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How about get a degree where there are jobs instead of crying about it.

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12467…14

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    #92
    facehugger99
    Registered Users Posts: 7,230 ✭✭✭facehugger99


    Your Face wrote: »
    An Arts Degree is still a degree.

    Don't be preposterous.


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    #93
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,004 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    mariaalice wrote: »
    He is not entitled he is bit delusional wanting a career in publishing and the arts while living in rural Clare and as I said its not the worst article of its kind.

    So not entitled then? The “entitled” argument fell apart at the very first enquiry. Kudos for admitting it.

    Now on to the second point he talks in the article about the expectation to move away from rural Ireland to go to uni in the first place. He never expected to work in Clare with his degree. It’s an expectation people from rural Ireland are born with.

    So, what exactly has this bloke done wrong? You seem pretty sure he’s wrong whether he’s “entitled” or “delusional” for wanting something he explicitly says he didn’t expect.

    So can you tell me what this fella has done that’s so wrong? Lots of posters seem in complete agreement that he’s wrong and entitled or delusional but definitely to be ridiculed. So it should be easy to point out exactly what he’s done wrong.


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    #94
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    So it should be easy to point out exactly what he’s done wrong.

    picked a foolish degree and career to be going looking for any sympathy when the irish times told him "wanna be this months poster boy for how tough life is when your work is your hobby?"


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    #95
    jmayo
    Registered Users Posts: 13,110 ✭✭✭✭jmayo


    Kitty6277 wrote: »
    Because not everyone has an interest/ability to do well in the business/IT/engineering courses

    Very true and it is why the calibre of some of our graduates is going down.
    Too many people are going to college for the sake of it and getting practically useless degrees.
    BTW not all useless degrees are in arts.
    And it is another reason why finding apprentices is getting harder and harder.

    Some arts degrees and masters prove more valuable than others in the real world of employment.
    For instance if you get a BA in Industrial Design, Psychology, Digital Media, Mathematics, some foreign language or other you can prove to be pretty employable to some companies and organisations.

    But banie01 sums this chap up pretty well.
    banie01 wrote: »
    An arts degree and a master's in Literature!
    Well done...

    The foresight to realise that such esoteric qualifications are of fúck all use in gaining somewhat local employment in a rural part of Co Clare...

    Well that doesn't say much for an arts degree is shaping one for actual adulthood!

    It would like some guy in Belmullet complaining there were no jobs for him in Mayo even though he had a degree in "Drama, Theatre, and Performance Studies".

    It is frankly moronic and a sad indictment of how far the Irish Times has fallen when they give this type of shyte column inches.


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    #96
    Millicently
    Closed Accounts Posts: 478 ✭✭Millicently


    Arghus wrote: »
    The guy did change his situation. He moved to London and took unpaid internship work in the industry he wanted to work in - and now he's a playwright. He's not saying his life is shyte.

    Honestly, do people actually read the articles they give out about?

    Also, there's no way he wrote the title or the sub heading for the article. That's the work of a sub editor somewhere in The Irish Times.
    Probably gets more on the Dole in Britain than he does from being a ''playwright''.


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    #97
    Millicently
    Closed Accounts Posts: 478 ✭✭Millicently


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    So not entitled then? The “entitled” argument fell apart at the very first enquiry. Kudos for admitting it.

    Now on to the second point he talks in the article about the expectation to move away from rural Ireland tho to uni in the first place. He never expected to work in Clare with his degree.

    So, what exactly has this bloke done wrong? You seem pretty sure he’s wrong whether he’s “entitled” or “delusional” for wanting something he explicitly says he didn’t expect.

    So can you tell me what this fella has done that’s so wrong? Lots of posters seem in complete agreement that he’s wrong and entitled or delusional but definitely to be ridiculed. So it should be easy to point out exactly what he’s done wrong.
    Well, for a start he's a nobody from the arse end of rural Clare that nobody has ever heard of yet he thinks his story merits an article in the Irish Times.


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    #98
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,004 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    couple things

    is yerman "young"? dont see his age

    the reasons for everyone leaving in the 80s aint the reasons now. and if you had to leave to be a skivvy from free third-level ireland in 2009 then thats on you. and im not sure that the irish times were running such frequent pieces from domhnhaihils and saoaoaoairseaias in 1984 lamenting the ****hole they left and how it hasnt cuddled them home upon their return

    people have not had it easy nor soft in ireland while the people who got their choice of a free degree (or their choice of no degree) departed for sunnier, better climes.

    not mention you come home now for a few bob on the plane, which wasnt the case back then.

    so no, its really no comparison between exporting our young with nothing to give them but the option to stay away for years and work manual jobs, and the travails of a fella who wants to be a playwright but nobody in london or clare has seen his genius yet.

    He says he was 24 in about 2009 so probably probably now 34. Been grafting for 10 years in London and living modestly, no money, no family, no prospect of buying a home and very grateful for his lot - but still “entitled” and worthy of ridicule,?according to some.

    The reasons for leaving in the 80s are exactly the same as the reasons in 2009. Like, precisely the same. No jobs, no prospects. But the people who left on the 80s are regarded as heroes who grasped for their living, the ones who emigrated mire recently are “entitled”, “delusional” and worthy of ridicule.

    I wonder whether people in the 80s also slagged off the emigrants or if people today are just more mean spirited.


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    #99
    partyguinness
    Registered Users Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭partyguinness


    I have an issue with regarding anyone with a degree as "qualified".

    What exactly are you "qualified" in? There are virtually no degrees that "qualify" a graduate for anything least of all a BA. It is further education and what you do with it afterwards is up to you.


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    #100
    Millicently
    Closed Accounts Posts: 478 ✭✭Millicently


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    He says he was 24 in about 2009 so probably probably now 34. Been grafting for 10 years in London and living modestly, no money, no family, no prospect of buying a home and very grateful for his lot - but still “entitled” and worthy of ridicule,?according to some.

    The reasons for leaving in the 80s are exactly the same as the reasons in 2009. Like, precisely the same. No jobs, no prospects. But the people who left on the 80s are regarded as heroes who grasped for their living, the ones who emigrated mire recently are “entitled”, “delusional” and worthy of ridicule.

    I wonder whether people in the 80s also slagged off the emigrants or if people today are just more mean spirited.
    What do you care? The emigration situation in the 80's was very different as was Ireland as a whole. Emigrants in the 80's just sucked it up and left, most people could only dream of going to University. This is less about this guy than about the IT publishing these bs articles on some Irish emigrant living abroad that nobody could care less about and some foreign immigrant bleating on about being hard done by in their New to The Parish articles. Lazy slacker journalism aimed at PC Millennials with an attitude of entitlement who are easily offended on behalf of everyone.


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    #101
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    He says he was 24 in about 2009 so probably probably now 34. Been grafting for 10 years in London and living modestly, no money, no family, no prospect of buying a home and very grateful for his lot - but still “entitled” and worthy of ridicule,?according to some.

    The reasons for leaving in the 80s are exactly the same as the reasons in 2009. Like, precisely the same. No jobs, no prospects. But the people who left on the 80s are regarded as heroes who grasped for their living, the ones who emigrated mire recently are “entitled”, “delusional” and worthy of ridicule.

    I wonder whether people in the 80s also slagged off the emigrants or if people today are just more mean spirited.


    yeah you just avoided all of the points there didnt you?

    also, the answer to " is he young" is "no, he's 34". that doesnt take a paragraph, but when it does you know you're reaching


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    #102
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,004 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    Millicently wrote: »
    Well, for a start he's a nobody from the arse end of rural Clare that nobody has ever heard of yet he thinks his story merits an article in the Irish Times.

    Yeah, he’s just a normal guy telling the story of a normal guy.

    So is not being famous what he’s done wrong?

    I see RTÉ archive footage speaking to emigrants working on building sites and I never felt the need to slag them off because they’re not famous. I saw it as a normal bloke sharing his experience. But a bloke sharing his story in 2020 is “entitled” “delusional” or not famous enough to be worth listening to but definitely worthy of ridicule. Maybe people are just a bit nastier now.


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    #103
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,004 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    picked a foolish degree and career to be going looking for any sympathy when the irish times told him "wanna be this months poster boy for how tough life is when your work is your hobby?"

    Where do you get the impression he’s looking for sympathy? He’s telling his story. Sharing his experience. He didn’t ask you to do anything or feel anything.

    But still the inclination to ridicule the bloke for even existing or dating to share his experience.

    Did you take the p1ss out of emigrants in the 80s too, as a matter of interest?


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    #104
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,004 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    yeah you just avoided all of the points there didnt you?

    also, the answer to " is he young" is "no, he's 34". that doesnt take a paragraph, but when it does you know you're reaching

    All the points? I don’t think your post was a full of points as you think it was. You declared that anyone who emigrated in 2009 did so with a free education and went to “sunnier climes”. Like, what do you want me to do with that “point”? It wasn’t the zinger you seem to think it was.

    It would be as silly as me ridiculing the hod carriers in London in the 80s for being too thick to do anything else, living the life of Reilly in London and spending all their money on lunchtime strippers with pints and working men’s clubs at night. But I actually think the situation was a lot more complicated than that.

    I’ve never heard this bitterness towards emigrants in the past. It’s genuinely fascinating to see the way people take agin young people and back each other up. Nobody has had a good attempt to explain why he’s wrong, to what he implied he’s “entitled” or why he should be ridiculed.


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    #105
    topper75
    Registered Users Posts: 5,942 ✭✭✭topper75


    mariaalice wrote: »
    To anyone who say the arts are not worth studying this is a peom I love by one of the civil servant poets not well know.


    ...

    A fine work mariaalice. Thanks for posting.

    But this poem and millions of others like it can be written in the evening after putting in a shift in a normal job, can it not?

    Is there some prerequisite in four full time years of Proust's views on feminism or Dante's religious allegories etc. to produce such a poem?

    The best service any career guidance teacher can do for an Irish kid today is to steer them away from Arts and other fluff. They are merely a transfer of money from Irish taxpayers to overpaid lecturers. Probably failed poets themselves. Resources are scarce and the economics is real. The dreaded market is not some punishment devised by nasty people. After you have satisfied its demands and earned your place in this world, you can sit down to the kitchen table after dinner with a pen and paper and create whatever you bloody well like. Even publish it and have people buy it.


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    #106
    Church on Tuesday
    Registered Users Posts: 3,858 ✭✭✭Church on Tuesday


    There's a few things about this.

    Regularly on this site you will get an awful lot of very bitter people; men and women with chips on their shoulders so big, they could open a chipper. No doubt these very same people would love the relative carefree lifestyle that this chap has in London of all places.

    We all have our own life path to journey on. People need to understand this. If you wanted to stay in Ballyhack stop complaining because others did not.

    He's doing just fine, working a part time job and staging plays in London and Dublin is pretty impressive to me. Then again London has all the opportunities in the world. Fair play to him.

    Dublin is grand, but it ain't London.

    *Insert your obligatory Terrorist/Brexit rebuttal here. Yawn.

    Maybe some of these dry ****es pissing on this lad here should relax a bit and take up a hobby or something, being so angry and bitter all the time ain't good for your health.


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    #107
    marieholmfan
    Registered Users Posts: 2,744 ✭✭✭marieholmfan


    Millicently wrote: »
    Well, for a start he's a nobody from the arse end of rural Clare that nobody has ever heard of yet he thinks his story merits an article in the Irish Times.
    Yeah because his play is being produced.
    That's why the Irish Times asked him for his story.


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    #108
    Millicently
    Closed Accounts Posts: 478 ✭✭Millicently


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    Yeah, he’s just a normal guy telling the story of a normal guy.

    So is not being famous what he’s done wrong?

    I see RTÉ archive footage speaking to emigrants working on building sites and I never felt the need to slag them off because they’re not famous. I saw it as a normal bloke sharing his experience. But a bloke sharing his story in 2020 is “entitled” “delusional” or not famous enough to be worth listening to but definitely worthy of ridicule. Maybe people are just a bit nastier now.
    It's lazy journalism filling columns. My generation who were at school in the 80's couldn't give a great whoop whoop about this guy or any other emigrant/immigrant, we just had to get on with things, nobody gave a good God damn how we 'felt' about things. It was taken as a given that you'd escape small town rural Ireland as soon as you could. You are exactly the type of person they aim this nonsense at.



    Grown man gets paid to whinge about having to emigrate so he can write stuff that will probably never see the light of day and you're annoyed on his behalf because people don't feel sorry for him. If you're going to rally behind something at least find a decent cause. I hear the environment is very popular at the moment, seems my generation destroyed the ozone layer with our hairspray.


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    #109
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Feckin hipsters..


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    #110
    marieholmfan
    Registered Users Posts: 2,744 ✭✭✭marieholmfan


    Millicently wrote: »
    It's lazy journalism filling columns. My generation who were at school in the 80's couldn't give a great whoop whoop about this guy or any other emigrant/immigrant, we just had to get on with things, nobody gave a good God damn how we 'felt' about things. It was taken as a given that you'd escape small town rural Ireland as soon as you could. You are exactly the type of person they aim this nonsense at.



    Grown man gets paid to whinge about having to emigrate so he can write stuff that will probably never see the light of day and you're annoyed on his behalf because people don't feel sorry for him. If you're going to rally behind something at least find a decent cause. I hear the environment is very popular at the moment, seems my generation destroyed the ozone layer with our hairspray.
    His play is on in the Project on Friday.


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    #111
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    All the points? I don’t think your post was a full of points as you think it was. You declared that anyone who emigrated in 2009 did so with a free education and went to “sunnier climes”. Like, what do you want me to do with that “point”? It wasn’t the zinger you seem to think it was.

    It would be as silly as me ridiculing the hod carriers in London in the 80s for being too thick to do anything else, living the life of Reilly in London and spending all their money on lunchtime strippers with pints and working men’s clubs at night. But I actually think the situation was a lot more complicated than that.

    I’ve never heard this bitterness towards emigrants in the past. It’s genuinely fascinating to see the way people take agin young people and back each other up. Nobody has had a good attempt to explain why he’s wrong, to what he implied he’s “entitled” or why he should be ridiculed.

    yeah i was giving out stink about the biyiz heading off to london when i was a toddler, surely

    you dont think anyone should be allowed tell this fella to cop on about the realities of a hobby masters, fair enough.

    you dont think anyone should give out about the irish times package coverage of the wearisome generation emigration, fair enough

    you feel entitled to speculate about posters because they speculate/opine about fellas who are giving interviews to promote their art. weird but fair enough.

    you think that emigration from ireland in the early 80's is equivalent to emigration from ireland in the late 00's. ridiculous.


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    #112
    Millicently
    Closed Accounts Posts: 478 ✭✭Millicently


    Church on Tuesday wrote: »
    There's a few things about this.

    Regularly on this site you will get an awful lot of very bitter people; men and women with chips on their shoulders so big, they could open a chipper. No doubt these very same people would love the relative carefree lifestyle that this chap has in London of all places.

    We all have our own life path to journey on. People need to understand this. If you wanted to stay in Ballyhack stop complaining because others did not.

    He's doing just fine, working a part time job and staging plays in London and Dublin is pretty impressive to me. Then again London has all the opportunities in the world. Fair play to him.

    Dublin is grand, but it ain't London.

    *Insert your obligatory Terrorist/Brexit rebuttal here. Yawn.

    Maybe some of these dry ****es pissing on this lad here should relax a bit and take up a hobby or something, being so angry and bitter all the time ain't good for your health.
    Do you see the irony of your post at all? Everyone who disagrees with you is a 'dry ****e' They say if you meet an asshole in the morning and an asshole in the evening there's a good chance that it's you whose the .......


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    #113
    Millicently
    Closed Accounts Posts: 478 ✭✭Millicently


    marieholmfan wrote: »
    His play is on in the Project on Friday.
    I have never heard of it, I have no interest in finding out what it is.


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    #114
    partyguinness
    Registered Users Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭partyguinness


    I cancelled my IT subscription years ago.

    I realised half the content was taken from The Guardian only 24 hours later.


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    #115
    pjohnson
    Registered Users Posts: 23,247 ✭✭✭✭pjohnson


    Millicently wrote: »
    I have never heard of it, I have no interest in finding out what it is.

    So therefore it doesnt exist :pac:

    Really are in "Old Man Yells at Cloud" territory.


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    #116
    Millicently
    Closed Accounts Posts: 478 ✭✭Millicently


    pjohnson wrote: »
    So therefore it doesnt exist :pac:

    Really are in "Old Man Yells at Cloud" territory.
    Nope, no argument so you just start insulting posters and lying, yep sounds like the kind of person who buys that rubbish.


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    #117
    Huntergonzo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,160 ✭✭✭Huntergonzo


    His degree is pretty niche so I can easily see why he'd struggle to find good employment in his chosen field.

    But look, loads of people grow up in rural parts of Ireland and have no problem finding employment, with or without degrees.

    Personally I grew up in a semi-rural part of Ireland (ie in the country but near Dublin), I have no degree (I left college early) but I've been in near constant employment since I left college in 2008.

    Granted the recession was tough but I've managed to work my way into a good job with plenty of promotion opportunities over the last 5 years. I left my previous job in 2014 and started again with JobBridge before gaining permanent employment.

    Moral of the story, if you really want a job, you'll get one and if you work hard you'll create opportunities for yourself.

    Moaning though?.....won't get you too far.


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    #118
    mariaalice
    Registered Users Posts: 12,378 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    topper75 wrote: »
    A fine work mariaalice. Thanks for posting.

    But this poem and millions of others like it can be written in the evening after putting in a shift in a normal job, can it not?

    Is there some prerequisite in four full time years of Proust's views on feminism or Dante's religious allegories etc. to produce such a poem?

    The best service any career guidance teacher can do for an Irish kid today is to steer them away from Arts and other fluff. They are merely a transfer of money from Irish taxpayers to overpaid lecturers. Probably failed poets themselves. Resources are scarce and the economics is real. The dreaded market is not some punishment devised by nasty people. After you have satisfied its demands and earned your place in this world, you can sit down to the kitchen table after dinner with a pen and paper and create whatever you bloody well like. Even publish it and have people buy it.

    Did you see the post about who writes all the scripts for all the media we consume? or who works in all the gigs we see, or music we listen too or books we read.

    Without being rude I think your post is ignorant and disrespectful to a lot of people.


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    #119
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    'Flights'..it's probably about man's search for meaning and purpose in the existential questions raised by frequenting the Ryanair Shannon-Stansted flight..


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    #120
    Woke Hogan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,630 ✭✭✭Woke Hogan


    EmmetSpiceland wrote: »
    Careful now, there’s a few on here who think the “Arts” degree is the height of enlightenment and not the, giant, waste of time it actually is.
    It's a pity you didn't study English in university in order to master commas, inverted or otherwise.

    I got to the second paragraph of the article before I read him mentioning his aspirations of becoming a playwright, and rightly anticipated that this discussion would immediately flooded by the foamy-mouthed, middle-aged bootlickers of Boards.ie who believe that education should only be a means to the end of becoming a salary-slave for the multinationals.

    I often wonder what it's like to be such a culture-less, idea-less slob. Scorning anyone with interests other than football, drinking cans of beer and fags through their yellow, stained teeth. Fat, self indulgent and snide. They disgust me.


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    #121
    Millicently
    Closed Accounts Posts: 478 ✭✭Millicently


    Woke Hogan wrote: »
    It's a pity you didn't study English in university in order to master commas, inverted or otherwise.

    I got to the second paragraph of the article before I read him mentioning his aspirations of becoming a playwright, and rightly anticipated that this discussion would immediately flooded by the foamy-mouthed, middle-aged bootlickers of Boards.ie who believe that education should only be a means to the end of becoming a salary-slave for the multinationals.

    I often wonder what it's like to be such a culture-less, idea-less slob. Scorning anyone with interests other than football, drinking cans of beer and fags through their yellow, stained teeth. Fat, self indulgent and snide. They disgust me.
    Ah, grammar Nazism and name calling the last resort of the irate who can't handle losing the argument.


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