Drink driving-virtue signaling gone mad

Bobtheman · 24-03-2019 8:19pm

lawred2 wrote: »

Bobtheman wrote: »

What bull****. Crazy drivers on the road all the time. Most of whom have no booze.
You base society's views on what? The law doesn't always reflect popular opinion. A lot of people will say one thing and think another.

Who said anything about popular opinion?

Diminished capacity due to alcohol is a proven reality.

There are indeed crazy drivers the road and when they break other road traffic laws they should and sometimes do get sanctioned accordingly.

Drink driving is no different.

To be honest, I'm not even sure why I responded to your incoherent post.

I would simply abolish the morning after check points.

machiavellianme · 24-03-2019 8:20pm

Bigmac1euro wrote: »

Hahahaha! "not me" :pac::pac::pac::pac:

Do you think not once in your whole life you have drove over the limit ?
It doesn't matter if you drive in the evening or you feel 100% fine. If you had a rake of pints the night before or wine you will sometimes be over the limit until later the following night therefore rendering the "evening drive" over the limit.

Lucky for you I am indeed gods gift and BTW a car with 14,000 km over 9 years is actually pretty bad for the car. Why bother having a car at all ? Looks like you might be throwing money down the drain while drink driving :P

Yes, I can genuinely state that I've never driven while impaired by alcohol.
I drink even less than I drive. I've not touched a drop in about 5 years and before that I was so worried about drink driving after seeing 8 of my friends killed in a car crash that I wouldn't drive in the same week after having a drink, nevermind the next day.

Anyone who owns a car is throwing money down the drain. It is a rapidly depreciating asset. But it gives a sense of security if you need it in an emergency and taxis aren't available.

Bobtheman · 24-03-2019 8:23pm

lawred2 wrote: »

Bobtheman wrote: »

What bull****. Crazy drivers on the road all the time. Most of whom have no booze.
You base society's views on what? The law doesn't always reflect popular opinion. A lot of people will say one thing and think another.

Who said anything about popular opinion?

Diminished capacity due to alcohol is a proven reality.

There are indeed crazy drivers the road and when they break other road traffic laws they should and sometimes do get sanctioned accordingly.

Drink driving is no different.

To be honest, I'm not even sure why I responded to your incoherent post.[/quote
Should people drink and drive? No.
Should there be a bit more flexibility in the law ? Yes
The first ban should be short-term a couple of months
The second ban should be jail
But amazing how many people here jump up and down about drivers drinking who mostly don't cause accidents but had no issue with most high streets being dominated by drug dealers ( pubs)
Double standards

lawred2 · 24-03-2019 8:25pm

Emiliano Many Cardinal wrote: »

To me boards is the anomaly, I have come across no one in real life who supports morning bagging or the lower limit. Friends, family and acquaintances alike giving out about morning bagging, cursing it to the last and no idea at all why the limit reduction was neceaaary has been a general conversation topic over the last while.

Never heard one person moaning about it...

e: actually I tell a lie, my mother in law complains about it. But I put that down to her 18 month ban in the UK for still being over the limit at 1130 the next morning. She must have had some skinful the night before.

lawred2 · 24-03-2019 8:27pm

Bobtheman wrote: »

lawred2 wrote: »

Who said anything about popular opinion?

Diminished capacity due to alcohol is a proven reality.

There are indeed crazy drivers the road and when they break other road traffic laws they should and sometimes do get sanctioned accordingly.

Drink driving is no different.

To be honest, I'm not even sure why I responded to your incoherent post.

Should people drink and drive? No.
Should there be a bit more flexibility in the law ? Yes
The first ban should be short-term a couple of months
The second ban should be jail
But amazing how many people here jump up and down about drivers drinking who mostly don't cause accidents but had no issue with most high streets being dominated by drug dealers ( pubs)
Double standards

You can go to the pub without driving. Taking the car to the pub is a conscious decision to drink and drive. I don't see any double standard at all.

super_furry · 24-03-2019 8:29pm

Think it's high time to introduce a drinking licence myself.

Dravokivich · 24-03-2019 8:29pm

Allinall wrote: »

Of course there is a right to drive.

If you’re not disqualified from driving by age, lack of license or any other reason, then by default you have a right to drive.

You are completely wrong in saying rights are set out in the constitution or in law.

What are you talking about? You are disqualified from driving due to lack of license.

McCrack · 24-03-2019 8:35pm

Allinall wrote: »

Of course there is a right to drive.

If you’re not disqualified from driving by age, lack of license or any other reason, then by default you have a right to drive.

You are completely wrong in saying rights are set out in the constitution or in law.

Driving is a privilege which is earned by means of a driving licence which can be taken away by a Court for a determined period of time in accordance with law

There is no automatic right or otherwise that anyone has to drive in a public place

Dravokivich · 24-03-2019 8:35pm

Bigmac1euro wrote: »

I can almost guarantee with 100% certainty that anyone who drinks posting on this thread has drove over the limit the following morning without realizing.
It amuses me to watch people post as if they are gods gift and have never put a foot wrong.
Ps. those tester kits you buy in the shop are not nearly as accurate as the tests the Garda use.

Nope, if im driving following day, I ain't drinking. Mainly because I do be a bit slower to wake up, if I've had some. T'is simple to go by.

Clareman · 24-03-2019 8:36pm

In my opinion they have drink driving beaten, not only are drink drivers seen as the complete scum of the earth but the only people that do it will never stop doing it.

For me, the "old" scheme where you were a little over the limit you got points was spot on and there wasn't a need to change it. The problem I have is no-one know how much is ok to drink with, some times I know I'd be fine after 3 pints but other times I'd be pissed after 3 pints, really depends on a lot of factors.

TheIrishGrover · 24-03-2019 8:39pm

Bobtheman wrote: »

I realise we have to have laws on this but to be honest I wonder if the checkpoints in the morning should be done way with ? Or perhaps less checkpoints overall?

I honestly think its ok to drive a short distance (1-3 miles) with 3 pints. There I said it . We allow people to drink heavily which is always a health risk but seem hell bent on persecuting people with a few pints? Im talking about rural areas.

No I dont drive drunk. Never have.

Why not?

AndrewJRenko · 24-03-2019 8:45pm

Emiliano Many Cardinal wrote: »

To me boards is the anomaly, I have come across no one in real life who supports morning bagging or the lower limit. Friends, family and acquaintances alike giving out about morning bagging, cursing it to the last and no idea at all why the limit reduction was neceaaary has been a general conversation topic over the last while.

You may need to add some diversity to your peer group.

dan1895 · 24-03-2019 8:47pm

Clareman wrote: »

drink drivers seen as the complete scum of the earth

Rightly so

machiavellianme · 24-03-2019 10:34pm

The thing that gets me about the drink driving issue is that a lot of the single car accidents that are reported in the late hours of the night / early morning may in fact be suicide. But that doesn't suit the RSA agenda so they are reporting them as drink/drug driving.

Bobtheman · 24-03-2019 10:42pm

dan1895 wrote: »

Rightly so

Really drink Drivers scum of the earth?Now that you have exhausted your vocabulary-what are paedophiles?!

Bobtheman · 24-03-2019 10:46pm

TheIrishGrover wrote: »

Why not?

I live within a mile of ten pubs. Im really aiming at rural dwellers. Im not against drink driving laws just think they need to be moderated. Tired of virtue signalers who have no issue with the amount of booze we allow to be sold, thus costing god knows what for families/health services etc but wet themselves in virtue over drink drivers?

Irish Guitarist · 24-03-2019 10:46pm

It's a known fact that car crashes are never fatal when one of the drivers has driven less than three miles. It's simple physics.

BBFAN · 24-03-2019 10:48pm

I don't agree with driving with 3 or 4 pints but I do agree that it's very hard to know if you're going to over the limit the morning after the night before and catching people out like this is a bit ott.

I heard a radio article about it before when a woman was breath tested at a checkpoint and found to be over the limit so she was arrested and brought to the Garda station and tested there. She was fine when she got to the Garda station and was let go but what I didn't realise is that still goes down as an arrest on your record! Like wtf?? Arrested on suspicion of something is still an arrest.

That has an effect on someone who needs Garda clearance for their work and that's very serious. I think the limit is so low now that even alcohol in mouthwash is going to be picked up which is just going too far.

pablo128 · 24-03-2019 10:48pm

machiavellianme wrote: »

The thing that gets me about the drink driving issue is that a lot of the single car accidents that are reported in the late hours of the night / early morning may in fact be suicide. But that doesn't suit the RSA agenda so they are reporting them as drink/drug driving.

I would assume post mortems are done afterwards which have indicated intoxicants in the deceased systems.

amcalester · 24-03-2019 10:49pm

lawred2 wrote: »

Never heard one person moaning about it...

e: actually I tell a lie, my mother in law complains about it. But I put that down to her 18 month ban in the UK for still being over the limit at 1130 the next morning. She must have had some skinful the night before.

I do a few hours work in a pub every now and then, old school boozer type place, and drink driving comes up quite a lot.

Most punters have no issue with current rules and have said that they’d think twice about driving the morning after or cut back the night before if they had to drive.

This can only be a good thing. Unfortunately there’ll always be people like Nox who think they know better but really are just a collision waiting to happen.

pablo128 · 24-03-2019 10:54pm

Bobtheman wrote: »

I live within a mile of ten pubs. Im really aiming at rural dwellers. Im not against drink driving laws just think they need to be moderated. Tired of virtue signalers who have no issue with the amount of booze we allow to be sold, thus costing god knows what for families/health services etc but wet themselves in virtue over drink drivers?

I don't give a flying fu.ck if you drink yourself to oblivion. I don't give a fu.ck about your family either. I don't know them, and they would be your responsibility anyway.

I do give a fu.ck if you were out on the road with drink on you, putting other members of the public at risk.

orourkeda1977 · 24-03-2019 10:55pm

Bobtheman wrote: »

I realise we have to have laws on this but to be honest I wonder if the checkpoints in the morning should be done way with ? Or perhaps less checkpoints overall?

I honestly think its ok to drive a short distance (1-3 miles) with 3 pints. There I said it . We allow people to drink heavily which is always a health risk but seem hell bent on persecuting people with a few pints? Im talking about rural areas.

No I dont drive drunk. Never have.

Anyone who sits behind the wheel of a vehicle with alcohol in their system should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

A zero tolerance approach should be adopted on this issue. If their driving could be affected by the previous nights excess the they should not be afforded an easy way out

If an adult wants to sit in a pub and get plastered. Good luck to them.

Just dont jeopardise the safety of innocent road users and pedestrians by an act of wanton negligence and get behind the wheel with any alcohol.

Guy:Incognito · 24-03-2019 10:56pm

Bobtheman wrote: »

Bottom line is the vast majority of drink drivers don't cause accidents. Again I emphasis that we allow people to drink themselves to death unless they get into a car. Yes I know they can kill others in a car but a more flexible law is needed.

So let them drink drive unless they kill someone? Thats **** all use to the innocent dead person, is it?

alan partridge aha · 24-03-2019 10:57pm

I'm defo going to buy one of those tester devices.

Whatever about been caught on the night it would be some kick in the balls to be done in the morning.

Guy:Incognito · 24-03-2019 10:59pm

Clareman wrote: »

For me, the "old" scheme where you were a little over the limit you got points was spot on and there wasn't a need to change it. The problem I have is no-one know how much is ok to drink with, some times I know I'd be fine after 3 pints but other times I'd be pissed after 3 pints, really depends on a lot of factors.

You think you'll be fine you mean. How do you know if you kill someone that if you had no drink you wouldnt have reacted slightly quicker or differently and the person might have just been injured and not killed?

Do you really need a drink that badly you're willing to gamble with your own and other peoples lives?

Guy:Incognito · 24-03-2019 11:02pm

Bobtheman wrote: »

Tired of virtue signalers who have no issue with the amount of booze we allow to be sold, thus costing god knows what for families/health services etc but wet themselves in virtue over drink drivers?

What do you not get about this, its really simple. Youve no right to be putting other people at risk because you want a drink. So no drink driving.

Pinch Flat · 24-03-2019 11:03pm

We really have some weird attitudes to drink driving.

Guy:Incognito · 24-03-2019 11:03pm

BBFAN wrote: »

I don't agree with driving with 3 or 4 pints but I do agree that it's very hard to know if you're going to over the limit the morning after the night before and catching people out like this is a bit ott.

Whats the difference between having 3, driving and blowing x over the limit and having 10, driving the next morning and blowing the same level?

Father Hernandez · 24-03-2019 11:51pm

alan partridge aha wrote: »

I'm defo going to buy one of those tester devices.

Whatever about been caught on the night it would be some kick in the balls to be done in the morning.

I'd like to do the same, but where can you buy a reliable one that would stand up if asked a question by the Gardai or in a court of law?

Have said no to going out a few evenings solely because I'm driving in the morning. RSA (I think) website is saying 6 pints would have you not able to drive for 12 hours which is fair enough if true, if stop drinking by 7pm, would have you okay for 7am but still petrified I might be over the limit.

mzungu · 25-03-2019 12:00am

Father Hernandez wrote: »

I'd like to do the same, but where can you buy a reliable one that would stand up if asked a question by the Gardai or in a court of law?

Have said no to going out a few evenings solely because I'm driving in the morning. RSA (I think) website is saying 6 pints would have you not able to drive for 12 hours which is fair enough if true, if stop drinking by 7pm, would have you okay for 7am but still petrified I might be over the limit.

AFAIK none of them. If a Guard stops you then the only one that matters is the one he has.

amcalester · 25-03-2019 12:00am

Father Hernandez wrote: »

I'd like to do the same, but where can you buy a reliable one that would stand up if asked a question by the Gardai or in a court of law?

Have said no to going out a few evenings solely because I'm driving in the morning. RSA (I think) website is saying 6 pints would have you not able to drive for 12 hours which is fair enough if true, if stop drinking by 7pm, would have you okay for 7am but still petrified I might be over the limit.

None of them will stand up in court, if you’re over you’re over.

joe swanson · 25-03-2019 12:03am

It's never OK. Drink driving laws need to be simplified way too many technicalities and loopholes to enable people to get off. There are solicitors and barristers in this country in specialise in getting clearly guilty people off with this . They should be ashamed .

Father Hernandez · 25-03-2019 12:04am

mzungu wrote: »

AFAIK none of them. If the Guard stops you then the only one that matters is the one he has.

amcalester wrote: »

None of them will stand up in court, if you’re over you’re over.

Thought as much.

I can't stand people who do it (knowingly). If I've had 2 drinks, I automatically know I'm over.

If I've had 6 and wake up the next morning and drive, I have no idea if I'm over even if it is after the 12 hours it says on RSA. Everyone's body is different.

That's what is unfair IMO

AtomicHorror · 25-03-2019 12:04am

Bobtheman wrote: »

Nope. If you are cause an accident then you go to jail. No contradiction there

By this logic we can all drive 150kph without fear of prosecution, as long as we don't actually hurt or kill anyone. The law stops being about risk management and goes full consequences-only. Attempted murder no longer illegal, etc.

Seriously, think over your posts for even 30 seconds before you hit the blue button.

alan partridge aha · 25-03-2019 12:09am

Father Hernandez wrote: »

I'd like to do the same, but where can you buy a reliable one that would stand up if asked a question by the Gardai or in a court of law?

Have said no to going out a few evenings solely because I'm driving in the morning. RSA (I think) website is saying 6 pints would have you not able to drive for 12 hours which is fair enough if true, if stop drinking by 7pm, would have you okay for 7am but still petrified I might be over the limit.

Ya don't know, but would like one that would give you a reading and then allow 10%.

If you drank 6 pints from 9pm till midnight, then as a rule of thumb the body will process a pint every 2 hrs. So 5 pints would be processed by 10 hrs after 9pm which would be 7am. So technically you could be ok after that with less than a pint in your system. Don't take this as true though test yourself 1st before ya drive.

I'd be sweating a brick though if I was bagged at 9am.

bodhrandude · 25-03-2019 12:27am

Drivers can also lessen the chance of being over the limit by re-hydrating, maybe drink a pint or two of water before going to bed it helps thin the alcohol out a bit. I'm not a driver myself but it also lessens my hangover in the morning and helps make you more alert.

25-03-2019 12:32am

alan partridge aha wrote: »

Ya don't know, but would like one that would give you a reading and then allow 10%.

If you drank 6 pints from 9pm till midnight, then as a rule of thumb the body will process a pint every 2 hrs. So 5 pints would be processed by 10 hrs after 9pm which would be 7am. So technically you could be ok after that with less than a pint in your system. Don't take this as true though test yourself 1st before ya drive.

I'd be sweating a brick though if I was bagged at 9am.

I’ve seen seen lads on different occasions blow under the limit at times between 9am and noon after anything from 10 to 15 pints the night before finishing up at 2am at the earliest though which really does not tally with the number put out there.

alan partridge aha · 25-03-2019 12:36am

Emiliano Many Cardinal wrote: »

I’ve seen seen lads on different occasions blow under the limit at times between 9am and noon after anything from 10 to 15 pints the night before finishing up at 2am at the earliest though which really does not tally with the number put out there.

Perhaps, but as a rule of thumb an average Male will process 1 unit per hour or glass of beer/stout.

machiavellianme · 25-03-2019 12:42am

Emiliano Many Cardinal wrote: »

I’ve seen seen lads on different occasions blow under the limit at times between 9am and noon after anything from 10 to 15 pints the night before finishing up at 2am at the earliest though which really does not tally with the number put out there.

Yes, but presumably that 10 pints wasn't all at 2am so some would have been processed before finishing up drinking. And there may have been some alco still in their system too, just not enough to trigger the breathalyser.

25-03-2019 12:57am

machiavellianme wrote: »

Yes, but presumably that 10 pints wasn't all at 2am so some would have been processed before finishing up drinking. And there may have been some alco still in their system too, just not enough to trigger the breathalyser.

I know this, the clock stats ticking the minute you start drinking not when you finish etc and the limit isn’t zero but at the same time you have people advising not driving until 6 in the evening if you look at a pint.

cannotlogin · 25-03-2019 1:05am

I despise drink driving.

I would have no issue with it if the driver was only posing a risk to themself, off with them but to pose a risk to others for no other reason than pure selfishness is just wrong.

I have fallen out with one friend over his drink driving and don't regret the loss of the friendship.

I know the impact of losing someone to a drunk driver. People who would still be with us only for the selfishness of others.

Maxed-irl · 25-03-2019 1:05am

As I sit here having a beer I think maybe I shouldn't drive tomorrowas the rules state hourly from your last drink. I'm all for pushing drink driving off the roads but seriously stating someone cant drive for the weekend after 8 can is ludacris. Another easy target imo for the gnarrrdi to make a few shillings on a Saturday morning

AtomicHorror · 25-03-2019 1:13am

Maxed-irl wrote: »

As I sit here having a beer I think maybe I shouldn't drive tomorrowas the rules state hourly from your last drink. I'm all for pushing drink driving off the roads but seriously stating someone cant drive for the weekend after 8 can is ludacris. Another easy target imo for the gnarrrdi to make a few shillings on a Saturday morning

You either have alcohol in your system or you don't. The night of or the morning after, it's the same substance. It increases the risk just the same.

Why should someone who fails a breath test at 8am be treated any different to someone who fails it at 3am?

Maxed-irl · 25-03-2019 1:18am

AtomicHorror wrote: »

You either have alcohol in your system or you don't. The night of or the morning after, it's the same substance. It increases the risk just the same.

Why should someone who fails a breath test at 8am be treated any different to someone who fails it at 3am?

I'm stating that someone who has 5 or 6 pints then goes to bed sleeps for 8 hours then wakes up is not the same as someone walking out of a pub at 3am and getting into a car. Since the law is so strict if you have say 8 pints you cant drive for 16 hours after your last drink.

Twenty Grand · 25-03-2019 1:24am

Maxed-irl wrote: »

I'm stating that someone who has 5 or 6 pints then goes to bed sleeps for 8 hours then wakes up is not the same as someone walking out of a pub at 3am and getting into a car. Since the law is so strict if you have say 8 pints you cant drive for 16 hours after your last drink.

You're wrong on your sums.

The "average" persons processes a unit of alcohol an hour. A pint is 2 units.

If you had one pint every 2 hours from 6pm to 12pm (4 total) then you should be sober to drive by 2am, though I wouldn't want to test it.

AtomicHorror · 25-03-2019 1:32am

Maxed-irl wrote: »

I'm stating that someone who has 5 or 6 pints then goes to bed sleeps for 8 hours then wakes up is not the same as someone walking out of a pub at 3am and getting into a car. Since the law is so strict if you have say 8 pints you cant drive for 16 hours after your last drink.

A person who drinks 6 pints and then sleeps 8 hours before driving might be exactly the same as someone who drinks 2 pints and gets into the car at 3am, depending on their metabolism and their tolerance to alcohol. Scale the numbers up and down as you like. 10 pints followed by sleep is maybe about the same as 6 pints and straight into the car. The intentions may differ, but the results is the same, and anyone who gets hurt as a result of the 10 pint guy probably won't care that he tried to sleep it off before he ran them over.

The variance on the numbers is probably huge, hence the push for less tolerance, but the point is nobody's counting the pints or the hours of sleep, the only measure that matters is how much alcohol is in your blood when you're at the wheel.

Maxed-irl · 25-03-2019 1:34am

Twenty Grand wrote: »

You're wrong on your sums.

The "average" persons processes a unit of alcohol an hour. A pint is 2 units.

If you had one pint every 2 hours from 6pm to 12pm (4 total) then you should be sober to drive by 2am, though I wouldn't want to test it.

I'm wrong you clearly said the average person processes one unit of alcohol per hour a pint is 2 units. I said if you had 8 cans you cant drive for 16 hours. 8 x 2 is 16 if I remember basic maths. Maybe you should learn basic reading and comprehension again

Gimme A Pound · 25-03-2019 1:37am

Balanadan wrote: »

I remember the old days, about 5 years ago, when you could go down the pub on a Friday after work, have four or five pints, and drive home not a bother. Simpler times.

No you couldn't.

Bobtheman wrote: »

I live within a mile of ten pubs. Im really aiming at rural dwellers. Im not against drink driving laws just think they need to be moderated. Tired of virtue signalers who have no issue with the amount of booze we allow to be sold, thus costing god knows what for families/health services etc but wet themselves in virtue over drink drivers?

You keep misusing the term "virtue signalling" and you keep repeating the nonsensical argument that people are ok with lots of pubs/binge drinking but not ok with people driving after three pints. As if you know what all of the above people think.

It's far more likely that people both object to binge drinking and to people driving after three pints - and it makes no sense to call pubs "drug dealers" but then to defend people driving after paying one.

If the binge drinkers got behind a driving wheel after a session, they'd get more criticism than the ones after three pints. But if people binge drink and don't drive, hardly anyone thinks that's ok but how can binge drinking be policed? It's personal choice - and sometimes bar staff do discontinue to serve them, and their friends bring them home.

I'd be fairly drunk after three pints - I know not everyone would be, but it's a significant amount of alcohol for driving. I think it would be fine to drive after one pint or 1.5 pints.

But this is a law, nothing to do with virtue signalling.

Necro · 25-03-2019 1:43am

CoBo55 wrote: »

Em... What does virtue signalling mean?

I'd also like to know this. Or preferably for people to stop using the stupid fcuking term.

alan partridge aha · 25-03-2019 1:43am

Maxed-irl wrote: »

I'm wrong you clearly said the average person processes one unit of alcohol per hour a pint is 2 units. I said if you had 8 cans you cant drive for 16 hours. 8 x 2 is 16 if I remember basic maths. Maybe you should learn basic reading and comprehension again

The crux of this is that I understand that the body processes alcohol from the start of the session.

Drink driving-virtue signaling gone mad

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