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Scientology Centre headed for old Victory Centre in Firhouse

24

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,533 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    All both groups are interested in is separating fools from their money, so why not cooperate?

    Scrap the cap!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,992 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    don't worry Michael Moriarty (head of ETB) is on the case https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/scientologists-target-schoolchildren-m0sv2xgk3
    Michael Moriarty, general secretary of the ETBI, said he became aware the Foundation for a Drug-Free World was a Scientology-backed group two weeks ago, when Newstalk reported on its presence at the TY Expo.

    “We had a contract because they paid for a stand,” said Moriarty. “There were no children at this conference. They are all adults. What should I do? They are against drugs and I’ve no problem with that. I checked it with people and they were reasonably positive about them.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,992 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    Church of Scientology invite local reps to visit ahead of Victory Centre opening http://www.echo.ie/news/article/church-of-scientology-invite-local-reps-to-visit-ahead-of-victory-centre-opening
    “I will be asking how the community centre will be run completely separate of the church, how it will run as a stand-alone community facility.”
    its not a communtiy facility its private operation


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,533 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    “We had a contract because they paid for a stand,” said Moriarty. “There were no children at this conference. They are all adults. What should I do? They are against drugs and I’ve no problem with that. I checked it with people and they were reasonably positive about them.

    Fcuking eejit.

    Scrap the cap!



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    In fairness, the idea of a standalone/integral community centre is nothing new. Its a fairly standard practice in this country, which allows a religion to recruit and control the community.
    Go to any small town and you'll find a community centre, parish GAA club, primary school and church, all overlapping each other and having some very blurred boundaries.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,992 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    recedite wrote: »
    In fairness, the idea of a standalone/integral community centre is nothing new. Its a fairly standard practice in this country, which allows a religion to recruit and control the community.
    the problem is pretending this is not the case


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,185 ✭✭✭mistersifter


    NOW LADS! let me just clear things up for you all. There was this bloke called XENU ,right? an intergalatic warrior right? and one day he decided "**** this!" and thrun loadsa alien blokes into VOLCANOES , ONLY FOR THEM TO EMERGE AND STICK TO OUR BODIES.

    Now, the thing is that - and I SWEAR im not bull****tin - youre gonna need to do a few courses to get these alien lads off ye ok? Just pop down to the bank tomorrow and see how youre fixed for 10k.

    and dont forget - free speech is brilliant and all but if your family and mates don't believe in Xenu, the best thing is to completely dismantle any relationship you have with them, ok?

    and just in case ye need any further reason to believe that this is a healthy set up - watch this - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UFBZ_uAbxS0


  • Registered Users Posts: 23 pedrofcuk


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    NnRCYP4.jpg


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Brilliant photos.
    Not quite sure what is happening there, but it looks like a Klingon spaceship has been captured by the IRA.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,971 ✭✭✭✭PopePalpatine


    I think we've just seen the Irish equivalent of blackface.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,132 ✭✭✭Tow


    Must have been a lot of cheques in the post...

    When is the money (including lost growth) Michael Noonan took in the Pension Levy going to be paid back?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,809 ✭✭✭Hector Savage


    recedite wrote: »
    Brilliant photos.
    Not quite sure what is happening there, but it looks like a Klingon spaceship has been captured by the IRA.

    :D You win the Internet !!

    I totally oppose this cult and am not happy about this hub.

    But honestly, long term, I'd be more worried about the plans for the new Islamic center (including a school - tho this might be cutback) in Dublin 15.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


    This post has been deleted.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,185 ✭✭✭mistersifter


    ....... wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    Did the lovely polite Sea Org people offer you a personality test by any chance!? :pac:

    All kinds of aggressive, violent behaviour go on in that cult - much worse than anything any of the protesters said or did I'm sure. Out of curiosity, what exactly did the protesters say or do to the cult clergy members?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


    This post has been deleted.


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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,778 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    :D You win the Internet !!

    I totally oppose this cult and am not happy about this hub.

    But honestly, long term, I'd be more worried about the plans for the new Islamic center (including a school - tho this might be cutback) in Dublin 15.

    No much time for Islam either, but I'd be more concerned about the Scientology brigade. Everything I've seen and read about them is pretty damning.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,593 ✭✭✭theteal


    Dang, they pulled out all the stops for that launch. David Mucksavage and all.

    I hope nobody loses too much money or family members by taking part.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,809 ✭✭✭Hector Savage


    smacl wrote: »
    No much time for Islam either, but I'd be more concerned about the Scientology brigade. Everything I've seen and read about them is pretty damning.

    I agree, but look at the numbers, how many members does Scientology have WORLDWIDE ? I think its ~50k ....

    But yeah, I remember one year they accosted me in town when I was a timid 18 year old kid and they wanted me to do some test - they eventually got me to do it , and it went on and on and on - so eventually I said look I need to leave to catch the bus etc ... they said We'll call the busdriver ... have him wait for you - WTF !


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 171 ✭✭Zerbini Blewitt


    Strange to see McSavage (surely one of the shadiest of lunatics on the fringe of the American landscape) in Baile Ath Cliath :eek:

    Some threat must be on the horizon from the US authorities to cause all this investment??

    I was looking at that site on google satellite. There’s a foot-bridge over the Dodder and it’s very public & open at the back. I wonder will they try to intimidate locals from using that footpath over time or put up hoardings or something?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,354 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    I wonder will they try to intimidate locals from using that footpath...?
    The very best of luck to them! That'd be a sight to see. Some of the lads you'd meet around the north side of the Dodder there wouldn't be overly receptive to intimidation.

    :D


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,430 ✭✭✭RustyNut


    endacl wrote: »
    The very best of luck to them! That'd be a sight to see. Some of the lads you'd meet around the north side of the Dodder there wouldn't be overly receptive to intimidation.

    :D

    They'll set their alien overlord on them, that will learn them.......


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,354 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    RustyNut wrote: »
    They'll set their alien overlord on them, that will learn them.......
    There'd be bits of overlord all over the gaff.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,430 ✭✭✭RustyNut


    endacl wrote: »
    There'd be bits of overlord all over the gaff.
    I heard he can turn their buckfast into water. That will get them running.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,778 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    RustyNut wrote: »
    I heard he can turn their buckfast into water. That will get them running.

    They're perfectly capable of turning buckfast into water by themselves


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch




  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 15,751 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tabnabs


    From the IT website
    A HSE drugs counsellor and a government funded anti-racism charity praised the work of the Church of Scientology during the opening of the controversial organisation’s new Dublin facility.

    A representative of the charity, Sports against Racism Ireland (Sari), outlined at the event how it distributes Scientology-produced literature to those taking part in its programmes around the country.

    The event was also addressed by a HSE drugs worker who praised Scientology-supported anti-drugs programmes.

    On October 14th last, the Church of Scientology opened the “Ideal Org” centre in Firhouse, Tallaght, which includes a 1,050-seat auditorium.

    Scientology has been criticised elsewhere for using seemingly innocuous front groups, such as drugs and human rights organisations, to establish itself in a country and to recruit members from vulnerable communities.

    A spokeswoman defended its programmes yesterday and described critics of its drugs programme as “religious bigots” who “complain about anything, even saving the life of a mother’s child”.
    Merrion Square

    In recent years it has stepped up its anti-drugs and anti-psychiatry campaigns in Ireland. This has coincided with the opening of a “national affairs office” on Merrion Square in 2016, the first such office to open outside the US.

    Both the HSE and Sari distanced themselves from Scientology when contacted by The Irish Times and said they do not endorse Scientology programmes, with one Sari official saying it was “duped” into taking part in the event.

    The event included a speech by church leader David Miscavige and an address by Amina Moustafa Keogh, described as a “programme director” with Sari.

    Sari chairman Perry Ogdan said he believes the church misrepresented his organisation as supporting Scientology and he was “still trying to get to the bottom of what happened”.

    He said Ms Keogh went with the understanding that she would be speaking at a separate event and not at the opening ceremony.

    Another Sari official, who asked not to be identified, said Ms Keogh had been “duped” into appearing at the event and he had threatened legal action against Scientology if it did not remove a report from the web mentioning her appearance.

    “The plan was we would go out and talk about human rights and nothing else. Then to our surprise and shock her photograph appeared with a quotation on their website. It’s crazy.
    ‘Duped’

    “We were basically duped into attending. Amina was duped into making a short speech.”

    He said Sari has distributed Scientology affiliated human rights material to children in the past but not recently. The materials, which have been seen by The Irish Times, are funded and printed by Scientology but do not mention the organisation.

    Sari promotes sport as a means of combating racism and other forms of discrimination. In 2015, some 40 per cent (€31,500) of its funding came from government sources.

    HSE drug outreach worker Nicola Keating also made a speech endorsing Scientology’s “Drug Free World” programme which she said was “straight-talking and speaks to everyone”, the Scientology website stated.

    A HSE spokeswoman told The Irish Times: “Ms Keating was not attending the event in her capacity as a HSE outreach worker, she was attending as a member of the community in her personal capacity.

    “The HSE does not endorse the Scientology ‘Drug Free World’ programme,” she added.

    Asked about the nature of both women’s appearance at the event, a Scientology spokeswoman said: “Both Ms Keating and Ms Keogh were invited to speak, which they were happy to do.”
    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/anti-racism-charity-duped-into-speaking-at-scientology-event-1.3266268


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


    This post has been deleted.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Yes indeedy, there are some minority cults that one should be seen to support, and some that one should not be seen to support :pac:
    Its a minefield out there for a young, but ambitious, public speaker.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,778 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    recedite wrote: »
    Yes indeedy, there are some minority cults that one should be seen to support, and some that one should not be seen to support :pac:
    Its a minefield out there for a young, but ambitious, public speaker.

    By 'duped' I wonder does that mean they'll have to return the brown paper envelopes :pac:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,132 ✭✭✭Tow


    smacl wrote: »
    By 'duped' I wonder does that mean they'll have to return the brown paper envelopes :pac:

    I don't see how anyone could have been 'duped'. Despite it looking like an American St Particks Day festival complete with Irish Dancers. They make no secret of who they are and there is no shortage of signage and symbols.

    When is the money (including lost growth) Michael Noonan took in the Pension Levy going to be paid back?



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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


    This post has been deleted.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,354 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    ....... wrote: »
    I think the insinuation is that they thought they were speaking at an anti drugs event and not at the opening of the Church of Scientology latest Ideal Org in Dublin.

    Two cheeks of the same arse. How they could have been so stupid as not to realise that is beyond me...


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


    This post has been deleted.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,132 ✭✭✭Tow


    What I can't understand is why Dialogue Ireland has no coverage of the opening? They (he) were quick enough investigate who the new owners where a month or two ago.

    When is the money (including lost growth) Michael Noonan took in the Pension Levy going to be paid back?



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,778 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    What they really need to do is open a Scientology ethos school in the local neighbourhood and see if they can get state funding for it. Could make for some interesting debate on the patronage system :pac:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,354 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    Feck it. Maybe we should all go for a visit?


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,411 ✭✭✭oceanclub


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/scientologists-in-dublin-peddle-autism-cure-0z5vc6d2m
    A woman who says that the Church of Scientology in Dublin offered her a €1,600 detoxification programme that would cure her autistic son has complained to gardaí.

    The church, which recently opened a centre in Firhouse, is likely to face questions about its alleged promotion of the controversial treatment. It follows claims by Fiona O’Leary, an autism rights campaigner, that a Scientology member based in the centre offered to sell her a “purification rundown” programme to treat her son.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


    This post has been deleted.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,411 ✭✭✭oceanclub


    ....... wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    She's complaining to the Guards because she claims they are trying to sell a autism "cure".
    She went and did a personality test and became involved with them willingly. And now she's upset over them offering one of their known quackery cures? The simple answer here is don't get involved with them in the first place!

    Perhaps an autism activist she only did a test with them ... to draw them out and get them to attempt to sell her a cure?

    P.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    ....... wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.
    At the most basic level, you don't need any grounds to make a complaint to Gardai. You can complain that you don't like your neighbour's shoes if you want.

    It's up to the Garda then to decide if there is an investigation required, charges to be filed, etc.

    Off the top of my head, if someone is purporting to offer medical services despite not being licensed to do so, that's one offence.

    Fraud is another.

    There are probably a few other more obscure things you could look at.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


    This post has been deleted.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,533 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    Yup really annoys me when I see homeopathy bollocks in a pharmacy.

    Scrap the cap!



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    A reporter for the Irish Times looks into Scientology's low-cost Santas out in Firhouse. Plus gets approached by Scientology Security.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/scientology-community-activity-sparks-concern-in-firhouse-1.3322442
    Residents and politicians in Firhouse have expressed concern about community outreach efforts by the Church of Scientology in the south Dublin suburb. Last week the controversial organisation, which has been officially labelled a cult in several countries, opened a “Winter Wonderland” event at its new 1,200-seat facility in Firhouse. The event lasts for a month and features fairground rides, Santa Claus and several other children’s activities.

    The event, which is free to enter, is the latest in a series of community events hosted by the facility since its opening in October. Other events include a Halloween festival, a variety concert and an “Alice in Wonderland tea party”. “Nothing’s for free. What is it they’re trying to do?” asked Firhouse resident and local area representative for the Social Democrats Carly Bailey. She was worried the church was targeting economically deprived communities with a view to recruitment. Ms Bailey, a mother of two, noted that bringing children to see Santa Claus can cost €20 or more in many places but that it was free at the Scientology centre. “It’s obviously aimed at people who don’t have a huge amount of money who would be absolutely thrilled to bring their kids to something that doesn’t cost an arm and a leg.”

    Dublin South-West TD SeCrowe said he was worried Scientology was attempting to become part of the fabric of the community in Tallaght before starting to actively recruit people. “They’ve made it known local groups can avail of its facilities. And there is a shortage of community facilities in the area. There’s always groups looking for a meeting room or something like that. So that’s their way in,” the Sinn F TD said. “But I’ve huge concerns in relation to the group itself. It is a cult. I wouldn’t be encouraging anybody to be using the facilities,” he added.

    “No, we won’t be going. From what I’ve seen on television and online I wouldn’t be bringing my kids near the place,” said Louise Kenny, a mother of two, while she shopped in the Firhouse Shopping Centre.

    When The Irish Times visited the facility on Sunday a security guard followed this reporter before ordering deletion of a photograph. Church management was alerted after The Irish Times refused. The church’s director of external affairs, Diana Stahl, said the facility was open to all but that members of the press must make an appointment. She said about 800 people had visited the centre since the Winter Wonderland opened last Friday. When The Irish Times visited at 2.30pm on Sunday there were less than 20 visitors present.

    Ms Stahl said members of the community were welcome to come in and discuss their concerns with a member of staff, except for protesters “who only want to cause trouble”. Asked how many people have joined the church since the Firhouse facility opened, another Scientology official, who identified herself as Janet, said they do not keep track of those numbers. In a separate emailed statement, Ms Stahl said Scientology is a “non conversionalist” organisation. “You can meet many people who we have known and worked with for years who will confirm to you that we have never tried to ‘recruit’ them.” She said “various local councillors and community representatives, local organisations, local media, numerous sports groups, artists and young families” have visited the facility since it opened.

    Many of Scientology’s Firhouse events have been accompanied by protests outside the facility by a small but vocal group of anti-Scientology activists. A protest against the “Winter Wonderland” festival took place last Friday. On Sunday a play titled “Squeeze my Cans” was staged in another community centre in Firhouse which mocked the church. It stars US actress and anti-Scientology activist Cathy Schenkelberg, who was a member of the church for 14 years before she left. The autobiographical plot features a woman auditioning to be the girlfriend of famous Scientologist and actor Tom Cruise.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    When The Irish Times visited the facility on Sunday a security guard followed this reporter before ordering deletion of a photograph. Church management was alerted after The Irish Times refused. The church’s director of external affairs, Diana Stahl, said the facility was open to all but that members of the press must make an appointment. She said about 800 people had visited the centre since the Winter Wonderland opened last Friday. When The Irish Times visited at 2.30pm on Sunday there were less than 20 visitors present.
    These kinds of nonsense demands and illegal overreaching are typical of Scientology.

    Louis Theroux's recent documentary also showed the same kind of behaviour - they illegally closed a public road and then approached the documentary team, aggressively demanding they vacate the area and stop filming. All the time denying that it was a public road and claiming authority that they didn't have.

    It's preying on the human nature to tend to obey someone who acts with apparent confidence and authority, and it's how they peddle their brainwashing.

    Hopefully Irish journalists know enough about their rights to push back. Conor Gallagher thankfully seems to know, but how many journalists would sheepishly delete the photo and leave, incorrectly believing that security are entitled to demand it?


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


    This post has been deleted.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Some good quotes in there..
    She was worried the church was targeting economically deprived communities with a view to recruitment
    They should try opening a free school and get the state to fund it. Best scam ever.
    Santa Claus can cost €20 or more in many places but that it was free at the Scientology centre. “It’s obviously aimed at people who don’t have a huge amount of money who would be absolutely thrilled to bring their kids to something that doesn’t cost an arm and a leg.
    Ah, but what's the cost of losing your soul? Surely more than an arm or a leg :D


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    Conor Gallagher looks deeper into goings-on in Firhouse and attempts to infiltrate into schools around the country:
    An older man says he doesn’t know much Scientology but has “no real problem” with their tactics. “They can’t be much worse than the Catholic Church, and we put up with them for long enough.”

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/religion-and-beliefs/how-scientology-is-trying-to-insert-itself-into-irish-schools-1.3327646


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,992 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    Scientologists meet with Fine Gael TD Colm Brophy in Leinster House http://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/politics/scientologists-meet-fine-gael-td-11696758 why are FG TDs the only ones willing to meet with them, money attracts?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,458 ✭✭✭✭gandalf


    Tbh up until recently I would had a benign attitude towards them. I thought that if an adult wanted to get involved with them it was their decision. However since that centre has opened and the deliberate targeting of children my mind has changed totally and I see them for the danger they are. It's one thing to sucker in an adult to their scam pyramid scheme "religion" it's quite another to deliberately target children.

    Apart from the attempt to sell a fake medical cure to that woman's son, they are running a film evening right after school on a Friday night attempting to attract in local teenagers, we have that monstrosity Winter Wonderland and now a revelation that they are sending out fake education packs to schools.

    This cult needs to be stopped in its tracks, we are trying extract one from our education system already we don't need to replace it with an even wackier one.

    I'm from the area and have a child attending school in a local school and to say all the parents are concerned is an understatement in the extreme. Most parents appear to be staying away from their Christmas fair, anytime I've driven past it appears dead. You'd really be a ****e parent if you did bring your kid there with their reputation.

    Btw the women that put the complaint into the Gardai has been threatened as has her kids by one of "staff" from the centre.

    They are a Pyramid Scheme offering false hope to vulnerable people and they have no place in our society.


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