Norwegian Air Discussion

ongarboy · 16-01-2019 9:31pm

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/01/16/reuters-america-update-1-norwegian-air-to-shut-some-bases-and-axe-routes-to-cut-costs.html

Did I read this correctly? Providence and Stewart bases to be dropped by Norwegian? How does this affect Dublin?

Shn99 · 16-01-2019 9:37pm

ongarboy wrote: »

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/01/16/reuters-america-update-1-norwegian-air-to-shut-some-bases-and-axe-routes-to-cut-costs.html

Did I read this correctly? Providence and Stewart bases to be dropped by Norwegian? How does this affect Dublin?

Irish routes are safe
https://www.rte.ie/amp/1023693/?__twitter_impression=true

vicwatson · 16-01-2019 9:39pm

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

With a credit card, you can charge back if a seller goes bust, with a debit card you can't.

I think only within 120 days

kub · 16-01-2019 9:50pm

Shn99 wrote: »

Irish routes are safe
https://www.rte.ie/amp/1023693/?__twitter_impression=true

But the article on CNBC says they are shutting their bases at Providence and Stewart

The airliner will close its bases in Palma de Mallorca, Gran Canaria, and Tenerife in Spain, as well as in Stewart and Providence in the United States. It would also shut the 737 base at Rome's Fiumicino airport but keep its Dreamliner base there.

Jamie2k9 · 16-01-2019 9:51pm

kub wrote: »

But the article on CNBC says they are shutting their bases at Providence and Stewart

The airliner will close its bases in Palma de Mallorca, Gran Canaria, and Tenerife in Spain, as well as in Stewart and Providence in the United States. It would also shut the 737 base at Rome's Fiumicino airport but keep its Dreamliner base there.

They have staff based in Dublin...

Tenzor07 · 16-01-2019 9:56pm

kub wrote: »

The airliner will close its bases in Palma de Mallorca, Gran Canaria, and Tenerife in Spain, as well as in Stewart and Providence in the United States. It would also shut the 737 base at Rome's Fiumicino airport but keep its Dreamliner base there.

From what I heard, the base in SWF is manned by a contract company, not sure about the other bases you mention if they even have any staff there...probably not, apart from FCO perhaps.

Limpy · 16-01-2019 10:35pm

It says flights in and out of Ireland not affected. The last thing this Airline needs is potential customers worried they will pull flights

Locker10a · 17-01-2019 11:13pm

Limpy wrote: »

It says flights in and out of Ireland not affected. The last thing this Airline needs is potential customers worried they will pull flights

The Dublin base will essentially close in September, when it will be reduced to 1 aircraft based

Limpy · 18-01-2019 12:21am

Locker10a wrote: »

The Dublin base will essentially close in September, when it will be reduced to 1 aircraft based

Pulling routes is OK once the flights are not out for sale. It's a no brainer reducing the flights as they were half full. I hope this will steady the ship.

Locker10a · 18-01-2019 1:34am

Limpy wrote: »

Pulling routes is OK once the flights are not out for sale. It's a no brainer reducing the flights as they were half full. I hope this will steady the ship.

With 1 aircraft over the winter, and no US based crew/aircraft for the Irish routes it will be a very bare bones schedule from Ireland this winter, couple of flights a week at best

Tenzor07 · 18-01-2019 10:32am

Locker10a wrote: »

The Dublin base will essentially close in September, when it will be reduced to 1 aircraft based

Where was your source for that? Closure Sept. 2019?

Locker10a · 18-01-2019 1:06pm

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Where was your source for that? Closure Sept. 2019?

It won’t fully close, it will be decimated to 1 aircraft. Source is internal

roadmaster · 18-01-2019 1:11pm

i have used them a fair bit as where they fly in new york is handy for work. I have to book a few flights for next August & September,if they go belly up will i get a refund or is it a case of to bad?

IngazZagni · 18-01-2019 3:44pm

I imagine the Cork and Shannon flights will very likely get the chop from mid September too.

Tenzor07 · 18-01-2019 4:14pm

Locker10a wrote: »

It won’t fully close, it will be decimated to 1 aircraft. Source is internal

Ah ok, i'm sure that 1 aircraft will disappear also.. And with Brexit they are really in serious trouble...

basill · 18-01-2019 8:08pm

They are in serious trouble as their business model is flawed and yields are poor.

theguzman · 20-01-2019 10:34pm

basill wrote: »

They are in serious trouble as their business model is flawed and yields are poor.

So many companies have tried and failed down through the years, you can't really do Low Cost Long Haul and Norwegian are not really low-cost if you add on baggage etc. and you figure in the additional transportation costs from Stewart also compared to the closer Proximity of Newark and JFK to New York; its popular with the price conscious Irish immigrants there but I wonder how they make money really.

ISOP · 20-01-2019 10:59pm

its cheaper to get to Manhattan from Stewart than from JFK

Donegal Storm · 21-01-2019 1:11am

Would anyone advise booking with them at the moment? Looking at flights to Boston during the summer and Providence is tempting

As an aside TAP are giving me some great deals routing through LIS this summer, has a layover obviously but some of the extra price conscious market that Norwegian target might be swayed..

Locker10a · 21-01-2019 1:32am

Donegal Storm wrote: »

Would anyone advise booking with them at the moment? Looking at flights to Boston during the summer and Providence is tempting

As an aside TAP are giving me some great deals routing through LIS this summer, has a layover obviously but some of the extra price conscious market that Norwegian target might be swayed..

It will probably be ok for the summer, but I wouldn’t be surprised if schedules change or are altered/cut more between now and then

Noxegon · 21-01-2019 9:36am

theguzman wrote: »

So many companies have tried and failed down through the years, you can't really do Low Cost Long Haul and Norwegian are not really low-cost if you add on baggage etc. and you figure in the additional transportation costs from Stewart also compared to the closer Proximity of Newark and JFK to New York; its popular with the price conscious Irish immigrants there but I wonder how they make money really.

Not everyone who flies into New York is going to the city.

SWF is considerably more convenient than JFK for virtually everyone going to the wider New York State.

Dardania · 21-01-2019 9:39am

Does anyone have a link to a list of the discontinued routes? Or are they segmenting the information?

Locker10a · 21-01-2019 1:24pm

Dardania wrote: »

Does anyone have a link to a list of the discontinued routes? Or are they segmenting the information?

Nothing has been officially discontinued, however from September this year the Dublin base will be cut from 6 aircraft to 1. They also haves bases in Providence and Stewart, these bases will close in April along with Edinburgh and others.
So by autumn 1 Dublin based aircraft will remain doing transatlantic flights, do the maths on that and it will give you an idea of what the schedule might look like considering they have 3 routes and also serve Shannon and Cork!
I can see Shannon and Cork scrapped completely and maybe Providence and Stewart served 2/3 weekly each from Dublin

Bussywussy · 24-01-2019 6:21pm

Looks like IAG are to offload their 4% in Norwegian....They must sense trouble ahead

kevinandrew · 24-01-2019 7:18pm

IAG’s bid being successful was always a long shot, it would have needed the support of a lot people who still very much believe in the Norwegian fantasy and have deep pockets to boot.

It’s starting to feel like Norwegian is a very expensive vanity or national pride project for certain shareholders and Norwegians. The tone of all their press releases and the constant spin regarding their finances is very telling.

basill · 24-01-2019 7:38pm

Job done from an IAG perspective. Get a look at the books to confirm much of what they already knew. Make offer and if the board do not want to play fair then tank the shares by selling. Norwegian could struggle to meet its debt covenants now. If it all goes South then pick up the profitable pieces for nought.

Dardania · 24-01-2019 7:46pm

basill wrote: »

Job done from an IAG perspective. Get a look at the books to confirm much of what they already knew. Make offer and if the board do not want to play fair then tank the shares by selling. Norwegian could struggle to meet its debt covenants now. If it all goes South then pick up the profitable pieces for nought.

Maybe IAG need the cash to do some share backs of their own stock, to meet EU ownership rules?

Helpneeded86 · 03-03-2019 7:16pm

Is that in flight wi fi any good? Happy enough to access work emails not looking fr streaming.

Dardania · 03-03-2019 7:21pm

Helpneeded86 wrote: »

Is that in flight wi fi any good? Happy enough to access work emails not looking fr streaming.

Grand for that purpose, if it's switched on in the jet. About half of my flights with them they make an excuse about the plane being so new, they haven't had a chance to set it up yet... (maybe 20 or so flights)

Locker10a · 03-03-2019 7:28pm

Dardania wrote: »

Grand for that purpose, if it's switched on in the jet. About half of my flights with them they make an excuse about the plane being so new, they haven't had a chance to set it up yet... (maybe 20 or so flights)

Why do you think they’re making up an excuse? Would that not be a plausible truth?

Helpneeded86 · 03-03-2019 7:31pm

Probably not the answer I was looking for. Just doing some reading again. Is it on Trans Atlantic flights?

Nijmegen · 03-03-2019 7:33pm

Given how much they tout the WiFi it should be enabled for each aircraft before it enters full service. Though I have to say I remain old school about WiFi on a plane. It was cool to message some pals the first time I saw it, but I still enjoy flights as one of the few truely disconnected times available to we mere mortals.

Limpy · 03-03-2019 7:40pm

I flew Snn to Stewart in November, there was no WiFi.

Locker10a · 03-03-2019 7:49pm

Nijmegen wrote: »

Given how much they tout the WiFi it should be enabled for each aircraft before it enters full service. Though I have to say I remain old school about WiFi on a plane. It was cool to message some pals the first time I saw it, but I still enjoy flights as one of the few truely disconnected times available to we mere mortals.

I know on the 787s I think only like 2 of them have WiFi

Dardania · 03-03-2019 7:52pm

Locker10a wrote: »

Why do you think they’re making up an excuse? Would that not be a plausible truth?

Generally it would, but I've started noticing the delivery date plaque as over a year old, it's a bit odd. Weirdly, my only 737MAX8 flight with them, the plane was same year, and it's WiFi worked fine

A319er · 12-03-2019 3:09pm

Today's USA flights cancelled due grounding of Max8 , pretty tough for a company already hit by other aircraft issues.

Muppet Man · 12-03-2019 3:15pm

Was there any alternative arrangements?

Comhrá · 12-03-2019 3:20pm

A319er wrote: »

Today's USA flights cancelled due grounding of Max8 , pretty tough for a company already hit by other aircraft issues.

Does Boeing ultimately have to pick up the tab for airlines affected by these cancellations due to aircraft groundings?

cson · 12-03-2019 3:39pm

This could well sink Norwegian.

crisco10 · 12-03-2019 3:45pm

Comhra wrote: »

Does Boeing ultimately have to pick up the tab for airlines affected by these cancellations due to aircraft groundings?

Don't know but even if there are recovery options in contracts, Norwegian would need a lot of working capital to survive until they can get the money back from Boeing.

Tenger · 12-03-2019 3:59pm

A319er wrote: »

Today's USA flights cancelled due grounding of Max8 , pretty tough for a company already hit by other aircraft issues.

cson wrote: »

This could well sink Norwegian.

I would agree that its a bad hit for Norwegian. However in this case it should be a bit less costly than the B787 delay/groundings/refit as they only have 9 B737MAX vs 57 B737-800 in service. (wiki) (20 B787 under the Norwegian Air International subsidary)
Am I right in thinking the MAX operates a lot from Dublin? I seem to see 1-2 of them everytime I am there, so Dublin Ops will be hit by this.

But considering the ongoing financial question mark over the company, their large debt issue, the IAG walkaway from purchase and the decision to delay A321LR delivery...... definitely looking grim for them. Would be sad to see them fold over something like this which wasnt their fault.

goingnowhere · 12-03-2019 4:03pm

Comhra wrote: »

Does Boeing ultimately have to pick up the tab for airlines affected by these cancellations due to aircraft groundings?

Its a curious one,

The IAA (assuming its an Irish Reg) hasn't issued a directive to stop flying
The FAA (as the country of certification) hasn't issued a directive to stop flying
Boeing hasn't applied to withdraw the certificate

The aircraft has a valid certificate of airworthiness

Good old EC261 would seem valid, nothing wrong with the aircraft...

Now if the country of registration says no or the country of certification withdraws/suspends the cert then exceptional circumstances come into play and the airline has a defense vs passenger.

Only if its proven the aircraft was 'defective by design or construction' then Boeing could be caught but business is business so you could assume a better price might be on offer on any aircraft on order when this is all sorted out.

Until both accident reports are in there is no factual data to base any decision off, and the safest aircraft is the one parked up on the apron

Limpy · 12-03-2019 4:03pm

Due to fly in 4 weeks with them. What will they do change the planes or cancel the flights?

Locker10a · 12-03-2019 4:06pm

Limpy wrote: »

Due to fly in 4 weeks with them. What will they do change the planes or cancel the flights?

Probably sub in an older type 737 but that may* require an additional fuel stop for a transatlantic flight.

Limpy · 12-03-2019 4:15pm

Locker10a wrote: »

Probably sub in an older type 737 but that may* require an additional fuel stop for a transatlantic flight.

.

Dublin - Providance,

Providance - Shannon.

It's a tricky one wait and see verses booking with another carrier for x amount.
If they are not cancelled then I will lose about a 1k. But I would rather fly safe so its a sensible decision re 737max.

Edit. Waiting in online chat 45 mins and it disconnected. Now number 226 in que. Basically a cluster fxxk. But luckily I have 4 weeks unlike some people who are flying soon.

errlloyd · 12-03-2019 4:36pm

Limpy wrote: »

.

Dublin - Providance,

Providance - Shannon.

It's a tricky one wait and see verses booking with another carrier for x amount.
If they are not cancelled then I will lose about a 1k. But I would rather fly safe so its a sensible decision re 737max.

Edit. Waiting in online chat 45 mins and it disconnected. Now number 226 in que. Basically a cluster fxxk. But luckily I have 4 weeks unlike some people who are flying soon.

My OH was due to fly tonight - as I said in another thread. Long distance relationship so it's a real pain when **** like this gets cancelled. She's flying from NYC to here, and given it's paddy's weekend every other flight is mental pricey.

kub · 12-03-2019 4:37pm

Am I correct in thinking that when Norwegian began the operation from Cork to Providence that they operated a 738?
Also I recall that they had to top up in Canada only once?
Obviously their 738's are assigned to other routes so it only the most profitable ones will now be operated.

Tenger · 12-03-2019 4:41pm

As of 15 minutes ago the IAA have suspended all B737 MAX into and out of Irish airspace.
https://www.thejournal.ie/boeing-irish-airspace-4537391-Mar2019/

So it was going to be out of their hands anyway.

Acosta · 12-03-2019 4:43pm

kub wrote: »

Am I correct in thinking that when Norwegian began the operation from Cork to Providence that they operated a 738?
Also I recall that they had to top up in Canada only once?
Obviously their 738's are assigned to other routes so it only the most profitable ones will now be operated.

Yeah I think so. Well it definitely wasn't the max when it started anyway. I think it was either the first or second flight over they had to make the fuel stop.

Apparently the Cork flight was fairly profitable but considering they stopped it over the winter I wouldn't be too hopeful going forward. Would love to see how a direct Aer Lingus(or other) flight to Boston or New York would perform.

c6ysaphjvqw41k · 12-03-2019 5:01pm

errlloyd wrote: »

My OH was due to fly tonight - as I said in another thread. Long distance relationship so it's a real pain when **** like this gets cancelled. She's flying from NYC to here, and given it's paddy's weekend every other flight is mental pricey.

My husband is American and I spent years flying back and forth across the Atlantic, so I feel for you. Can she just wait and reorganize it for after this weekend or will you be even more out of pocket then with any hotels/bookings etc.

Norwegian Air Discussion

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