VW disable start/stop eco stupidity

alsiet2017

Doltanian wrote: »

I am driving a VW and I've heard that you can get the start-stop eco stupidity permanently switched off. I've been using the switch and I just switch off each time I start the car but I'd like to get it permanently disabled. Its a pain at traffic lights or roundabout as the engine shuts off and by the time it restarts it basically renders the reaction time of the DSG autobox back down to Manual snails pace. It also places alot of unnecessary wear and tear on the starter motor.

Look up OBD ELEVEN . Small wireless dongle plugs into car that hooks up to android device . Disable start stop in one button press. So simple . Did it with my Audi.. the tool does plenty more as well . Cost around 40 euro only

John.G

tossy wrote: »

I believe you can disable it permanently by changing the changing the parameters on the conditions it needs to work in, you can change the voltage settings or temperature settings, i've never done it but i imagine it's pretty easy, once you have VCDS.

The downside is you will need VCDS to re enable it again.

I am surprised that the stop/start operates with the engine stone cold, at least that's what its doing on a 2019 Polo, once you drive a few hundred yards it is operational, it happened this morning after a overnight stop and with a ambient temperature of 7C, I may not disable it permanently with the loan of a VCDS but I (and wife much more frequently) will certainly get in the habit of pressing the disable switch once the engine starts.

Do all make start/stop systems operate with a cold engine?, I would have thought that the coolant should reach some minimum level before allowing it. It also means that you may have to wear a fur coat and gloves permanently if doing all very short trips in the winter.

zilog_jones

If you have the cabin heat on, the engine should start again (even while stationery) if the coolant temperature drops beyond a certain threshold.

Start/stop mode should only become available depending on a number of factors, possibly including exhaust temperature (for emissions reasons) and battery voltage. I don't know exactly what's happening in your case. Small petrol engines don't take very long to warm up, and modern cars could be using some exhaust heat recovery system or other fancyness.

John.G

zilog_jones wrote: »

If you have the cabin heat on, the engine should start again (even while stationery) if the coolant temperature drops beyond a certain threshold.

Start/stop mode should only become available depending on a number of factors, possibly including exhaust temperature (for emissions reasons) and battery voltage. I don't know exactly what's happening in your case. Small petrol engines don't take very long to warm up, and modern cars could be using some exhaust heat recovery system or other fancyness.

From the horses,s mouth....my Polo certainly is not heating up in a few hundred yards of driving.

Important preconditions for automatic engine switch-off
•The driver is wearing their seat belt.
•The driver door is closed.
•The bonnet is closed.
•The factory-fitted towing bracket is not attached electrically to a trailer.
•A minimum engine temperature has been reached.
•The vehicle has been moved since the engine was last switched off.

adox

Just dont leave your foot on the brake?

I drive a DSG and thats what I don when stopping if i dont want the start stop to kick in.

The car still stays stationary and doesnt crawl when left in "drive".

Edit: I have the Hill Hold function permanently activated so the car doesnt roll on an incline.

Pkiernan

Run your battery down.

John.G

Pkiernan wrote: »

Run your battery down.

Took a few battery terminal readings off the Polo today, 12.6V, everything off, 14.9V immediately after starting with everything off and 13.3 V after a few minutes at idle with either no or large electrical load. So it looks like this model has a smart charging system which would tend to keep the battery fully charged vs all my previous Vws which charged at a constant 14.2/14.3V and gave very very long battery life. My biggest crib with the stop/start is that it is enabled with a very cold engine which I think is daft and apart from any worries about a shortened engine life can result in spending the whole of a short urban journey with no cabin heating whatsoever. I did ask the question in another post if all makes operate likewise, I would like to think that they don't.

corkgsxr

Times like this I love my petrol. A5 2l tfsi.

It dies in such a quiet manner you'd not notice. Before you can fully press the clutch it's started

Your not using the turbo for anything but very fast take offs so no lag or delays or stutters.

But i average 29mpg so has one disadvantage

Micky 32

OSI wrote: »

They have an electrical coolant pump that continues to circulate oil through the turbo if it needs cooling post engine shut off.

I found 3 electric pumps on my car!

oleras

Driving an auto Renault, and the start/stop is managed by the brake pressure applied, light pressure and the engine keeps running, press hard and it cuts it out. Not the same with VW ?

Micky 32

oleras wrote: »

Driving an auto Renault, and the start/stop is managed by the brake pressure applied, light pressure and the engine keeps running, press hard and it cuts it out. Not the same with VW ?

Yes i think it’s a similiar effect on VW, the auto’s anyway.

John.G

oleras wrote: »

Driving an auto Renault, and the start/stop is managed by the brake pressure applied, light pressure and the engine keeps running, press hard and it cuts it out. Not the same with VW ?

2019 Polo is out at the moment and will re post when available but my recollection of the stop start is that pressing hard on the brake pedal will restart the engine, not sure about stopping it though.

One other thing oleras, does your engine have to reach a certain minimum (coolant) temperature before the stop/start activates?. Thanks

Rusky rusky

We have 2 automatic vw cars in the family. A 2015 1.2 tsi polo and a 2018 1.0 tsi golf. Both in golf and polo pressing the brake pedal hard will stop the engine, while keeping light pressure on the pedal keeps the engine running. The engine in polo restarts when the break pedal is released. In golf the engine restarts if the car in front moves off (I presume the acc radar does that) or if you tap on the accelerator.

colm_mcm

Rusky rusky wrote: »

We have 2 automatic vw cars in the family. A 2015 1.2 tsi polo and a 2018 1.0 tsi golf. Both in golf and polo pressing the brake pedal hard will stop the engine, while keeping light pressure on the pedal keeps the engine running. The engine in polo restarts when the break pedal is released. In golf the engine restarts if the car in front moves off (I presume the acc radar does that) or if you tap on the accelerator.

That’s with Auto Hold turned on in the Polo I assume.

oleras

John.G wrote: »

2019 Polo is out at the moment and will re post when available but my recollection of the stop start is that pressing hard on the brake pedal will restart the engine, not sure about stopping it though.

One other thing oleras, does your engine have to reach a certain minimum (coolant) temperature before the stop/start activates?. Thanks

As far as i know it uses the cabin temp in the climate control, hot day it will keep the engine running for A/C and similar for cold, may be wrong though.

Rusky rusky

colm_mcm wrote: »

That’s with Auto Hold turned on in the Polo I assume.

There’s a manual hand break in polo so no auto hold. Just hill start control (or whatever it called)

John.G

oleras wrote: »

As far as i know it uses the cabin temp in the climate control, hot day it will keep the engine running for A/C and similar for cold, may be wrong though.

Thanks.
Re (Polo) stop/start, it's as I thought, when you stop and the engine cuts out, then it will restart if you press the foot brake hard, it will do this with the handbrake either on or off. The engine doesn't appear to stop if I come to a halt while pressing the foot brake...it stops when I remove my foot.

I don't have any A/C and after driving less than 500 meters yesterday with a ambient temperature of 1.5C it immediately stopped, the engine (coolant) couldn't have been more than 15/20C, the air from the heating ducts was cold even though my manual clearly states that one of the parameters is that the engine must be at a minimum temperature??, the wife and I just disable it now when we start the engine, VW technical didn't seem to have a clue what this minimum engine temperature should be!. The only thing that inhibits it from stopping when cold is if the blower speed is at 4, (it will also restart if you turn the blower speed to 4) a setting that I rarely use because of the noise.

John.G

John.G wrote: »

I am surprised that the stop/start operates with the engine stone cold, at least that's what its doing on a 2019 Polo, once you drive a few hundred yards it is operational, it happened this morning after a overnight stop and with a ambient temperature of 7C, I may not disable it permanently with the loan of a VCDS but I (and wife much more frequently) will certainly get in the habit of pressing the disable switch once the engine starts.

Do all make start/stop systems operate with a cold engine?, I would have thought that the coolant should reach some minimum level before allowing it. It also means that you may have to wear a fur coat and gloves permanently if doing all very short trips in the winter.

Informed by VW technical dept that the stop/start does NOT depend on the engine reaching a certain minimum temperature.

I just disable it when cold and re enable it when engine is up to operating temperature, wife disables it "permanently" each time she starts the engine. QED.

micks_address

i switch it off everytime i turn on the car.. id get it disabled via vcds but probably changing car in next 12 months so would be better to leave it back in factory state? its annoying in stop start traffic as i find you get stop on the m50 but you're really about to start again so you get a stutter.. i doubt it helps mpg.. maybe emissions..

John.G

There is no way that it can help emissions in all short city driving due to the engine never getting to remotely like its operating temperature, apart from the occupants being frozen in the winter. I have no problem with the stop start philosophy itself but it seems utterly crazy from all aspects not to make a minimum engine temperature one of the stop start criteria even though it states quite clearly in the manual that a minimum operating temperature must be achieved!!, it must be something like 10/20 deg C at the most.

tossy

Since this thread was started i've bought a VW with stop/start i changed one of the set parameters of one of the prerequisites it looks for (battery voltage) and now its disabled full time.

As far as i know it checks outside temp not engine temp.

John.G

tossy wrote: »

Since this thread was started i've bought a VW with stop/start i changed one of the set parameters of one of the prerequisites it looks for (battery voltage) and now its disabled full time.

As far as i know it checks outside temp not engine temp.

Yes, I think outside air temperature is considered but this what it states in my users manual.....period.

Important preconditions for automatic engine switch-off
•The driver is wearing their seat belt.
•The driver door is closed.
•The bonnet is closed.
•The factory-fitted towing bracket is not attached electrically to a trailer.
•A minimum engine temperature has been reached.
•The vehicle has been moved since the engine was last switched off.

John.G

tossy wrote: »

Since this thread was started i've bought a VW with stop/start i changed one of the set parameters of one of the prerequisites it looks for (battery voltage) and now its disabled full time.

As far as i know it checks outside temp not engine temp.

Re 2000 petrol Polo and start/stop parameters, got hold of a VCDS Hex-V2 this am and had a brief look at parameters, there is no mention of engine/coolant temperature and this is what I saw... (Wonder is this the same (daft) case in all VAG petrol engine vehicles.)

Deactivation Stop/start: default: "Mode not active", Other modes were, "Stop Release", "Stop prohibition:No start request", "Start Request" and "System Malfunction".

Start/Stop Start voltage limit: default: 7.6V.
Start/Stop Start minimum ambient temperature: default: -50C
Start/Stop Start maximum ambient temperature: default: -50C

I didn,t change any parameter but I think that 12.1V is the maximum settable limit so don't see how this would help inhibit the stop as the charging voltage will be well above this even when idling with a lot of electrical auxiliaries on but it will restart obviously if the voltage drops below this with a stopped engine.
The minimum settable ambient temperature is -50C and the maximum settable temperature is +50C.

colm_mcm

I think mine looks for a minimum voltage of 15v now.

Needless to say it never turns off the engine!

30 second job with OBDeleven.

John.G

I thought the VCDS showed 7.6V but I also saw 12.1V which is the more likely (default) setting for inhibiting the stop/start, with 7.6V being the minimum, I don't want to inhibit the stop/start "permanently", its just that I find it unbelievable really that there doesn't appear to be any minimum engine coolant temperature setting.

Spook_ie

John.G wrote: »

I thought the VCDS showed 7.6V but I also saw 12.1V which is the more likely (default) setting for inhibiting the stop/start, with 7.6V being the minimum, I don't want to inhibit the stop/start "permanently", its just that I find it unbelievable really that there doesn't appear to be any minimum engine coolant temperature setting.

I seem to recall reading somewhere that it's go do with the air conditioning, I'd give it a whirl with the A/C on snd set to 20C +

Spook_ie

Spook_ie wrote: »

I seem to recall reading somewhere that it's go do with the air conditioning, I'd give it a whirl with the A/C on snd set to 20C +

Spook_ie wrote: »

I seem to recall reading somewhere that it's go do with the air conditioning, I'd give it a whirl with the A/C on snd set to 20C +

So I photographed the sequence I got over 25 minutes of driving on a cold night, the engine cold went off very quickly but it took nigh on 20 minutes before it decided I was warm enough set at 18C, turned the a/c upto 24C and the engine started with the engine must be on for AC message. If your stop start is active so quickly I would suspect a sensor fault somewhere

Can't get the photos up from mobile site I'll try later when I'm at home

Skyhawk1990

I have a 2014 Golf, I have it disabled permanently.

On one of the battery terminals, can't remember which one, there's a plug with two wires coming out of it. This is what reads the battery voltage for the auto stop/start. Unplug this and tape up the plug and the socket to help stop corrosion should you want to re-connect it.

This has no other effect on the car other than reading the battery voltage as zero so it just leaves the car running when stopped.

Just saw this was posted earlier in the thread 😂😂

John.G

I'm sorry but I think you are all are missing my point.... I don't want to permanently disable the stop/start, all I am asking is why the engine/coolant temperature reaching a minimum temperature on a PETROL POLO does not seem to play any part in its stop start philosophy, can or would someone please tell me if this is true of all petrol engined VAG cars or just drive one of them with AC or whatever switched off from a cold start and just see if the engine cuts out after stopping after driving for a few hundred meters or so, that's all I am asking.

zilog_jones

Does VCDS show exhaust or oil temperature? Seems a bit odd.

I assume your car has manual cabin heating controls, i.e. not automatic climate control? Maybe the heating would work better with climate control since it has no feedback loop (it doesn't know the cabin temp) without it.

Is there an exhaust heat recovery system? This is used in hybrids to speed up getting the engine up to temperature, not sure if start/stop cars have similar. Look for coolant pipes going to the exhaust somewhere.