dog with colic

lulu1 · 02-01-2019 6:40pm #1

Hi Not sure if I posted here before about this problem. Our dog is almost 8 and this last year he had developed this wind/colic problem. We have had him to the vets countless times. The last time was a few weeks before xmas. That time we were told to avoid chicken at all costs, he never ate much chicken anyway.

Early this morning it started again you can hear his tummy rumbling and he just cant settle he's in and out all day.

He wants to go out a walk and he would walk to the end of the earth and back which is not like him at all, normally you would have to fight to get him to go out

He is a bishon x poodle

Bells21 · 02-01-2019 7:04pm

What do you currently feed him? When he goes to the toilet is it runny/jelly like/ any blood in it? Is it likely that he's gotten any extra bits of fatty foods or anything over Xmas?

lulu1 · 02-01-2019 7:17pm

Bells21 wrote: »

What do you currently feed him? When he goes to the toilet is it runny/jelly like/ any blood in it? Is it likely that he's gotten any extra bits of fatty foods or anything over Xmas?

No we wouldnt really give him much other than his usual dog food even over xmas. When he is like this he would usually eat grass to make himself sick it will either do that or come out the other end.

He has started to settle a bit now

Bells21 · 02-01-2019 7:33pm

Glad to hear he's feeling a little better. Maybe it would be an idea to jot down each time it happens, what it looks like, what he's had to eat and when he's eaten beforehand etc. You may be able to pin point something that's causing it that way. I'd also visit the vet again and discuss it with them.

McCrack · 02-01-2019 7:38pm

lulu1 wrote: »

No we wouldnt really give him much other than his usual dog food even over xmas. When he is like this he would usually eat grass to make himself sick it will either do that or come out the other end.

He has started to settle a bit now

What do you give him besides his usual food?

lulu1 · 02-01-2019 7:46pm

McCrack wrote: »

What do you give him besides his usual food?

He got a small piece of toast yesterday but nothing worth talking about.

I am starting to think it is dairy products as there was butter on the toast and another time i remember there were visitors in the house and they gave him some ice cream

Would that make sense

tk123 · 02-01-2019 9:19pm

It sounds more like pancreatitis - has he been tested for it? Its a snap blood test the vet can do and it needs to be done when he’s symptomatic so when his tummy is rumbling. If it IS panc you need to feed small and often so eg my guy gets 3 meals a day spaced out instead of 2. He’s fed a low fat diet and gets digestive enzymes with each meal too. If he doesn’t have supper he could have a flare up and would have the symptoms you describe so gurgling tummy and vomiting foam and one time even blood(!). I don’t let him eat grass and get sick as it just prolongs the flare up. Once he has the gurgling and vomiting now I know I can’t turn it around (I could in the past) so I take him for the anti nausea shot. Otherwise we could have days and days of sleepless nights and it’s just not fair on him.
Don’t underestimate it because it’s very painful and the pain killer injection itself for it when it’s bad is very very painful for them - he’s needed it once and was crying and yelping in pain when he got it

Oh and when he does have a flare up I feed wet food for a few days - Rocco sensitive from zooplus

lulu1 · 02-01-2019 9:39pm

No he has never been tested for it as far as I know unless the vet did the test herself and never said.

He seem to be back to himself now but I am going to keep a record of what he eats just too see if anything triggers it.

aonb · 02-01-2019 9:50pm

OP could it be BLOAT? Worth discussing with your vet

Your dog might just be sensitive, so keeping a track of what he eats and especially when he has a flare-up would be a good idea

Is your dogs tummy hard/distended a bit? My dog who was inclined to Bloat had similar symptoms to your guy - gurgling, discomfort/unable to settle, eating grass etc. We found over the years that there were certain foods he shouldnt eat, so we fed him a home cooked diet. He ate 3 smaller meals/day. no walks after eating etc.

lulu1 · 02-01-2019 11:04pm

we think that there must be something bringing on the flare up

The thing is he cant eat when his tummy is full off wind

He has hardly eaten a bite all day

aonb · 02-01-2019 11:27pm

lulu1 wrote: »

we think that there must be something bringing on the flare up

The thing is he cant eat when his tummy is full off wind

He has hardly eaten a bite all day

My dog was very unwell when he had a episode, uncomfortable and restless, panting, we had to wait for it to pass, which was nervewracking. We would give him very gentle small amounts of food next day, with lots of rest.

How often does he have an episode OP?
What food are you currently feeding?
Have you tried a "sensitive" food?
Could he be eating something disgusting on walks or when he's outside?
Is he overweight?
Does he chew toys etc a lot? Could he be ingesting something that is causing a blockage?

We never did find what it was that caused our dogs bloat episodes. Thankfully they passed over after a day of discomfort. Once we moved to a homecooked diet it definitely helped, he had skin issues too, so we thought allergies were at the root of the whole problem

lulu1 · 03-01-2019 12:31am

The last one was about a few weeks before xmas. i would say he would have them one day out of every month.

He would never chew anything or even pick anything up off the floor and to our knowledge he hasn't eaten anything on walks.

He's not overweight

Not sure of the name off the food but its a tinned variety.

He's just back from a walk and doing his usual thing. We put a towel on the floor and he dries himself so that's a good sign

Latatian · 03-01-2019 7:16am

I am not a vet, ask your vet etc but my dog had pancreatitis and got something like what you describe when she ate almost anything.

The royal canin gastrointestinal dry food worked wonders for her, and once we had stopped her symptoms entirely I could try different foods tosee if there was anything else she wasn't uncomfortable on.

It might be worth a shot. But if you're feeding it feed literally nothing else- no scraps or titbits.

lulu1 · 18-02-2019 1:09am

Latatian wrote: »

I am not a vet, ask your vet etc but my dog had pancreatitis and got something like what you describe when she ate almost anything.

The royal canin gastrointestinal dry food worked wonders for her, and once we had stopped her symptoms entirely I could try different foods tosee if there was anything else she wasn't uncomfortable on.

It might be worth a shot. But if you're feeding it feed literally nothing else- no scraps or titbits.

Could I ask you where you bought this food please Its been 2 weeks today since he has been sick but had a bit of rumbling in the tummy this morning again. He has not eaten A thing except his usual food.
Went to the pet shop and they say that you can only get this food online or from a vet

Bells21 · 18-02-2019 4:28pm

Have you gone to your vet with your concerns? If not it's like shooting in the dark. I think it would be wise to get some advice and then you'd be better able to make a plan to help your dog.

tk123 · 18-02-2019 4:37pm

Bells21 wrote: »

Have you gone to your vet with your concerns? If not it's like shooting in the dark. I think it would be wise to get some advice and then you'd be better able to make a plan to help your dog.

+1

If you're not feeding the right food at the right times you're just going around in circles. Possibly you just need to feed smaller meals more often but a vet should be able to advise.

lulu1 · 18-02-2019 11:00pm

Bells21 wrote: »

Have you gone to your vet with your concerns? If not it's like shooting in the dark. I think it would be wise to get some advice and then you'd be better able to make a plan to help your dog.

we have been to the vet several times same answer every time dont give him chicken he never got that much at any time. This past few weeks we are keeping him off everything except his normal dog food and he still got the rumbling tummy although this time it didnt last the full day

Bells21 · 18-02-2019 11:19pm

lulu1 wrote:

we have been to the vet several times same answer every time dont give him chicken he never got that much at any time. This past few weeks we are keeping him off everything except his normal dog food and he still got the rumbling tummy although this time it didnt last the full day

I would be asking the vet to do some further tests. Especially given that you have been so strict with what you give him but there is still some issue. It seems to me that the vet is just zoning in on the chicken rather than looking at the bigger picture. You obviously are concerned for your pet so don't be afraid to question your vet if you feel you're being fobbed off. Or else look for a recommendation for a different vet.

Latatian · 18-02-2019 11:34pm

Lulu1- I got it from the vet but the large pet shops sometines have it.

What is his usual dog food?

lulu1 · 19-02-2019 12:52am

Latatian wrote: »

Lulu1- I got it from the vet but the large pet shops sometines have it.

What is his usual dog food?

He eats ceaser dog food.

think we may change the vet

cocker5 · 19-02-2019 9:05am

lulu1 wrote: »

Latatian wrote: »

Lulu1- I got it from the vet but the large pet shops sometines have it.

What is his usual dog food?

He eats ceaser dog food.

think we may change the vet

OP ceasers is pretty low quality food to be honest .. it’s pretty awful I’m afraid-

https://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/dog-food-reviews/cesar-dog-food/

I not sure the issue is your vet...

You need to feed your dog a better quality food and possible split the meals to 3 times per day

tk123 · 19-02-2019 10:20am

The fact that you're feeding ceaser is actually great because it's most likely what's causing the problem! I'd try a 'normal' food before forking out for the likes of hills/rc gasto/id/whatever they call it. If you're happy with feeding wet food Rocco sensitive from Zooplus is low fat and great value.

maggiepip · 19-02-2019 2:02pm

Rocco sensitive is actually pretty high in fat, fat is calculated on a dry matter basis, so with dry foods if the packet says 15% fat then it's more or less 15% as there's very little moisture content. With wet foods however you need to calculate what the dry matter fat content is, as wet food is very high in moisture. To do this you take the (fat %) divided by ( 100 - moisture%) multiplied by 100.
Example rocco sensitive lamb and rice has 7.4% fat and 74% moisture, so 7.4 ÷ (100-74) x 100 = 28.4 % fat. So rocco has 28.4% fat on a dry matter basis.

This link has a calculator and clearer explanation
https://www.pawdiet.com/articles/dry-matter-basis-calculator-for-pet-food/

maggiepip · 19-02-2019 2:27pm

What was the reason for no chicken?
I've 2 collies with sensitive tummies, one of them misdiagnosed with pancreatitis so was on low fat for awhile but it didn't end up helping.
The biggest helpful things for my dogs are absolutely no gluten or grains, including rice. A little potato seems to be OK. Pro Koalin Enterogenic has worked wonders for my younger dog and Slippery Elm is great for rumbly tummies. I've found the Animonda Sensitive chicken tinned food from zooplus great, it's the lowest fat grain free tinned I can find at 4% (20% on a dry matter basis) so still not exactly low fat but not as high as most. The lamb one is good too but slightly higher in fat.

To be totally honest at the end of the day I had to figure it out myself through trial and error, and although had numerous vet visits I didn't get much help from them apart from antibiotics (which were needed at times)

lulu1 · 19-02-2019 7:39pm

maggiepip wrote: »

What was the reason for no chicken?
I've 2 collies with sensitive tummies, one of them misdiagnosed with pancreatitis so was on low fat for awhile but it didn't end up helping.
The biggest helpful things for my dogs are absolutely no gluten or grains, including rice. A little potato seems to be OK. Pro Koalin Enterogenic has worked wonders for my younger dog and Slippery Elm is great for rumbly tummies. I've found the Animonda Sensitive chicken tinned food from zooplus great, it's the lowest fat grain free tinned I can find at 4% (20% on a dry matter basis) so still not exactly low fat but not as high as most. The lamb one is good too but slightly higher in fat.

To be totally honest at the end of the day I had to figure it out myself through trial and error, and although had numerous vet visits I didn't get much help from them apart from antibiotics (which were needed at times)

In her opinion a dog should not be eating anything that a human would eat

cocker5 · 19-02-2019 7:46pm

lulu1 wrote: »

maggiepip wrote: »

What was the reason for no chicken?
I've 2 collies with sensitive tummies, one of them misdiagnosed with pancreatitis so was on low fat for awhile but it didn't end up helping.
The biggest helpful things for my dogs are absolutely no gluten or grains, including rice. A little potato seems to be OK. Pro Koalin Enterogenic has worked wonders for my younger dog and Slippery Elm is great for rumbly tummies. I've found the Animonda Sensitive chicken tinned food from zooplus great, it's the lowest fat grain free tinned I can find at 4% (20% on a dry matter basis) so still not exactly low fat but not as high as most. The lamb one is good too but slightly higher in fat.

To be totally honest at the end of the day I had to figure it out myself through trial and error, and although had numerous vet visits I didn't get much help from them apart from antibiotics (which were needed at times)

In her opinion a dog should not be eating anything that a human would eat

Please be aware many vets are not trained nutritionally and when they are it’s by the makers of Royal Canin etc

OP you need to address what your feeding your dog .. it’s dreadful stuff move him over to a decent food / raw or home cooked .. anything is better than what he is on in all honesty

maggiepip · 19-02-2019 8:08pm

lulu1 wrote: »

In her opinion a dog should not be eating anything that a human would eat

Thats quite bizzare really, chicken meat would be a pretty natural healthy snack compared to the rubbish cereals, sugars, additives in many dog foods!

tk123 · 19-02-2019 8:59pm

Haha winner winner chicken dinner was on the menu here for supper

Rechuchote · 30-03-2019 7:23pm

I've been feeding my pup Hill's, and a neighbour who has his litter-mate ditto. She (the litter mate) has been a very picky eater all along. My pup has had a problem with diarrhoea a few times.

The neighbour changed his formerly picky pup from Hill's to a fish-based puppy food (on the ingredients it's salmon, plaice, sweet potato and asparagus) brand named Grain Free and she devours it.

I asked the vet, who hadn't heard of this brand ("Grain Free"), but said that if my pup's sister was doing well on it, it was worth my changing. I changed him yesterday and he likes it, and has no more diarrhoea (though this may reflect the antibiotic shot the vet gave him just in case, and the worm tablet, and the probiotic course).

Has anyone come across this as a brand? Any opinions of it?

coathanger · 30-03-2019 8:56pm

Rechuchote wrote: »

I've been feeding my pup Hill's, and a neighbour who has his litter-mate ditto. She (the litter mate) has been a very picky eater all along. My pup has had a problem with diarrhoea a few times.

The neighbour changed his formerly picky pup from Hill's to a fish-based puppy food (on the ingredients it's salmon, plaice, sweet potato and asparagus) brand named Grain Free and she devours it.

I asked the vet, who hadn't heard of this brand ("Grain Free"), but said that if my pup's sister was doing well on it, it was worth my changing. I changed him yesterday and he likes it, and has no more diarrhoea (though this may reflect the antibiotic shot the vet gave him just in case, and the worm tablet, and the probiotic course).

Has anyone come across this as a brand? Any opinions of it?

Did u get this in your local pet shop & does it have the name of the shop on it, a sticker on the front with the name ?

tk123 · 30-03-2019 10:11pm

I’d assume it’s champion aka nourish rite aka <insert resellers name here >? The link here has a pic of the bag some of them use https://dogfooddirect.ie/modules/shop/cats/champion-/

Cherry Blossom · 30-03-2019 10:19pm

Rechuchote wrote: »

Has anyone come across this as a brand? Any opinions of it?

It's highly unlikely the brand name is 'Grain Free'. That would be a marketing nightmare and impossible to find in an online search if you wanted to buy it online. What else does it say on the bag or can you post a photo of it?

em_cat · 30-03-2019 10:54pm

We’ve a horrible time with Mr C’s tummy at times and pretty much stick to novel protein, low fat and easy to digest veg.

One thing tho, is that I’m deathly allergic to Salmon so also have a super difficult time trying to find commercially available high end foods as it seems to be a common ingredient, but worry endlessly that he’s not getting the right requirements when I do home cooked.

Rechuchote · 31-03-2019 9:14am

The brand name is Grain Free. Oddly, though, there's no maker's name or address on it, that I can see.

By the way, my pup is crazy about kefir (which I buy and gollish down myself - it's €1.10 a litre from the Moldova shop beside Lidl in Rathmines, and I assume other Eastern European shops. I started going in there for their big buches of dill and flatleaf parsley, €1.50 a bunch, and stayed for the kefir and the vegetables you don't find easily elsewhere, like beetroots.

muddypaws · 31-03-2019 11:24am

That's a food made by GA in the UK that is sold to pet shops etc with their own label put on - that one says Pet Parlour.

Rechuchote · 31-03-2019 11:40am

Where does it say Pet Parlour, and what's GA, please? I can't see any manufacturer's address on it.

31-03-2019 12:00pm

Firstly, change vet.
Secondly, change food. What breed dog is it?

Rechuchote · 31-03-2019 12:01pm

Why should I change the vet, and why should I change the food?

Border collie puppy, merle, seven months old.

31-03-2019 12:05pm

Rechuchote wrote: »

Why should I change the vet, and why should I change the food?

Border collie puppy, merle, seven months old.

If the vet you’ve attended numerous times hasn’t identified the problem but focus on a foodstuff that you don’t use, then go to one who is more experienced. Where are you based?

There are dog foods suited to breed, size and age. Red Mills, Gain and Pedigree are brands I’ve used and trust.

Sorry, I’m talking to the OP.

Rechuchote · 31-03-2019 12:14pm

Well, with a puppy that's having diarrhoea, it's probable that it's
a) eating shíte,
b) food intolerance,
c) infection
d) worms.

He's had an infection before, and been treated for it.

I'm in south central Dublin. I don't drive, so need a vet within half an hour's walk. I'm happy enough with this vet so far; with my old dog I was bringing her to a vet an hour's walk away, and it just became impossible by the time she was an old lady of 17.

muddypaws · 31-03-2019 1:13pm

Rechuchote wrote: »

Where does it say Pet Parlour, and what's GA, please? I can't see any manufacturer's address on it.

In your first photo, the big pink label that says The Pet Parlour.

Golden Acres http://www.ga-petfoodpartners.co.uk/ga-direct

coathanger · 31-03-2019 2:21pm

I use this food on my girl, who was on Gain, when we got her from the rescue as that’s what they feed all their dogs, but she suffered profuse diarrhoea on it ! We tried numerous foods for her before settling on this food & she is doing really well on it, vet is very happy with her progress as we were in attendance regularly for itchy skin & hotspot issues closed followed by frequent bouts of diarrhoea, all of which seem to have gone since on this food !!!

muddypaws · 31-03-2019 3:12pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

If the vet you’ve attended numerous times hasn’t identified the problem but focus on a foodstuff that you don’t use, then go to one who is more experienced. Where are you based?

There are dog foods suited to breed, size and age. Red Mills, Gain and Pedigree are brands I’ve used and trust.

Sorry, I’m talking to the OP.

Pedigree? Even when I get given that for free I don't use it

Rechuchote · 31-03-2019 4:06pm

coathanger wrote: »

I use this food on my girl, who was on Gain, when we got her from the rescue as that’s what they feed all their dogs, but she suffered profuse diarrhoea on it ! We tried numerous foods for her before settling on this food & she is doing really well on it, vet is very happy with her progress as we were in attendance regularly for itchy skin & hotspot issues closed followed by frequent bouts of diarrhoea, all of which seem to have gone since on this food !!!

You use the Grain Free, you're saying? And your pup's thriving on it?

tk123 · 31-03-2019 5:11pm

Rechuchote wrote: »

You use the Grain Free, you're saying? And your pup's thriving on it?

Most dogs who are on it do fine on it. Shop around the different places that sell it though as you might get a better price and most deliver - eg www.fetchyourpetsneeds.ie has 10% off today for mothers day -as mentioned above they have it branded Nourish Rite...
DogFoodDirect have it branded Champion, pet world call it Nature's best, Pet Depot call it Stanley's Best etc etc

The type of food is grain free - the same way as Diet Coke is sugar free... but it's still called Diet Coke.. you don't go into a shop and ask for a bottle of sugar free or a bottle of diet.. so if you go into a shop and ask if the have 'grain free' you'll probably get a confused look!

coathanger · 31-03-2019 7:19pm

Rechuchote wrote: »

You use the Grain Free, you're saying? And your pup's thriving on it?

Yes, that’s what I’m using for her, no more hotspots, itchy skin ,or diarrhoea,Thankfully

cocker5 · 31-03-2019 8:01pm

muddypaws wrote: »

[Deleted User] wrote: »

If the vet you’ve attended numerous times hasn’t identified the problem but focus on a foodstuff that you don’t use, then go to one who is more experienced. Where are you based?

There are dog foods suited to breed, size and age. Red Mills, Gain and Pedigree are brands I’ve used and trust.

Sorry, I’m talking to the OP.

Pedigree? Even when I get given that for free I don't use it

Jesus would never feed pedigree! It’s total sh*te

Rechuchote · 01-04-2019 9:29am

tk123 wrote: »

Most dogs who are on it do fine on it. Shop around the different places that sell it though as you might get a better price and most deliver - eg www.fetchyourpetsneeds.ie has 10% off today for mothers day - as mentioned above they have it branded Nourish Rite...
DogFoodDirect have it branded Champion, pet world call it Nature's best, Pet Depot call it Stanley's Best etc etc

Thanks, this is useful. Dear enough where I bought it; €64 for the 12kg bag.

Is there any identifier by which I can ask for it, other than searching for its many noms de guerre?

coathanger · 01-04-2019 11:16am

Rechuchote wrote: »

Thanks, this is useful. Dear enough where I bought it; €64 for the 12kg bag.

Is there any identifier by which I can ask for it, other than searching for its many noms de guerre?

I pay €14.50 for a 2kg bag in my local pet shop!!!

muddypaws · 01-04-2019 1:58pm

Rechuchote wrote: »

Thanks, this is useful. Dear enough where I bought it; €64 for the 12kg bag.

Is there any identifier by which I can ask for it, other than searching for its many noms de guerre?

You can see the manufacturer's code in one of the photos, bottom of the bag, starts with GB. It will be the same on every product they make.

It's not bad food, small businesses can't afford to run their own factory, so this allows them to have their name out there more than if they were just selling 'named brands'. The company make generic foods and also foods to different recipes that businesses ask them to, which can be dependent on whether they want to market to pet dogs, working, different sizes etc.

Rechuchote · 03-04-2019 10:02am

coathanger wrote: »

I pay €14.50 for a 2kg bag in my local pet shop!!!

Hm, that's €87 for 12kg.

dog with colic

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