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TII Motorway Service Areas (MSA) Progress Thread

12357…31

Comments

  • #202
    Pete_Cavan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,045 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    We now have a situation where the Government does not have the money to build Service Stations in Limerick, Cork, Waterford, Wexford and Cavan.

    First of all, why on earth would anyone want to build a Motorway Service Area in Cavan when there isn't even a motorway within 10km of the county? I understand that some people are unhappy that motorways were built without service areas but building service areas without the motorway makes even less sense.
    There is a simple solution to this problem which is let the private sector build them, this is best practice in other EU Member States and does not involve reinventing the wheel. All the NRA has to do is assign a plot of land for development and let the private sector construct the necessary access routes, buildings and so on.

    The MSAs are being built by the private sector with private sector money. They are PPPs. The NRA has to do is assigned the plots of land for development and let the private sector construct the necessary access routes, buildings and run and operate the stations. At least this way the MSAs are guaranteed to be open 24 hours (if just run by a private company they might decide to close at 10pm because it was costing them money to stay open) and they will stay open (if it is not profitable the private company could close it down and we would be left with no MSAs). Even if the private company operating the petrol station stayed open, the food outlets (eg. BurgerKing) could close down. Basically this is the best way to ensure we have properly run and maintained MSAs. When the current PPP contracts expire, the NRA will still own the infrastructure and future contracts for operating the MSAs will be very profitable for them.


  • #203
    Sulmac
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,021 ✭✭✭Sulmac


    Pete_Cavan wrote: »
    The MSAs are being built by the private sector with private sector money. They are PPPs. The NRA has to do is assigned the plots of land for development and let the private sector construct the necessary access routes, buildings and run and operate the stations. At least this way the MSAs are guaranteed to be open 24 hours (if just run by a private company they might decide to close at 10pm because it was costing them money to stay open) and they will stay open (if it is not profitable the private company could close it down and we would be left with no MSAs). Even if the private company operating the petrol station stayed open, the food outlets (eg. BurgerKing) could close down. Basically this is the best way to ensure we have properly run and maintained MSAs. When the current PPP contracts expire, the NRA will still own the infrastructure and future contracts for operating the MSAs will be very profitable for them.

    Are you sure every part of the MSAs will be open 24/7? I think I remember reading somewhere that the restaurants (e.g. Burger King) only have to open for a minimum of 18 hours a day, while only the petrol station and toilet aspects need to be open permanently.

    That said, there's nothing to stop them all being open 24/7 if they want.


  • #204
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 31,118 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Sulmac wrote: »
    Are you sure every part of the MSAs will be open 24/7? I think I remember reading somewhere that the restaurants (e.g. Burger King) only have to open for a minimum of 18 hours a day, while only the petrol station and toilet aspects need to be open permanently.

    That said, there's nothing to stop them all being open 24/7 if they want.

    The petrol station will, no doubt sell the usual collection of "extras" that all large service stations sell, no one will go hungry.


  • #205
    Bluetonic
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,588 ✭✭✭Bluetonic


    Lots of work on the M1 @ Ballough the last few nights.

    Road markings are now in place off the M1 and a good bit of tarmac was delivered each night. Work is on going on the M1 for the approach signs.

    The north building was fully light up last night, all signs etc..,.


  • #206
    L1011
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,588 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    MYOB wrote: »
    The forecourt roof edging appears to be on both N4 ones now, light green on the one in front of the facilities block (for Applegreen) and dark green on the further out one (TOP, for trucks presumably).

    Signs up on the roof edging now.


  • #207
    NFD100
    Registered Users Posts: 141 ✭✭NFD100


    any pics?


  • #208
    baalthor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,241 ✭✭✭baalthor


    murpho999 wrote: »
    Understand your anger, but I was surprised two years ago when I drove in the US and none of their vast Interstate networks have service areas on them.


    Are you sure ?? The "service area" doesn't have to be right on the motorway - it just means there's a designated site with these services at reasonable distance when you exit the motorway/freeway.

    The US does have them but as you can see from the article, local businesses lobbied to prevent them being built directly off the motorway - just like they did here Eurodeputy Kelly !


  • #209
    Geogregor
    Registered Users Posts: 397 ✭✭Geogregor


    baalthor wrote: »
    Are you sure ?? The "service area" doesn't have to be right on the motorway - it just means there's a designated site with these services at reasonable distance when you exit the motorway/freeway.

    The US does have them but as you can see from the article, local businesses lobbied to prevent them being built directly off the motorway - just like they did here Eurodeputy Kelly !

    I actually prefer US system over European one. Building services off the motorway offers greater competition as there is no one selected operator. You often have 3 or 4 gas stations and even more eating options around some junctions.
    The key is clear signage on the freeway which tells you what gas, food, and logging you can expect on coming junction.
    It is simple and less bureaucratic than selection of official contractors to run European style services.


  • #210
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 31,118 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Geogregor wrote: »
    I actually prefer US system over European one. Building services off the motorway offers greater competition as there is no one selected operator. You often have 3 or 4 gas stations and even more eating options around some junctions.
    The key is clear signage on the freeway which tells you what gas, food, and logging you can expect on coming junction.
    It is simple and less bureaucratic than selection of official contractors to run European style services.
    Personally, I prefer the European/UK system as it ensures the services are where they are needed (as in between junctions etc.), not where the operators would prefer to place them to maximise profit!


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  • #211
    cameramonkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,220 ✭✭✭cameramonkey


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Personally, I prefer the European/UK system as it ensures the services are where they are needed (as in between junctions etc.), not where the operators would prefer to place them to maximise profit!

    i would prefer a Us style system with better sign posting. Uk is in Europe by the way.


  • #212
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 31,118 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    cameramonkey wrote: »
    i would prefer a Us style system with better sign posting. Uk is in Europe by the way.

    I know, just that some try to separate it away! ;)


  • #213
    cameramonkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,220 ✭✭✭cameramonkey


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I know, just that some try to separate it away! ;)

    they can try but geography dosnt lie:).


  • #214
    csd
    Registered Users Posts: 260 ✭✭csd


    Folks,

    I had a chance to take some shots of the M4 MSAs today, both on and off the motorway. It appears that the M4 areas are a bit behind their M1 cousins.

    1. The westbound MSA, taken from the M4 mainline.
    IMG_5047.JPG

    2. Another one of the westbound MSA.
    IMG_5048.JPG

    3. Eastbound MSA, taken from the M4 mainline westbound.
    IMG_5049.JPG

    4. Eastbound MSA, taken from a nearby bridge over the M4.
    IMG_5063.JPG

    5. Eastbound diverge and westbound merge (looking east).
    IMG_5064.JPG

    6. Detail of the pump area, eastbound MSA.
    IMG_5067.JPG

    7. Car park of the eastbound area.
    IMG_5070.JPG

    8. A final overall site view of the eastbound MSA.
    IMG_5072.JPG

    /csd


  • #215
    Tech3
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,010 ✭✭✭Tech3


    Those photos are brilliant. When is this MSA due to be completed?


  • #216
    csd
    Registered Users Posts: 260 ✭✭csd


    tech2 wrote: »
    Those photos are brilliant. When is this MSA due to be completed?

    Thanks!

    The three MSAs (two M1 and M4) are all supposed to be finished in October, but it looks like the M1 ones might come in a little earlier.

    /csd


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  • #217
    Bluetonic
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,588 ✭✭✭Bluetonic


    csd wrote: »
    Thanks!

    The three MSAs (two M1 and M4) are all supposed to be finished in October, but it looks like the M1 ones might come in a little earlier.

    /csd
    There is a staggered opening with the M1 (@ Ballough) opening a few weeks before the others.


  • #218
    Bluetonic
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,588 ✭✭✭Bluetonic


    A northbound sign at Ballough.

    k2i9ah.jpg

    A southbound sign at Ballough.

    2cdaloz.jpg


  • #219
    cargo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,216 ✭✭✭cargo


    csd wrote: »
    Thanks!

    The three MSAs (two M1 and M4) are all supposed to be finished in October, but it looks like the M1 ones might come in a little earlier.

    /csd
    Bluetonic wrote: »
    There is a staggered opening with the M1 (@ Ballough) opening a few weeks before the others.


    Yeah the M1 sites started a little earlier than the M4 so that probably accounts for the time difference.


  • #220
    KevR
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,110 ✭✭✭KevR


    Was watching 'Police, Camera, Action' on ITV earlier and the episode was called 'when lorries become lethal' (i.e. - lorry drivers falling asleep at the wheel). Apparently, 20% of lorry drivers questioned admitted falling asleep at the wheel.

    Was really shocking viewing and it further highlights the urgent need for MSAs that will reduce the risk of all drivers (not just lorry driver) falling asleep behind the wheel.


  • #221
    marmurr1916
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,091 ✭✭✭marmurr1916


    Bluetonic wrote: »
    A northbound sign at Ballough.

    k2i9ah.jpg

    A southbound sign at Ballough.

    2cdaloz.jpg

    Begod, the country's first motorway services signs!

    They should have a wheelchair symbol if the facilities (incl. toilets) are accessible.

    Also distance to next services (maybe not so relevant on the M4!) should be underneath, like this:

    Germany-Motorway-Services-Sign.aspx


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  • #222
    Bluetonic
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,588 ✭✭✭Bluetonic


    There also other signs up around 1km from the turn off which will have the petrol and diesel prices on them similar to forecourt signs.

    All in all I think it's three side of the road signs before at 1,500m 1,000m and 500m and the one overhead at the turn off.


  • #223
    L1011
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,588 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    I notice there still hasn't been a bit of work on the private M8 services at Cashel since the road laying was done...


  • #224
    Bluetonic
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,588 ✭✭✭Bluetonic


    A few more recent photo's here.


  • #225
    cargo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,216 ✭✭✭cargo


    Bluetonic wrote: »
    There also other signs up around 1km from the turn off which will have the petrol and diesel prices on them similar to forecourt signs.

    All in all I think it's three side of the road signs before at 1,500m 1,000m and 500m and the one overhead at the turn off.

    Was it just me or was there 2 holes in the new signs already? Saw them going SB on Friday am and all looked fine but coming NB past the Lusk site I thought the 2 lED fuel price signs looked like they had 2 hols in them from either stones or possibly bullets. I only saw it at the last minute so can't be 100% sure. Anyone else notice this Friday pm?


  • #226
    whyulittle
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,878 ✭✭✭whyulittle


    3 big signs up for the M4 service area this morning on the westbound carraigeway. They were working on the eastbound carraigeway when I passed.

    No great advance notice though, I'd say all 3 were within 500 metres of the entrance. Most of them weren't grayed out either. 4x4 in front of me drove in, not sure if he was working there or thought it was open!


  • #227
    cargo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,216 ✭✭✭cargo


    cargo wrote: »
    Was it just me or was there 2 holes in the new signs already? Saw them going SB on Friday am and all looked fine but coming NB past the Lusk site I thought the 2 lED fuel price signs looked like they had 2 hols in them from either stones or possibly bullets. I only saw it at the last minute so can't be 100% sure. Anyone else notice this Friday pm?

    Have had a chance to look at them again a few times since and I'd say it was only a concentraion of condensation around a particular spot in the middle of both signs. There's still a small spot on them as they probably "acclimatise " to life on the side of the M1.

    M1 North sigs now up as well and loasd of landscaping, car park marking going on at the sites. Must be an opening coming up soon. Anyone hear a date?


  • #228
    skinnyboy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 108 ✭✭skinnyboy


    Hello lads i work for applegreen,the first motorway site is opening the 6th of september which is lusk,last one opening up will be enfield in october.finishing touches are happening in lusk at the moment,there goin to be fantastic sites.


  • #229
    csd
    Registered Users Posts: 260 ✭✭csd


    Folks,

    As noted above, signage has been erected on the M4 westbound -- see pics below (including the electronic price signage).

    IMG_5416.JPG

    IMG_5420.JPG

    There's a tree planted right in front of this one:
    IMG_5424.JPG


  • #230
    thetonynator
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,234 ✭✭✭thetonynator


    Anyone know where the service areas on the M9 will be and who has the contracts for them??


  • #231
    L1011
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,588 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    thetonynator wrote: »
    Anyone know where the service areas on the M9 will be and who has the contracts for them??

    Nowhere and nobody.

    There are no contracts issued for any further service areas at the moment. One will be issued for the M11 at Gorey to the concessionaire for the Arklow-Rathnew & Newlands Cross scheme and one is planned to be included in the M20 PPP if that even goes ahead.


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  • #232
    Amtmann
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,093 ✭✭✭Amtmann


    thetonynator wrote: »
    Anyone know where the service areas on the M9 will be and who has the contracts for them??

    There will be a service area on the M9 near Kilcullen but it won't be built any time soon.


  • #233
    thetonynator
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,234 ✭✭✭thetonynator


    MYOB wrote: »
    Nowhere and nobody.

    There are no contracts issued for any further service areas at the moment. One will be issued for the M11 at Gorey to the concessionaire for the Arklow-Rathnew & Newlands Cross scheme and one is planned to be included in the M20 PPP if that even goes ahead.
    Furet wrote: »
    There will be a service area on the M9 near Kilcullen but it won't be built any time soon.


    Thanks.

    Disgraceful really - Naas to Waterford without a service area near the motorway . . .


  • #234
    cargo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,216 ✭✭✭cargo


    thetonynator wrote: »
    Thanks.

    Disgraceful really - Naas to Waterford without a service area near the motorway . . .

    Crookstown and Castledermot are not far from an exit if you needed fuel or a pit(ss) stop!! Or come off at Crookstown and travel downthrough Kilcullen to avoid having to double-back. You wont starve dont worry.

    Don't know about the MSA at Kilcullen but I know the NRA were looking to take land south of Powerstown (end of current motorway) for a MSA but all the builds have been put on-hold for now so I'm not sure if they followed through and aquired the land.


  • #235
    Amtmann
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,093 ✭✭✭Amtmann


    Kilcullen Service Area Main Report: http://www.nra.ie/Publications/EISPublications/file,15905,en.pdf

    See here for further documentation (scroll down): http://www.nra.ie/Publications/EISPublications/


  • #236
    Amtmann
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,093 ✭✭✭Amtmann


    DSCF3435.jpg

    This appeared in today's paper and is welcome.


  • #237
    Chris_5339762
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,967 ✭✭✭Chris_5339762


    Very welcome, if it gets anywhere. Very VERY welcome.

    We can get away with one MSA about halfway along each route for the time being, then build more later.


  • #238
    L1011
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,588 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Bye bye Mother Hubbards there if that gets built, methinks. But it is needed.


  • #239
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 31,118 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    MYOB wrote: »
    Bye bye Mother Hubbards there if that gets built, methinks. But it is needed.

    The one near Enfield may be OK as many trucks already toll dodge.

    I don't know the M8 but is the service station on the tolled section


  • #240
    Geogregor
    Registered Users Posts: 397 ✭✭Geogregor


    Furet wrote: »
    Kilcullen Service Area Main Report: http://www.nra.ie/Publications/EISPublications/file,15905,en.pdf

    See here for further documentation (scroll down): http://www.nra.ie/Publications/EISPublications/

    How about the time frame? When the Cashel MSA is going to be build? What is the next step? Is location approved on 100% ?
    How about the other MSA? (like Kilcullen)

    I looked at the drawings. I have to say I like design of the Irish MSA. They look quite spacious and are logically planned. Hope they will build them soon.


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  • #241
    pat13wx
    Registered Users Posts: 296 ✭✭pat13wx


    Furet wrote: »
    DSCF3435.jpg

    This appeared in today's paper and is welcome.

    Very welcome, indeed. Thanks Furet for posting the above.

    Looking at the map I see that as the crow flies it is only about a mile from our house.


    @dolanbaker...This is an untolled section of the M8.


  • #242
    whyulittle
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,878 ✭✭✭whyulittle


    The digital displays for the petrol/diesel prices were uncovered on the eastbound M4 carraigway today. They seem to have those signs up and uncovered way too early, if it's not going to open until, October, did I read on here?

    Carwash visible at each station this morning, which I hadn't noticed before.


  • #243
    Amtmann
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,093 ✭✭✭Amtmann


    Geogregor wrote: »
    How about the time frame? When the Cashel MSA is going to be build?
    There is no way to tell geogregor. The service areas are indefinitely postponed, but this announcement took me by surprise and I'm hopeful that it could be built by sometime in 2013 at a guess. Maybe sooner, maybe not. We'll have to wait and see. Political pressure might put the MSAs back on the NRA's list of priorities.
    What is the next step? Is location approved on 100% ?
    The location is approved 100%. The next step is to buy the land and, I presume, put the contract out to tender. The sooner the tender is announced, the sooner the MSA will be built.
    How about the other MSA? (like Kilcullen)

    Dead in the water for now.


  • #244
    Trotter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,362 ✭✭✭Trotter


    Does anyone know if there are plans for any service stations on the M9? I almost got caught without petrol on the Dublin Galway motorway recently and given that I'll be using the M9 quite a bit I was curious as to what services plans there are (or arent!).


  • #245
    Pete_Cavan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,045 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    Trotter wrote: »
    Does anyone know if there are plans for any service stations on the M9? I almost got caught without petrol on the Dublin Galway motorway recently and given that I'll be using the M9 quite a bit I was curious as to what services plans there are (or arent!).

    Ah lads, there is already a thread on MSA in general, there is no need to open a new one just so you can ask a question about the M9.


  • #246
    Amtmann
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,093 ✭✭✭Amtmann


    Trotter wrote: »
    Any info on the question though?

    Trotter, if you view from here you will find an answer.

    For offline services, ask here. I'm quite unfamiliar with the M9, hence I can't be of more direct help.


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  • #247
    L1011
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,588 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Horan's Maxol Castledermot is probably the closest to a junction on the M9 (J4 Carlow North/Castledermot), but the one in Crookstown which is quite a bit further from a junction (J3) is a lot closer to being a proto-MSA. Large shop, deli, some seating, other shops (chemist, doctor, butcher).

    There is nothing great near the other open section as it stands and I'm unsure what will be near the uncompleted section - the N9 corridor was poorly served to begin with!


  • #248
    brian ireland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,647 ✭✭✭brian ireland


    The service station heading north on the M1 Lusk will open on Wednesday 8th September. The service Station on the opposite side of the motor-way heading into Dublin will open the following Wednesday Sept 15th.


  • #249
    nordydan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,107 ✭✭✭nordydan


    brian ireland wrote: »
    The service station heading north on the M1 Lusk will open on Wednesday 8th September. The service Station on the opposite side of the motor-way heading into Dublin will open the following Wednesday Sept 15th.

    Saw the signs up today when I was driving down the road, orange signs saying "opening mid-september".

    Further up the road, similar signs stated "opening end September" for the ones at Castlebellingham (or at least the southbound one)


  • #250
    brian ireland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,647 ✭✭✭brian ireland


    The dates i have posted are correct.


  • #251
    Absurdum
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,445 ✭✭✭Absurdum


    brian ireland wrote: »
    The service station heading north on the M1 Lusk will open on Wednesday 8th September. The service Station on the opposite side of the motor-way heading into Dublin will open the following Wednesday Sept 15th.


    I thought the southbound one might be open this morning because the traffic was unusually heavy, but no, it was just a car stopped in the hard shoulder so everyone had to slow down and have a look, just in case it was something interesting.


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