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Hyundai Kona EV pre orders open

12467…48

Comments

  • #152
    rocky
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,961 ✭✭✭rocky


    Haven't seen this posted here yet, Autogefühl's review on the Geneva show floor

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZkWlzuJRrjg


    Doesn't look too small, a 64kWh sounds like the perfect family car for us (once my 2 kids don't grow up to be 188cm tall like their old man... but we'll find out in ~18 years, plenty of time to find a replacement :cool:

    I suppose I'll keep the 530i as a second car in the meantime :D


  • #153
    80sDiesel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,349 ✭✭✭80sDiesel


    Yeah big fan of Autogefühl reviews. 
    They did a nice review of the lexus UX. When you compare the exterior, the kona sure is ugly !

    A man is rich in proportion to the number of things which he can afford to let alone.



  • #154
    liamog
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 8,061 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    Each to their own I guess, but the Lexus UX has to be one of the ugliest front ends of a car I've seen.

    Ditto on the quality of Autogefühl, they seem very good.


  • #155
    80sDiesel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,349 ✭✭✭80sDiesel


    liamog wrote: »
    Each to their own I guess, but the Lexus UX has to be one of the ugliest front ends of a car I've seen.

    Ditto on the quality of Autogefühl, they seem very good.
    Definitely hate it or love it. The kona frontend. Forgettable.

    A man is rich in proportion to the number of things which he can afford to let alone.



  • #156
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 21,179 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    unkel wrote: »
    No decent spec on Ioniq? You're making a fool of yourself by posting stuff like that, Mad_Lad



    Not to mention active cruise control, lane keep assist, auto lights, auto wipers, keyless entry / locking / start, etc. :)

    Active cruise is cool but lane keep assist is a joke,

    They should have imported a few highest spec ones than lol


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  • #157
    ELM327
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,234 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Active cruise is cool but lane keep assist is a joke,

    They should have imported a few highest spec ones than lol
    Bjorn's reviews would leave me to believe that the LKA in the Ioniq is the best non-Tesla AP system.

    The only spec we don't get here that they have in the UK is the premium model with leather seats etc. But the spec here is not paddy spec.


  • #158
    unkel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,733 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Sure what does Bjorn know about EVs? Or any of us who have owned Ioniq for quite some time? :p

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  • #159
    liamog
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 8,061 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    Are we back to the Shrodinger's Mad_Lad's cat of EVs.

    Until personally experienced by Mad_Lad, all EVs and the experience of driving one are a conspiracy and the numbers made up.

    If it's anything like the Ioniq we'll see models in dealers by the end of summer with deliveries due for the 191 plate.


  • #160
    peposhi
    Registered Users Posts: 1,404 ✭✭✭peposhi


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Most people dont want big cars anymore.

    I showed to my wife and she loved it, if she didn't have 3 kids then it would be bought tomorrow.....`

    Her sister spent stupid money buying a Hybrid C-HR......every extra she included on it,.....

    Same with a colleague of mine... Paid 34 Gs for her CHR (- some discounts). Went for the look, did not care for the figures...


  • #161
    unkel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,733 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    How fast will Kona 64kWh charge? Ioniq charges at up to 70kW, so has a 70/28 = 2.5c

    If Kona can do 2.5c too, it can charge up to 160kW :eek:

    That would be brilliant on the 150kW Ionity chargers. 20%-80% @150kW in 15 minutes, taking on almost 40kWh, good for at least 200km @120km/h

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  • #162
    KCross
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,136 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    I believe its the same as the Ioniq.


  • #163
    ELM327
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,234 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    KCross wrote: »
    I believe its the same as the Ioniq.
    But is it the same speed (ie 70kW), or is it the same C rate?

    EDIT: Going by the linked post below it's the same speed and not the same C-Rate


  • #164
    KCross
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,136 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    ELM327 wrote: »
    But is it the same speed (ie 70kW), or is it the same C rate?

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=106273387&postcount=53

    Thats Hyundai's official statement.


  • #165
    unkel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,733 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    That would be a bit disappointing :(

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  • #166
    KCross
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,136 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    There really isnt any EV available (or on the horizon) that can do 100kW+, apart from Tesla's, and they are only marginally above that.

    Getting to 150kW and beyond clearly needs some additional engineering around the charge cable (liquid cooling) and also additional cooling in the battery as well, above and beyond what they already have, which means increasing cost.

    Its going to be the preserve of premium EV's in the medium term, imo.

    Even the recently revealed, premium priced Jag iPace with a 90kWh battery cant do anything close to 100kW! That was a shock to me! I was fully expecting them to push the boat out on the charging, since its a premium product. It doesnt leave much hope for affordable 150kW capable cars in the next few years.


  • #167
    unkel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,733 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Even 100kW on the Kona would be a huge step forwards. The official stats from Hyundai were confusing, showing a 54 minute to 80% for both 39kWh and 64kWh batteries. Hopefully it will be better than 70kW, but at least it is not 43kW max (and only charge once) like a major competitor :p

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  • #168
    liamog
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 8,061 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    Fastned have recently announced a new filter on their map app.

    They listed the following capabilities.

    Hyundai Ioniq @70 kW;
    Hyundai Kona @100 kW;
    Jaguar I-Pace @100 kW;
    Audi Q6 e-tron @150 kW.


  • #169
    thelikelylad
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 369 ✭✭thelikelylad


    KCross wrote: »
    There really isnt any EV available (or on the horizon) that can do 100kW+, apart from Tesla's, and they are only marginally above that.

    I was actually watching Teslabjorn's Model 3 Supercharging video, the Kona's charge time seems respectable enough when I compared them. Model 3 started at 27% so I'm guessing it would perform better at a lower SOC.

    Model 3:
    ~78kWh usable
    +63% or +49kWh in 56mins

    Kona:
    64kWh usable
    +80% or +51kWh in 54mins


    Now if IONITY could just start rolling out them chargers that'd be great. :)


  • #170
    unkel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,733 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    thelikelylad wrote: »
    Model 3:
    ~78kWh usable
    +63% or +49kWh in 56mins

    Kona:
    64kWh usable
    +80% or +51kWh in 54mins

    Model 3 only charges at a bit over 50kW at a supercharger?

    It will be a lot more efficient at motorway speeds than Kona though.

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  • #171
    unkel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,733 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Watched the vid, Model 3 charged up to 93kW but it was tapering off quite dramatically and quite early, doing 60kW at 60% and only 32kW at 80%. He said the battery was already quite warm though.

    And with a range like Model 3 LR, you don't need to charge beyond 50% to get to your destination or to the next supercharger anywhere in Europe I'd have thought. What luxury! :)

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  • #172
    thelikelylad
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 369 ✭✭thelikelylad


    unkel wrote: »
    Watched the vid, Model 3 charged up to 93kW but it was tapering off quite dramatically and quite early, doing 60kW at 60% and only 32kW at 80%. He said the battery was already quite warm though.

    And with a range like Model 3 LR, you don't need to charge beyond 50% to get to your destination or to the next supercharger anywhere in Europe I'd have thought. What luxury! :)

    Here's another video. Peaks at 105kW in this one but overall similar numbers.


    +63% or +49 kWh in 60 mins


    Looking forward to seeing some real world tests of the Kona in terms of charging and motorway efficiency.

    My dream would be an efficiency of around 20-22kWh/100km at 120km/h or thereabouts. At those figures Cork - Belfast should be possible 120km/h all the way with a just 30ish minute stop at a currently non-existent 100kW point. Come on Fastned/IONITY! :D


  • #173
    unkel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,733 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    thelikelylad wrote: »
    Here's another video. Peaks at 105kW in this one but overall similar numbers.


    +63% or +49 kWh in 60 mins

    Looks like the trick with the Model 3 is that you're better off stopping more often and charging only for maybe 20 minutes. That works for the LR model in Ireland and probably works in most of the rest of Europe too with the density of superchargers over there
    thelikelylad wrote: »
    My dream would be an efficiency of around 20-22kWh/100km at 120km/h or thereabouts.

    I'm afraid that will remain a dream :(

    Ioniq is roughly 20kWh/100km at 120km/h real speed in summer (giving a range of 170km). I don't know the coefficient of drag of Kona and how its frontal area compares to Ioniq, but I'd say it will likely be something more like 25kWh/100km

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  • #174
    thelikelylad
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 369 ✭✭thelikelylad


    unkel wrote: »
    Ioniq is roughly 20kWh/100km at 120km/h real speed in summer (giving a range of 170km). I don't know the coefficient of drag of Kona and how its frontal area compares to Ioniq, but I'd say it will likely be something more like 25kWh/100km

    Damn. The ICE Kona is 0.32 according to the specs here . That's the same as the Leaf 1 right? :(

    The 30kWh Leaf has about 28kWh usable? So 25kWh/100km there would be about 112km at 120km/h. Would that be reasonable for a 30kWh Leaf?

    A Kona averaging 25kWh/100km would only just do Cork to the Red Cow.
    I normally averaged around 16.5kWh/100km last summer at those speeds. +9kWh/100km would be a shame. :(

    Hopefully the redesigned front with closed up grille will help improve the drag coefficient.


  • #175
    thierry14
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,480 ✭✭✭thierry14


    thelikelylad wrote: »
    Damn. The ICE Kona is 0.32 according to the specs here . That's the same as the Leaf 1 right? :(

    The 30kWh Leaf has about 28kWh usable? So 25kWh/100km there would be about 112km at 120km/h. Would that be reasonable for a 30kWh Leaf?

    A Kona averaging 25kWh/100km would only just do Cork to the Red Cow.
    I normally averaged around 16.5kWh/100km last summer at those speeds. +9kWh/100km would be a shame. :(

    Hopefully the redesigned front with closed up grille will help improve the drag coefficient.

    The Kia Niro 64kWh makes more sense imo

    Better drag @0.29 and much bigger car

    Doesn't weigh much more either

    Niro is only 30kg more than Ioniq

    Using below as a guide if we compare epa Highway efficiency with same ice engine

    I'd say it will it will be 20kWh/100km for Niro against 16.5kWh/100km for Ioniq

    Thats 300km or so highway for 64kWh useable Niro

    I'll take that :)

    https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/Find.do?action=sbs&id=38486&id=39615


  • #176
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 21,179 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    unkel wrote: »
    That would be brilliant on the 150kW Ionity chargers.

    350 Kw mate, 350 ! ;)

    At least that's what the Topaz Fuels director emailed me. Doubt he got that wrong.


  • #177
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 21,179 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    unkel wrote: »
    Hopefully it will be better than 70kW, but at least it is not 43kW max (and only charge once) like a major competitor :p

    And that's only in the happy temp range too, as low as 22 Kw when hot, absolutely shocking. :D


  • #178
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 21,179 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Not every EV will be very efficient at speed as manufacturers start to make vehicles people actually want to drive, larger cars, 7 seaters and cars that don't look so cramped like the Kona.

    Hyundai had to make it small to give it headline range figures for a vehicle of it's class, i.e a mini SUV type car which is really just a taller tiny car.

    If they had made a more practical EV like a Tucson or Santa Fe, two quiet popular cars in Ireland then the range would be a lot less so they had to come up with the kona, tiny car, better range less practical.

    You'd want probably 100 Kwh in the Tecsun and Santa Fe to make the range more appealing. A santa Fe might have a range of 200 Kms at 120 Kph and 60 Kwh for instance or even less.


  • #179
    unkel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,733 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Deleted User wrote: »
    350 Kw mate, 350 ! ;)

    At least that's what the Topaz Fuels director emailed me. Doubt he got that wrong.

    He wasn't wrong. The Ionity chargers will all be 350kW capable, but will initially "only" provide 150kW

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  • #180
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 21,179 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Really, how come ?


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  • #181
    KCross
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,136 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    Because the marketing looks better when you say 350kW capable! :)
    Its upgradeable to 350kW I think.


  • #182
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 21,179 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    A well it will be years before a 350 Kw vehicle is available, unless maybe EV buses start to appear, unlikely for the next 5-10 years .....

    It will be so sad to see slow charging cars plugged into them , what a waste, a 40 Kwh Leaf charging at 22 Kw that's already being fast charge and the battery is hot, 24 Kwh Leafs , charging at 30-35 Kw after 50%.

    30 Kwh Leaf 45 kw, i3 50 kw. i3 is one car that should be able to charge faster for fs. AC cooled battery, that's a joke !


  • #183
    thierry14
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,480 ✭✭✭thierry14


    Just a shame on the price :(

    Was talking to a colleague who buys new every few years and he was pretty interested, read up about it, looked cool

    Then the price

    Kona ICE is 20k, Kona 64kWh EV is 35k

    Explained you will save on fuel, but not 15k worth

    Its much faster with 200bhp vs little ICE engine with 110bhp, I don't need speed can only do 120kph


  • #184
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 21,179 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Power isn't just about speed, over taking needs a lot of power to get out in tighter spaces and it's about the fun factor.

    I wouldn't go back to a 110 Hp EV in a hurry.

    Low power cars aren't necessary with electrics because electricity is a lot cheaper than petrol or diesel.


  • #185
    unkel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,733 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Deleted User wrote: »
    It will be so sad to see slow charging cars plugged into them , what a waste, a 40 Kwh Leaf charging at 22 Kw

    There will be no Leafs allowed to charge on any of the Ionity chargers :p

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  • #186
    Casati
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,043 ✭✭✭Casati


    thierry14 wrote: »
    Just a shame on the price :(

    Was talking to a colleague who buys new every few years and he was pretty interested, read up about it, looked cool

    Then the price

    Kona ICE is 20k, Kona 64kWh EV is 35k

    Explained you will save on fuel, but not 15k worth

    Its much faster with 200bhp vs little ICE engine with 110bhp, I don't need speed can only do 120kph

    Is the Kona pricing out? Would that be 35k after 10k of grants or would it be 25k?


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  • #187
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 21,179 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    unkel wrote: »
    There will be no Leafs allowed to charge on any of the Ionity chargers :p

    Oh yeah , Duh, they'll be CCS only haha. Forgot. :D


  • #188
    Casati
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,043 ✭✭✭Casati


    thierry14 wrote: »
    Just a shame on the price :(

    Was talking to a colleague who buys new every few years and he was pretty interested, read up about it, looked cool

    Then the price

    Kona ICE is 20k, Kona 64kWh EV is 35k

    Explained you will save on fuel, but not 15k worth

    Its much faster with 200bhp vs little ICE engine with 110bhp, I don't need speed can only do 120kph

    Is the Kona pricing out? Would that be 35k after 10k of grants or would it be 25k?


  • #189
    KCross
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,136 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    thierry14 wrote: »
    Just a shame on the price :(

    Was talking to a colleague who buys new every few years and he was pretty interested, read up about it, looked cool

    Then the price

    Kona ICE is 20k, Kona 64kWh EV is 35k

    Explained you will save on fuel, but not 15k worth

    Its much faster with 200bhp vs little ICE engine with 110bhp, I don't need speed can only do 120kph

    But he wont lose the €15k. He will get more for that car 3yrs later than he would for the €20k Kona at 3yrs.... its all relative. Explain TCO to him!

    e.g. An ICE Golf goes from €22k to €40k+. Does that mean its not worth buying one of the €40k ones.... it depends on what you are after.... they all take you from A to B but the Golf R a "bit" faster!

    In the case of EV you have a much nicer car to drive, massive potential fuel savings, less maintenance.... he needs to look beyond the €15k and look at TCO... if he doesnt have the €15k then fair enough... tough luck on him but its not a reason not to buy.


  • #190
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    thierry14 wrote: »
    Just a shame on the price :(

    Was talking to a colleague who buys new every few years and he was pretty interested, read up about it, looked cool

    Then the price

    Kona ICE is 20k, Kona 64kWh EV is 35k

    Explained you will save on fuel, but not 15k worth

    Its much faster with 200bhp vs little ICE engine with 110bhp, I don't need speed can only do 120kph

    You cannot and should not compare the base model with the Electric model. This was the same arguement for the eGolf as well.

    Based on images I have seen the spec is high so you need to compare with the Premium model and automatic. So that is 30k.

    So for the electric you are paying a premium of 5k. Not bad to be honest.


  • #191
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Casati wrote: »
    Is the Kona pricing out? Would that be 35k after 10k of grants or would it be 25k?

    Expect the larger range model to be 35k to the customer.


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  • #192
    positron
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,410 ✭✭✭positron


    theirry14, any source for that 35k figure? This is the most I can find, from Carwow's/URL, which is just a guestimate I think.
    Price and release date
    Expect the entry-level Kona Electric to cost around £26,000 and the faster, longer-range version to creep closer to £30,000. It’s set to go on sale in the UK in December 2018.


  • #193
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    positron wrote: »
    theirry14, any source for that 35k figure? This is the most I can find, from Carwow's/URL, which is just a guestimate I think.

    He/she is working it out based on the pricing given on the Korea pre-order website. It is a couple of pages back

    Based on those numbers the Kia Niro will be the exact same cost so I am unsure how correct they are


  • #194
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    I was flying up bus lane today without a care in the World when I spotted a 181 Kona. Had to slow down and let them pass and then slotted in behind them. Much to the dismay of the driver behind them....dont know why people feel the need to beep!!!

    Had a good look from behind and then back into bus lane and passed them again and up the road.

    Based on what I have seen it is way too small for the young family man if more than 2 children are required in back. The back doors are bloody tiny, so a pain in ass trying to even get a child seat in & out of back of car.

    Very similar to my sister in laws C-HR. Try and get a car seat into it and its a pain. Also to even get a kid in & out of back you need to open the door to the max....not going to work in Irish parking spots :-)

    My wife was with me and said it was lovely, way nicer than her sisters C-HR. It was in the dark red and black top which would be my preferred option.

    Kona off the list anyway. Hopefully the Niro wil be more suited.


  • #195
    Water John
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,808 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    Yes the elusive ecar to go from Cork to Dublin. It also has to be reasonable size.
    Yaris was a nice handy little car, a family member had. Would never fancy driving Cork-Dublin in it though.


  • #196
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Water John wrote: »
    Yes the elusive ecar to go from Cork to Dublin. It also has to be reasonable size.
    Yaris was a nice handy little car, a family member had. Would never fancy driving Cork-Dublin in it though.

    Dont get me wrong the car is lovely and looked very nice inside from what I could see....also from videos. I would have no issue with driving long distance in it. I would never do it in a Yaris...

    I wouldn't use it on a regular basis if you are trying to get kids in and out of the back.

    From the spec it is wider than my eGolf but the Golf has more square doors if you know what I mean, so you can reach in and out with kids. Hard on back but easy to slot in & out. Especially with Axiss car seat.

    Now the Kona, which is same as the C-HR, has a slopping back, this means the back doors are small but also limited access space to the seat space. You wouldn't have the back pain but you and your child would have a constant sore head as you keep banging it off the car:p


  • #197
    Water John
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,808 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    My 'children', at this stage, can stay driving their own cars.
    Will look at it. Intend to see the petrol version, to see would the EV version be a runner.


  • #198
    thierry14
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,480 ✭✭✭thierry14


    EPA 400km

    https://insideevs.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/2019-hyundai-kona-electric-1.jpg

    Range won't be a problem here :)


  • #199
    KCross
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,136 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    According to Hyundai’s press release it has a Cd the same as the old Leaf of 0.29Cd

    How it then manages to be more efficient than every other car is a mystery!

    They still also say 100kW charging but it takes 54mins for 0-80%, which doesn’t compute!


  • #200
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    thierry14 wrote: »
    EPA 400km

    https://insideevs.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/2019-hyundai-kona-electric-1.jpg

    Range won't be a problem here :)

    It looks awful from that picture....maybe it is the colour but not great.....


  • #201
    unkel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,733 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    KCross wrote: »
    According to Hyundai’s press release it has a Cd the same as the old Leaf of 0.29Cd

    How it then manages to be more efficient than every other car is a mystery!

    Not a mystery at all. Leaf has very old and inefficient drivetrain. And Kona gets the most efficient drivetrain ever made

    Is that 400km EPA official? Linky? It's a bit more than I expected, but we have to keep remembering that EPA <> motorway driving. The test goes up to 120km/h but only stays at that for a few seconds. It would really help if EVs came with an official range at 120km/h. That is where range matters, not in city driving (unless you're a taxi man)

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    https://www.adverts.ie/member/5856/ads



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