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250,000 Ton UK Export Market Gone

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Comments

  • #52
    Jim2007
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 10,436 Mod ✭✭✭✭Jim2007


    Bog Trotter99 wrote: »
    My point Listermint is that if someone wants to do something then they will do it. Rules only apply if you want to abide by them. It is not compulsory to 'have' to trade with someone or 'accept' what they offer.

    Look you clearly have no interest in dealing with reality beyond the tabloids, if you’d even do a little research you realize how off your statements are.

    Off course the rules are important and the sanctions that can be applied can have significant impacts on an economy. The only reason the UK never walked away from negotiations is because they couldn’t afford to take the consequences, the only reason Boris accepted the NI protocol is because he had little choice.

    Since all you do is parrot the UK press, there is little point in a discussion.


  • #53
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    I think the OP needs to get some rest, been shouting this topic non stop for the last 24hrs including posts at 1am, 3am and 5am. Bizzare stuff for someone who claims not to be a farmer and neither care.


  • #54
    Bog Trotter99
    Closed Accounts Posts: 259 ✭✭Bog Trotter99


    Mayo_fan wrote: »
    I think the OP needs to get some rest, been shouting this topic non stop for the last 24hrs including posts at 1am, 3am and 5am. Bizzare stuff for someone who claims not to be a farmer and neither care.
    Again others alter what I say to suit. But you are correct on care. Work away.


  • #55
    Bog Trotter99
    Closed Accounts Posts: 259 ✭✭Bog Trotter99


    Jim2007 wrote: »

    Off course the rules are important and the sanctions that can be applied can have significant impacts on an economy. The only reason the UK never walked away from negotiations is because they couldn’t afford to take the consequences, the only reason Boris accepted the NI protocol is because he had little choice.

    :confused::confused::confused: Where we off to now?


  • #56
    knipex
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,018 ✭✭✭knipex


    You seem to be misunderstanding how trade agreements work.

    The deal with OZ does not guarantee them a price, or that someone will even buy their beef.

    It allows then to export an agreed quantity of a product at an agreed tariff to compete in that market.

    That's it.. That is all.

    Once it's here it's up to them to sell it for whatever price they can get..


  • #57
    Bass Reeves
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,974 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    knipex wrote: »
    The deal with OZ does not guarantee them a price, or that someone will even buy their beef.

    It allows then to export an agreed quantity of a product at an agreed tariff to compete in that market.

    That's it.. That is all.
    ..

    That it in a nutshell. The agreement is it allows Australia to export that much beef into the UK. It will not mean that it can and will be imported. Australia has expensive beef when I was over there it was more expensive than Irish Beef yet the export price indicated it was much lower.

    A lot of beef in Australia is sold by a quality grade. It fairly similar to the US. Because a lot of beef is feedlot finished the feedlots can struggle to finish all cattle out of feedlots. A lot of beef especially cows are often culled during drought and the quality can vary.

    It was explained to me by an Australian farmer. If you cull cows at what would be our FS1&2 at 250 kg carcasses this beef could be bought for 1-2 euro/ kg (2-3 Aussie dollars) these would be Q5 cows however at the same time quality finished cows fs4 weighting 400 kgs DW could be making 4 euro/ kg these would be Q1 or Q2 cows

    All the poorer quality stuff gets exported this drags down there export price. At present in Australia we are seeing the effect of 2-3 years drought and last summer's wildfires. Quality beef which the UK market requires is by no means cheap.

    Slava Ukrainii



  • #58
    The J Stands for Jay
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,807 ✭✭✭The J Stands for Jay


    The two sources linked are from a newspaper policitcallynl aligned to UKIP, and another who's editors have personal links to the Tory party. No possible bias there.


  • #59
    Too_Old_Boots
    Registered Users Posts: 32 ✭Too_Old_Boots


    knipex wrote: »
    You seem to be misunderstanding how trade agreements work.

    The deal with OZ does not guarantee them a price, or that someone will even buy their beef.

    It allows then to export an agreed quantity of a product at an agreed tariff to compete in that market.

    That's it.. That is all.

    Once it's here it's up to them to sell it for whatever price they can get..

    No that's not it in the Nutshell
    The problem is (For both Irish and UK farmers) the standards set are much higher here. The paper work, the rules etc.
    Standards in Aussi-land are a joke compared with EU/UK. Little to no traceability, little to no regulation and policing of Veterinary medicines administered to the animals.
    Hormones OK
    No age limits
    Sub standard animal welfare standards

    So basically Johnsons Brexit crew have thrown farmers under the bus


  • #60
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Too_Old_Boots wrote: »
    No that's not it in the Nutshell
    The problem is (For both Irish and UK farmers) the standards set are much higher here. The paper work, the rules etc.
    Standards in Aussi-land are a joke compared with EU/UK. Little to no traceability, little to no regulation and policing of Veterinary medicines administered to the animals.
    Hormones OK
    No age limits
    Sub standard animal welfare standards

    So basically Johnsons Brexit crew have thrown farmers under the bus

    Could end up that quality UK beef gets cheaper as a result of pressure from cheap aussie imports and is bought by fast food outlets etc here.

    You regularly hear stories of cheap meat already making its way from south america to ireland.

    I think teagasc should be coming up with alternatives to beef and dairy for smaller operators that want to stay farming.


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  • #61
    knipex
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,018 ✭✭✭knipex


    Too_Old_Boots wrote:
    No that's not it in the Nutshell

    It kind of is..
    Too_Old_Boots wrote:

    The problem is (For both Irish and UK farmers) the standards set are much higher here. The paper work, the rules etc. Standards in Aussi-land are a joke compared with EU/UK. Little to no traceability, little to no regulation and policing of Veterinary medicines administered to the animals. Hormones OK No age limits Sub standard animal welfare standards

    Why are you surprised ??

    This isnt news.Its been coming since the brexit vote. The UK didn't align with EU food standards specifically to allow trade deals like this. It wasnt a secret..


  • #62
    blackvalley
    Registered Users Posts: 707 ✭✭✭blackvalley


    We certainly live in bizarre times . There are regular warnings that the Irish cattle heard numbers may need to be reduced due to methane emissions and effect on global climate change.
    Meanwhile our next door neighbours appear to deem it economically viable and environmentally ethical to import large amounts of beef from the other side of the planet . Truly Orwellian.


  • #63
    Danzy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,177 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    blackvalley wrote: »
    We certainly live in bizarre times . There are regular warnings that the Irish cattle heard numbers may need to be reduced due to methane emissions and effect on global climate change.
    Meanwhile our next door neighbours appear to deem it economically viable and environmentally ethical to import large amounts of beef from the other side of the planet . Truly Orwellian.

    The EU approach was to get it from Brazil. Still is, though national Governments seem to be close to shooting it down.

    There is much in trade, economics etc that the EU Commission would be too extreme even for the Tories.

    Leaving the Brexit debate aside.


  • #64
    einn32
    Registered Users Posts: 1,016 ✭✭✭einn32


    Too_Old_Boots wrote: »
    No that's not it in the Nutshell
    The problem is (For both Irish and UK farmers) the standards set are much higher here. The paper work, the rules etc.
    Standards in Aussi-land are a joke compared with EU/UK. Little to no traceability, little to no regulation and policing of Veterinary medicines administered to the animals.
    Hormones OK
    No age limits
    Sub standard animal welfare standards

    So basically Johnsons Brexit crew have thrown farmers under the bus

    There is traceability and policing of medicines. Frankly you're accusing Australian farmers of cruelty with the last comment on welfare standards? The only way you make money out here in farming is to work hard and have top produce and at that you only have a fighting chance. I assume you don't represent the majority view on Australian farming. Most Australian farmers are passionate about their animals and do their best for them.


  • #65
    Bog Trotter99
    Closed Accounts Posts: 259 ✭✭Bog Trotter99


    And not only!

    Wait until you tell some of them what you read in the papers and then see what happens. :eek:


  • #66
    Bog Trotter99
    Closed Accounts Posts: 259 ✭✭Bog Trotter99


    Danzy wrote: »
    The EU approach was to get it from Brazil. Still is, though national Governments seem to be close to shooting it down.

    There is much in trade, economics etc that the EU Commission would be too extreme even for the Tories.

    Leaving the Brexit debate aside.

    Why the Tories?

    Regards your steak travelling around the world, it has nothing to do with political parties. It is the publics reluctance to pay anymore and as little as possible for their grub.

    Some cannot afford to pay much money for their food. But others just will not.

    There is lots of hot air about buying locally and ethically etc, but the first chance they get they run as fast as possible into the cheapest supermarket to buy the cheapest.

    So before people start pointing fingers, just remember who actually drives the desire or cheap food and the destruction of the planet.

    If the people were as good as they say, then I doubt a foreign bit of meat would ever enter any country. But in reality they talk boll..........


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  • #67
    Too_Old_Boots
    Registered Users Posts: 32 ✭Too_Old_Boots


    einn32 wrote: »
    There is traceability and policing of medicines. Frankly you're accusing Australian farmers of cruelty with the last comment on welfare standards? The only way you make money out here in farming is to work hard and have top produce and at that you only have a fighting chance. I assume you don't represent the majority view on Australian farming. Most Australian farmers are passionate about their animals and do their best for them.

    Growth promoters are used so commonly they cannot give exact usage detail only estimates
    prophylactic dosing of antibiotics is common place on the feedlots.
    Animal cruelty laws are legally bypassed by so called "codes of conduct" ie its make money at whatever cost so there is no anesthetics used for dehorning.
    The use of hot iron branding of livestock is still common.
    Male dairy bulls treated like dirt then killed within a week.
    Animal minimum spacing doesn't exist.

    All glossed over by the "Codes of conduct rules"


  • #68
    Snickers Man
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,301 ✭✭✭Snickers Man


    Too_Old_Boots wrote: »
    Standards in Aussi-land are a joke compared with EU/UK. Little to no traceability, little to no regulation and policing of Veterinary medicines administered to the animals.
    Hormones OK
    No age limits
    Sub standard animal welfare standards

    So basically Johnsons Brexit crew have thrown farmers under the bus

    The Daily Telegraph seems to agree with you, but they say it very quietly!

    I've posted about this elsewhere, but the day after the agreement was signed they carried a full page report with the following pessimistic caveat, among others:
    "It is a win that must have outstripped Australian negotiators' hopes and expectations. It is hard to shake the feeling that Britain may have given away too much too cheaply. ......it will be unforgivable if that mistake forms the blueprint for all the trade deals to follow. The Government will have to toughen up, wise up, and..be prepared to walk away from a bad deal if it wants to make a success of Brexit."

    Of course, you wouldn't infer that from reading the triumphalist headlines!

    One cannot completely rule out the possibility that Johnson and his ilk have been willing to cut off their farmers' faces to spite the noses, or at least the beef exporters, of the EU. He and his cronies really could be that petty.

    Whether they will get away with it is another matter.


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