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Do you think nurses will get their payrise?

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Comments

  • #3352
    feckthisgenie
    Registered Users Posts: 181 ✭✭feckthisgenie


    Nonoperational wrote: »
    Actually no. Majority of cancer ops and scopes etc cancelled. Causing massive concern.

    Oncology and dialysis except from the strike to the best of my knowledge.


  • #3353
    alloywheel
    Closed Accounts Posts: 245 ✭✭alloywheel


    Twenty Grand wrote: »
    Appointments are cancelled by the thousands in every hospital each year due to conditions and staffing.

    Appointments of cancer patients were cancelled during the week due to nurses greed.

    Conditions and staffing....lol...do not forget Ireland spends €4,706 per head of population on healthcare, one-third more than the average across 35 member countries of the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD). The State's spend last year was the seventh highest per person in the OECD.
    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/state-among-highest-spenders-on-health-per-person-in-oecd-1.3547256


  • #3354
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,548 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    mariaalice wrote: »

    That will not happen but only because the middle classes are very supportive of the NHS. They might introduce some sort of extra class of national insurance to pay for it though.
    That will be a hard sell post Brexit. But Id like to see it happen. Or just increase the in one tax rate to meet spending needs. The wealthy are well represented by the Tories so they will probably continue to pull further away from the working and middle classes.

    Nursing is a really important job so they should pay them a good wage. That's the bottom line. We can find money to pay for some things - Trident is no problem but paying nurses, police and teachers is difficult.

    It's a matter of priorities. If you need a job to be done you need to pay for it. Simply as that.


  • #3355
    Miike
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,021 ✭✭✭Miike


    feckthisgenie wrote: »
    Oncology and dialysis except from the strike to the best of my knowledge.

    No, as part of escalations last week cancer relater surgeries were cancelled - which isn't good enough in my opinion. Core aspects of care need to be staffed and a all-drop-tools approach is a terrible idea.


  • #3356
    feckthisgenie
    Registered Users Posts: 181 ✭✭feckthisgenie


    alloywheel wrote: »
    Appointments of cancer patients were cancelled during the week due to nurses greed.

    Conditions and staffing....lol...do not forget Ireland spends €4,706 per head of population on healthcare, one-third more than the average across 35 member countries of the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD). The State's spend last year was the seventh highest per person in the OECD.
    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/state-among-highest-spenders-on-health-per-person-in-oecd-1.3547256

    https://www.rte.ie/news/health/2019/0127/1025820-hse-strike-plans/

    Look at services that's except. Just shows the lies on here from the ill informed


  • #3357
    Miike
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,021 ✭✭✭Miike


    feckthisgenie wrote: »
    https://www.rte.ie/news/health/2019/0127/1025820-hse-strike-plans/

    Look at services that's except. Just shows the lies on here from the ill informed

    That article is ancient in terms of escalation of strikes.

    https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/some-cancer-surgeries-cancelled-due-to-strike-says-hses-chief-clinical-officer-902889.html

    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/health/bid-to-get-cancer-surgery-back-on-track-as-nurses-strike-again-37791292.html


  • #3358
    feckthisgenie
    Registered Users Posts: 181 ✭✭feckthisgenie


    Miike wrote: »
    No, as part of escalations last week cancer relater surgeries were cancelled - which isn't good enough in my opinion. Core aspects of care need to be staffed and a all-drop-tools approach is a terrible idea.

    That's the government fault not the nurses. The government are a joke in this country.


  • #3359
    David73
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 162 ✭✭David73


    This thread has turned into a sh!t throwing exercise, it's quite unfortunate!


  • #3360
    road_high
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,474 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    A Shropshire Lad wrote: »
    To be honest I dont see any particular party currently in Irish politics that would be prepared to reform the public sector. Even suggesting it seems to be off the cards for most of them.

    It actually surprises me a bit as I assume there are many many people out there who are sick and tired of the waste in the PS and why their tax is being shoved into black holes year on year. Surely politicians hear this stuff at the doorstep at election time

    They don’t really- those working and paying the taxes don’t have the time or energy. Those that don’t complain and shout the loudest.
    Too many people anyhow in Ireland depending on the state for a living to change- be it welfare, public service workers or various combinations of the above.


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  • #3361
    Varta
    Closed Accounts Posts: 517 ✭✭✭Varta


    David73 wrote: »
    The problem with nurses is one of a psychological issue.

    My sister is a nurse and the amount of ****e she thinks she knows but actually doesn't is chronic, she tells me stuff that I later reliably research and find she's incorrect.

    Because the majority of nurses are female, they are infested daily by of cesspit of bitchiness. Coupled with the fact they work with Doctors, they suffer major inferiority issues.

    This then manifests into them thinking they are the greatest and so undervalued. Wha! Wha! Wha!

    For your sake, I hope the psychiatric nurses don't go on strike.


  • #3362
    Miike
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,021 ✭✭✭Miike


    From...
    David73 wrote: »
    Paramedic should get paid more than nurses, they work way more harder in tougher conditions!

    To...
    David73 wrote: »
    This thread has turned into a sh!t throwing exercise, it's quite unfortunate!

    Ha.


  • #3363
    road_high
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,474 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    feckthisgenie wrote: »
    That's the government fault not the nurses. The government are a joke in this country.

    And a sf PBP would be a utopian government? They’re useful for screeching at a protest, as useful as a chocolate teapot at actually governing. Which is why they never do it!


  • #3364
    feckthisgenie
    Registered Users Posts: 181 ✭✭feckthisgenie


    road_high wrote: »
    And a sf PBP would be a utopian government? They’re useful for screeching at a protest, as useful as a chocolate teapot at actually governing. Which is why they never do it!

    Who mentioned SF? They be worst for anybody working. All wages be cut to give to the dole


  • #3365
    Old diesel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,821 ✭✭✭Old diesel


    Listening to a podcast of one of the radio shows - a listener was talking about his wife's nursing work.

    1) she's supposed to be on a 7 to 4 shift Mon to Fri (she's a clinical nurse manager in a HDU).

    2) she has to do 3 to 4 hours overtime EVERY day but doesn't get paid for them. She can't get time in lieu due to the same short staffing that causes her to have to do 3 to 4 hours overtime everyday.

    3) her overtime is fequently doing direct patient care due to short staffing.

    4) that's 15 to 20 hours a week FREE work she is doing.

    On the same show another listener noted that their nurse friend comes in at 7.30 am for the 8 am shift and normally ends up doing an extra hour at the end of the 12 hour shift. Not paid for the extra hours.


  • #3366
    alloywheel
    Closed Accounts Posts: 245 ✭✭alloywheel


    And if you believe that you'll believe anything.

    They do not tell you about the nurses on over 100,000 per year inc overtime, allowances etc.


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  • #3367
    road_high
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,474 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    feckthisgenie wrote: »
    Who mentioned SF? They be worst for anybody working. All wages be cut to give to the dole

    Well they’re the main alternative party outside of FF or FG? Without them there’s no (so called) alternatives.
    I agree with the second part, they’ll bankrupt us. Voters know that too


  • #3368
    Old diesel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,821 ✭✭✭Old diesel


    alloywheel wrote: »
    And if you believe that you'll believe anything.

    They do not tell you about the nurses on over 100,000 per year inc overtime, allowances etc.

    It's no more unbelievable then some of the anti nurse crap on this thread.


  • #3369
    iamwhoiam
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,153 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    alloywheel wrote: »
    And if you believe that you'll believe anything.

    Were you on that ward ? I have seen nurses stay hours over their shift to try get patients sorted . I have done it myself numerous times , shifts ending at 8 and still there at 9:30 . We did I admit sign in extra hours and if you were lucky you got time off . More often than not you didn't


  • #3370
    feckthisgenie
    Registered Users Posts: 181 ✭✭feckthisgenie


    alloywheel wrote: »
    And if you believe that you'll believe anything.

    They do not tell you about the nurses on over 100,000 per year inc overtime, allowances etc.

    A director of nursing wouldnt even be near that. You havent a clue what your talking about with regard their pay, conditions and pay for unsociable hours. Most of that pay for unsociable hours goes on tax


  • #3371
    road_high
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,474 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    Old diesel wrote: »
    It's no more unbelievable then some of the anti nurse crap on this thread.

    Which means you don’t find it credible either!


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  • #3372
    jlm29
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭jlm29


    feckthisgenie wrote: »
    Yes we're talking basic pay. Of course nurses are going to get extra for unsociable hours for nights , wkds etc which will increase their monthly pay. They want pay parity as physio, OT etc which is 52-53k basic pay.
    Physiotherapists get paid extra for wkd work, every person in whatever discipline get extra for unsociable hours.
    So I think a nurse is entitled to the same basic pay as a "basic grade" OT or physiotherapist

    To put this into perspective, physiotherapists do get paid extra for weekend work, but in most hospitals in Ireland, they have to work 12 days in a row if it’s their turn to do a weekend. The weekends might not be full 7.5 hour days (but they often are) but it’s still 12 days with none off.


  • #3373
    A Shropshire Lad
    Registered Users Posts: 196 ✭✭A Shropshire Lad


    road_high wrote: »
    Well they’re the main alternative party outside of FF or FG? Without them there’s no (so called) alternatives.
    I agree with the second part, they’ll bankrupt us. Voters know that too




    Its slim pickins on the political front. FF and FG , I dont acutally know what the difference is between them on major policy, if any. SF are on the left, as are most of the alternatives. Not much out there for the tax payer to put their faith in !


  • #3374
    David73
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 162 ✭✭David73


    Varta wrote: »
    You are the most abusive, misogynistic and ignorant poster in this thread.

    Will you shut up and stop reverting to abuse when you know you can't report an argument!


  • #3375
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 17,728 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    feckthisgenie wrote: »
    .... Most of that pay for unsociable hours goes on tax

    Most of everyone's pay over 35.4k goes on tax .....unless there's a higher rate of income tax etc for nurses....I don't see your point


  • #3376
    jlm29
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭jlm29


    feckthisgenie wrote: »
    Are you talking about a CNM 3 earns high 50k?? Because a staff nurse with 15-19 years gets 46k
    A senior physio earns 62k at top scale.
    The salaries you mention for OT/Physio at 53k is for a staff grade/ basic grade
    I work in the HSE and not as a nurse by the way. I know what I'm talking about as my wage slip tells me

    And also, there are almost no senior posts for ahps at the moment, there hasn’t been in years. I know a lot of therapists in all disciplines who have maxed out the staff grade salary, and have very little hope of progressing until there’s a wave of retirements in a couple of decades.

    This doesn’t seem to be the case for nurses, but I’m sure it varies geographically


  • #3377
    alloywheel
    Closed Accounts Posts: 245 ✭✭alloywheel


    feckthisgenie wrote: »
    A director of nursing wouldnt even be near that.
    (€100,000)

    Its only a few years since the headline in the Examiner was:
    Four staff nurses earned over €140,000 last year

    https://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/four-staff-nurses-earned-over-140000-last-year-229997.html


  • #3378
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 17,728 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    feckthisgenie wrote: »
    A director of nursing wouldnt even be near that. You havent a clue what your talking about with regard their pay, conditions and pay for unsociable hours. Most of that pay for unsociable hours goes on tax

    Won't most of the (wanted) payrise go on tax too....sure what good is it so :pac:


  • #3379
    feckthisgenie
    Registered Users Posts: 181 ✭✭feckthisgenie


    jlm29 wrote: »
    To put this into perspective, physiotherapists do get paid extra for weekend work, but in most hospitals in Ireland, they have to work 12 days in a row if it’s their turn to do a weekend. The weekends might not be full 7.5 hour days (but they often are) but it’s still 12 days with none off.

    Yes but any physio I know usually takes a Monday or/and Tuesday off, every few will choose to work 12 days straight and obviously get added A/L (and rightly so)


  • #3380
    road_high
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,474 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    Augeo wrote: »
    Most of everyone's pay over 35.4k goes on tax .....unless there's a higher rate of income tax etc for nurses....I don't see your point

    We all pay a fortune over €32k or whatever it is now- do nurses think this only applies to them?


  • #3381
    feckthisgenie
    Registered Users Posts: 181 ✭✭feckthisgenie


    Augeo wrote: »
    Most of everyone's pay over 35.4k goes on tax .....unless there's a higher rate of income tax etc for nurses....I don't see your point

    If you bother your arse looking at what i was replying to you might.
    The poster said nurses can earn 100k with their pay including allowances.
    I called bullsh1t and stated unsociable hours are mostly taxed which you agreed with


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  • #3382
    jlm29
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭jlm29


    feckthisgenie wrote: »
    Yes but any physio I know usually takes a Monday or/and Tuesday off, every few will choose to work 12 days straight and obviously get added A/L (and rightly so)

    There’s never been any added A/L for physios in any hospital I’ve worked in. It’s 12 days in a row. Some places, but not all, might offer a few hours back after a full weekend, but never a full day, unless one chooses to take annual leave.
    But it’s very much local policy I’m sure


  • #3383
    road_high
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,474 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    feckthisgenie wrote: »
    If you bother your arse looking at what i was replying to you might.
    The poster said nurses can earn 100k with their pay including allowances.
    I called bullsh1t and stated unsociable hours are mostly taxed which you agreed with

    No need for the borderline abusive replies- I know nurses and their cheerleaders are getting increasing edgy. The point being we all pay massive taxes not just nurses


  • #3384
    Varta
    Closed Accounts Posts: 517 ✭✭✭Varta


    David73 wrote: »
    Will you shut up and stop reverting to abuse when you know you can't report an argument!

    There you go again. You really could benefit from talking to someone who can help.


  • #3385
    David73
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 162 ✭✭David73


    road_high wrote: »
    No need for the borderline abusive replies- I know nurses and their cheerleaders are getting increasing edgy. The point being we all pay massive taxes not just nurses

    feckthisgenie has been abusive all night. He should be banned. He's abused me too and I've reported it.


  • #3386
    David73
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 162 ✭✭David73


    alloywheel wrote: »
    (€100,000)

    Its only a few years since the headline in the Examiner was:
    Four staff nurses earned over €140,000 last year

    That's absolutely scandalous!

    Pure gravy train stuff! Rip off value! It's a pay cut they did!


  • #3387
    feckthisgenie
    Registered Users Posts: 181 ✭✭feckthisgenie


    road_high wrote: »
    No need for the borderline abusive replies- I know nurses and their cheerleaders are getting increasing edgy. The point being we all pay massive taxes not just nurses

    Anybody that works knows that. You and that other poster took my post out of context to suit yourselves.


  • #3388
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,548 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    Yeah loads of the additional pay would Come straight back to the government in tax. So any pay rise actually costs much less than it appears.


  • #3389
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 17,728 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    feckthisgenie wrote: »
    If you bother your arse looking at what i was replying to you might.
    The poster said nurses can earn 100k with their pay including allowances.
    I called bullsh1t and stated unsociable hours are mostly taxed which you agreed with

    Gross pay figures are pretax so I still have no idea what your point is....I don't think you do either :)


  • #3390
    David73
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 162 ✭✭David73


    Augeo wrote: »
    Gross pay figures are pretax so I still have no idea what your point is....I don't think you do either :)

    Ban him, he's also been abusive all night


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  • #3391
    road_high
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,474 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    feckthisgenie wrote: »
    Anybody that works knows that.

    So why continually repeat as if it’s something unique to nurses salaries? Just reinforces the view that nurses are out of touch


  • #3392
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    alloywheel wrote: »
    (€100,000)

    Its only a few years since the headline in the Examiner was:
    Four staff nurses earned over €140,000 last year

    https://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/four-staff-nurses-earned-over-140000-last-year-229997.html

    Ah would ya stop. 4 out of how many thousand.

    And they're probably working 24/7 in something very specialised or management.


  • #3393
    alloywheel
    Closed Accounts Posts: 245 ✭✭alloywheel


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    Yeah loads of the additional pay would Come straight back to the government in tax.

    We all have to pay tax. I have zero sympathy for the 4 Four staff nurses who earned over €140,000 having to pay a lot of that in tax.

    https://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/four-staff-nurses-earned-over-140000-last-year-229997.html


  • #3394
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,548 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    alloywheel wrote: »
    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    Yeah loads of the additional pay would Come straight back to the government in tax.

    We all have to pay tax. I have zero sympathy for the 4 Four staff nurses who earned over €140,000 having to pay a lot of that in tax.

    https://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/four-staff-nurses-earned-over-140000-last-year-229997.html

    OK. I didn't ask anything about your sympathy or 4 nurses earning big money.

    The pay rise nurses would get would actually cost considerably less than the headline figure because the government would get lots of it straight back in tax.


  • #3395
    alloywheel
    Closed Accounts Posts: 245 ✭✭alloywheel


    Topgear on Dave wrote: »
    Ah would ya stop. 4 out of how many thousand.

    And they're probably working 24/7 in something very specialised or management.

    Nobody works 24/7. And just as I have no sympathy for the staff nurses on €140,000, I have no sympathy for those on 60k, 80k, 100k, 120k either.
    It is a secure job well pensioned, and not rocket science.


  • #3396
    Miike
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,021 ✭✭✭Miike


    Topgear on Dave wrote: »
    Ah would ya stop. 4 out of how many thousand.

    And they're probably working 24/7 in something very specialised or management.

    IIRC - There was some squandering of money going on actually and they ended up repaying a fairly hefty sum :pac:


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  • #3397
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 17,728 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    ....

    The pay rise nurses would get would actually cost considerably less than the headline figure because the government would get lots of it straight back in tax.

    That's no secret.
    However there's s deal in place until 2020 for wages :)


  • #3398
    alloywheel
    Closed Accounts Posts: 245 ✭✭alloywheel


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    The pay rise nurses would get would actually cost considerably less than the headline figure because the government would get lots of it straight back in tax.

    If that is your logic why not give every single worker in the country a handout - shure the government will get lots of it back in tax?

    The average industrial wage is a lot less that average nurses income.


  • #3399
    David73
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 162 ✭✭David73


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    OK. I didn't ask anything about your sympathy or 4nursea earning big money.

    The pay rise nurses would get would actually cost considerably less than the headline figure because the government would get lots of it straight back in tax.

    Errrr......not how it works!

    The Health department will have far greater spend while the Revenue will have a greater income. This increased income won't go directly back to the Health department, probably will be used to fund a new statue of Charlie Haughey in In mhic alan for 1.5 million


  • #3400
    A Shropshire Lad
    Registered Users Posts: 196 ✭✭A Shropshire Lad


    What should be done is to make it an offense for a person employed by the state to go on strike. Basically they have secure jobs and guaranteed pensions, the trade off is that they cant strike. They sign up to that agreement when they join or they dont join the public sector.

    I am sure there are major flaws in my idea but I havent heard any better ones !


  • #3401
    David73
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 162 ✭✭David73


    A Shropshire Lad wrote: »
    What should be done is to make it an offense for a person employed by the state to go on strike. Basically they have secure jobs and guaranteed pensions, the trade off is that they cant strike. They sign up to that agreement when they join or they dont join the public sector.

    I am sure there are major flaws in my idea but I havent heard any better ones !

    Then they'll go out on strike for not being able to strike!


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