Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

Sandor Clegane · 18-06-2019 2:36pm

The verdict was never in doubt, the question is whether anna and her parents get justice for her death now, we don't have a death penalty so the only thing for these two is to remain in prison for the rest of their lives which sadly in this country probably wont happen.

humberklog · 18-06-2019 2:36pm

Priscilla Mushy Banner wrote: »

We don't know all of the details of these boys' background yet. That's a bit unfair.

Yeah you are right but there was a really odd story that came out from boy B"s father's testimony.

The gardai came to the door of boy B the day after Ana's disappearance. The father had returned from work at 5 and the Gardai knocked at the door at 8. The mother and boy B talked to the gardai on the doorstep. The father passed them in the hall,at 9 noted his son and wife were still talking to the gards about Ana. He didn't stop to listen and went straight up to bed and went to sleep.
In the morning he had a brief conversation about it with his wife.

Now that is a sign of some pretty sh1tty parenting skills.

elli21 · 18-06-2019 2:37pm

retro:electro wrote: »

I am absolutely elated at the verdict.

What absolutely broke my heart was when Ana’s mother said that she knew something was wrong when she came home and learned that Ana had gone out with two boys, because in all the years of her life no one had ever called for her, no one had ever knocked in to ask her to play and she had no friends. The poor, poor girl.

Seeing her happy, smiley and absolutely beautiful face in all of the coverage has been just tragic. The whole thing just seems so absolutely senseless and pointless.
What an absolute waste of three young lives.

Depressing to think that such young teenagers could be behind such brutality.

I think the prosecution summed it up well when they said in closing argument;
“Boy A was like a child caught eating biscuits, with chocolate all around his mouth still insisting “no it wasn’t me”
I would say the delay in deliberations was mostly due to boy B.

I don’t think I’ve ever willed a verdict to be the correct one as much as this in my life, RIP Ana. I’m thankful justice was served for you.

I know a lady who was involved in their local youth club.She told me that when Ana would sit down with a group the other kids would get up and walk away.
Heartbreaking that she suffered so much

Danzy · 18-06-2019 2:37pm

Hopefully they'll get life, the calculated approach before and after mark them out as exceptionally dangerous Individuals.

If they got away with it, they would kill again.

babydream · 18-06-2019 2:37pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Will they be named?

Happened in 2004 but he was named and was only 15 also got life

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/teenager-who-killed-for-a-mobile-phone-gets-life-in-jail-25889614.html

Ave Sodalis · 18-06-2019 2:37pm

Say my name wrote:

What was galling was the parents of these two by their side at court and both pleading not guilty.

Of course they are. It would have had to be a pretty broken relationship between parent and child for them to be told something as crazy as their child has murdered someone, and they immediately believe it and cut ties. People go into denial to deal with shock. They will probably then start to blame themselves and try and figure out what they did wrong, when the truth could very well be that the actions of these boys had nothing to do with them.

My heart goes out to all parents involved. Absolutely moreso the parents of the deceased. They have gone through absolute hell and I hope with ever fibre of my being that they can find some sort of peace. However, in the very likely event that the parents of the boys had nothing to do with the incident, they are also grieving and it is horribly unfair to put any sort of blame on them unless warranted.

blackwhite · 18-06-2019 2:38pm

wicorthered wrote: »

The sad things is they could easily be out and about by their 18 birthdays.

They'll definitely be free men in their 20s. If the trial information is anything to go by Boy A will do this again.

Last instance I can remember of a minor being convicted of murder in Ireland was given a life sentance (but of course, with our justice system that actually resulted in just over 10 years being served :rolleyes:).

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/i-can-relax-now-and-not-be-nervous-that-i-would-see-him-mum-after-sons-killer-banned-from-town-35711934.html

Chicken George · 18-06-2019 2:38pm

Im so happy that both these little ****ing bastards were found guilty but knowing our justice system... justice won't be served.

hawkelady · 18-06-2019 2:38pm

MightyMandarin wrote: »

God help you if your child ever commits a heinous crime. While how one is raised is definitely a factor in how they end up, to blame the parents for their sons committing an act of murder is totally unfair. Plenty of murderers and criminals were raised in good homes with loving parents.

The fact remains the parents stood by the not guilty plea .. they should have made them plead guilty and teach them something!! Horrible bad parents

Gael23 · 18-06-2019 2:39pm

grassroot1 wrote: »

They were their sons someday you will realise the strength of the parent offspring bond.

A mother’s love is unconditional and all that I suppose

Berserker · 18-06-2019 2:39pm

Where will these lads serve their sentence? The joy is an adult only prison isn't it?

18-06-2019 2:39pm

MightyMandarin wrote: »

God help you if your child ever commits a heinous crime. While how one is raised is definitely a factor in how they end up, to blame the parents for their sons committing an act of murder is totally unfair. Plenty of murderers and criminals were raised in good homes with loving parents.

If your child comes home saying they’ve been attacked by some men, would you take their blooded clothes from them and wash them or would you ring the Gardaí and pass on clothes as evidence?

SEPT 23 1989 · 18-06-2019 2:39pm

Berserker wrote: »

Where will these lads serve their sentence? The joy is an adult only prison isn't it?

oberstown

Ulysses Gaze · 18-06-2019 2:40pm

Bambi wrote: »

They'll be out before their 21st birthdays I'd imagine

Scumbag A should never be allowed out. A pure blooded Psychopath that will rape and kill someone again.

alchemist33 · 18-06-2019 2:40pm

elli21 wrote: »

I know a lady who was involved in their local youth club.She told me that when Ana would sit down with a group the other kids would get up and walk away.
Heartbreaking that she suffered so much

And the killers probably used that, playing on her desperation to be liked. It makes me so angry, and so sad about her.

joeguevara · 18-06-2019 2:40pm

MrMusician18 wrote: »

Murder is a mandatory life sentence. These boys were tried as adults so that's what they will get. With good behavior in prison they will most likely be paroled in 2029

As for them ever being named publicly, I'm not sure.

Average life sentence served for murder is 18 years.

Good behaviorist I.e remission does not come into life murder sentence (is time off for good behavior) as they are let out on bond.

I don’t see these getting out in the 2020s and earliest will be mid to late 2030s. It will be up to parole board to let them out.

bennyl10 · 18-06-2019 2:40pm

MrMusician18 wrote: »

Murder is a mandatory life sentence. These boys were tried as adults so that's what they will get. With good behavior in prison they will most likely be paroled in 2029

As for them ever being named publicly, I'm not sure.

They can’t have been tried as adults afaik?
Irish law doesn’t allow for it.(agin I could be wrong)

All child convictions have to be reviewed at 18

mloc123 · 18-06-2019 2:41pm

The parents and barristers of the two boys should be ashamed of themselves. If they had any remorse they would have pleaded guilty to start.

jmayo · 18-06-2019 2:41pm

OldMrBrennan83 wrote: »

Hopefully they never see the outside world again, you can't cure that level of evil.

Bullcr**.

The triple murderer Brian Hennessy, who raped and killed a mother and then killed her two young children in the subsequent fire to hide his deeds on Christmas morning was eligible for parole after 7 odd years.

A 17 year old Thomas Murray killed his elderly neighbour in Co. Galway just to see what it was like.
Contrary to the advice and wishes of Castlerea prison governor and Gardai he was allowed out on temporary weekend release and 19 years later he bludgeoned another elderly neighbour to death.
He is also prime suspect in murder of Galway taxi driver woman.

That is our fooked up legal and justice system.

pjohnson · 18-06-2019 2:41pm

They should be publicly named and photos released. They should never be able to just start life fresh once released (which they will be).

The parents deserve the shame aswell and public deserve to know if they spawned any other monsters.

Boy A is lucky we dont have a death penalty.

Cryptopagan · 18-06-2019 2:42pm

Awful story. Heartbreaking reading everything Ana went through, for it to end like that. RIP

tinner777 · 18-06-2019 2:42pm

grassroot1 wrote: »

They were their sons someday you will realise the strength of the parent offspring bond.

I've three boys of similar ages, I love them to bits, not sure I'd be able to cover up for murder for them....

Neyite · 18-06-2019 2:43pm

Wombatman wrote: »

Not sure about that. There was no forensic evidence connecting Boy B to the scene.

Wasn't it proven that the tape around her neck originally came from Boy B?

Gael23 · 18-06-2019 2:43pm

Oberstown is too soft for murderers

Say my name · 18-06-2019 2:43pm

grassroot1 wrote: »

They were their sons someday you will realise the strength of the parent offspring bond.

Ah bullsh1t.

If I was even accused of any stupid thing as a child /teenager I'd be afraid of the consequences from my parents. The threat of violence would be enough to even stop you looking at a packet of sweets if you had no money.
Imagine if you then went home and said "ah Da. I raped and murdered a school buddy of mine"

He wouldn't have said "That's ok buddy. We'll plead not guilty. Everything will be fine."

Duane Dibbley · 18-06-2019 2:44pm

I know there was overwhelming forensic evidence against Boy A.

I didnt think Boy B would be found Guilty of Murder.

McCrack · 18-06-2019 2:45pm

mloc123 wrote: »

The parents and barristers of the two boys should be ashamed of themselves. If they had any remorse they would have pleaded guilty to start.

The defence have nothing to be ashamed for. The good, bad and ugly are entitled to legal representation. It's part of living in a democracy - trial in due course of law.

AudreyHepburn · 18-06-2019 2:46pm

Thank god - justice has been served. Hopefully Ana can rest peacefully now and her family can have closure.

I can’t understand why they won’t name the two boys - children or not they knew damn well what they were doing and they knew damn well that it was wrong and cruel. They don’t deserve protection.

mloc123 · 18-06-2019 2:46pm

Gael23 wrote: »

Oberstown is too soft for murderers

They will be moved to mountjoy at... 17 or 18?

Cryptopagan · 18-06-2019 2:46pm

Bambi wrote: »

They'll be out before their 21st birthdays I'd imagine

They’ll only just be eligible to have their cases looked at by the Parole Board by then.

ohnonotgmail · 18-06-2019 2:46pm

Neyite wrote: »

Wasn't it proven that the tape around her neck originally came from Boy B?

RTE seem to think they did. they mention it in their story.

BattleCorp · 18-06-2019 2:46pm

joeguevara wrote: »

Average life sentence served for murder is 18 years.

Good behaviorist I.e remission does not come into life murder sentence (is time off for good behavior) as they are let out on bond.

I don’t see these getting out in the 2020s and earliest will be mid to late 2030s. It will be up to parole board to let them out.

No way they will do 18 years for this crime - unfortunately.

They were 14 at the time of the crime, so the judge will take account of that and give them a lesser sentence. They'll be out before 2030. They won't even do 10 years.

And what are the odds that both will appeal their convictions?

Tacitus Kilgore · 18-06-2019 2:47pm

Duane Dibbley wrote: »

I know there was overwhelming forensic evidence against Boy A.

I didnt think Boy B would be found Guilty of Murder.

For a while I thought he was just an innocent fool, until the evidence concluded:

What was the end number? was it 9 signed statements, each different from the last - This probably didn't help prove his innocence.

LorelaiG · 18-06-2019 2:47pm

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

Thank god - justice has been served. Hopefully Ana can rest peacefully now and her family can have closure.

I can’t understand why they won’t name the two boys - children or not they knew damn well what they were doing and they knew damn well that it was wrong and cruel. They don’t deserve protection.

It's probably to protect their families more than it is to protect them because they'll be put away, and two boys arriving into Oberstown together it will be clear who they are to everyone there.

ohnonotgmail · 18-06-2019 2:47pm

BattleCorp wrote: »

No way they will do 18 years for this crime - unfortunately.

They were 14 at the time of the crime, so the judge will take account of that and give them a lesser sentence. They'll be out before 2030. They won't even do 10 years.

And what are the odds that both will appeal their convictions?

if they were tried as adults the only sentence the judge can give is life.

Gimme A Pound · 18-06-2019 2:48pm

MightyMandarin wrote: »

God help you if your child ever commits a heinous crime.

Well yeah obviously. Because of the heinous crime.

I've seen levelheaded people on this thread, whom I'm pretty sure are parents, condemn the boys' parents. I don't buy the notion that people would stick by their children no matter what. When it comes to horrors like this, I hope not.

I understand denial and a strong sense of parental obligation initially of course, but I don't understand this not fading to some extent eventually.

Cryptopagan · 18-06-2019 2:48pm

BattleCorp wrote: »

No way they will do 18 years for this crime - unfortunately.

They were 14 at the time of the crime, so the judge will take account of that and give them a lesser sentence. They'll be out before 2030. They won't even do 10 years.

And what are the odds that both will appeal their convictions?

They can’t get a lesser sentence. Life is mandatory for murder.

18-06-2019 2:48pm

Duane Dibbley wrote: »

I know there was overwhelming forensic evidence against Boy A.

I didnt think Boy B would be found Guilty of Murder.

I could well imagine (based on his continuous lies) that Boy B is a sick little **** that enjoyed sitting back and watching it all.

Strazdas · 18-06-2019 2:48pm

elli21 wrote: »

I know a lady who was involved in their local youth club.She told me that when Ana would sit down with a group the other kids would get up and walk away.
Heartbreaking that she suffered so much

Apparently, poor Ana stood out like a sore thumb. She was born in Russia, was fostered and her peers all knew this. She seems to have had virtually no friends in the area.

Hector Savage · 18-06-2019 2:48pm

seasidedub wrote: »

Maybe we could all learn something from this?

If we know of a kid who's being ostracized, bullied, left out, considered weird we could try to encourage our own kids to get to know them, we could include them in invites, play etc.

This poor kid. I hope there is another life on some distant planet and she rocks there.

Hearbreaking, beautiful looking girl too, was surprised that she was such a loner - jealousy perhaps from other girls ?

Kids can be such cruel cruel c*nts...

ZeitgeistGlee · 18-06-2019 2:48pm

I'm so glad Boy B didn't slip the noose, A was basically a done deal but I was worried a couple of soft hearts on the jury might waver in spite of the horror they inflicted on that poor girl.

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Severely bullied in school.

That annoys me no end too.

Other kids involved in making her life a misery.

As someone who was badly bullied in school and as has a lot of difficulty with social interaction as a result this struck a real chord with me.

If just one or two people had reached out a hand to Anna in friendship this probably never wouldn't happened. I hope there's a lot of heavy consciences in her locality over this, just because A & B have been found guilty doesn't absolve them of the hurt they did to the poor girl while she was still alive.

MrMusician18 · 18-06-2019 2:49pm

mloc123 wrote: »

The parents and barristers of the two boys should be ashamed of themselves. If they had any remorse they would have pleaded guilty to start.

This is the problem with mandatory sentencing. There is no reason for them to plead guilty since it's life either way.

The argument is that they may as well take their chances with a jury as you never know what could happen. But if the boys had been able to plead guilty and get 8 years for example, there would've been no trial.

antodeco · 18-06-2019 2:50pm

I was originally reading the case when it started, and I stopped as it was quite upsetting, especially having a 15 year old daughter.

Made the mistake of reading the report today, that went into details. Poor poor girl.

In relation to the people saying their parents are scum, is not fair. I'd honestly be thorn about offering up my child for a guilty verdict. As much of a horrible crime it is, a parent will (nearly) always do whatever they can to protect their children. Regardless of crime, a parent will want to try and protect their kids.

bigpink · 18-06-2019 2:50pm

The parents knew well they were guilty

NabyLadistheman · 18-06-2019 2:53pm

What planet were they on actually pleading not guilty? Talk about being ill-advised. Absolutely delighted

Cryptopagan · 18-06-2019 2:53pm

Strazdas wrote: »

Apparently, poor Ana stood out like a sore thumb. She was born in Russia, was fostered and her peers all knew this. She seems to have had virtually no friends in the area.

Think she was supposed to be very tall too. Kids will single someone out for nothing.

Small Wonder · 18-06-2019 2:54pm

Why do people want then named? What good will it do?

Reati · 18-06-2019 2:54pm

RollieFingers wrote: »

Don't know if they'll be identified but there's a picture going round on WhatsApp of one of the little scrotes, I'm sure locals know who they are. Horrible scumbags, RIP Anna.

The dogs on the street around those parts who exactly who it was. They did the day after she disappeared.

ohnonotgmail · 18-06-2019 2:54pm

Suarezistheman wrote: »

What planet were they on actually pleading not guilty? Talk about being ill-advised. Absolutely delighted

if they pled guilty the sentence would have been the same. they took their chances with the jury.

MrMusician18 · 18-06-2019 2:54pm

Suarezistheman wrote: »

What planet were they on actually pleading not guilty? Talk about being ill-advised. Absolutely delighted

Why would they please guilty and get an automatic life sentence?

As I said above, there is no incentive to plead guilty to crimes where life is mandatory.

Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

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