11 year old wants iPhone 11

snickers · 15-05-2020 5:18pm

Dr Devious wrote: »

And yet you feel the need to post a thread here looking for advise!!

I'd have thought it was fairly obvious what the answer is.

To be honest I was looking for feedback from other parents as to wether or not it was normal for kids so young to have such high end phones thinking maybe I was the one being unreasonable and just out of touch with what’s going on in the world .

LLMMLL · 15-05-2020 5:26pm

From what I can remember one of the joys of having your own savings as a kid was getting to spend it on what you want and having a small measure of Independence from your parents.

While I could understand putting your foot down if you had a no smartphone policy, it seems you're ok with smartphones. In that case I don't see the harm in letting her go as expensive as she likes with her own cash (although how she got that serious amount of money at 11 is another matter). She's not more likely to be groomed or cyberbullied or have greater access to porn with an iPhone 11 than a 7 or a Huawei.

You could offer her the following options:

1. Iphone 11 + insurance if she can afford both.
2. iPhone 11 alone if she can't afford insurance. If it's lost/stolen/damaged tough luck. The only replacement you will provide is the cheapest possible model with no internet access or camera.
3. Cheaper iPhone + Insurance.

Explain how often phones are lost/broken/stolen and stick to your guns on the above options.

corks finest · 15-05-2020 5:38pm

minikin wrote: »

Are you being made to feel like you'll be the bad cop if you don't relent?

It's a tricky one espeically for girls, they're so bitchy even at that' age, so Daddy you're in a lose lose scenario, short term, she will hate ya overnight only, do what you think is right , get your missus on board , that way 2 of ye are ba*tard s, good luck with it,
No one was sniping

snickers · 15-05-2020 5:39pm

I’m an 80s kid myself was still using an Atari 2600 when most were playing a Super Nintendo i also remember only being allowed to spend 20 punt out of my confo money the rest was banked till I was 18 .I would prefer to see my daughter build on her savings for the future and just use her current phone or the iPhone I offered her as I feel both are more than adequate for what she needs.A poster enquired earlier about the relationship with my ex and for the most part everything is good and we normally discuss and compromise on such matters but this seems to be a case of her promising her something and not wanting to back out .I don’t think it’s a case of my daughter being actively bullied in school about the phone more a case of worried about being bullied or has witnessed other kids being bullied about the quality of phone they have I know one of her friends for certain has an 11 haven’t a clue what exactly the rest of the class are using but I would imagine very few have high end phones anyway it would seem I’m banging my head against a wall as ex will not back down and rather than fall out over it with her I have basically washed my hands of it and left it and the consequences of it up to her .

minikin · 15-05-2020 5:44pm

Hyzepher wrote: »

Iw ould actually go and talk with the other parents - especially those of her close friends. Kids are smart these days and it's most likley a plan by all of them to get what they want. If your kids class all have iphone 11s then it's the most affluant class in Europe. It's more likely that one kid has one and everyone else has talked up the fact that they are getting one as well. I would be suprised, if you took the time to check that , if any of them have the 11 at all

Are any of the parents iPhone salespeople?

LLMMLL · 15-05-2020 5:46pm

snickers wrote: »

I’m an 80s kid myself was still using an Atari 2600 when most were playing a Super Nintendo i also remember only being allowed to spend 20 punt out of my confo money the rest was banked till I was 18 .I would prefer to see my daughter build on her savings for the future and just use her current phone or the iPhone I offered her as I feel both are more than adequate for what she needs.A poster enquired earlier about the relationship with my ex and for the most part everything is good and we normally discuss and compromise on such matters but this seems to be a case of her promising her something and not wanting to back out .I don’t think it’s a case of my daughter being actively bullied in school about the phone more a case of worried about being bullied or has witnessed other kids being bullied about the quality of phone they have I know one of her friends for certain has an 11 haven’t a clue what exactly the rest of the class are using but I would imagine very few have high end phones anyway it would seem I’m banging my head against a wall as ex will not back down and rather than fall out over it with her I have basically washed my hands of it and left it and the consequences of it up to her .

I do wonder if being forced to save money actually teaches kids to save or whether when they finally get a chance to spend their money without interference they'll just go mental with it.

corks finest · 15-05-2020 5:47pm

minikin wrote: »

Snickers, not sure what to say to you. In a similar boat, have a ten year old who lives with her mam pretty much all the time... my influence as her dad has fallen off a cliff pretty much the same. She has had tablets etc for the last three years that never would have been in the house had I been her live-in parent.

It is entirely wrong that kids have smart phones at all, they destroy their attention spans, make everything else boring and can make some very impatient and snappy.

I'm making do with a dead battery, cracked screen ip6s because I'd rather pay the maintenance for herself every month than have the latest shiny iThing.

I would ask a fundamental question though... what is an 11 year old doing with >€700 in petty cash???

Reared my now 17 years old from age of 2 and a bit,
Hard to say no , especially when all around him / her seemingly have the latest this n that
I had it out with my ex red the 2 iPhones,add begged her to work with me,she did
He's had all second hand phones until this year, technology never held him back,black belt tae Kwon do,
Munsters schools winners soccer,
Cork co football champions etc etc
So the argument that technology stops them going out/ mixing/ not getting involved in sororts etc is bull and void,
Have a heart to heart 3 of ye and decide.
My bargaining chip on anything he got was, study, sports, and help around the house,
If I'd the bobs at the time I still wouldn't buy him ( have bought him ) anything near e1000

the14thwarrior · 15-05-2020 5:49pm

in some circles an 11 year old having an Iphone 11 would be normal
in some circles an 11 year old having a phone would be normal
in some circles an 11 year old having no phone at all would be normal

I personally think an iphone 11 is very large, heavy enough and does't fit into pockets very well. also not sure if they come with a pair of headphones that you can plug in. if not you will be forking out money for wireless headphones and assuming you have the necessary wi fi to do that. or risk listening to endless tunes, videos or phone games.

agree to a phone with your husband if you can.
set a price budget (half of it i would say)
the bullying..... blah blah... if its not phone, its runners, or x boxes, or jeans.....
that is not a reasonable excuse to have a decent reflection on

minikin · 15-05-2020 5:50pm

snickers wrote: »

Yes .

Being a bad cop: I've explained to my lass that sometimes I can't let her do/have things because my primary job is to keep her safe and healthy, helping her keep happy comes a close second.

mvl · 15-05-2020 5:52pm

corks finest wrote: »

It's a tricky one espeically for girls, they're so bitchy even at that' age, so Daddy you're in a lose lose scenario, short term, she will hate ya overnight only, do what you think is right , get your missus on board , that way 2 of ye are ba*tard s, good luck with it,
No one was sniping

- its his Ex missus - that may be part of the problem ?!?

Too bad we're in lockdown and OP can't go talk to the school principal about this perceived bullying over the generation of a smartphone.

Maybe the school should ban phones for all kids, so that normal ppl don't get this sh*t from their Ex-es ?

Also, I totally favor the legislation introduced in France from 2018 to ban cell phones in schools; I think government should introduce this here too. :pac:

snickers · 15-05-2020 5:52pm

Sorry just to clear up were the money came from it would have been gifts from birthdays Xmas communion that sort of thing.My daughter is extremely responsible and very mature for her age she really is a great kid good in school and at home never a peep out of her I’m not just saying that because she’s mine I have another daughter that’s the polar opposite that breaks screens on phones every couple of months all hand me down phones I might add but still she’s so careless I know the 11 year would genuinely take care of it but still 700 quid on a phone for a kid is ridiculous in my book .

minikin · 15-05-2020 5:53pm

corks finest wrote: »

Reared my now 17 years old from age of 2 and a bit,
Hard to say no , especially when all around him / her seemingly have the latest this n that
I had it out with my ex red the 2 iPhones,add begged her to work with me,she did
He's had all second hand phones until this year, technology never held him back,black belt tae Kwon do,
Munsters schools winners soccer,
Cork co football champions etc etc
So the argument that technology stops them going out/ mixing/ not getting involved in sororts etc is bull and void,
Have a heart to heart 3 of ye and decide.
My bargaining chip on anything he got was, study, sports, and help around the house,
If I'd the bobs at the time I still wouldn't buy him ( have bought him ) anything near e1000

I didn't make that particular argument.

punisher5112 · 15-05-2020 5:54pm

Absolutely ridiculous anyone would even consider letting a child access to such a phone....

No child under 16 should have access to android or iPhone for example unless you know fully they are responsible but he'll what child is.....

We are going to hold off for as long as possible with are one as she learnt how to access porn and was talking to strangers through Alexa and the Xbox.... 11 years old and can use tech better then we can and knows ways around the restrictions I had set. I found out what she was up to and have fully locked out now ...

The worrying part for me is the strangers, porn and also the so called friends and other numpties she will deal with and peer pressure and bullying which is near a given....

Op I'd be fully against.

antodeco · 15-05-2020 5:57pm

You need to talk to her and give her 2 options.

No iPhone or a cheaper iPhone

She is 11 and has a phone already so can access whatever she wants regardless. It's the "fashion" piece that she wants. Trust me, 1 month after whatever iPhone she has, she'll be happy. Position it saying a cheaper iPhone gives her money to spend on something else she wants

15-05-2020 5:58pm

I’d say no. No way. That money should be put in a bank account and added to, not pissed away on tech.

Then offer to pay half the price of whatever phone her mother agrees is okay for her to have, only if her mother pays the other half herself and only when the childs savings go somewhere nobody gets to touch it until she’s 18.

One time offer. See what the mother has to say then about expensive phones for children.

Turquoise Hexagon Sun · 15-05-2020 6:09pm

snickers wrote: »

So long story short my ex partner wants to allow our 11 year old daughter spend nearly 700 euro of her savings on an Iphone 11 apparently all the kids in her class have them and she gets bullied about her current huawei smart phone I offered my old iPhone se that’s working perfect but that’s to small apparently. I am completely against this purchase for obvious reasons is this the norm that 11 year olds have such high end phones I mean I work full time and only have a 7 .

The fact that Apple is favoured among a bunch of kids tells you the power of Apple branding and marketing.

I know this is going to sound awful but it might be a good time to show her that for half the price, she can get another brand with twice the specifications.

You can say an 11-year-old might be too young for that but it might be good to pant the seed.

I've gone on about this subject in a another topic. But here I go again:

iPhone 11 is a 700 quid phone and has a sub-standard batter: 3110 mAh battery

My nearly 2 year old €200 phone has a 4000 mAh battery. Yep, I don't have to charge my phone every day.

iPhone 11, a 700 quid phone only has 4gb RAM

My nearly 2 year old €200 phone has 4 GB RAM.

They're just two huge examples of how Apple skim on hardware and charge a premium. Now, you can ask if your kid if they're going to enjoy having to charge their phone all the time in 6 months time when Apple pushes out their new IOS and slows the phone down or when the battery life, just starts to fade anyway. Is she going to pay to get the battery replaced?

Who will replace the battery? What if the screen get's scratched? What is the plan to replace the screen if it cracks and who will pay for it. If you don't send it back to Apple and they will charge you a premium, it will voice the warranty sending it else where.

This phone here has a great reputation has 50% more RAM than you overrated iPhone 11. It has 6gb RAM, and a battery that is 5260 mAh unlike iPhone's paltry 3110 mAh.

It's got an Amoled screen ( the best kind) and you don't need any propriertroy cables, or iTunes, just plug and play. It's unlocked and can use any network. You can use 2 sim cards. It's got fingerprint recognition and $300 quid less!

Even this phone here..

Xiaomi Mi 9T 6GB/64GB Dual Sim (Redmi K20) - Carbon Black (With 2 years Xiaomi Official EU warranty)

6gm RAM (better than iPhone)
4,000 mAh battery (still better than iPhone 11)
Amoled screen
48 megapixel camera

for €265.99!!!

She could by nearly 3 of these phones and each of them more powerful and longer lasting batteries than an iPhone 11

I know it's an 11 year old and some of these specs might go over their head but I'd like to just throw that information out there.

I don't know, why be a sheep and use Apple when you can be a shepard actually get an objectively better phone for half of the price. It's mental!!.

One eyed Jack · 15-05-2020 6:21pm

Turquoise Hexagon Sun wrote: »

I don't know, why be a sheep and use Apple when you can be a shepard actually get an objectively better phone for half of the price. It's mental!!.

Because then you’re a shepherd with a device that hardly anyone actually wants, and therefore it has no resale value, whereas an iPhone will easily hold it’s value when the OPs daughter figures she wants to sell it on.

@OP the point you make that your daughter is responsible and everything else would have me thinking that you should trust her to be able to spend her own money on a device she actually wants. It’s not the same scenario at all as though she’s asking you to spend €700 of your money on the phone.

At the same time, I keep coming back to the fact that you’re her parent and you have your reservations, so that’s the end of it really.

mvl · 15-05-2020 6:22pm

Good point: my one just before turning 12 started looking up the specs for the cameras/battery herself, I remember she was telling me why she doesn't need an expensive iphone - and picked up a couple hundred android she's happy about

So OP if your daughter is as you say, maybe get her to use her brains rather than feel the peer pressure from other silly girls.

Turquoise Hexagon Sun · 15-05-2020 6:48pm

One eyed Jack wrote: »

Because then you’re a shepherd with a device that hardly anyone actually wants, and therefore it has no resale value, whereas an iPhone will easily hold it’s value when the OPs daughter figures she wants to sell it on.

What sort of logic is that? lol. The phone is good value to begin with and if you've ever used them, they are reliable and good quality. It's just a newish brand to you. It doesn't hold the same weight. It doesn't negate that it's objectively a more powerful phone.

But yeah, I can see why you'd want to sell an iPhone. I have my Xiaomi with zero issue. I use it a lot and when I buy a new phone, I wont want to sell it because it' so good.

You always hear of people selling iPhones (I've owned some iPhones) and they slow down and the batteries are ****e. You know this but you'll deny it for the Apple experience, haha. And "the resale value" to put towards another vastlyoverpriced and underpowered iPhone keeping you in a perpetual state of keep up with the joneses and then that phone dying prematurely because of weak specs and pathetic batteries.

And your rebuttal is resale value? Sure you haven't even got the phone and your just thinking how you can resell it because it's going to become piss-poor very shortly.

Typical Apple brain-rot mentality.

You can always spot the iPhone user because they're either A asking you for a bogie "type" charger or they have to carry one every where they go because their batteries keep running out. They have some weird stockholm syndrome with Apple. Bizarre. Glad I ditched Apple a long time ago.

challengemaster · 15-05-2020 6:54pm

snickers wrote: »

I have been told the se is to small .

Time to tell her take a running jump...

antodeco wrote: »

You need to talk to her and give her 2 options.

No iPhone or a cheaper iPhone

She is 11 and has a phone already so can access whatever she wants regardless. It's the "fashion" piece that she wants. Trust me, 1 month after whatever iPhone she has, she'll be happy. Position it saying a cheaper iPhone gives her money to spend on something else she wants

^

corks finest · 15-05-2020 6:55pm

mvl wrote: »

- its his Ex missus - that may be part of the problem ?!?

Too bad we're in lockdown and OP can't go talk to the school principal about this perceived bullying over the generation of a smartphone.

Maybe the school should ban phones for all kids, so that normal ppl don't get this sh*t from their Ex-es ?

Also, I totally favor the legislation introduced in France from 2018 to ban cell phones in schools; I think government should introduce this here too. :pac:

They are in my kids secondary school

corks finest · 15-05-2020 6:59pm

minikin wrote: »

I didn't make that particular argument.

No but OP brought up technology and if he was the primary carer etc etc

15-05-2020 7:18pm

OP, from how you have described your daughter, she seems pretty reasonable and I personally don't think it should be a big deal to let her buy it as she already has money for it. My only problem is the "every kid has it" mentality. For me, that is enough grounds to not give in.

You need to find a way to help her understand that she shouldn't be doing things because others are doing it. She is just 11 but before you know it she will get to her teenage years. Those years are very tough on kids when their peers start doing really weird stuff and they feel like they have to join in because they don't want to be the odd one out.

Those years are definitely ahead and so you need to have a chat with your daughter and explain this at her level to her.

While growing up in my case, my parents were never that type that did the popular things for me. However, they were reasonable and made sure they provided things that I needed for academic and extra curricular activities. Its a different thing if you were being asked to buy a musical equipment or a sport equipment or even an tech device because they have a passion for something. But when it is because of fear or being the odd one out, you really need to handle it with wisdom so that they don't misunderstand the lesson you are teaching them.

One eyed Jack · 15-05-2020 7:29pm

Turquoise Hexagon Sun wrote: »

What sort of logic is that? lol. The phone is good value to begin with and if you've ever used them, they are reliable and good quality. It's just a newish brand to you. It doesn't hold the same weight. It doesn't negate that it's objectively a more powerful phone.

Look, they’re all fantastic points you make about Chinese phones and Android and all the rest of it, and if someone were in the market for a Chinese Android phone I’d be making the same points myself, having gone through plenty of them in the past and being well used to installing custom ROMs and tweaking and all the rest of it, they’re great fun, and I learned plenty repairing them too.

However, if someone says they want an iPhone, then the more obvious logic is to listen to what they’re saying. The OP’s daughter doesn’t want anything other than an iPhone 11, they have the money themselves to pay for an iPhone 11, so what logic is there in recommending a Chinese Android device? You think they don’t know the difference? You think they aren’t aware of all the fanboi arguments for and against all sorts of low-end or flagship devices? The more logical conclusion is simply that they don’t care.

Different strokes for different folks, everyone will have their own reasons. I personally wouldn’t buy an iPhone 11 because the iPhone 7 Plus I have already does everything I need it to do. If I wanted to buy the iPhone 11, I would. If I wanted to buy a Chinese Android, I would. But the OP’s daughter wants an iPhone 11, and has the money to spend on an iPhone 11, and doesn’t want a Chinese Android.

Implying anyone is a sheep because they don’t want the same thing you want, not only is it counterproductive, but it’s the mentality I’d expect of an immature child, and if my own child were to come out with that sort of nonsense I’d despair and wonder where I went wrong, frankly :pac:

15-05-2020 7:38pm

Also want to add that she doesn't know how her colleagues got their phones.

Their parents may be well off, or it may be on bill pay, or a gift, or a parent sacrificing for their kids.
Either way, it is aligned with their family priorities. Some people would rather sleep in a flashy car than live in a house.
Some would rather be up to their eyes in debt, so that they can have the latest technology.
So this is a lesson that must be taught to kids young that they must not do everything others do.

I know some parents who are saving up for their kids college tuition, and so they do not go for the latest phones, cars etc.
I know others who think, their kids can always get student loans, get a job, etc so they splurge and don't save hard.
This is a personal choice but it is very easy for the kids of the latter parents to seem better off than tier peers even though both parents earn the same.

NSAman · 15-05-2020 7:40pm

Remember this one.....??

(crying).. "I WANT A PONY"

15-05-2020 8:05pm

JayZeus wrote: »

I’d say no. No way. That money should be put in a bank account and added to, not pissed away on tech.

Then offer to pay half the price of whatever phone her mother agrees is okay for her to have, only if her mother pays the other half herself and only when the childs savings go somewhere nobody gets to touch it until she’s 18.

One time offer. See what the mother has to say then about expensive phones for children.

This is so true.
If you gave any 16-21yr old €700, they would be grateful for it and if they still choose to spend it on an iPhone, then that's their choice.
They probably have jobs and can make decisions on what they spend money on as they work themselves.
I don't think it is fair for parents to allow kids spend their gifts on something so pricey that will not really add value to them.
If you think it is ok for 11yr olds to use €700 phones and you want yours using one, why do it at the expense of the child?
Both parents should pay for it. And when the child wants a mercedes as their first car cos thats what all their friends got, they can both contribute for that as well.

I personally dont have a problem with the child having iPhone 11 at that age.
I just have a problem with the fact that they want it cos everyone does.

They have no intention to be productive with it. I would favour an iPad or a kindle as a gift to an 11 year old.

Maybe ask her what she intends to be doing with it and if just texting and call, then no need for an iPhone 11. If she wants to make videos and do creative stuff, we can look for the best device for that.

FreshCoffee · 15-05-2020 9:26pm

To the original poster. I will go against the trend in this thread.

Your daughter sounds wonderful to me. She has carefully saved her own money and wants to treat herself on something she will use and hopefully get lots of pleasure out of. You also believe she will look after it which is important. Sure it's an expensive phone but she is not asking/nagging her parents to pay for it as so many do. Give her some guidance on insurance, minding it etc and just let her spend her money as she wants.

When she grows up and is working and saves her money for eg a 1000 euro luxury handbag, will you be there at her elbow to tell her you disapprove 'for obvious reasons'? We all treat ourselves from time to time on things others frown on and think of a waste of money. This happens just as much with children who eg must have clothes/shoes with the 'right' label. It's universal.

The key here to me is that it's her money that she has made the effort to save and hoped she could do with it as she wants rather than as others want. Maybe going forward and using this experience try and get her to agree to put a % of the money she gets in the future into a savings account for the future and let her spend the rest as she wants.

And to answer your original question. Yes, I see lots of school children with high end mobile phones that I personally wouldn't be bothered with and would never spend my money on. But then I save and spend my money on things I'm sure others would think silly.

I hope it all works out for you both.

15-05-2020 11:34pm

@FreshCoffee clearly, she is not deriving any pleasure from it other than "being part of the iPhone 11 gang"
As I and a few other posters have mentioned earlier, it is just a device and not a problem if she has it.
But she should not give into the "everybody in my class has it" mentality or give in to bullies!
Why should an 11 year spend €700 of her own money on a phone to "not be the odd one out" or get bullies off her back?

In a few years time when some of her mates start drinking, smoking, doing drugs, having relationships and sex, cheating in tests, shoplifting, and she gets excluded for not being part of them, will that be a good enough reason to do join them?

If she gets the phone and "is no longer bullied", can she ever stand up to them for other mean stuff that they do other kids? or will she be now be part of the problem?

Children come from different homes where different principles and values apply.
OP's child should be made to understand that in her own home, and iPhone 7 is ok if that's what her parents think is reasonable. Her dad is willing to compromise with an iPhone 7 but she is not willing to compromise.
Why?

There will always be kids whose parents are well off right up to college. Those ones who can afford luxury apartments, cars, generous budget, good prospects of jobs after college etc. So she better start getting used to it now.

OP's daughter seems like a really sweet kid and I believe she is not a problematic child, but these are lessons that any child needs to learn to navigate that phase of growing up.

I see a lot of nice kids amongst bullies and they just look while these nasty kids bully others. They dont agree but cant say a word because they are afraid to. and that makes them part of the problem.

Personally, if that were my kid, she is not having that phone for this reason, and i will let her know that i am willing to come to the school and see the principal if anyone bullies her over it.
Plus they are all at home for the rest of the school year so she doesn't have to think about the bullies.

When kids are given money, they should not be able to decide what to do with until they are at least 16. 11 years doesn't know enough to make decisions for herself and should be taught with love and patience.

mvl · 16-05-2020 7:51am

And if there is a professional working mother wanting to instill their 11yo daughter the value of "treating yourself with a *** EUR product" then good luck bringing that girl up - not over my dead body for my daughter.
Consumerism is creating cunning and callous kids

- do think parents have the right even when you're 40 to remind you that the car you want to spend money on is not worth it. you don't have to act on it, but defo should be lucky to hear from them because they care.

11 year old wants iPhone 11

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