, with direct onward connection to Sandyford etc. I will be surprised if your average commute is longer with the Interconnector as it will eliminate conflicts (and thus delays) from the network on a massive scale.

My bold btw. Think bigger picture, for the greater good and can the me me me approach to Infrastructural and service planning. It's this sort of tripe that has paralysed Ireland for decades as it is. Networks only function because people have to wait for it, change train/bus/tram etc.

Aard · 02-01-2010 3:03am

@Miss no stars:

Your proposal is a case of the needs of the few outweighing the needs of the many. Do you think that's fair?

D.L.R. · 03-01-2010 2:25am

On that note, I've always thought a station at Ossory Jn would be useful. Seems a waste of a major junction not to have a station there.

L1011 · 03-01-2010 2:50am

D.L.R. wrote: »

On that note, I've always thought a station at Ossory Jn would be useful. Seems a waste of a major junction not to have a station there.

Where is that? I'm trying to think of junctions in Dublin and the only one I can think of with any proper traffic at it is Glasnevin... other than Howth and Connolly itself!

Aard · 03-01-2010 12:21pm

Ossory Jctn is, afaik, the flyover junction immediately north of Connolly.

I'd think it's too close to Connolly. Perhaps further out - on the Ballybough Road?

D.L.R. · 03-01-2010 3:27pm

Yeah thats it. About the same distance from Connolly to Tara St, and further than Tara-Pearse. Given that the two dart lines will come within 100m of each other at this point, its got merit. Ballybough also has merit, but it misses the interchange value.

Aard · 03-01-2010 10:43pm

If it's purely for interchange-purposes, then Pearse isn't too far away. Would building a new station on the junction be worth it?

murphaph · 03-01-2010 11:32pm

Aard wrote: »

If it's purely for interchange-purposes, then Pearse isn't too far away. Would building a new station on the junction be worth it?

Eventually I'd say it would be. The Interconnector is going to force the hand of a lot more investment in the rail network (if it ever gets built) than anything we've seen before. Once the public sees the bones of a network they'll start demanding more. A northern interchange between the two DART lines at Ossory Road was on the original PFC plans IIRC, and would make eminent sense down the road. The new DART network will radically change how people view mass transit in Dublin and will ultimately lead to people making commutes they'd never dream about today.

spacetweek · 05-01-2010 8:07pm

murphaph wrote: »

Eventually I'd say it would be. The Interconnector is going to force the hand of a lot more investment in the rail network (if it ever gets built) than anything we've seen before. Once the public sees the bones of a network they'll start demanding more. A northern interchange between the two DART lines at Ossory Road was on the original PFC plans IIRC, and would make eminent sense down the road. The new DART network will radically change how people view mass transit in Dublin and will ultimately lead to people making commutes they'd never dream about today.

This is correct; it was called East Wall I believe.

I agree it might be a good idea, but in the long term only. Don't want to unnecessarily waste people's time adding stations that mightn't be needed.

When the new infrastructures are in place, we can see how the network beds down and whether there is a need for a second DART crossover.

Empire o de Sun · 19-01-2010 9:56pm

I think that more train stations would be viable on the Maynooth line closer to the city centre once the Dart is separated into Dart 1 and Dart 2, and the Metro is built.

A station for East Wall / North Strand would be deadly.

And also could the Luas be extended to East point and then to Clontarf maybe?

Dublin Metro.png

L1011 · 19-01-2010 9:58pm

Outside of the city the Maynooth line runs through open countryside most of the way (due to fantastic planning), a Lucan North station would make sense if they'd push the future building of the town that way though.

dowlingm · 20-01-2010 3:14am

How much scope is there for adding passing tracks on the Maynooth line to allow expresses to pass stoppers at these extra stations?

L1011 · 20-01-2010 12:47pm

dowlingm wrote: »

How much scope is there for adding passing tracks on the Maynooth line to allow expresses to pass stoppers at these extra stations?

Limited. In the city its elevated for part, and built up to when not elevated.

Out of the city it has the canal along one side for most of the way, and roads the other side at times. However, cause its just Sligo trains that are express on the line since the 1980s when Galway trains were re-routed to Heuston its not as pressing an issue as on Kildare or the Northern line.

You could add a decent enough passing loop between Leixlip and Maynooth I'd expect but this is so close to one end of the shared zone you may as well pass in a station...

Cool Mo D · 20-01-2010 1:11pm

MYOB wrote: »

Limited. In the city its elevated for part, and built up to when not elevated.

Out of the city it has the canal along one side for most of the way, and roads the other side at times. However, cause its just Sligo trains that are express on the line since the 1980s when Galway trains were re-routed to Heuston its not as pressing an issue as on Kildare or the Northern line.

You could add a decent enough passing loop between Leixlip and Maynooth I'd expect but this is so close to one end of the shared zone you may as well pass in a station...

However, fast trains could travel along the canal, rather than through Drumcondra, which would free up capacity between Glasnevin and the city centre.
The disadvantage is that they would have to terminate at Docklands station, rather than Connolly, as that particular line would have to cross the Dart and Maynooth line to get into Connolly's terminus platforms, causing lots of disruption.

Although, looking at the Goole map, it looks like there's room to construct a new approach from that line to Connolly that would not have to cross the DART. This might have been a better idea then building Docklands station...

murphaph · 20-01-2010 1:22pm

Cool Mo D wrote: »

However, fast trains could travel along the canal, rather than through Drumcondra, which would free up capacity between Glasnevin and the city centre.
The disadvantage is that they would have to terminate at Docklands station, rather than Connolly, as that particular line would have to cross the Dart and Maynooth line to get into Connolly's terminus platforms, causing lots of disruption.

Although, looking at the Goole map, it looks like there's room to construct a new approach from that line to Connolly that would not have to cross the DART. This might have been a better idea then building Docklands station...

I don't see the problem with terminating Intercity services in Docklands (if it still exists) or simply building 2 platforms where the Midland Line (the one beside the canal) crosses under the tracks that head north out of connolly and a lift/escalator and walkway up to the other Connolly platforms (ca. 400m walk). That would be a shorter interchange than some interchanges in Berlin and London, so no problem really.

I would definitely strive to remove IC services from as much of the DART line as possible. A passing loop could easily be constructed between the old Lucan North station and Clonsilla too, or even a bit further east as there's still no development on the south side of the line (the canal is to the north of the railway here), just fields. It's almost Coolmine before the development is encroaching so far that a passing loop couldn't be added.

spacetweek · 20-01-2010 4:09pm

MYOB wrote: »

a Lucan North station would make sense if they'd push the future building of the town that way though.

I grew up in Lucan, this wouldn't be a good idea. Lots of new bridges would be needed and the land all along the Liffey is parks or privately owned. The Lucan Bypass with its continuous buslanes and future DART to the south should be enough, if they only get moving on better bus services and expediting the DART.

Hungerford · 24-01-2010 12:18pm

Cool Mo D wrote: »

Although, looking at the Goole map, it looks like there's room to construct a new approach from that line to Connolly that would not have to cross the DART. This might have been a better idea then building Docklands station...

If you are referring to what I think you are, that's the site of the existing Newcommen Junction, which is extremely steep and has to have a special mechanical bridge to allow navigation on the canal.

Victor · 25-01-2010 3:06am

Hungerford wrote: »

If you are referring to what I think you are, that's the site of the existing Newcommen Junction, which is extremely steep and has to have a special mechanical bridge to allow navigation on the canal.

Not a problem for trains going downhill.

murphaph · 25-01-2010 9:53am

Victor wrote: »

Not a problem for trains going downhill.

Maybe that was tongue in cheek, as I'm sure you're aware it would be no use if it only allowed trains to go one way.

In seriousness however, I think the lighter weight of an EMU
as compared to a DMU should easily enable it to climb that curve, so could the DART line not be routed along the Midland line (shorter route) and climb up the Newcommen curve into P6/7 and let intercity and outer suburban services to go via Drumcondra and terminate in Connolly shed?

I have to say, EMUs in Berlin seem to be able to cope with extremely severe gradients, like Newcommen Curve, everyday with ease. The canal navigation can be sorted with a lock that drops boats under the railway if needed, although navigation along the canal here hardly requires more that this bridge affair at is so rarely lifted.

Victor · 25-01-2010 10:18am

If the Midland line is used for westbound traffic (with an extra platform at Drumcondra and where ever else) and the upper line for eastbound traffic it cuts out a certain amount of messing.

The canal is rarely used and given it is tidal at that point, putting a lock under it would be interesting

.

csd · 25-01-2010 11:08am

Victor wrote: »

The canal is rarely used and given it is tidal at that point, putting a lock under it would be interesting .

A tidal canal??

The attached picture shows the area under discussion. I happened to come across a bridge lift in progress in May 2003 and had my camera on me.

/csd

Road-Hog · 09-02-2010 9:45am

According to the link below, CIE will be seeking tenders later this year for a DBO/PPP type contract to design and build about 16km of underground dart line, its anyones guess as to when it might start though, could be 2015 or later before we see any tunnel boring machines in operation

http://www.etenders.gov.ie/search/show/search_view.aspx?ID=FEB140989

murphaph · 09-02-2010 11:43am

Victor wrote: »

If the Midland line is used for westbound traffic (with an extra platform at Drumcondra and where ever else) and the upper line for eastbound traffic it cuts out a certain amount of messing.

The canal is rarely used and given it is tidal at that point, putting a lock under it would be interesting .

I think the idea of running on separate lines is a bit messy tbh (for example I hate the proposal to extend the Luas along 2 parallel streets (O'Connell and Marlborough) but could probably work somehow.

I think the canal is only tidal because Spencer Dock lock is busted and left permanently open, but the plan is to repair that lock.

munchkin_utd · 10-02-2010 9:56am

THE PROPOSED “Dart Underground” line linking Heuston Station with Spencer Dock took a step closer to reality yesterday when Iarnród Éireann flagged it in the EU’s Official Journal.

Describing the notice as the first phase “in what is set to be a year of major significance in the development of Dart Underground”, the rail company stated that an application for a Railway Order for the project is due to be lodged next month.

Dart Underground is to be procured as a public private partnership (PPP) project, and the publication of an indicative notice outlining its scope and duration is the first stage of a competitive process to select a private sector partner.

... ... ... ... ...

Twin tunnels, each containing a single track, will be excavated at an average depth of 24m (nearly 80ft) below ground level. The tunnel entrances will be at Inchicore and in the Docklands.

The project would facilitate two high-capacity Dart lines, proposed as Drogheda/Howth to Hazelhatch and Maynooth to Greystones. Dart trains on the northern line would bypass Connolly Station, enter the tunnel at Docklands and emerge at Inchicore. Iarnród Éireann said this would free up Connolly Station, currently a major bottleneck, and facilitate a new high-frequency Dart line “with greatly increased capacity from Maynooth through Connolly and all the way to Greystones”.

With trains operating “up to every three minutes”, it said the project — a key element of Transport 21 — “will complete the transformation of the Greater Dublin Area’s rail service capacity from 33 million passenger journeys annually now to over 100 million passenger journeys.”

Iarnród Éireann said it intended to publish a contract notice in the EU’s Official Journal in the second quarter of 2010, which would set out a process to “pre-qualify” potential private partners who would be invited to tender.
.... ..... .....

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/0210/1224264112195.html

Good to see progress being made in the planning of the thing with the Railway Order due next month and tendering process moving forward later in the year.

I'd also see it as positive that the article makes a compelling case for why this is needed and what it DOES for the travelling punter in Dublin.
Until recently it was seen as a random 1billion Euro Tunnel parallel to the Heuston Connolly Luas, it was the "interconnector".
Now its being marketed correctly as the central plank of a bigger plan, in bringing the Dart to Maynooth and Kildare and trippling the number of passengers using the Dart.
It was no good just stating plainly that it is needed without elaborating much. You need to convince people as to WHY it is, and thats now happening with every press release.

Zebra3 · 11-02-2010 10:48am

murphaph wrote: »

Maybe that was tongue in cheek, as I'm sure you're aware it would be no use if it only allowed trains to go one way.

In seriousness however, I think the lighter weight of an EMU
as compared to a DMU should easily enable it to climb that curve, so could the DART line not be routed along the Midland line (shorter route) and climb up the Newcommen curve into P6/7 and let intercity and outer suburban services to go via Drumcondra and terminate in Connolly shed?

I have to say, EMUs in Berlin seem to be able to cope with extremely severe gradients, like Newcommen Curve, everyday with ease. The canal navigation can be sorted with a lock that drops boats under the railway if needed, although navigation along the canal here hardly requires more that this bridge affair at is so rarely lifted.

You wanna take the Maynooth DART line out of Drumcondra? :eek:

Victor · 11-02-2010 11:02am

Zebra3 wrote: »

You wanna take the Maynooth DART line out of Drumcondra? :eek:

Well Dr. Lynch is already promising an extra stop to serve the Mater.

Sponge Bob · 11-02-2010 7:51pm

They still have not sorted out the missing link west of Kylemore road

TED has this

http://ted.europa.eu/Exec?DataFlow=N_list_results.dfl&Template=TED/N_result_details_curr.htm&Page=1&docnumber=2010037471&StatLang=EN

SECTION I: CONTRACTING ENTITY
I.1) NAME, ADDRESSES AND CONTACT POINT(S): Coras Iompair Eireann, DART Underground Project Office, Heuston Station, Contact: DART Underground Project, Attn: Colm Reynolds, Dublin 8, IRELAND. Tel. +353 18585612. E-mail: dartundergroundprocurement@irishrail.ie.
Internet address(es):
General address of the contracting entity: http://www.cie.ie.
Address of the buyer profile: http://www.irishrail.ie/dartunderground.
Further information can be obtained at: As in above-mentioned contact point(s).

I.2) MAIN ACTIVITY OR ACTIVITIES OF THE CONTRACTING ENTITY: Railway services
Urban railway, tramway, trolleybus or bus services.

SECTION II: OBJECT OF THE CONTRACT
II.1) TITLE ATTRIBUTED TO THE CONTRACT BY THE CONTRACTING ENTITY: DART Underground Project.

II.2) TYPE OF CONTRACT: Works.

II.3) SHORT DESCRIPTION OF THE CONTRACT OR PURCHASE(S): The purpose of this notice is to inform interested parties that the DART underground project, which will be delivered as a public private partnership project, will commence its formal procurement process, through the publication of a Contract Notice during the second quarter of 2010. The Project will require some or all of the following works, supplies or services including all related works, services and supplies:
Design, construction, integration, commissioning, testing, financing, bringing into service and maintenance of the DART Underground and the operation of the DART underground and related facilities.
Additionally, market consultations are being conducted on the scope of the contract to be procured and interested parties are now invited to register their interest following which they will be issued the DART underground market consultation brochure including a questionnaire for completion and return by the 4th March.
DART underground is approximately 8.6km in length, running from East Wall Junction, which is south of Clontarf Road Station on the northern line, to a new station at Inchicore via approximately 7.6km of twin running tunnels constructed for the most part in limestone rock at an average depth of 24 meters. There will be five underground stations at:
— Docklands - this will facilitate an interchange with the Luas Red Line at Spencer Dock and will serve the International Financial Services Centre,
— Pearse - this will provide an interchange with DART services from Maynooth/ Dunboyne to Bray/ Greystones, existing mainline Intercity and Commuter services and Dublin Bus services,
— St Stephen’s Green - this will provide an interchange with Metro North, the Luas Green Line and Dublin bus services,
— Christchurch; and,
— Heuston for interchange with mainline Intercity and Commuter services, Luas Red Line and Dublin Bus services.
A turn-back facility will be provided at a surface station at Inchicore Station.
DART underground will have the capability and capacity to run DART services of 20 trains per hour in each direction. The journey time between East Wall Junction and Inchicore Station will be approximately 14 minutes and the journey time from Docklands to Heuston Station will be approximately 8 minutes. The DART Underground will form part of the national heavy rail network and consequently, systems and operational interfaces will be required. It is important to note that the provision of rolling stock will not form part of this contract.
It is anticipated that the qualification process will commence with the publication of the OJEU Notice in the second quarter of 2010 which will result in the establishment of a list of qualified candidates who will be invited to participate in negotiations leading to the award of the contract. At this stage, it is envisaged that the contract will be for a period of between 25 and 35 years including the design and construction period.

II.4) COMMON PROCUREMENT VOCABULARY (CPV): 45234122, 66122000, 45234000, 45234100, 45234111, 45234124, 50225000.

II.5) SCHEDULED DATE FOR AWARD PROCEDURES AND DURATION OF THE CONTRACT:
II.6) ESTIMATED COST AND MAIN TERMS OF FINANCING:
II.6.1) Initial estimated cost:
II.6.2) Main financing conditions and payment arrangements and/or reference to the relevant provisions governing them: It is currently anticipated that the project will proceed as a public private partnership with financing conditions set out in the tender documents.

II.7) CONTRACT COVERED BY THE GOVERNMENT PROCUREMENT AGREEMENT (GPA): Yes.

II.8) ADDITIONAL INFORMATION: It is currently anticipated that the award procedure will commence in the second quarter of 2010.
Interested parties are invited to register their interest, by email, to dartundergroundprocurement@irishrail.ie and they will be issued the DART underground market consultation brochure including Questionnaire. The purpose of this questionnaire is to obtain input from interested parties into the scope of the contract and the procurement process. Questionaires are requested to be answered and returned before the 4.3.2010.
Please note that the procurement process for the DART Underground will be conducted entirely in english.

SECTION VI: COMPLEMENTARY INFORMATION
VI.1) CONTRACTS RELATED TO A PROJECT AND/OR PROGRAMME FINANCED BY EU FUNDS: No.

VI.2) ADDITIONAL INFORMATION:
VI.3) ESTIMATED TOTAL VALUE OF SUPPLIES OR SERVICES CONTRACT(S):
VI.4) DATE OF DISPATCH OF THIS NOTICE: 4.2.2010.

munchkin_utd · 24-02-2010 10:16am

The residents of the railway estate in Inchicore are not happy about the main tunneling access point being right on their doorstep.

The Irish Times - Wednesday, February 24, 2010
Opposition to Inchicore Dart plan
FRANK McDONALD Environment Editor

RESIDENTS OF the historic Railway Estate in Inchicore, Dublin, claimed yesterday they were being “railroaded” by Iarnród Éireann’s plan for a Dart underground link between Heuston station and the Docklands area.

John Beck, chairman of Inchicore on Track, the residents’ new campaign group, said the plan – to cost €2 billion – was being “pushed through without any proper consultation”.

“The Iarnród Éireann plan will see the heritage estate, ironically built for railway workers in the 1840s, turned into Dublin’s largest 24-hour a day construction site. At its centre there will be a hole the size of a football pitch,” he said.

Inchicore on Track commissioned London-based tunnelling consultants OTB Engineering to review the proposal, which would involve excavating the local football pitch to provide an entry point for the tunnel boring machines.

The report recommends relocating the construction works a few hundred metres to an Iarnród Éireann works site, saying it would be “completely unreasonable” for the construction to be carried out in a residential area.

A spokesman for Iarnród Éireann said the site for the tunnel portal in Inchicore had been selected to avoid demolition of any houses, that the construction work would be temporary, and that local people would benefit from having a new station.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/0224/1224265093538.html

I presume here is the location for the start of the tunnell? Is it?
http://maps.google.de/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=inchicore+parade&sll=53.340707,-6.324885&sspn=0.002191,0.004737&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Inchicore+Parade,+Dublin,+County+Dublin+City,+Ireland&ll=53.340617,-6.325164&spn=0.004382,0.009474&t=h&z=17

Theta · 24-02-2010 12:56pm

Yeah that is the location of the inichore works just to the left of your marker. Most of it is in the slow process of being vacaited I think.

Are there any other objections apart from the loss of the football field for a year? There are at least 3 pitches there?

munchkin_utd · 24-02-2010 1:37pm

it seems that the residents are concerned about a lack of information and other environmental impacts like dust levels and noise pollution.

or more specifically....

"The current proposed location of the portal construction site in the heart of a residential area is unacceptable because we think it would have an invasive, disruptive and detrimental impact on the Inchicore Estate and the lives and health of its people during the construction and operational phases. A residential area is simply not suitable to host work of this scale and duration. This is compounded by the loss of amenities and green areas for local residents, sports clubs and school. The quality of life of the residents would be severely compromised for a period in excess of 5 years".

We will be notifying our public representatives of this information immediately but we would strongly urge all residents to take it on themselves to use this information and let all their public representatives know the depth of their concerns. They should ask the public reps to make good on their promises of support.

Latest info....

DURING CONSTRUCTION:

Construction site would be working 24 hours a day. 20 hours of significant plant movement and 4 hours of maintenance.

The construction site would be lit to the levels of the Con Colbert road junction.

There would be up to 140 large lorry movements each day on the site. That's one HGV every 3-4 minutes during peak construction.

This works compound would be in use for 3.5 years minimum.

The hoarding around the compound would be about 6 metres (20 feet) high.

The digging of the hole for the TBMs would be done by heavy machinery, and spoil would be removed by truck up along Inchicore Parade and out through the back of the works.

The TBMs would be assembled in the compound – the machines are about as long as St Patrick’s Terrace (x2). This assembly would take 3 months of 24 hr day working.

The TBM (tunnel boring machines) are now only going to Heuston from Inchicore, and they envisage that this would take approx nine months.

Cut and cover construction between SGV and St Patricks Terrace would be normal builders hours (all day Mon-Fri, half day Saturday).

This cut and cover works to facilitate the site entrance would take approximately one year.

During this time there would be large drilling machinery, 50 trucks a day, 12/18 concrete wagons a day, 2 reinforced steel trucks each day – plus all the associated noise/personnel etc.

There would be around 400 personnel working in the compound with associated parking, noise etc.

http://www.inchicore.info/news/view/57/
http://www.inchicore.info/news/view/66/

Theta · 24-02-2010 2:44pm

What does the line " The TBM (tunnel boring machines) are now only going to Heuston from Inchicore" mean? They will be going from Inchicore to docklands no? or is there TMB's going from docklands to Hueston?

GerardKeating · 24-02-2010 2:57pm

Theta wrote: »

What does the line " The TBM (tunnel boring machines) are now only going to Heuston from Inchicore" mean? They will be going from Inchicore to docklands no? or is there TMB's going from docklands to Hueston?

Maybe there is another starting at Docklands and they meet at Heuston ?

The residents complain of 50 trucks a day to take the spoil away, if only there was another way, like rail ???

KevR · 24-02-2010 3:53pm

I thought they said they could take the bulk of it away by rail? Isn't that one of the reasons it's terminating at Inchicore - so they can remove a lot of the spoil by rail.

I'm nearly sure I read something along those lines, although am not certain and am open to correction.

bg07 · 24-02-2010 4:16pm

KevR wrote: »

I thought they said they could take the bulk of it away by rail? Isn't that one of the reasons it's terminating at Inchicore - so they can remove a lot of the spoil by rail.

I'm nearly sure I read something along those lines, although am not certain and am open to correction.

It says in here:-
http://www.irishrail.ie/news_centre/general_news.asp?action=view&news_id=641

Irish Rail Press Release wrote:

There is potential for more than 75% of the spoil to be removed by rail.

Someone on boards said that this is what these wagons are for:-

http://www.etenders.gov.ie/search/show/search_view.aspx?ID=JAN140196&catID=22

munchkin_utd · 24-02-2010 4:35pm

KevR wrote: »

I thought they said they could take the bulk of it away by rail? Isn't that one of the reasons it's terminating at Inchicore - so they can remove a lot of the spoil by rail.

I'm nearly sure I read something along those lines, although am not certain and am open to correction.

Maybe they could send it over to the ennis line to shore up/ raise the bit that keeps flooding!!!!

yermanoffthetv · 26-02-2010 10:48pm

munchkin_utd wrote: »

Maybe they could send it over to the ennis line to shore up/ raise the bit that keeps flooding!!!!

Thats not a half bad idea. There saying that is not really economically feasable to raise up the Ennis line any more so maybe they could use it to create some kind of embankment barrier or something? I dunno, just a thought.

BluntGuy · 03-03-2010 7:18pm

Some new schematics/drawings here:

http://www.irishrail.ie/projects/dart_underground_documents.asp

Sponge Bob · 03-03-2010 7:40pm

BluntGuy wrote: »

Some new schematics/drawings here:

http://www.irishrail.ie/projects/dart_underground_documents.asp

Nope , that is the last batch from 23 November and with the missing link west of Kylemore Road still missing.

BluntGuy · 03-03-2010 7:52pm

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Nope , that is the last batch from 23 November and with the missing link west of Kylemore Road still missing.

Most of those were there last November, but there's a couple of new ones showing station entrances and tunnel profiles I don't recall seeing there.

The docklands station seems to be well-integrated with Luas, I must admit.

bg07 · 04-03-2010 1:34pm

Irish Times wrote:

Dart Underground's economic benefit 'will far outweigh costs'
TIM O'BRIEN

THE BENEFITS of Dublin’s proposed “Dart Underground” outweigh the costs by more than two to one, according a new economic appraisal from London-based consultants Colin Buchanan.

A €2 billion proposal to link Docklands Station with Heuston via Pearse Street and Christchurch, Dart Underground is intended to provide for a reorganisation of Dublin suburban services with trains running from Greystones to Maynooth and from Hazelhatch to Balbriggan or Drogheda.

Making a presentation on the economic advantages of public transport investment to a breakfast meeting in Dublin yesterday, Paul Buchanan, of Colin Buchanan, said high-density cities had a high pay-off for the environment and economy and were more productive as employers had access to a greater pool of workers, while innovation always increased.

He said “Dublin without a strong commercial centre will not deliver the growth Ireland needs” and maintained good public transport was the key to creating one. His company’s analysis for Iarnród Éireann had found Dart Underground would be “immensely” beneficial in creating the strong commercial centre.

“Quite apart from tying together Dublin’s two growth areas for high density, Docklands and Heuston,” he said, Dart Underground would “sweat” the rail company’s assets, making much better use of investment in track and trains.

“It brings rail-based public transport right through the central business district (CBD). This is much better than passing beside the CBD as happens at present,” he told The Irish Times.

Mr Buchanan said his firm’s analysis was that investment made in Dart Underground would return a benefit about 2.5 times greater than the cost.
He made his presentation at a breakfast briefing organised by Dublin Chamber of Commerce and hosted by corporate lawyers Byrne Wallace.

Iarnród Éireann said it welcomed comments on Dart Underground which, a spokesman said, “demonstrated the crucial value of an integrated transport system” which, he added, would being economic benefits to the entire city region.

Link

I suppose a report paid for by Irish Rail is hardly going to say other wise. Interesting all the same.

BluntGuy · 08-03-2010 2:26am

For some time this map of the proposed Greater Dublin transport area has been floating around (click for full size):

Well it's become obvious at this stage that isn't going to happen, so I tried to produce a more realistic one, with the powers of photoshop (again, click for full size):

Might come in handy, I dunno. Boredom does this to you sometimes.

Aard · 08-03-2010 5:46am

Lol, "Luas North"!

dowlingm · 08-03-2010 8:22pm

I'm in favour of MetroWest being changed to LUAS-width rather than binned. It seems to me that the likely traffic counts can be handled by 30 or 40m LRVs and it adds resiliency to Lines A, D and F by providing an interlink between them to allow inter-line vehicle transfer and emergency depot space in the event of a disruption to one of the other depots - plus MetroWest won't be full grade separated as I understand making the distinction with LUAS pointless. So I'd at least build from Belgard to Blanchardstown and see how that goes, and enforce on IE the ability to use LUASWest to transfer between Maynooth, Pace and Kildare Line services.

As for MetroNorth, I'm okay with the distinction between a high frequency grade separated service and LUAS. It would have made more sense using DART cars with automatic train control. The 8500 series 2-car DART sets could have been sold to the winning consortium to be refitted as part of the mid-life update they'll need anyway and replaced with 4-car sets as part of the Interconnector order required to bring the Maynooth and Hazelhatch sections to electric.

DART+ (DART Expansion)

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