Championship and Covid

billyhead · 03-04-2020 2:59pm #1

I know how long is a price of string but surely Tipp and Dublin can't be awarded AI titles without a ball even been thrown in. Will it ultimately come to games behind close doors and the old traditional knock out formula? Hopefully games can get under way by mid to late Summer.

mountgomery burns · 03-04-2020 5:24pm

billyhead wrote: »

I know how long is a price of string but surely Tipp and Dublin can't be awarded AI titles without a ball even been thrown in. Will it ultimately come to games behind close doors and the old traditional knock out formula? Hopefully games can get under way by mid to late Summer.

One thing is for sure, neither Tipp nor Dublin will be awarded titles without a ball being thrown in.

patsman07 · 03-04-2020 5:30pm

Hopefully we will get a championship and I hope it will be run on the old knock-out format. I would be delighted if that transpires. Football has become more and more predictable since it was abandoned almost 20 years ago. Old format also guaranteed the importance of the provincial championships. You would never have seen teams accepting the provincial trophy while looking like they'd just won a challenge match back in the straight knock-out days!
Hurling might be a different matter though.

03-04-2020 6:07pm

It will be a great day when teams run out onto pitches again hopefully we will be all able to see it.

Chalk McHugh · 03-04-2020 6:19pm

billyhead wrote: »

I know how long is a price of string but surely Tipp and Dublin can't be awarded AI titles without a ball even been thrown in. Will it ultimately come to games behind close doors and the old traditional knock out formula? Hopefully games can get under way by mid to late Summer.

Is this a wind up? Tipp and Dublin awarded All Irelands? Would ya get real. Nobody proposed such a daft idea. Least of all Dublin and Tipp. Why even mention it?

Chalk McHugh · 03-04-2020 6:24pm

Fred Daly wrote: »

It will be a great day when teams run out onto pitches again hopefully we will be all able to see it.

It surely will. We'll love it more than ever when its back.

billyhead · 03-04-2020 6:50pm

Chalk McHugh wrote: »

Is this a wind up? Tipp and Dublin awarded All Irelands? Would ya get real. Nobody proposed such a daft idea. Least of all Dublin and Tipp. Why even mention it?

The Gaa have said that's what will happen if no Championship happens. It was mentioned on Newstalk radio the other day. Complete farce if it happens.

Greensoup · 03-04-2020 7:12pm

It was on Newstalk on Wednesday (April 1st)....

03-04-2020 7:13pm

Chalk McHugh wrote: »

It surely will. We'll love it more than ever when its back.

Can’t wait.

irishgeo · 03-04-2020 7:15pm

Condense the games , championship with a few games on the same time
/ weekend. Playing every weekend. Take a break before senior finals and finals.

PTH2009 · 03-04-2020 7:20pm

hopefully a decison on the format will be made soon

I knw theres more important things but having the championship to look forward too is some bit of an escape from all the current affairs

Say Your Number · 03-04-2020 8:05pm

If it comes to a point where there's no Championships this year, I couldn't imagine them handing over the trophies to bewildered Dublin and Tipperary players in an empty Croke Park in September.

03-04-2020 8:06pm

Say Your Number wrote: »

If it comes to a point where there's no Championships this year, I couldn't imagine them handing over the trophies to bewildered Dublin and Tipperary players in an empty Croke Park in September.

That was an April fools joke wasn’t it?

dxhound2005 · 03-04-2020 9:12pm

patsman07 wrote: »

Hopefully we will get a championship and I hope it will be run on the old knock-out format. I would be delighted if that transpires. Football has become more and more predictable since it was abandoned almost 20 years ago. Old format also guaranteed the importance of the provincial championships. You would never have seen teams accepting the provincial trophy while looking like they'd just won a challenge match back in the straight knock-out days!
Hurling might be a different matter though.

The provincial winners in Munster and Connacht were just as predictable before the qualifiers. Sligo, Leitrim, New York, London, Clare, Waterford, Limerick and Tipperary might just as well have stayed at home.

When Leitrim and Clare did get a provincial win in the 1990's, they both played exactly one game the year after. Same for Derry the year after they won their only All Ireland. In the new system I think that more than 20 counties have reached the last 8.

Anyway the best team in the country should be determined by a home and away league, with promotion and relegation. It is a nonsense trying to turn the hundred year old lopsided knockout competition into something better by giving losers a second go, but at least it does give every county a couple of games.

03-04-2020 9:14pm

If the knockout happens hopefully it reminds people that knockout is the way to go later in the year and those quarter final groups can die forever.

Chalk McHugh · 03-04-2020 9:28pm

I know things are bad now and will probably get worse before they get a little better but i do hope and expect (could be badly wrong) that we will see a knock out championship this summer. Even August and Sept you could run it off. That gives us a bit of leeway please god.

One thing i cannot foresee is a full house in Thurles or Pair Ui Chaoimh or wherever. What about a packed Hill 16 bursting at the seams to see Dublin try do 6 in a row? I just cant see that being allowed or many fans even wanting it.

These desperate times may have changed match attendances for many years to come.

And what i would give now for few pre match drinks in the Confession Box or Clearys or the Clonliffe House or wherever. But will we see packed pubs this year? Or next? Im off the drink for a while but with all thats happened i would just love a bit of normality like that.

I think one thing is for sure. None of us will take for granted these simple pleasures again for as long as we live.

Fr Tod Umptious · 04-04-2020 10:56am

I don't get this love affair with going back to straight knockout.

It's a farce that the provincial championship is used as a qualifying for the All Ireland series as it is, never might going back to a time when it was the only means of qualifying.

In what world is it fair that a Connacht or Munster team can play as little as two games to get to the All Ireland series and a Ulster or Leinster team may have to play as many as four ?

Hopefully this current situation and it's fall out will be a catalyst for a proper change.

04-04-2020 10:58am

Open draw knockout would be class for one year. Might help accelerate the death of the provincials too.

PCeeeee · 04-04-2020 12:29pm

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

Open draw knockout would be class for one year. Might help accelerate the death of the provincials too.

Agree, it would be brilliant. Something to look forward to.

On the other hand as a Galway man I do not want to see an end to the Connacht Championship. I love it. While it is dominated by the Galway/Mayo rivalry; since I started going to games Roscommon have 4 and were runners up 5 times, Sligo have won it once and been runners up 4 times. Leitrim won it in 94 and were runners up in 2000. Even London made the final in '13.

It is plenty vibrant yet and if the tiered structure come to pass it will still allow the lower ranked teams their go at the higher ones. With a winnable prize at stake.

The Lost Sheep · 04-04-2020 11:05pm

patsman07 wrote: »

Hopefully we will get a championship and I hope it will be run on the old knock-out format. I would be delighted if that transpires. Football has become more and more predictable since it was abandoned almost 20 years ago. Old format also guaranteed the importance of the provincial championships. You would never have seen teams accepting the provincial trophy while looking like they'd just won a challenge match back in the straight knock-out days!
Hurling might be a different matter though.

and if the old format does occur hopefully it's for one season and one season only. The work players, coaches put in deserves far better than that format.

dxhound2005 wrote: »

The provincial winners in Munster and Connacht were just as predictable before the qualifiers. Sligo, Leitrim, New York, London, Clare, Waterford, Limerick and Tipperary might just as well have stayed at home.

When Leitrim and Clare did get a provincial win in the 1990's, they both played exactly one game the year after. Same for Derry the year after they won their only All Ireland. In the new system I think that more than 20 counties have reached the last 8.

Anyway the best team in the country should be determined by a home and away league, with promotion and relegation. It is a nonsense trying to turn the hundred year old lopsided knockout competition into something better by giving losers a second go, but at least it does give every county a couple of games.

a league based competition with end of year playoffs should determine all Ireland winner with provincial cups played as well in off weeks to the league. These if spaced off appropriately could allow far more time for club games as well

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

I don't get this love affair with going back to straight knockout.

It's a farce that the provincial championship is used as a qualifying for the All Ireland series as it is, never might going back to a time when it was the only means of qualifying.

In what world is it fair that a Connacht or Munster team can play as little as two games to get to the All Ireland series and a Ulster or Leinster team may have to play as many as four ?

Hopefully this current situation and it's fall out will be a catalyst for a proper change.

provincial competitions still should be kept but I agree that you cant go back to what was in place pre qualifiers.

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

Open draw knockout would be class for one year. Might help accelerate the death of the provincials too.

provincial championships not bring played would be very backwards step to take.

04-04-2020 11:07pm

Provincial championships in their current guise are backward in themselves.

mountgomery burns · 04-04-2020 11:28pm

If there's a championship it'll be old format for hurling, and not sure what they'll do with football but it would have to be significantly condensed.

It will be one year only. They won't can the second tier championship for football before it's even piloted.

PCeeeee · 04-04-2020 11:29pm

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

Provincial championships in their current guise are backward in themselves.

We'll have to disagree on that.

LoughNeagh2017 · 05-04-2020 7:25pm

If it wasn't for the qualifiers I barely would have any childhood GAA memories, Derry were often knocked out first round by Tyrone in the early 2000s and we went on family trips to the games, for example Derry v Wexford in Parnell Park. Regardless of what you think of the structure they still created many outings and memories for people.

Feenie · 07-04-2020 6:21am

I think the provincial championships are a good thing. Introducing a league/group structure introduces less incentive to win and give people less reward for winning a title. Assuming whoever wins their group goes straight to the semi like a Munster or Leinster championship, who would really care? Every county would celebrate winning their province to a certain extent because there's alot of local rivalries that go back generations which are now built into the all Ireland series due the provinces. It's alot sweeter for Clare to win Munster beating Cork and Kerry on the way then to go through their group beating Meath, Mayo and Galway.

scrubs33 · 07-04-2020 9:18am

Looking at this through a hurling lens only for a moment I can see the Leinster and Munster round robin games being played off over 6 weekends (including rest weekends) from the middle of June to the end of July. This will be done behind closed doors to fulfill TV deals. Provincial finals the August weekend: I think the situation will have improved by then based on current numbers and predictions, and you will have full houses at both. AI semi finals two weeks later on Sat and Sunday as usual. AI final as close to the first Sunday in September as possible then. Given that soccer teams in Germany are back training I do think that mid May is reasonable for inter county teams to get back training.

mountgomery burns · 07-04-2020 9:47am

scrubs33 wrote: »

Looking at this through a hurling lens only for a moment I can see the Leinster and Munster round robin games being played off over 6 weekends (including rest weekends) from the middle of June to the end of July. This will be done behind closed doors to fulfill TV deals. Provincial finals the August weekend: I think the situation will have improved by then based on current numbers and predictions, and you will have full houses at both. AI semi finals two weeks later on Sat and Sunday as usual. AI final as close to the first Sunday in September as possible then. Given that soccer teams in Germany are back training I do think that mid May is reasonable for inter county teams to get back training.

Won't happen they've already mentioned a knockout format with a start date in mid June. They want to be as close to the current all Ireland final dates as possible.

Government will have the say on crowds, but there could be significant political pressure in that regard if other sporting events aren't treated the same or other large events such as concerts.

Feenie · 07-04-2020 10:26am

scrubs33 wrote: »

Looking at this through a hurling lens only for a moment I can see the Leinster and Munster round robin games being played off over 6 weekends (including rest weekends) from the middle of June to the end of July. This will be done behind closed doors to fulfill TV deals. Provincial finals the August weekend: I think the situation will have improved by then based on current numbers and predictions, and you will have full houses at both. AI semi finals two weeks later on Sat and Sunday as usual. AI final as close to the first Sunday in September as possible then. Given that soccer teams in Germany are back training I do think that mid May is reasonable for inter county teams to get back training.

I think it's not a great idea to do things behind closed doors. For the players the atmosphere will be different and harder to hurl in if non of the fans show up to cheer them on. Not to mention the GAA will lose alot of money.
In my opinion a knockout situation would ruin the championship. It's a good thing that we left it after 97', because the championship is more interesting with it.
In general we're facing a poor championship or no championship. Which will you take?

scrubs33 · 07-04-2020 11:22am

Feenie wrote: »

I think it's not a great idea to do things behind closed doors. For the players the atmosphere will be different and harder to hurl in if non of the fans show up to cheer them on. Not to mention the GAA will lose alot of money.
In my opinion a knockout situation would ruin the championship. It's a good thing that we left it after 97', because the championship is more interesting with it.
In general we're facing a poor championship or no championship. Which will you take?

I'd settle for two flies pucking a ball to each other at this stage:) Mind you looking at data from one of the number crunchers on Twitter the number of new cases admitted to hospital with Covid has gone from 131 on the 30th March to 62 a few days ago and ICU admissions from 29 to 4. Dare I say we are past the peak and can look at a return to training at least by the end of the month?

Feenie · 07-04-2020 11:29am

scrubs33 wrote: »

I'd settle for two flies pucking a ball to each other at this stage:) Mind you looking at data from one of the number crunchers on Twitter the number of new cases admitted to hospital with Covid has gone from 131 on the 30th March to 62 a few days ago and ICU admissions from 29 to 4. Dare I say we are past the peak and can look at a return to training at least by the end of the month?

I never knew that last part.
Yeah, I'll agree with you there pal. training by the end of the month seems plausible and I hope for it. I'm dying to get back with the lads.
An idea being thrown around is club championship only since A. Less people come the matches and 2. not everyone plays county but everyone plays for a club, so it's more fair.

CrabRevolution · 07-04-2020 12:57pm

If knockout do-or die football is what the people crave, why do we not get enormous crowds at qualifier games?

Carlow and Longford played a first round qualifier last year that should tick all the cliché boxes people love. Winnable game for both teams, summer game, do-or-die championship match etc. but the crowd was pretty sparse.

Why would having the same game as a straight knockout Leinster 1st round improve the crowd?

rpurfield · 07-04-2020 1:59pm

I'd prefer an FA Cup style championship for the year. Open draw with home and away basis used. It doesn't matter the size of a team's home ground, they're out of the hat first then they're at home. It wouldn't be sustainable over a few season mind but it would be nice to see this year.

Coillte_Bhoy · 07-04-2020 2:33pm

I dont think there is a hope in hell of the cships being player this year. Are people not listening or paying attention? Barring some sort of miraculous breakthrough here will be no vaccine for months yet, even an antibody test is a long way off. I understand the need for hope but some of the stuff posted here is just pure delusion. This virus isnt going anywhere, and if we do tentatively start the games again what happens when a player tests positive and the whole panel has to go into isolation for 2 weeks, further dragging thiugn sout. Please feel free to bump this post in September if the cships are in full flow, and ill gladly eat humble pie.

07-04-2020 6:10pm

CrabRevolution wrote: »

If knockout do-or die football is what the people crave, why do we not get enormous crowds at qualifier games?

Carlow and Longford played a first round qualifier last year that should tick all the cliché boxes people love. Winnable game for both teams, summer game, do-or-die championship match etc. but the crowd was pretty sparse.

Why would having the same game as a straight knockout Leinster 1st round improve the crowd?

Because nobody cares in either county.

Chalk McHugh · 07-04-2020 6:27pm

I still expect to see a Championship of some sort played this year. I know its hard to see any light at the end of the tunnel at present and i could be badly wrong but if players could get back training in say July (even second half of July) then it could be run off in Aug - Oct.

That gives us 3 months to try and combat this disease. Bayern Munich are back doing some sort of training as well as other German teams. Good to see some sort of normality somewhere on the continent.

We have to have hope lads. Its shocking stuff thats going on but three months is a good length of time. We may be in a better place then. I sincerely hope we are.

One thing for sure there will be no full houses permitted at matches i would expect. I dont know how they'd work that. Maybe 50% maximum allowed. Maybe no crowd at all. I really dont know.

But as another posted said this could be all wishful thinking. What if a player was tested and was positive in some team? It could be messy. And very serious.

Please god we'll have some sunshine to lighten this very dark time.

kksaints · 07-04-2020 9:28pm

scrubs33 wrote: »

Looking at this through a hurling lens only for a moment I can see the Leinster and Munster round robin games being played off over 6 weekends (including rest weekends) from the middle of June to the end of July. This will be done behind closed doors to fulfill TV deals. Provincial finals the August weekend: I think the situation will have improved by then based on current numbers and predictions, and you will have full houses at both. AI semi finals two weeks later on Sat and Sunday as usual. AI final as close to the first Sunday in September as possible then. Given that soccer teams in Germany are back training I do think that mid May is reasonable for inter county teams to get back training.

Its very hard to see the Championship been back by June when a country like Austria which is further ahead on the curve then we are only considering sport been back by the middle of June. Mass gatherings such as matches and concerts will be the last thing to come back when the restrictions are lifted. The Health Authorities would also prefer to cut down on as much discretionary travel as possible this year so a round robin system doesn't seem likely. A straight knock out format may be possible inter county wise but it would have to be very quickly done as in rounds every weekend and limited travel. The County Club championships may have a better chance of being allowed.

Its also very hard to see full capacities being allowed at all this year. Its hard to see Social Distancing lifted at all until a vaccine is introduced and there is no way a full terrace like the Hill or Semple Stadium behind the goal would be acceptable.

It also must be noticed that one of the things being blamed for Bergamo being the hardest hit area of Italy is the Atalanta vs Valencia Champions League match in Milan in mid February when 40,000 Atalanta fans travelled from Bergamo to Milan and would also have packed out the pubs of Bergamo for those who didn't travel. Looking at that scenario, it sounds very similar to a match in Croke Park with everyone travelling to Dublin and then back home so its easy to see how mass gatherings of the sort could led to virus outbreaks spreading massively unfortunately.

mcgragger · 07-04-2020 9:34pm

Greensoup wrote: »

It was on Newstalk on Wednesday (April 1st)....

Legit if it was on Newstalk

Greensoup · 07-04-2020 11:25pm

Yep sure is for April 1st.

rpurfield · 08-04-2020 1:59pm

Coillte_Bhoy wrote: »

I dont think there is a hope in hell of the cships being player this year. Are people not listening or paying attention? Barring some sort of miraculous breakthrough here will be no vaccine for months yet, even an antibody test is a long way off. I understand the need for hope but some of the stuff posted here is just pure delusion. This virus isnt going anywhere, and if we do tentatively start the games again what happens when a player tests positive and the whole panel has to go into isolation for 2 weeks, further dragging thiugn sout. Please feel free to bump this post in September if the cships are in full flow, and ill gladly eat humble pie.

No harm having a bit of a debate on it in these testing times. I don't think the GAA or Government are going to be logging on here and taking advice from a bunch of people talking sh1te on an internet forum!

Coillte_Bhoy · 08-04-2020 3:07pm

[QUOTE=rpurfield;113094654]No harm having a bit of a debate on it in these testing times. I don't think the GAA or Government are going to be logging on here and taking advice from a bunch of people talking sh1te on an internet forum![/QUOTE]

No, you're quite right so in the unlikely event of the cship being played i think the most likely scenario is an 'open' draw type knockout with top 8 teams seeded

scrubs33 · 08-04-2020 3:42pm

Coillte_Bhoy wrote: »

No, you're quite right so in the unlikely event of the cship being played i think the most likely scenario is an 'open' draw type knockout with top 8 teams seeded

I think there is a real chance for the GAA to implement real reform for the Championship but I'm not sure whether they want to take a chance on it. I would love to see an open draw for the McCarthy cup. Teams from 1a and 1b when the league stopped with home advantage to first drawn team. Imagine a repeat of last years hurling semi finals in Nolan Park or Thurles on a Saturday and Sunday with one of the teams going out each day.... And as for the football Kerry vs Dublin in Killarney....

Chalk McHugh · 08-04-2020 4:05pm

scrubs33 wrote: »

I think there is a real chance for the GAA to implement real reform for the Championship but I'm not sure whether they want to take a chance on it. I would love to see an open draw for the McCarthy cup. Teams from 1a and 1b when the league stopped with home advantage to first drawn team. Imagine a repeat of last years hurling semi finals in Nolan Park or Thurles on a Saturday and Sunday with one of the teams going out each day.... And as for the football Kerry vs Dublin in Killarney....

Sounds good. But what about fans attending the games? Maybe 20% capacity permitted? I'd take behind cloeed doors at this stage but the GAA rely on gate receipts so tv money wont suffice.

arctictree · 08-04-2020 4:20pm

scrubs33 wrote: »

I think there is a real chance for the GAA to implement real reform for the Championship but I'm not sure whether they want to take a chance on it. I would love to see an open draw for the McCarthy cup. Teams from 1a and 1b when the league stopped with home advantage to first drawn team. Imagine a repeat of last years hurling semi finals in Nolan Park or Thurles on a Saturday and Sunday with one of the teams going out each day.... And as for the football Kerry vs Dublin in Killarney....

Extend it to the top 4 from 2A and you have 16 teams. Open draw, straight knockout.

C__MC · 08-04-2020 4:27pm

Wont be a championship lads
Cramming thousands of people into grounds when no cure is close

We live in hope though

09-04-2020 6:57pm

The Gaa are taking there time about making a decession as it is only a month away to the round robin in the hurling.

PTH2009 · 09-04-2020 8:04pm

its possible we could see the return of the old calender wih it finishing on paddys day 2021 with the AI senior club finals. IC championships July/Aug/Sep/possibly til Oct

dobman88 · 09-04-2020 10:44pm

Fred Daly wrote: »

The Gaa are taking there time about making a decession as it is only a month away to the round robin in the hurling.

Well since we seem to be looking at an extension to restrictions for another 2 weeks (govt announcement due tomorrow evening), I wouldn't expect the round Robin format to go ahead.

Vinnie222 · 10-04-2020 10:27am

dobman88 wrote: »

Well since we seem to be looking at an extension to restrictions for another 2 weeks (govt announcement due tomorrow evening), I wouldn't expect the round Robin format to go ahead.

Social distance is going to be here good while. Hard to see any championship happening.

Chalk McHugh · 10-04-2020 10:57am

It will be played lads. Have some faith and hope. All Ire champions in football and hurling will be known before the year is out. If they have to run it off under lights in Croke Park Oct - Dec they will. We will see action this year. Am i losing my marbles? After all some say its the hope that kills you in the end.

dobman88 · 10-04-2020 4:18pm

dobman88 wrote: »

Well since we seem to be looking at an extension to restrictions for another 2 weeks (govt announcement due tomorrow evening), I wouldn't expect the round Robin format to go ahead.

3 week extension so that brings us up to May 5th.

Forget about a championship this season lads

Chalk McHugh · 10-04-2020 4:20pm

dobman88 wrote: »

3 week extension so that brings us up to May 5th.

Forget about a championship this season lads

I'll do an imaginary 100e bet with you that there will.

Championship and Covid

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