New England Patriots Thread Mod Warning Post #253

j8wk2feszrnpao · 03-04-2020 9:30pm

Griselda wrote: »

I'm following brandy to tampa

#teambrady

I'll follow how Brady does in Tampa, but it's all about the Pats.

decies · 03-04-2020 11:51pm

munstermagic11 wrote: »

I'll follow how Brady does in Tampa, but it's all about the Pats.

I follow the patriots

StringerBell · 05-04-2020 7:09pm

Griselda wrote: »

I'm following brandy to tampa

#teambrady

The singer? Does she know?

el Fenomeno · 20-04-2020 1:21pm

New uniforms unveiled today.

eagle eye · 20-04-2020 1:32pm

I don't like the shoulder thing.

el Fenomeno · 20-04-2020 2:14pm

eagle eye wrote: »

I don't like the shoulder thing.

Likewise. The way it just ends abruptly puts me off, and it's too big.

Don't like the navy pants, would prefer silver to tie in with the helmet (or white if they changed the helmet to white too).

I thought the previous uniform was beautiful so was always going to be disappointed.

me89 · 21-04-2020 9:03pm

Gronk to the Buccs now looking likely

Foxtrol · 21-04-2020 9:12pm

me89 wrote: »

Gronk to the Buccs now looking likely

OJ Howard for Gronk?

el Fenomeno · 21-04-2020 9:36pm

Not bad getting a 4th round pick for basically nothing.

Foxtrol · 21-04-2020 9:57pm

el Fenomeno wrote: »

Not bad getting a 4th round pick for basically nothing.

Seems like a pretty fair trade. Most 4th rounds turn out to be nothing, whereas Bucs get the GOAT TE off a year of recuperation. 4th is better than nothing but if Gronk plays well it'll be a steal.

ScrubsfanChris · 21-04-2020 10:08pm

I don't know, that last season with the Pats he looked completely done.
Receiving yards were down 40% on the previous year and just 3TDs

Hope he does well, but I'm thinking he had no intention of coming back but only doing it now because it's Florida

eagle eye · 21-04-2020 10:11pm

Two of my favourite players of all time but I'm hoping it all goes wrong in Tampa. I honestly don't want them to do well.

I'm more interested in our Pats moving on and hopefully still dominating the AFC.

I'd have refused to let Gronk go there. I'd have traded him somewhere else instead like Carolina or Atlanta or even New Orleans.

dh1985 · 21-04-2020 10:34pm

I think that's a good move for the bucs. Gronk is still only 30. Not that old for a TE. He has had some injuries and slowed down but he is a big unit and hard managed and can surely still be effective blocking. And might be refreshed after time out.
Would be happy.to see himself and brady go well. The backbone of the Pat's offence for many years along with Edelman. Couldn't resent a run of success for either away from foxboro.

StringerBell · 21-04-2020 11:30pm

Shot to nothing for the Bucs, great move by them in all honesty.

Foxtrol · 21-04-2020 11:46pm

eagle eye wrote: »

Two of my favourite players of all time but I'm hoping it all goes wrong in Tampa. I honestly don't want them to do well.

I'm more interested in our Pats moving on and hopefully still dominating the AFC.

I'd have refused to let Gronk go there. I'd have traded him somewhere else instead like Carolina or Atlanta or even New Orleans.

By doing that they would be cutting off their nose to spite their face. Gronk said Tampa with Brady or nowhere.

The Patriots organisation have no right to feel bitter about him looking for a trade away now anyway, sure they agreed to trade him to the Lions in 2018 and it only fell through when Gronk said he'd retire.

Gronk's trade value has plummeted in the interim though:

https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/1252707661705076738?s=20

Podge_irl · 22-04-2020 7:03am

eagle eye wrote: »

I'd have refused to let Gronk go there. I'd have traded him somewhere else instead like Carolina or Atlanta or even New Orleans.

They would have struggled to trade a retired player.

eagle eye · 22-04-2020 8:58am

Podge_irl wrote:

They would have struggled to trade a retired player.

He isn't retired.

Podge_irl · 22-04-2020 9:06am

eagle eye wrote: »

He isn't retired.

And if they tried to trade him elsewhere he would be. They had no way of getting anything from anyone else for him.

eagle eye · 22-04-2020 9:29am

Podge_irl wrote:

And if they tried to trade him elsewhere he would be. They had no way of getting anything from anyone else for him.

They'd get a comp pick eventually.

The_Dave · 22-04-2020 9:41am

Foxtrol wrote: »

By doing that they would be cutting off their nose to spite their face. Gronk said Tampa with Brady or nowhere.

The Patriots organisation have no right to feel bitter about him looking for a trade away now anyway, sure they agreed to trade him to the Lions in 2018 and it only fell through when Gronk said he'd retire.

Gronk's trade value has plummeted in the interim though:

https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/1252707661705076738?s=20

It's hard to compare, he's that much older and the contract has only 1 remaining on it

Podge_irl · 22-04-2020 11:59am

eagle eye wrote: »

They'd get a comp pick eventually.

Get a comp pick for what?

The options were
A) trade him to the Bucs for whatever they can get

him staying retired and they get nothing

eagle eye · 22-04-2020 12:30pm

Podge_irl wrote:

Get a comp pick for what?

When his contract ended the Patriots would get a comp pick.

adrian522 · 22-04-2020 12:49pm

eagle eye wrote: »

When his contract ended the Patriots would get a comp pick.

Only if he sat out the 2020 season, then he signed somewhere else and even then it depends on the value of the contract and who else NE lose and sign that off season.

eagle eye · 22-04-2020 1:16pm

adrian522 wrote:

Only if he sat out the 2020 season, then he signed somewhere else and even then it depends on the value of the contract and who else NE lose and sign that off season.

He had a big contract and he doesn't have to sign with another team. We're talking 4th rounder at worst.

Podge_irl · 22-04-2020 1:26pm

I was under the impression you do not get comp picks for retirements. Why would you?

adrian522 · 22-04-2020 1:29pm

Podge_irl wrote: »

I was under the impression you do not get comp picks for retirements. Why would you?

You dont. You only get comp picks for players that sign elsewhere and only where you lose more free agents than you sign.

eagle eye · 22-04-2020 1:46pm

adrian522 wrote:

You dont. You only get comp picks for players that sign elsewhere and only where you lose more free agents than you sign.

Unless it's changed you are wrong. Can you link me to where this printed?

Foxtrol · 22-04-2020 1:51pm

The_Dave wrote: »

It's hard to compare, he's that much older and the contract has only 1 remaining on it

He isn't much older, only 2 years have passed and he only took 1 season of damage followed by a year of rest. The difference in contract is only 1 year as it was paused while he was retired.

adrian522 · 22-04-2020 1:57pm

eagle eye wrote: »

Unless it's changed you are wrong. Can you link me to where this printed?

It hasn't changed its always been like this.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Football_League_Draft#Compensatory_picks

In addition to the 32 selections in each of the seven rounds, a total of 32 compensatory picks are awarded to teams based on the players they lost and gained in free agency. The league defines a class of unrestricted free agents as "compensatory free agents ("CFA"). Teams that have lost more compensatory free agents than they signed in the previous year receive between one and four picks somewhere in the third through seventh rounds.[68] Teams that gain and lose equal numbers of players but lose higher-valued players can also be awarded a single seventh-round pick. Compensatory picks are awarded each year at the NFL annual meeting which is held at the end of March; typically, about three or four weeks before the draft. Compensatory picks can be traded; this began with the 2017 NFL Draft.[

ELM327 · 22-04-2020 1:59pm

eagle eye wrote: »

Unless it's changed you are wrong. Can you link me to where this printed?

Plenty of sources online for this, not only every draft and wiki.
Here's the first source on google.

https://www.profootballrumors.com/2020/03/nfl-announces-compensatory-picks-for-2020-draft

You categorically do not get comp picks for players that retire or that you trade away. You only get comp picks for players that you lose in FA and if you do not sign a comparable FA

eagle eye · 22-04-2020 1:59pm

adrian522 wrote:

It hasn't changed its always been like this.

That says players you lost in free agency. Once a players contract expires and he does not resign you have lost him in free agency.

adrian522 · 22-04-2020 2:02pm

eagle eye wrote: »

That says players you lost in free agency. Once a players contract expires and he does not resign you have lost him in free agency.

Thats incorrect, if he doesn't sign elsewhere you don't anything for him. Even if he does sign elsewhere but it happens after June 1st you still don't get anything for him.

There are no examples that I know of where retired players resulted in a comp pick.

There are only comp picks per year, much more than this retire every year,

eagle eye · 22-04-2020 2:03pm

adrian522 wrote:

Thats incorrect, if he doesn't sign elsewhere you don't anything for him.

Show me where it says that.

adrian522 · 22-04-2020 2:06pm

Definition of Compensatory Free agent below.

Compensatory Free Agent (“CFA”) shall be defined as an Unrestricted Free Agent (“UFA”) who: (i) signed with a new Club during the prior free agency signing period […] prior to 4:00 p.m., New York time, on the Monday following the NFL Draft for that League Year1 […]; and (ii) ranked within the top 35%2 of all League players […]. Clubs that lose to other Clubs a greater number of CFAs than they sign or acquire from other Clubs shall be eligible to receive a Compensatory Draft Selection in the College Draft to be held in the following League Year subject to the provisions set forth below.

https://overthecap.com/the-basics-and-methodology-of-projecting-the-nfls-compensatory-draft-picks/

Foxtrol · 22-04-2020 2:06pm

eagle eye wrote: »

Unless it's changed you are wrong. Can you link me to where this printed?

What adrian said is pretty accurate, the only difference is that the FAs are banded in rounds and cancel out. So if you sign 12 backup level talent FAs it doesn't negate your star QB that signs for another team.

adrian522 · 22-04-2020 2:06pm

eagle eye wrote: »

Show me where it says that.

Show me a single example of a retired player resulting in a comp pick.

Foxtrol · 22-04-2020 2:08pm

adrian522 wrote: »

Thats incorrect, if he doesn't sign elsewhere you don't anything for him. Even if he does sign elsewhere but it happens after June 1st you still don't get anything for him.

There are no examples that I know of where retired players resulted in a comp pick.

There are only comp picks per year, much more than this retire every year,

That is because contracts are paused, the player is moved to retired list, and teams eat the dead cap once a player retires. The contract never runs out because it isn't running so they can never become an FA.

eagle eye · 22-04-2020 2:17pm

adrian522 wrote:

Show me a single example of a retired player resulting in a comp pick.

I asked you to show me where it says you don't.

adrian522 · 22-04-2020 2:23pm

eagle eye wrote: »

I asked you to show me where it says you don't.

Post 3985 above, quoted from the CBA.

Foxtrol · 22-04-2020 2:24pm

eagle eye wrote: »

I asked you to show me where it says you don't.

If your logic was correct then Gronk would be a free agent this year and the Bucs wouldn't have had to trade for him because he would be a FA.

The last year of his contract was paused when he retired with the Patriots, like all players, so now he still has a year left when he returned

eagle eye · 22-04-2020 2:25pm

adrian522 wrote:

Post 3985 above, quoted from the CBA.

Ok, I missed that. Thanks. I was of the opinion you got compensatory picks for retired players from way back. I never heard much about it since tbh.

Anyways I'd rather not get a pick than let Gronk go play with Brady.

The_Honeybadger · 22-04-2020 2:46pm

No brainer for the Pats, he was never going to agree to go anywhere else and it’s a different conference where they won’t meet unless they both make the SuperBowl. As jarring as it will be for some Pats fans to see arguably their two best players ever in another uniform they are getting a free fourth round pick. There was absolutely no incentive to block the move.

Mr. Guappa · 22-04-2020 2:54pm

The_Honeybadger wrote: »

No brainer for the Pats, he was never going to agree to go anywhere else and it’s a different conference where they won’t meet unless they both make the SuperBowl. As jarring as it will be for some Pats fans to see arguably their two best players ever in another uniform they are getting a free fourth round pick. There was absolutely no incentive to block the move.

If Gronk really wanted he could have un-retired and had his rights and $9 million cap hit revert to the Patriots. We've so little cap space that this would have forced us to cut him (as we knew he had no intention of playing for us), so a 4th round pick is a great bonus.

I hope Brady and Gronk tear it up in Tampa - it's not like they've joined the Jets!

eagle eye · 22-04-2020 3:02pm

The_Honeybadger wrote:

No brainer for the Pats, he was never going to agree to go anywhere else and itâ€™s a different conference where they wonâ€™t meet unless they both make the SuperBowl. As jarring as it will be for some Pats fans to see arguably their two best players ever in another uniform they are getting a free fourth round pick. There was absolutely no incentive to block the move.

Well it's not our two best players ever but likely our two most popular.
Brady's obviously the GOAT and then John Hannah is next without question, after that there's a group that Gronk is a part of that includes Wilfork, Tippett, Brown, Law, Haynes and Seymour. Gilmour will join that group very soon and I suppose Edelman deserves a mention too.

The_Honeybadger · 22-04-2020 3:18pm

eagle eye wrote: »

Well it's not our two best players ever but likely our two most popular.
Brady's obviously the GOAT and then John Hannah is next without question, after that there's a group that Gronk is a part of that includes Wilfork, Tippett, Brown, Law, Haynes and Seymour. Gilmour will join that group very soon and I suppose Edelman deserves a mention too.

I did say ‘arguably’. There is rarely consensus on these matters

eagle eye · 22-04-2020 3:22pm

The_Honeybadger wrote:

I did say â€˜arguablyâ€™. There is rarely consensus on these matters

I think you'll find consensus amongst Patriots fans as to who is no.1 and no.2.

The_Honeybadger · 22-04-2020 3:26pm

eagle eye wrote: »

I think you'll find consensus amongst Patriots fans as to who is no.1 and no.2.

If you say so

StringerBell · 22-04-2020 4:06pm

Being spiteful and petty for the sake of it isn't really the BB way though when it comes to making decisions he is known for pragmatism, not being a pissy little bitch basically.

Also, no way with how Kraft feels about both Brady and Gronk he was going to stand in the way of what a player who gave so much to the cause (and was apparently expendable two years ago anyway) wants. Its not how you do business and show gratitude to those who put the bodies on the line for your organisation, doesn't go with the image Kraft wants either for that matter.

Its also just pointless, I mean.....Gronk isn't going to play for the Patriots again, get the most value you can for him is the obvious thing to do really. Considering he was basically retired anything is a bonus. One of the all time greats to put on a Patriot uniform, again he has earned the right to play out his career where he likes in my opinion. If he wants one last ride with Brady I can both understand that and also wish him well in it.

I have no confusion where my loyalty lies, I just don't have any bitterness toward either player after the years of joy they have given me. I appreciate what they have done for the Patriots and don't see a need to punish.

Shedite27 · 22-04-2020 5:17pm

If they had left us in their prime, it's a different story, but it's a Brady and Gronk that are well past their best. This is Jerry Rice at Seattle Seahawks here, we're unlikely to cross paths more than once in the future

ELM327 · 22-04-2020 5:27pm

eagle eye wrote: »

Well it's not our two best players ever but likely our two most popular.
Brady's obviously the GOAT and then John Hannah is next without question, after that there's a group that Gronk is a part of that includes Wilfork, Tippett, Brown, Law, Haynes and Seymour. Gilmour will join that group very soon and I suppose Edelman deserves a mention too.

Hannah is before my time, I know he's in the hof (?) but I never saw him play so wouldnt be on my list.

Brady is obviously the GOAT in NE, behind him is a few players IMO, gronk is for sure one of them. Arguable Julian Edelman, Wilfork, Bruschi, Seymour, Troy Brown, and some others too.

New England Patriots Thread Mod Warning Post #253

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