VW disable start/stop eco stupidity

Doltanian · 20-03-2018 8:23pm #1

I am driving a VW and I've heard that you can get the start-stop eco stupidity permanently switched off. I've been using the switch and I just switch off each time I start the car but I'd like to get it permanently disabled. Its a pain at traffic lights or roundabout as the engine shuts off and by the time it restarts it basically renders the reaction time of the DSG autobox back down to Manual snails pace. It also places alot of unnecessary wear and tear on the starter motor.

biko · 20-03-2018 8:30pm

You need a VCDS tool to do it. Do you have one?

teediddlyeye · 20-03-2018 8:35pm

Disconnect the battery monitoring. Its the small connector on the battery negative terminal.
One way of doing it!

Toyotafanboi · 20-03-2018 9:01pm

It's not an option on some of the newer cars. It couldn't be done on our Mk7.

If you unplug the switch it stops it working but it leaves an error on the MFD. Might be an option.

GarIT · 20-03-2018 9:05pm

Doltanian wrote: »

It also places alot of unnecessary wear and tear on the starter motor.

I've read that this isn't true. They use a different type of starter motor that is built to withstand the stop/start sequence.

Toyotafanboi · 20-03-2018 9:07pm

GarIT wrote: »

I've read that this isn't true. They use a different type of starter motor that is built to withstand the stop/start sequence.

The engine is also conditioned to stop just before TDC on cylinder one to minimise the amount of cranking necessary to restart.

GarIT · 20-03-2018 9:11pm

amber2 wrote: »

There’s an A button with a circle around it to the left Of the gear leaver turns it on and off.

They know that, they want it off permanently.

Spook_ie · 21-03-2018 1:23pm

I just disable it when I think a faster take off is required, then reengage it afterwards, seems to save a good deal of fuel when in use, and obviously if in stop/start traffic cuts down on fumes.

As to reaction times at roundabouts etc. do you (OP) switch the box to S mode to get away faster or rely on the drive settings? When I need to go at busy roundabouts etc.I just flick the gear stick into S mode and then back to Drive/Eco mode, works for me.

Henry Ford III · 21-03-2018 1:31pm

Just hit the disable switch. Makes less than no sense to disable it permanently.

tossy · 21-03-2018 2:05pm

I believe you can disable it permanently by changing the changing the parameters on the conditions it needs to work in, you can change the voltage settings or temperature settings, i've never done it but i imagine it's pretty easy, once you have VCDS.

The downside is you will need VCDS to re enable it again.

Doltanian · 21-03-2018 4:36pm

I haven't used Sport mode yet, I only managed to test out the Cruise control yesterday for around 5 minutes. I was thinking to disable the on/off feature as my father (elderly) occasionally borrows the car and finds it to be a right balls of a system. But in he's truth he is fond of the automatic, which is attraction to my car to him lol.

I find it a nuisance myself when I forget to turn it off. I am in the country and average 80-100km/h the whole time with very little stop start traffic except the few times I'd go into the cities, towns etc.

lawred2 · 21-03-2018 4:38pm

Don't you have to drop into neutral with your foot on the brake for it to shut off the engine anyway?

if you want a quick getaway - just keep the clutch depressed

that's the way it works in mine anyway

Doltanian · 21-03-2018 4:42pm

lawred2 wrote: »

Don;t you have to drop into neutral with your foot on the brake for it to shut off the engine anyway?

if you want a quick getaway - just keep the clutch depressed

that's the way it works in mine anyway

Mines a DSG Autobox, keeping my foot on the brake at a stop for more than a second or two e.g. a Junction or Roundabout will switch off the engine.

lawred2 · 21-03-2018 4:43pm

Doltanian wrote: »

Mines a DSG Autobox, keeping my foot on the brake at a stop for more than a second or two e.g. a Junction or Roundabout will switch off the engine.

ah

zilog_jones · 21-03-2018 5:44pm

If you need to pull off quickly, use your left foot on the brake so you can press the accelerator at the same time. Always worked for me driving hybrids and other automatics.

Caliden · 21-03-2018 5:47pm

I'm pretty sure you'll need to get the ECU coded to turn it off permanently.

It should really be a system setting somewhere to have it always on/off and then allow you to turn it off/on at will.

tossy · 21-03-2018 6:01pm

Caliden wrote: »

I'm pretty sure you'll need to get the ECU coded to turn it off permanently.

It should really be a system setting somewhere to have it always on/off and then allow you to turn it off/on at will.

Thats the thing with VCDS your not turning it off per say you are just changing the parameters at which it operates. It's probably a 5 min job.

uncle-mofo · 21-03-2018 6:03pm

On a slightly related note, has anyone thought of how this might affect turbos? I always read that it was bad to turn off the engine straight away when the turbo is hot, and better to leave it run until the turbo cools. My stop/start kicks in straight away when stopping at a toll on the motorway after some spirited driving.

tossy · 21-03-2018 6:07pm

Is there an after run pump on your car ? If so it probably kicks in when the stop start kicks in also.

An after run pump, pumps coolant around the engine for 10 minutes adter switching off.

uncle-mofo · 21-03-2018 6:21pm

OSI wrote: »

They have an electrical coolant pump that continues to circulate oil through the turbo if it needs cooling post engine shut off.

Nice one, learn something new every day!

tossy · 21-03-2018 6:27pm

uncle-mofo wrote: »

Nice one, learn something new every day!

You're welcome

Doltanian · 21-03-2018 6:48pm

OSI wrote: »

They have an electrical coolant pump that continues to circulate oil through the turbo if it needs cooling post engine shut off.

Oh, I have noticed something humming alright after I switch off the engine and had no idea what it was, I thought it was maybe the fan or something.

whippet · 21-03-2018 7:18pm

I have it on my manual and being able to control the stop/start with the clutch is a god send .. my wife’s car is a DSG and it is infuriating at lights and roundabouts when you forget to switch it off.

As an aside I’ve well over 300,000km done on mine and no starter motor or turbo issues so not sure where this paranoia comes from

Doltanian · 21-03-2018 7:30pm

whippet wrote: »

I have it on my manual and being able to control the stop/start with the clutch is a god send .. my wife’s car is a DSG and it is infuriating at lights and roundabouts when you forget to switch it off.

As an aside I’ve well over 300,000km done on mine and no starter motor or turbo issues so not sure where this paranoia comes from

What are you driving? I've a 2.0L VW Jetta DSG 2015 model. Its good to hear that at 300,000kms, are you servicing at the VW Main dealers or an Independent Mechanic?

JoeA3 · 21-03-2018 8:36pm

You don't need VCDS. OBDEleven will do it - far cheaper and suits the casual user much more.

Depending on the model, you can possibly code it so that it remembers last setting... so you switch it off once and never worry about it again - this doesn't work for all models. I know I did this in an A4 but it wasn't possible in a Golf.

When you "disable" it with OBDEleven, the car is effectively coded to raise the battery voltage cut off level (to a point it'll never fall below) at which it thinks its OK to switch off the car. So the "stop" never kicks in then as the car thinks it isn't OK to do so.

Reversing it again to standard is as simple.

whippet · 21-03-2018 10:20pm

Doltanian wrote: »

What are you driving? I've a 2.0L VW Jetta DSG 2015 model. Its good to hear that at 300,000kms, are you servicing at the VW Main dealers or an Independent Mechanic?

It’s a 1.6tdi superb 2011 .. serviced at main dealers for the first 3 years and at an Indy since then.

Rusky rusky · 22-03-2018 12:48am

Doltanian wrote: »

I am driving a VW and I've heard that you can get the start-stop eco stupidity permanently switched off. I've been using the switch and I just switch off each time I start the car but I'd like to get it permanently disabled. Its a pain at traffic lights or roundabout as the engine shuts off and by the time it restarts it basically renders the reaction time of the DSG autobox back down to Manual snails pace. It also places alot of unnecessary wear and tear on the starter motor.

The s/s button in vw golf is located on the lhs of the gearstick so it’s easy to find it w/o looking. I usually disable it at the junctions where I need to drive off quickly. On the new golf the s/s shuts the engine before you come to a full stop and restarts it when the car in front move off. This could be annoying if the driver in front keep on creeping forward....
Btw, pulling back the gearstick from drive position will put the gearbox into the sports mode which good for fast overtaking. Pulling back again will return it into the drive mode. I also find useful manual mode to stop the car constantly changing gears on Cork hills:)

Doltanian · 22-03-2018 1:06am

I've also got tiptronic but haven't tried it out yet, I haven't drove a manual car since 2005 so the whole concept of changing gears is alien to me, even without a clutch.

Spook_ie · 22-03-2018 3:41am

Doltanian wrote: »

I've also got tiptronic but haven't tried it out yet, I haven't drove a manual car since 2005 so the whole concept of changing gears is alien to me, even without a clutch.

Don't think you'll keep up with the recommend a change up/down display but yeah useful to keep the car in a lower gear going downhill and things like that.

Doltanian · 22-03-2018 12:09pm

Spook_ie wrote: »

Don't think you'll keep up with the recommend a change up/down display but yeah useful to keep the car in a lower gear going downhill and things like that.

I think it’s used for towing like a small caravan downhill etc. I don’t have a hitch so it’s just another feature I’ll probably never use.

Skylinehead · 22-03-2018 12:46pm

Doltanian wrote: »

I think it’s used for towing like a small caravan downhill etc. I don’t have a hitch so it’s just another feature I’ll probably never use.

It's handy for setting off in heavy snow too, chuck it in 2nd or 3rd and off you go.

alsiet2017 · 27-03-2018 8:56pm

Doltanian wrote: »

I am driving a VW and I've heard that you can get the start-stop eco stupidity permanently switched off. I've been using the switch and I just switch off each time I start the car but I'd like to get it permanently disabled. Its a pain at traffic lights or roundabout as the engine shuts off and by the time it restarts it basically renders the reaction time of the DSG autobox back down to Manual snails pace. It also places alot of unnecessary wear and tear on the starter motor.

Look up OBD ELEVEN . Small wireless dongle plugs into car that hooks up to android device . Disable start stop in one button press. So simple . Did it with my Audi.. the tool does plenty more as well . Cost around 40 euro only

John.G · 09-01-2019 12:50pm

tossy wrote: »

I believe you can disable it permanently by changing the changing the parameters on the conditions it needs to work in, you can change the voltage settings or temperature settings, i've never done it but i imagine it's pretty easy, once you have VCDS.

The downside is you will need VCDS to re enable it again.

I am surprised that the stop/start operates with the engine stone cold, at least that's what its doing on a 2019 Polo, once you drive a few hundred yards it is operational, it happened this morning after a overnight stop and with a ambient temperature of 7C, I may not disable it permanently with the loan of a VCDS but I (and wife much more frequently) will certainly get in the habit of pressing the disable switch once the engine starts.

Do all make start/stop systems operate with a cold engine?, I would have thought that the coolant should reach some minimum level before allowing it. It also means that you may have to wear a fur coat and gloves permanently if doing all very short trips in the winter.

zilog_jones · 09-01-2019 1:01pm

If you have the cabin heat on, the engine should start again (even while stationery) if the coolant temperature drops beyond a certain threshold.

Start/stop mode should only become available depending on a number of factors, possibly including exhaust temperature (for emissions reasons) and battery voltage. I don't know exactly what's happening in your case. Small petrol engines don't take very long to warm up, and modern cars could be using some exhaust heat recovery system or other fancyness.

John.G · 09-01-2019 2:50pm

zilog_jones wrote: »

If you have the cabin heat on, the engine should start again (even while stationery) if the coolant temperature drops beyond a certain threshold.

Start/stop mode should only become available depending on a number of factors, possibly including exhaust temperature (for emissions reasons) and battery voltage. I don't know exactly what's happening in your case. Small petrol engines don't take very long to warm up, and modern cars could be using some exhaust heat recovery system or other fancyness.

From the horses,s mouth....my Polo certainly is not heating up in a few hundred yards of driving.

Important preconditions for automatic engine switch-off
•The driver is wearing their seat belt.
•The driver door is closed.
•The bonnet is closed.
•The factory-fitted towing bracket is not attached electrically to a trailer.
•A minimum engine temperature has been reached.
•The vehicle has been moved since the engine was last switched off.

adox · 09-01-2019 3:24pm

Just dont leave your foot on the brake?

I drive a DSG and thats what I don when stopping if i dont want the start stop to kick in.

The car still stays stationary and doesnt crawl when left in "drive".

Edit: I have the Hill Hold function permanently activated so the car doesnt roll on an incline.

Pkiernan · 10-01-2019 8:28pm

Run your battery down.

John.G · 10-01-2019 8:53pm

Pkiernan wrote: »

Run your battery down.

Took a few battery terminal readings off the Polo today, 12.6V, everything off, 14.9V immediately after starting with everything off and 13.3 V after a few minutes at idle with either no or large electrical load. So it looks like this model has a smart charging system which would tend to keep the battery fully charged vs all my previous Vws which charged at a constant 14.2/14.3V and gave very very long battery life. My biggest crib with the stop/start is that it is enabled with a very cold engine which I think is daft and apart from any worries about a shortened engine life can result in spending the whole of a short urban journey with no cabin heating whatsoever. I did ask the question in another post if all makes operate likewise, I would like to think that they don't.

corkgsxr · 10-01-2019 11:09pm

Times like this I love my petrol. A5 2l tfsi.

It dies in such a quiet manner you'd not notice. Before you can fully press the clutch it's started

Your not using the turbo for anything but very fast take offs so no lag or delays or stutters.

But i average 29mpg so has one disadvantage

Micky 32 · 19-01-2019 2:13am

OSI wrote: »

They have an electrical coolant pump that continues to circulate oil through the turbo if it needs cooling post engine shut off.

I found 3 electric pumps on my car!

oleras · 20-01-2019 1:06pm

Driving an auto Renault, and the start/stop is managed by the brake pressure applied, light pressure and the engine keeps running, press hard and it cuts it out. Not the same with VW ?

Micky 32 · 20-01-2019 1:08pm

oleras wrote: »

Driving an auto Renault, and the start/stop is managed by the brake pressure applied, light pressure and the engine keeps running, press hard and it cuts it out. Not the same with VW ?

Yes i think it’s a similiar effect on VW, the auto’s anyway.

John.G · 20-01-2019 2:43pm

oleras wrote: »

Driving an auto Renault, and the start/stop is managed by the brake pressure applied, light pressure and the engine keeps running, press hard and it cuts it out. Not the same with VW ?

2019 Polo is out at the moment and will re post when available but my recollection of the stop start is that pressing hard on the brake pedal will restart the engine, not sure about stopping it though.

One other thing oleras, does your engine have to reach a certain minimum (coolant) temperature before the stop/start activates?. Thanks

Rusky rusky · 20-01-2019 3:02pm

We have 2 automatic vw cars in the family. A 2015 1.2 tsi polo and a 2018 1.0 tsi golf. Both in golf and polo pressing the brake pedal hard will stop the engine, while keeping light pressure on the pedal keeps the engine running. The engine in polo restarts when the break pedal is released. In golf the engine restarts if the car in front moves off (I presume the acc radar does that) or if you tap on the accelerator.

colm_mcm · 20-01-2019 3:06pm

Rusky rusky wrote: »

We have 2 automatic vw cars in the family. A 2015 1.2 tsi polo and a 2018 1.0 tsi golf. Both in golf and polo pressing the brake pedal hard will stop the engine, while keeping light pressure on the pedal keeps the engine running. The engine in polo restarts when the break pedal is released. In golf the engine restarts if the car in front moves off (I presume the acc radar does that) or if you tap on the accelerator.

That’s with Auto Hold turned on in the Polo I assume.

oleras · 20-01-2019 5:04pm

John.G wrote: »

2019 Polo is out at the moment and will re post when available but my recollection of the stop start is that pressing hard on the brake pedal will restart the engine, not sure about stopping it though.

One other thing oleras, does your engine have to reach a certain minimum (coolant) temperature before the stop/start activates?. Thanks

As far as i know it uses the cabin temp in the climate control, hot day it will keep the engine running for A/C and similar for cold, may be wrong though.

Rusky rusky · 20-01-2019 5:20pm

colm_mcm wrote: »

That’s with Auto Hold turned on in the Polo I assume.

There’s a manual hand break in polo so no auto hold. Just hill start control (or whatever it called)

John.G · 20-01-2019 6:56pm

oleras wrote: »

As far as i know it uses the cabin temp in the climate control, hot day it will keep the engine running for A/C and similar for cold, may be wrong though.

Thanks.
Re (Polo) stop/start, it's as I thought, when you stop and the engine cuts out, then it will restart if you press the foot brake hard, it will do this with the handbrake either on or off. The engine doesn't appear to stop if I come to a halt while pressing the foot brake...it stops when I remove my foot.

I don't have any A/C and after driving less than 500 meters yesterday with a ambient temperature of 1.5C it immediately stopped, the engine (coolant) couldn't have been more than 15/20C, the air from the heating ducts was cold even though my manual clearly states that one of the parameters is that the engine must be at a minimum temperature??, the wife and I just disable it now when we start the engine, VW technical didn't seem to have a clue what this minimum engine temperature should be!. The only thing that inhibits it from stopping when cold is if the blower speed is at 4, (it will also restart if you turn the blower speed to 4) a setting that I rarely use because of the noise.

John.G · 27-02-2019 12:13pm

John.G wrote: »

I am surprised that the stop/start operates with the engine stone cold, at least that's what its doing on a 2019 Polo, once you drive a few hundred yards it is operational, it happened this morning after a overnight stop and with a ambient temperature of 7C, I may not disable it permanently with the loan of a VCDS but I (and wife much more frequently) will certainly get in the habit of pressing the disable switch once the engine starts.

Do all make start/stop systems operate with a cold engine?, I would have thought that the coolant should reach some minimum level before allowing it. It also means that you may have to wear a fur coat and gloves permanently if doing all very short trips in the winter.

Informed by VW technical dept that the stop/start does NOT depend on the engine reaching a certain minimum temperature.

I just disable it when cold and re enable it when engine is up to operating temperature, wife disables it "permanently" each time she starts the engine. QED.

micks_address · 27-02-2019 12:26pm

i switch it off everytime i turn on the car.. id get it disabled via vcds but probably changing car in next 12 months so would be better to leave it back in factory state? its annoying in stop start traffic as i find you get stop on the m50 but you're really about to start again so you get a stutter.. i doubt it helps mpg.. maybe emissions..

John.G · 27-02-2019 12:37pm

There is no way that it can help emissions in all short city driving due to the engine never getting to remotely like its operating temperature, apart from the occupants being frozen in the winter. I have no problem with the stop start philosophy itself but it seems utterly crazy from all aspects not to make a minimum engine temperature one of the stop start criteria even though it states quite clearly in the manual that a minimum operating temperature must be achieved!!, it must be something like 10/20 deg C at the most.

VW disable start/stop eco stupidity

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