Ridiculous short interval at traffic lights

testarossa40 · 04-07-2020 10:09pm

Implementation of the UK version light sequence (Green-Amber-Red-Amber-Green) might help get more cars away when the lights turn green?

Tarabuses · 05-07-2020 2:01pm

testarossa40 wrote: »

Implementation of the UK version light sequence (Green-Amber-Red-Amber-Green) might help get more cars away when the lights turn green?

Not when the drivers are busy using their phones at the red light.

tibia · 05-07-2020 7:55pm

As someone who drives to work with no realistic public transport alternative, I was concerned reading this thread.

I too had noticed the short green lights in various places over the last few months and thought it might have been the low traffic volumes causing problems with the adaptive sequencing. Now I realise it is a deliberate adjustment as described earlier in the thread.

It makes sense to adjust the traffic systems to facilitate increased pedestrian and bicycle traffic. However, throttling vehicle traffic to an excessive degree will have a negative environmental impact - especially in the immediate locality.

I can think of one such thoroughfare in a leafy suburb which is choked with traffic in both directions during morning and evening rush hour - essentially a 700m long line of cars in each direction either stationary or moving at walking pace - courtesy of traffic lights at each end. When a car is stopped with the engine idling it achieves 0 MPG. The exhaust fumes from all the petrol and diesel cars idling on this road in the morning and evening are very unpleasant. I would think the residents of the expensive houses do not enjoy this particular feature of their locality.

From an environmental and even health-and-safety perspective, it would seem to make sense to optimise the traffic flow so that cars can move efficiently to their destination instead of creating miles of polluting tailbacks especially in residential areas. For example, in the evening rush hour the traffic system should aim to get all the polluting cars out of the city as quickly as possible instead of keeping them queuing everywhere with their engines idling and fumes pouring out. Of course, doing this will just encourage more people into cars which is probably self-defeating and not what we want to be doing anyhow.

I think the only way to reduce car usage is to make public transport a more realistic alternative for more people. Using short green intervals to frustrate the motorist just leads to hardship for people like me who have no practical alternative (unless my morning journey goes up from 50 minutes to 2.5 hours which is what the bus took, last time I tried it).

My fear is that come next Autumn when schools return, the new short green intervals will create tailbacks of unseen proportions all over Dublin.

Truthvader · 05-07-2020 8:24pm

tibia wrote: »

As someone who drives to work with no realistic public transport alternative, I was concerned reading this thread.

I too had noticed the short green lights in various places over the last few months and thought it might have been the low traffic volumes causing problems with the adaptive sequencing. Now I realise it is a deliberate adjustment as described earlier in the thread.

It makes sense to adjust the traffic systems to facilitate increased pedestrian and bicycle traffic. However, throttling vehicle traffic to an excessive degree will have a negative environmental impact - especially in the immediate locality.

I can think of one such thoroughfare in a leafy suburb which is choked with traffic in both directions during morning and evening rush hour - essentially a 700m long line of cars in each direction either stationary or moving at walking pace - courtesy of traffic lights at each end. When a car is stopped with the engine idling it achieves 0 MPG. The exhaust fumes from all the petrol and diesel cars idling on this road in the morning and evening are very unpleasant. I would think the residents of the expensive houses do not enjoy this particular feature of their locality.

From an environmental and even health-and-safety perspective, it would seem to make sense to optimise the traffic flow so that cars can move efficiently to their destination instead of creating miles of polluting tailbacks especially in residential areas. For example, in the evening rush hour the traffic system should aim to get all the polluting cars out of the city as quickly as possible instead of keeping them queuing everywhere with their engines idling and fumes pouring out. Of course, doing this will just encourage more people into cars which is probably self-defeating and not what we want to be doing anyhow.

I think the only way to reduce car usage is to make public transport a more realistic alternative for more people. Using short green intervals to frustrate the motorist just leads to hardship for people like me who have no practical alternative (unless my morning journey goes up from 50 minutes to 2.5 hours which is what the bus took, last time I tried it).

My fear is that come next Autumn when schools return, the new short green intervals will create tailbacks of unseen proportions all over Dublin.

Dont think you get it. DCC have dedicated themselves to making Dublin traffic as slow and difficult as possible over the last 30 years. This is just the latest wheeze after years of blocked roads, parking removed, footpaths deliberately extended to obstruct left hand lanes/ turns. Many of the posters here think this is a great thing and will promte and cheer it every step of the way.

Galadriel · 05-07-2020 8:27pm

HeidiHeidi wrote: »

It's like when there was no traffic, they switched all the lights to night-time mode, but forgot to switch them back now that traffic is increasing back to near normal levels.

There's a couple of sets on my route home that barely let two cars through, even if they're on the ball.

That's exactly what I thought, it's crazy that they haven't change them back, it's so frustrating.

markpb · 05-07-2020 9:01pm

tibia wrote: »

From an environmental and even health-and-safety perspective, it would seem to make sense to optimise the traffic flow so that cars can move efficiently to their destination instead of creating miles of polluting tailbacks

What you’re suggesting is/was law in California and was used to block cycling and bus improvements over the years. It turns out that it’s wrong and doesn’t work. Optimising locally for vehicles ends up making active and mass transport a lot less attractive so people end up driving. The net effect is that overall pollution is worse, the throughout of the entire system is reduced and the health benefits of cycling, walking and even walking to/from bus stops is lost.

bigar · 05-07-2020 9:57pm

I can only applaud anything that inconveniences cars inside build up areas. Cars standing still are much safer for pedestrians and cyclists (although no cars would be even better).
Cannot stand sitting in your car just waiting? Take a bicycle, walk or get a motorbike/moped and waiting times will be greatly reduced.

LeinsterDub · 05-07-2020 10:54pm

Truthvader wrote: »

Dont think you get it. DCC have dedicated themselves to making Dublin traffic as slow and difficult as possible over the last 30 years. This is just the latest wheeze after years of blocked roads, parking removed, footpaths deliberately extended to obstruct left hand lanes/ turns. Many of the posters here think this is a great thing and will promte and cheer it every step of the way.

Do you understand the concept of limited capacity? Dublin has no more room for cars. Alternatives need to be promoted

Truthvader · 05-07-2020 11:00pm

LeinsterDub wrote: »

Do you understand the concept of limited capacity? Dublin has no more room for cars. Alternatives need to be promoted

The capacity has been deliberately and artificially reduced. Check out all the cheerleaders here and the level of jealousy and spite informing their posts. The agenda is not to promote alternatives but to drag everyone down to the level of bicycles/CIE they are stuck with

LeinsterDub · 05-07-2020 11:06pm

Truthvader wrote: »

The capacity has been deliberately and artificially reduced. Check out all the cheerleaders here and the level of jealousy and spite informing their posts. The agenda is not to promote alternatives but to drag everyone down to the level of bicycles/CIE they are stuck with

No it hasn't. The number of cars has sky rocketed. Up nearly 100% in 30 years.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/452305/ireland-number-of-registered-passenger-cars/#:~:text=Registered%20passenger%20cars%20in%20Ireland%201990-2017&text=In%202017%2C%20the%20number%20of,approximately%20two%20million%20registered%20vehicles.

You've dismissed cycling and public transport. Not many alternatives left for you is there?

magicbastarder · 05-07-2020 11:07pm

ah, the old jealousy argument. says more about the person making the claim than it does about who they're making the claim against.

FitzElla · 06-07-2020 8:57am

I also thought the reduced traffic volumes during the lockdown had messed up the sensors but reading this thread has been interesting. Several sets of lights I go through barley let 2 cars through now. The fact so many people check their phone at lights doesn't help either, the light can be green for a bit before some people get moving.

I agree with getting people to move from cars to other transport, but will the changes to lights not massively impact Dublin Bus? From what I remember they carry the majority of public transport users in Dublin. How do they expect people to switch to the bus when it is getting slower?

LeinsterDub · 06-07-2020 8:59am

FitzElla wrote: »

I also thought the reduced traffic volumes during the lockdown had messed up the sensors but reading this thread has been interesting. Several sets of lights I go through barley let 2 cars through now. The fact so many people check their phone at lights doesn't help either, the light can be green for a bit before some people get moving.

I agree with getting people to move from cars to other transport, but will the changes to lights not massively impact Dublin Bus? From what I remember they carry the majority of public transport users in Dublin. How do they expect people to switch to the bus when it is getting slower?

Lights are basically the bottom of the list for buses.
It goes in my opinion.
Cars in bus lanes
Dwell time
Rambling routes
Excessive number of stop
Traffic lights

FitzElla · 06-07-2020 9:11am

LeinsterDub wrote: »

Lights are basically the bottom of the list for buses.
It goes in my opinion.
Cars in bus lanes
Dwell time
Rambling routes
Excessive number of stop
Traffic lights

True, but where there is no bus lane the effect of slowing down traffic directly impacts on buses. Also drivers get frustrated at short change lights and start blocking junctions, using bus lanes and generally create more congestion for buses to navigate. Coupled with little to no enforcement of red lights, yellow box junctions or bus lanes, it is a free for all out there.

Fiddling with the light sequence in the absence of real enforcement and a real effort to improve the alternatives (bus mainly) only makes everyone's journey worse. When the schools go back in September the city is going to grind to a halt.

LeinsterDub · 06-07-2020 9:30am

FitzElla wrote: »

True, but where there is no bus lane the effect of slowing down traffic directly impacts on buses. Also drivers get frustrated at short change lights and start blocking junctions, using bus lanes and generally create more congestion for buses to navigate. Coupled with little to no enforcement of red lights, yellow box junctions or bus lanes, it is a free for all out there.

Fiddling with the light sequence in the absence of real enforcement and a real effort to improve the alternatives (bus mainly) only makes everyone's journey worse. When the schools go back in September the city is going to grind to a halt.

So because motorist will break the law we should just give them what they want? We already tried that and it failed. Cycling and walking are real alternatives regardless of the fact you seem to think they aren't. Hopefully with a new government ANPR isn't too far away now

FitzElla · 06-07-2020 10:05am

LeinsterDub wrote: »

So because motorist will break the law we should just give them what they want? We already tried that and it failed. Cycling and walking are real alternatives regardless of the fact you seem to think they aren't. Hopefully with a new government ANPR isn't too far away now

I never mentioned walking or cycling at all. I think they are the ideal alternatives for those who have that option. What about the 1000's who commute from beyond the M50 - north county Dublin, Meath, Kildare and Wicklow? For many of those they will be on a bus. The bus that will be stuck in the new traffic caused by changing the lights. I think that the decision to change the lights in the absence of better enforcement or engineering more priority for buses at junctions is shortsighted and will make many bus users commutes longer without changing the numbers of drivers on the road.

Truthvader · 06-07-2020 10:16am

LeinsterDub wrote: »

No it hasn't. The number of cars has sky rocketed. Up nearly 100% in 30 years.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/452305/ireland-number-of-registered-passenger-cars/#:~:text=Registered%20passenger%20cars%20in%20Ireland%201990-2017&text=In%202017%2C%20the%20number%20of,approximately%20two%20million%20registered%20vehicles.

You've dismissed cycling and public transport. Not many alternatives left for you is there?

Cars up 100% according to you. Parking and road space artificially reduced over 30 years. What result were you expecting?

How about cars up !00% Road space and parking up 100%?

The only answer you get here is the sad, spiteful bicycle crowd repeating that "it wont work" plus the cheering for the continuation of DCC's malicious campaign.

I don't commute myself (sorry lads) but have watched this going on year after year. Actually met DCC Traffic Department about 20 years ago. Even then all were bicycle loons with no other agenda.

As I have posted before the solution is an underground but they will not consider that on any account as it does not meet the primary goal (as evidenced here) to "get" motorists

LeinsterDub · 06-07-2020 10:20am

FitzElla wrote: »

I never mentioned walking or cycling at all. I think they are the ideal alternatives for those who have that option. What about the 1000's who commute from beyond the M50 - north county Dublin, Meath, Kildare and Wicklow? For many of those they will be on a bus. The bus that will be stuck in the new traffic caused by changing the lights. I think that the decision to change the lights in the absence of better enforcement or engineering more priority for buses at junctions is shortsighted and will make many bus users commutes longer without changing the numbers of drivers on the road.

Enforcement of Bus Lanes will save as much time if not more than lost at lights. We need ANPR now

markpb · 06-07-2020 10:48am

Truthvader wrote: »

How about cars up !00% Road space and parking up 100%?

Car usage is up in Ireland. Car usage in Dublin city centre is down every year for the last decade. If you look at the number of people instead of the number of vehicles, car usage makes up a tiny proportion of the traffic inside the city centre. And yet car lanes (aside from bus lanes) make up the largest proportion of the road space.

If you're saying that increasing road space to accommodate extra cars is a good solution, you have been proven wrong repeatedly by history, not just here but in every other city. You can live in your own bizarre little world where everyone who disagrees with you is sad, spiteful or a bicycle loon but that says more about you than it does about anyone else.

Also, the conspiracy theory that DCC don't want a metro is a wonderful invention. DCC couldn't ever pay for a metro, that will be done by central government through TII/NTA. On the other hand, central government has very little say in the timing of traffic lights, that's done by DCC. I suppose you could suggest that they're scheming together to get you but then you'd have to ignore the billions of euros put into road building and maintenance over the last twenty years. It's a bit odd to spend that kind of money building roads if you hate cyclists.

trellheim · 06-07-2020 10:54am

the amount of twaddle here trying to argue against what is increased safety for pedestrians is unreal. Stand at any busy traffic lights in Dublin and watch the red light jumpers, in many cases across green pedestrian lights. And you are wondering why they get increased time ?

Zero sympathy whatsoever should be seven points on the license for jumping ambers and reds

Lockheed · 06-07-2020 11:00am

There are a few awful traffic lights like this in and around Navan. On the driving test route no less. You slow down to approach the junction and the lights go from red to green back to red by the time you've made it there. Makes progression very difficult as you try to judge the lights when really, you should be making sure there is no traffic in your blindspot and ahead of you on the approach to the junction. I get that the point is to make people more cautious but in a way it actually makes driving more dangerous as its another un needed variable you have to account for in a situation where you need to be on top of all traffic around you and ahead of you. I hate the gamble of whether I keep my speed up to progress or just slow down to avoid having to slam on the brakes.

LeinsterDub · 06-07-2020 11:04am

Truthvader wrote: »

Cars up 100% according to you.

No according to the CSO not me .

Truthvader wrote: »

Parking and road space artificially reduced over 30 years. What result were you expecting?

If memory serves the following have been built in the last 30 years
M50 and all the motorways that feed into it
M50 and all the motorways that feed into it upgrade
1000's of KM's roads around housing estates
Underground parking at most new builds in town
Jervis St car park
1000's of KM's of road widening and slip corners

Versus
Several 100 km of bus lanes that cars constantly abuse
10's of km for luas
Several 100 km of cycle lanes that cars constantly abuse

Truthvader wrote: »

How about cars up !00% Road space and parking up 100%?

Your basically calling for Dublin to be bulldozed so

Truthvader wrote: »

The only answer you get here is the sad, spiteful bicycle crowd

What the hell is the spiteful bike crowd ?

Truthvader wrote: »

repeating that "it wont work" plus the cheering for the continuation of DCC's malicious campaign.

Not 'it won't work' , it hasn't worked.

Truthvader wrote: »

As I have posted before the solution is an underground but they will not consider that on any account as it does not meet the primary goal (as evidenced here) to "get" motorists

You mean this https://www.metrolink.ie/#/home

magicbastarder · 06-07-2020 11:04am

trellheim wrote: »

the amount of twaddle here trying to argue against what is increased safety for pedestrians is unreal. Stand at any busy traffic lights in Dublin and watch the red light jumpers, in many cases across green pedestrian lights. And you are wondering why they get increased time ?

Zero sympathy whatsoever should be seven points on the license for jumping ambers and reds

that's a different issue though. total lack of enforcement, and length of light sequences, are different issues.

ahnowbrowncow · 06-07-2020 12:33pm

To me it llooks like DCC are deliberately slowing an already painfully slow public transport system for very little gain.

There are far more roads without bus lanes than those with bus lanes in Dublin so the traffic light sequence has a much bigger impact on buses than cars illegally using bus lanes. Plus I'd be interested in seeing stats on illegal bus lane use and the impact of it in Dublin, aside from triggering indiviuals, but I'm nothing really seeing the relevance of it in this conversation anyway.

Quackster · 06-07-2020 12:55pm

Truthvader wrote: »

The capacity has been deliberately and artificially reduced. Check out all the cheerleaders here and the level of jealousy and spite informing their posts. The agenda is not to promote alternatives but to drag everyone down to the level of bicycles/CIE they are stuck with

Jealousy and spite at what exactly..??

I am a car owner and I absolutely applaud what DCC is doing.

LeinsterDub · 06-07-2020 1:00pm

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

but I'm nothing really seeing the relevance of it in this conversation anyway.

Pre-covid: Bus is stuck behind a line of cars illegally using the bus lane , has to wait for 3 or 4 set sequences to get through.

Post-covid (hopefully): Enforce the bus lanes , bus has to wait slightly longer for lights to change but gets out on the 1st sequence

ahnowbrowncow · 06-07-2020 1:40pm

LeinsterDub wrote: »

Pre-covid: Bus is stuck behind a line of cars illegally using the bus lane , has to wait for 3 or 4 set sequences to get through.

Post-covid (hopefully): Enforce the bus lanes , bus has to wait slightly longer for lights to change but gets out on the 1st sequence

Except that the majority of roads don't have bus lanes and they're sitting waiting on traffic lights to change with all the other vehicles. Plus many bus lanes often merge with normal traffic and have to wait for another couple of light sequences to get through so buses are yet again badly affected by this change.

I haven't seen a bus miss numerous lights because of so many cars illegally using a bus lane. Taxi drivers and parked vehicles are a bigger issue for buses so I don't believe there would be a big difference with 100% enforcement. I'm happy to be proven wrong with research and statistics.

markpb · 06-07-2020 2:05pm

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

I haven't seen a bus miss numerous lights because of so many cars illegally using a bus lane.

DCC had to cordon off almost 500m of bus lane at N1/Collins Ave junction because so many cars were blocking it. Anecdotes are wonderful things.

LeinsterDub · 06-07-2020 2:12pm

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

Except that the majority of roads don't have bus lanes and they're sitting waiting on traffic lights to change with all the other vehicles. Plus many bus lanes often merge with normal traffic and have to wait for another couple of light sequences to get through so buses are yet again badly affected by this change.

I haven't seen a bus miss numerous lights because of so many cars illegally using a bus lane. Taxi drivers and parked vehicles are a bigger issue for buses so I don't believe there would be a big difference with 100% enforcement. I'm happy to be proven wrong with research and statistics.

Nothing is perfect but it's a start
I see it all the time. Can't find any research at the moment but I know the NTA consider this a major problem, partly BusConnects is designed to fix the problem. DCC have installed bollards at numerous locations to help with this problem.

LeinsterDub · 06-07-2020 2:16pm

markpb wrote: »

DCC had to cordon off almost 500m of bus lane at N1/Collins Ave junction because so many cars were blocking it. Anecdotes are wonderful things.

https://twitter.com/ccferrie/status/1279838828572917761?s=20

Just this week

https://dublininquirer.com/2020/03/04/misuse-of-bus-lanes-by-drivers-of-cars-could-badly-hamper-proposed-busconnects-network

https://labourforeurope.ie/news/2019/11/12/gridlock-traffic-cameras-needed-in-bus-lanes/

donvito99 · 06-07-2020 3:11pm

Truthvader wrote: »

The capacity has been deliberately and artificially reduced. Check out all the cheerleaders here and the level of jealousy and spite informing their posts. The agenda is not to promote alternatives but to drag everyone down to the level of bicycles/CIE they are stuck with

And private cars don't drag down bus reliability/journey times? Ha.

beauf · 06-07-2020 5:13pm

The change in timings caused lots of tailbacks even with light traffic at some local bottlenecks near me. Heard people complaining in local and social media.

I didn't notice personally as I rarely drive though them and WFH hardly driving anyway.

In fact its quite strange with traffic still being light how often you hit a queue lately, and not peak times either.

The time to try all this stuff is certainly now. But the main thing causing a difference is WFH and lots of places being closed. So it's not a true test of anything. They should be promoting staggered hours and more WFH.

I suspect once things reopen they'll go back to peak time again.

markpb · 06-07-2020 5:28pm

beauf wrote: »

In fact its quite strange with traffic still being light how often you hit a queue lately, and not peak times either.

Traffic is not light, that’s a misconception held by people who are WFH. TII traffic counters show volumes increasing since mid-April and by mid May they were back to 50% so they’re well on the way to recovery by now.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/significantly-higher-traffic-volumes-on-some-roads-figures-show-1.4256172

For example, last week traffic count on the M50 between N4 and N7 was 131k. The same week last year was 167k.

beauf · 06-07-2020 5:46pm

50% of normal volumes is light no?

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/car-hgv-traffic-returns-to-pre-covid-levels-amid-slower-recovery-on-public-transport-1.4295467

The point is there are queues off peak where normally there aren't even during peak, or at least not as bad.

LeinsterDub · 06-07-2020 6:19pm

beauf wrote: »

50% of normal volumes is light no?

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/car-hgv-traffic-returns-to-pre-covid-levels-amid-slower-recovery-on-public-transport-1.4295467

The point is there are queues off peak where normally there aren't even during peak, or at least not as bad.

The nature of traffic has changed. Cars moving at different times and to different locations

Ben D Bus · 06-07-2020 7:31pm

Truthvader wrote: »

The agenda is not to promote alternatives but to drag everyone down to the level of bicycles/CIE they are stuck with

I have to challenge the assertion that cycling and public transport are in some way levels below the private car.

I feel they are actually superior as they are more efficient, environmentally friendly, socially responsible, eaglitarian, and generally make for a more pleasant city.

punisher5112 · 06-07-2020 7:59pm

With Chu as lord mayor I can only see things getting much worse....

davindub · 06-07-2020 8:31pm

markpb wrote: »

DCC had to cordon off almost 500m of bus lane at N1/Collins Ave junction because so many cars were blocking it. Anecdotes are wonderful things.

The cordoned off area is just used as a rat run for cars to skip the queue now.

These things are great if they are only used by the buses but between taxis and queue jumpers who wont let cars turn left, it is a bit of a bottle neck..

markpb · 06-07-2020 8:45pm

punisher5112 wrote: »

With Chu as lord mayor I can only see things getting much worse....

The Lord Mayor has very little power. If she was Chief Exec, you might have some cause for concern.

LeinsterDub · 06-07-2020 9:03pm

punisher5112 wrote: »

With Chu as lord mayor I can only see things getting much worse....

I've a carton of milk that has more power than the lord mayor

magicbastarder · 06-07-2020 9:19pm

indeed, they'd be replacing car lanes with whitewater streams rather than cycle lanes.

AlekSmart · 06-07-2020 10:03pm

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

To me it llooks like DCC are deliberately slowing an already painfully slow public transport system for very little gain.

There are far more roads without bus lanes than those with bus lanes in Dublin so the traffic light sequence has a much bigger impact on buses than cars illegally using bus lanes. Plus I'd be interested in seeing stats on illegal bus lane use and the impact of it in Dublin, aside from triggering indiviuals, but I'm nothing really seeing the relevance of it in this conversation anyway.

The DCC/NTA post Covid-19 document is available here...

http://www.dublincity.ie/covidmobilityprogramme

The main thrust is to Increase cycling by 200% and walking by 100%.

Interestingly the Council's committment to Bus Service Prioritization is somewhat vague and subject to that wonderful caveat,so often used by reluctant authorities...."Insofar as practicable"...;)

https://www.dublincity.ie/node/19521

Oh well,at least we get a specific mention of Winetavern Street.

West Access Radial Route
This route will allow buses coming from the Cork Street and High Street directions to use the river crossing at O’Donovan Rossa Bridge via Winetavern Street.
These bus routes, along the western alignment will be facilitated by a new contra-flow bus lane on Winetavern Street as well as measures on other streets.

A jolly jape indeed !

magicbastarder · 07-07-2020 8:54pm

was waiting at lights - northbound at the main junction in the middle of ballymun - about an hour ago, first in the queue. i know the light sequence there, so was moving as soon as they went green - and they turned amber when i was still about two car lengths from the light on the other side of the junction. shortest sequence i've seen yet.

Truthvader · 09-07-2020 10:11am

LeinsterDub wrote: »

No according to the CSO not me .

If memory serves the following have been built in the last 30 years
M50 and all the motorways that feed into it
M50 and all the motorways that feed into it upgrade
1000's of KM's roads around housing estates
Underground parking at most new builds in town
Jervis St car park
1000's of KM's of road widening and slip corners

Versus
Several 100 km of bus lanes that cars constantly abuse
10's of km for luas
Several 100 km of cycle lanes that cars constantly abuse

Your basically calling for Dublin to be bulldozed so

What the hell is the spiteful bike crowd ?

Not 'it won't work' , it hasn't worked.

You mean this https://www.metrolink.ie/#/home

The purpose of this thread is DCC's action on traffic lights, I am highlighting that this part of a long ongoing campaign to make driving unpleasant and that the bicycle crowd support this campaign

All the roads to Cork Galway Limerick Belfast have been vastly improved plus the M 50 etc etc. Thank God. No charge is paid by me so happily as road toll

DCC have repeatedly taken actions to make things **** for drivers with no other agenda. If you are a bicycle fan I can fully understand why a bicycle lane is a good idea and why you would agitate and lobby for same BUT blocking roads, extending footpaths to extinguish left filter lanes removing parking and changing light sequences to deliberately create traffic problems just makes things **** for everyone. Even if you are a bicycle nut none of this makes your life any better.

My further point re spite and malice is that as evidenced on every cycling thread on Boards there is a sizeable section of he bicycle mob who support these actions purely on the basis that it "gets" car owners and for no other reason. The same people crop up encouraging others to provoke conflict by cycling in the middle of the road and get cameras to record the trouble they hope to cause etc etc

donvito99 · 09-07-2020 10:20am

Truthvader wrote: »

The purpose of this thread is DCC's action on traffic lights, I am highlighting that this part of a long ongoing campaign to make driving unpleasant and that the bicycle crowd support this campaign

All the roads to Cork Galway Limerick Belfast have been vastly improved plus the M 50 etc etc. Thank God. No charge is paid by me so happily as road toll

DCC have repeatedly taken actions to make things **** for drivers with no other agenda. If you are a bicycle fan I can fully understand why a bicycle lane is a good idea and why you would agitate and lobby for same BUT blocking roads, extending footpaths to extinguish left filter lanes removing parking and changing light sequences to deliberately create traffic problems just makes things **** for everyone. Even if you are a bicycle nut none of this makes your life any better.

My further point re spite and malice is that as evidenced on every cycling thread on Boards there is a sizeable section of he bicycle mob who support these actions purely on the basis that it "gets" car owners and for no other reason. The same people crop up encouraging others to provoke conflict by cycling in the middle of the road and get cameras to record the trouble they hope to cause etc etc

Clearly it doesn't. Wider footpaths and longer crossing times obviously makes life easier for pedestrians.

The purpose is to discourage driving. There was crazy traffic prior to these measures and crazy traffic after. That's fairly telling.

I don't agree with these measures but saying that it is just to "get" motorists is silly, it's to "get" all of the shite resulting from the traffic caused by cars that everyone has to put up with, COVID or not.

bigar · 09-07-2020 11:02am

the boss of me wrote: »

I think you're missing the point. It's the ridiculously short time the traffic light is staying green that is causing the problem and making the car so inefficient. But it's not just cars being held up. There is no bus priority on that particular stretch of road so the short sequence is having an adverse effect on buses.

The point is that traffic lights are needed because there are too many private cars and taxis blocking up the city. Reduce these and less traffic lights are needed. Bus lanes would also no longer be required.

The amount of junctions with traffic lights in Dublin is ridiculous and people really need to get into a mindset of not wanting to go everywhere by car.

Hotblack Desiato · 09-07-2020 11:12am

Truthvader wrote: »

DCC have repeatedly taken actions to make things **** for drivers with no other agenda.

Tbh what makes "things **** for drivers" is all the other drivers.

Problem is drivers make things **** for bus users, cyclists, pedestrians, residents and the environment in general too.

Because private cars are such a wildly inefficient use of road space, road space demand always rises to exceed road space provision. This is the case everywhere in the world except for authoritarian states which drastically ration car ownership.

Dublin needs to undergo a major shift away from private car commuting if it is to become a livable and viable city. You can choose to be part of the problem, or part of the solution.

(Before working from home I was a motorcycle commuter)

_Kaiser_ · 09-07-2020 11:17am

Listening to Eoin Keegan from DCC on R1 here and he seems to be acknowledging that the light changes are causing issues as general traffic has increased again and complaints are mounting. Seems to be suggesting that they'll look at moving the timing back to somewhere closer to what it was "100 seconds rather than 120"

beauf · 09-07-2020 12:08pm

I'm a little confused by all this.

Even as a keen cyclist, I cannot do all my journeys by bicycle or public transport. So some car use is inevitable. Sometimes I might have a situation where I have to do all my journeys by car.
Even where I can use my bikes, there are other issues not being addressed. High level of bicycle theft etc. It makes using a decent bike or something like an eBike problematic.
An my work has off road, secure(ish) bike cage. But they can break into anything. They need to crack down on bike crime with severe penalties.

WFH home and even flexible hours plays a big part in traffic. The Govt needs to incentive staggered opening, for schools and offices, and WFH.

Planning. Our planning is brutal. We are creating bottlenecks and demand problems with our planning. Look at national children's hospital fisaco. I dread visiting that a peak, or parking at it.
Local junctions are all destroyed by poor signalling, and design. Then traffic is blamed. But it only part of the issue. Instead of doing more with less. We are doing less with more.

Yes we have to move to less car use, and yes you have try it. But the traffic at the moment is not at normal levels. Its mistake to think all these measures are working based on the current traffic levels. TBH I would said they aren't working.

If the answer is tough, that just how it is. Fine.

markpb · 09-07-2020 12:15pm

Truthvader wrote: »

DCC have repeatedly taken actions to make things **** for drivers with no other agenda. If you are a bicycle fan I can fully understand why a bicycle lane is a good idea and why you would agitate and lobby for same BUT blocking roads, extending footpaths to extinguish left filter lanes removing parking and changing light sequences to deliberately create traffic problems just makes things **** for everyone. Even if you are a bicycle nut none of this makes your life any better.

You have a persecution complex. Slip lanes are being removed because they are dangerous for cyclists, not to make drivers lives worse. Footpaths are being widened because pedestrians need more space, not to make drivers lives worse. Parking spots were removed to create space for cycle lanes, not to make drivers lives worse. Light sequences were changed to reduce the time pedestrians need to wait to cross the road, not to make drivers lives worse. All these things benefit lots of people. You could even say that they benefit you by encouraging others out of their cars which makes more space for you. It might even encourage other people to be healthier, leaving more capacity in the health system for you if you need it.

You really need to get over yourself and your weird obsession that they're out to get you, it's unhealthy.

Ridiculous short interval at traffic lights

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