Cocaine

Winning_Stroke · 17-01-2020 1:53pm

whisky_galore wrote: »

If there was only the same social disapproval for coke as there is with drink driving.

Maybe as well legalise it and make it safer for everyone via a reduced speed limit for drink drivers, only on certain routes etc. And make them pay extra for the ability to do so.

Hmm, tax and legalise... Maybe the Healey-Raes are closer to the average boardsie than we all think?

1o059k7ewrqj3n · 17-01-2020 2:10pm

cian68 wrote: »

Would that be the case if it were legal?

If it were legally produced by fair trade environmentally friendly monks in Switzerland the drug itself would have the same effect: a jumped-up drug for jumped-up people.

Adyx · 17-01-2020 2:24pm

Harry Palmr wrote: »

This is a classic bull**** false equivalence. No one is defending Chinese (or wherever) sweatshops, are you defending coked up psychopaths and their malicious effects on Ireland?

You mean coked up psychopaths like your daughters primary school teacher or the guy that tiled your bathroom or your dentist.

Because they are the coke users in this country.

ollkiller · 17-01-2020 2:25pm

I put some diesel in my car today. Is it my fault that there is oil spills by big petroleum companies. I bought a pair of Nikes and and Apple IPhone. Am I now complicit in endorsing child labour. I could go on and on.

We will now get the "it's a watershed moment" bollocks from all quarters and enough is enough and this current trench of sadistic gangs will get caught and jailed. And what will happen to the drug trade. Not a thing.

Nothing will change until it is legalized. You want more murders. Keep it illegal. You want more kids groomed into the lifestyle. Keep it illegal. You're sound with addicts being forced into heinous acts to pay off drug debts. Keep it illegal. You're ok with witness intimidation, scare tactics, harrasing families firndrug debts. Keep it illegal.

We will still be here in 20 years ever more aghast at the acts carried out by these people who are protecting their business until politicians have the actual guts to take the money away from them. By legalizing the feckin lot of it (don't touch it myself, horrible drug).

Porklife · 17-01-2020 2:31pm

circadian wrote: »

The War on Drugs and prohibition are failed policies and a complete disaster. The Government should have realised this in the 80's when there was a heroin epidemic. Then we had the market flooded with synthetic analogues which were arguablely much more dangerous.

I'm all for legalisation of marijuana and decriminalisation of all other drugs. I do believe, however, anyone caught with large supplies with intent to sell or bypassing any marijuana licencing laws should be handed a heavy sentence.

The school curriculum should be honest and Frank about drugs. Not this drugs are bad approach. More along the lines of how the drugs actually effect you, responsible usage if you do decide to do drugs and the risks involved.

Nightclubs/festivals should be allowed to have drug testing on site.

While I think users contribute to the criminal factor ultimately it falls on successive governments failure to tackle the issue in a mature and responsible way. There will always be a demand, let's at least make it safer for the average joe. After all, addiction is an illness and that also needs to be dealt with in a much better manner than it currently is.

Well said and agree with you completely. In Amsterdam they test your drugs at the door of many clubs and advise you if you're taking too much. The war on drugs will continue to be a losing battle until/unless the approach changes.
I'm not a fan of cocaine personally. It changes people dramatically and it's so boring being around someone on coke much like it's no fun being around a drunk person. People under the influence always think they're acting five when the reality is most likely the opposite.
No harm doing it the odd time at a festival or something but people get addicted to coke really quickly and it turns them into an egotistical asshole.
I'll stick with my Guinness thank you very much!

Deebles McBeebles · 17-01-2020 2:37pm

Porklife wrote: »

No harm doing it the odd time at a festival or something but people get addicted to coke really quickly and it turns them into an egotistical asshole.
I'll stick with my Guinness thank you very much!

To be fair, P, I've seen alcohol turn more people into assholes than coke. They are both very similar drugs in that regard. If you're an asshole it will come out when under the influence of either, if you're not, you're no more likely to be an asshole.

Winning_Stroke · 17-01-2020 2:38pm

ollkiller wrote: »

I put some diesel in my car today. Is it my fault that there is oil spills by big petroleum companies. I bought a pair of Nikes and and Apple IPhone. Am I now complicit in endorsing child labour. I could go on and on.

You could, but the endless deflection won't work. On the inside, every coke head knows what the cycle they're helping. Cry and crow all you want, blame the government and call them every name under the Sun but if you're buying, you're endorsing the whole supply trail and the horrors and misery it entails. But sure, whatever it's the weekend right?

whisky_galore · 17-01-2020 2:44pm

Winning_Stroke wrote: »

You could, but the endless deflection won't work. On the inside, every coke head knows what the cycle they're helping. Cry and crow all you want, blame the government and call them every name under the Sun but if you're buying, you're endorsing the whole supply trail and the horrors and misery it entails. But sure, whatever it's the weekend right?

I'd rather these so called grown adults took some civic responsibility and realised that their selfish hedonism has consequences. Coke isn't going to be made legal in any shape or form, I'm not aware of any jurisdiction that has made it legal across the board.

wiggle16 · 17-01-2020 2:44pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Which is in itself a leading question, and one following a particular agenda. Guilt.

Collective guilt.

I'm not a cocaine user. Never have been and never will. And I find the notion of collective guilt to be disgusting. So, no, They're not responsible... no more than you're responsible for the priests molesting boys if you're a Christian. :rolleyes:

What utter waffle. That's not the same thing at all. It's not even sophistry, the analogy makes no sense whatsoever.

If you buy cocaine then you're financing the killings which take place in order to retain control of the trade of the cocaine you buy, whether that's in Ireland, in the countries the drug must transit or in the country of origin.

That's not hyperbole. By way of a much tamer analogy, people buy fair trade coffee/clothes/whatever cos they don't want to contribute to the exploitation that occurs in the usual manufacture of those items. People buy free range eggs for the same reasons.

You make choices as a consumer, whatever it is you're buying. If you buy coke, you're contributing to the suffering and violence inflicted to get it up your nose.

Rejection of collective guilt is BS.

Porklife · 17-01-2020 2:45pm

Deebles McBeebles wrote: »

To be fair, P, I've seen alcohol turn more people into assholes than coke. They are both very similar drugs in that regard. If you're an asshole it will come out when under the influence of either, if you're not, you're no more likely to be an asshole.

That's a good point and you're right. Certain drinks even turn typically lovely people into assholes. I've very rarely seen somebody drink a fair bit of whiskey and not become aggressive and messy.

Shanotheslayer · 17-01-2020 2:46pm

Winning_Stroke wrote: »

You could, but the endless deflection won't work. On the inside, every coke head knows what the cycle they're helping. Cry and crow all you want, blame the government and call them every name under the Sun but if you're buying, you're endorsing the whole supply trail and the horrors and misery it entails. But sure, whatever it's the weekend right?

I don't think people are disputing it, the point they're arguing is that there are plenty of other similar scenarios and people fully support them by buying their product as you say. So why is this one any different? I know, because you hear about the repercussions.

Winning_Stroke · 17-01-2020 2:46pm

whisky_galore wrote: »

I'd rather these so called grown adults took some civic responsibility and realised that their selfish hedonism has consequences. Coke isn't going to be made legal in any shape or form, I'm not aware of any jurisdiction that has made it legal.

Imagine if Ireland legalised it tomorrow. Imagine the absolute scum weekend tourists we'd attract *shudder*

Winning_Stroke · 17-01-2020 2:52pm

Shanotheslayer wrote: »

I don't think people are disputing it, the point they're arguing is that there are plenty of other similar scenarios and people fully support them by buying their product as you say..

Ah yeah, it's easier to absolve yourself if you rallying and cry about unrelated stuff and draw false comparisons.

If you guys want to compare it to something, let's settle on something solid.

Do you think people were right to boycott goods from South Africa under apartheid? Would ye have hummed and hawwed and said "Ah well sure, but wadabout the way Native Americans are treated... and nuclear waste... it's the government's fault."

Do you think someone who went out of their to actively buy products from that country were endorsing the system? Or were the Dunnes workers on strikes just a bunch of malcontents who should have just gone along with stuff, "cos the government"

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 17-01-2020 2:52pm

Anyone who thinks the stuff should be banned has blood on their hands. THIS is the result of exaggerating the dangers of something and then bannign it.

Shanotheslayer · 17-01-2020 2:56pm

Winning_Stroke wrote: »

Ah yeah, it's easier to absolve yourself if you rallying and cry about unrelated stuff and draw false comparisons.

If you guys want to compare it to something, let's settle on something solid.

Do you think people were right to boycott goods from South Africa under apartheid? Would ye have hummed and hawwed and said "Ah well sure, but wadabout the way Native Americans are treated... and nuclear waste... it's the government's fault."

Do you think someone who went out of their to actively buy products from that country were endorsing the system? Or were the Dunnes workers on strikes just a bunch of malcontents who should have just gone along with stuff, "cos the government"

Where are the false comparisons? By you logic you endorse child labor if you buy clothes that are made in chinese sweat shops etc.

The moral of the story is, people don't fcking care and that's ok.

I don't feel guilty for buying clothes that a 5 year old Asian may have made. I don't feel guilty for playing Blizzard games dispute all the ridiculous things going on there.

Why should I?

Winning_Stroke · 17-01-2020 2:59pm

Shanotheslayer wrote: »

Where are the false comparisons? By you logic you endorse child labor if you buy clothes that are made in chinese sweat shops etc.

The moral of the story is, people don't fcking care and that's ok.

I don't feel guilty for buying clothes that a 5 year old Asian may have made. I don't feel guilty for playing Blizzard games dispute all the ridiculous things going on there.

Why should I?

Hold on, please let's settle on the one comparison. The one mentioned in my post which you quoted. Apartheid South Africa.

What is it with people desperate to bring in the world?

whisky_galore · 17-01-2020 3:00pm

Shanotheslayer wrote: »

The moral of the story is, people don't fcking care and that's ok.

Then they shouldn't be shocked when there's dealing outside schools and their area slowly turning to shít.

pure.conya · 17-01-2020 3:07pm

the government created the criminal market by prohibiting drugs amd ignoring the facts that the war on drugs has been an abysmal failure, globally less than 1% of drugs are detected by police, that's some statistic

1o059k7ewrqj3n · 17-01-2020 3:09pm

People trying to deflect criticism of Cocaine use citing enjoyment or use of products by companies such as Apple and Nestle who have dodgy backgrounds are happily avoiding the fact that these companies can be investigated, charged, shamed into action, heavily fined and will want to avoid bad PR.

And when these companies try to avoid sanctions or criticism, people can say right well sod off.

People can choose not to buy an iPhone, not to use Apple products, not to buy Nestle products. It takes a certain amount of effort to be conscious of how far those companies reach extends into different areas, but it can be done.

Of course the argument will be trotted out that because Cocaine is illegal, it’s production is pushed underground and so is the sale and use of, and if only it were legal then it would be safe for everyone.

It would still be a manky drug. It would still be the drug of choice for the vapid, self-obsessed, greedy egomaniac who needs a buzz to feel good about themselves.

That’s not something I want promoted in society.

chrissb8 · 17-01-2020 4:42pm

More nonsense. No one questions where the oil came from to keep their electricity going, or what nation suffered a violent supported coup in order to keep the oil coming.

No one thinks of the phone they hold in their hands and the materials that are obtained from places where there are deplorable working conditions. Even worse, where they are made and what the workers go through.

You can apply a magnifying glass of ethics to alot of industries and see that their practices and what they do are horrible. Just drugs are the most easy to go after because drugs.

We facilitate alot of badness in the world by the way we live. We're all just hypocrites.

ollkiller · 17-01-2020 4:43pm

Winning_Stroke wrote: »

You could, but the endless deflection won't work. On the inside, every coke head knows what the cycle they're helping. Cry and crow all you want, blame the government and call them every name under the Sun but if you're buying, you're endorsing the whole supply trail and the horrors and misery it entails. But sure, whatever it's the weekend right?

If a person buys coke are they contributing. Yep. My point is will people ever stop buying cocaine. No. It will never happen. First law of economics supply will meet demand. And there will always be a demand. So the ONLY option left is who supplies it. The government. Or who is currently supplying it. Who would you prefer. Because they are the only 2 options.

chrissb8 · 17-01-2020 4:46pm

Steyr 556 wrote: »

People trying to deflect criticism of Cocaine use citing enjoyment or use of products by companies such as Apple and Nestle who have dodgy backgrounds are happily avoiding the fact that these companies can be investigated, charged, shamed into action, heavily fined and will want to avoid bad PR.

And when these companies try to avoid sanctions or criticism, people can say right well sod off.

People can choose not to buy an iPhone, not to use Apple products, not to buy Nestle products. It takes a certain amount of effort to be conscious of how far those companies reach extends into different areas, but it can be done.

Of course the argument will be trotted out that because Cocaine is illegal, it’s production is pushed underground and so is the sale and use of, and if only it were legal then it would be safe for everyone.

It would still be a manky drug. It would still be the drug of choice for the vapid, self-obsessed, greedy egomaniac who needs a buzz to feel good about themselves.

That’s not something I want promoted in society.

And buying a new phone every year that only has one small insignificant difference to the last one is not vapid and self obsessed?

Get over it, the argument of Apple etc. is a perfectly valid argument. Look at the tax they're not paying as a small example. You think there's not alot of people in Ireland who couldn't do with that financial help? Does that stop Apple from doing it? Will people stop buying the new tiny screen that attaches to their nipple or something? No it won't

They don't care if they're examined or whatever they will always go for the cheaper easier solution. That extends to production of materials in countries with less than stellar human right mandates.

dundalkfc10 · 17-01-2020 5:00pm

Just so I have this correct, everyone who buys Penney's clothes etc... are contributing to child slave labour.

dubstepper · 17-01-2020 5:04pm

wiggle16 wrote: »

If you buy cocaine then you're financing the killings which take place in order to retain control of the trade of the cocaine you buy, whether that's in Ireland, in the countries the drug must transit or in the country of origin.

No. The problem is that the drug is not legal. People want to do it and they will continue to do so. When they tried prohibition in the US there was gang warfare to control it. Did the people who wanted to drink have blood on their hands? Would you stop drinking if the government made it illegal? I would say the holier than thou lot would be on the poitin in no time flat.

JupiterKid · 17-01-2020 5:23pm

I've dabbled and partaken in quite a few drugs and illicit substances in my life (and ended up loving alcohol much too much) but cocaine is the one drug I steered well clear of.

Plenty of my friends and acquaintances were/are fond of a snort and it just never seemed to appeal.

Ireland is a country completely awash with the stuff and there have been plenty of casualties, both from users, dealers and those around them.

galwayllm · 17-01-2020 5:28pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

yes

I think you mean yes please ....

....yes yes a thousand times yes please

LuasSimon · 17-01-2020 5:30pm

Drugs are for mugs
Are you a mug ?

MichaelKnee · 17-01-2020 5:31pm

Anybody who does cocaine is sub-human slime.

galwayllm · 17-01-2020 5:32pm

LuasSimon wrote: »

Drugs are for mugs
Are you a mug ?

No, but I have a mug I could fill with drugs ...

Yes yes a thousand times yes please!

Ash.J.Williams · 17-01-2020 5:34pm

Blaming users is lazy

galwayllm · 17-01-2020 5:40pm

I'm really only messing, I don't partake myself, never have.

But if someone wants to do it I've no problem, people are big and bold enough to make their own decisions.

UrbanFret · 17-01-2020 5:42pm

How much would a casual user spend on a hit?

MrMusician18 · 17-01-2020 5:50pm

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

Blaming users is lazy

Who do we blame then? Their need for a high is partially at least causing this mess.

It's quite selfish actually.

akelly02 · 17-01-2020 5:58pm

UrbanFret wrote: »

How much would a casual user spend on a hit?

€80 per gram approx...will will probably be mixed 1 to 1 if you are lucky

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 17-01-2020 6:14pm

MrMusician18 wrote: »

Who do we blame then? Their need for a high is partially at least causing this mess.

It's quite selfish actually.

There's no "need" as it's actually as addictive as a lot of other drugs on the market (not all of them illegal).

vriesmays · 17-01-2020 6:30pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlDLslFwewU

Shanotheslayer · 17-01-2020 6:42pm

MrMusician18 wrote: »

Who do we blame then?

Maybe the lads chopping people up is a start.

1o059k7ewrqj3n · 17-01-2020 6:45pm

vriesmays wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlDLslFwewU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OR664gHwHF8

AllForIt · 17-01-2020 7:16pm

I blame the drug dealers 100%. Or drug pushers as they were known at the height of Dublin Heroin's epidemic in the 80's.

I find it disturbing that lefty style opinions are seeping into general societies psyche. i.e the disadvantaged are forced into criminality such as drug dealing and they are in fact victims of privileged capitalists.

tdf7187 · 17-01-2020 9:12pm

Fwiw:

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/cocaine-is-almost-synonymous-with-grotesque-violence-says-er-specialist-976081.html

tuxy · 17-01-2020 9:21pm

tdf7187 wrote: »

Fwiw:

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/cocaine-is-almost-synonymous-with-grotesque-violence-says-er-specialist-976081.html

We could have it replaced with methamphetamine, it's much cheaper so there is less need for people to waste money.

17-01-2020 9:35pm

whisky_galore wrote: »

Then they shouldn't be shocked when there's dealing outside schools and their area slowly turning to shít.

I don't think people are shocked by such changes anymore. It's been gradually going that way for decades... but then, I guess there's a general apathy about the changes because the hard-line stance hasn't worked. The banning of drugs hasn't removed them, and if anything, their presence has increased a hundredfold in the last twenty years. I can remember when Speed or E were considered the worst of the incoming drugs, with heroin being around but generally hidden away in derelict houses. Cocaine was the drug of the hyper rich. That's not the case anymore.

The problem is that people want a polite friendly police force but don't want to give the Gardai the freedom to deal with the criminals in the manner they need to. I remember what Athlone was like in the late 80s/90s with the drugs and violent crime... the Gardai finally descended in force, and had a field day with those involved... Hardly a fair and gentle approach, but it cleared out the worst offenders for two decades after...

People often consider harsher sentencing to be important, but don't want to appear too hard on the criminals while they're inside, or worse yet, fully acknowledge that incarceration on its own doesn't work. So, we get lots of half arsed measures which ultimately do nothing but defer the problems on to the next generation.

So, no... I don't think anyone with an ounce (no pun) of sense is shocked by how their neighborhood or Ireland has declined in the last few decades with regards to drugs or violent crime...

Cody montana · 17-01-2020 9:37pm

Awful drug overall.
Good at the time.
Best avoided.

puppieperson1 · 17-01-2020 9:45pm

Our lovely pals in leafy foxrock and the legal eagles of our country are so far removed from the reality of the drug trade they cant equate their ball and biscuit with the murder of that young man. They probably babble about it over their scallops but they dont equate the line in the loo with his drawn & quartering.

They are not so bright really when it comes down to it. They spend too much time with each other and dont live in any type of reality outside their Burberry bubble.

RIP that poor young man who obviously had a bad start in life so he had no chance he fell in with the wrong crowd and his result was gruesome. Ireland is now like the wild west gone are the days of a good old punch up, murder, machetes, guns, & knives when did we turn that corner and who is to blame?

17-01-2020 9:55pm

Cody montana wrote: »

Awful drug overall.
Good at the time.
Best avoided.

Tried it twice, and hated it both times. Headaches, nostril irritations, and other less enjoyable "side-effects". Never quite understood the appeal.

xckjoo · 17-01-2020 10:00pm

tdf7187 wrote: »

Fwiw:

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/cocaine-is-almost-synonymous-with-grotesque-violence-says-er-specialist-976081.html

I'm no fan of the drug but that's sensationalist trash. Do they actually insinuate that it's linked to human sacrifice? Considering the concentration of cocaine in its natural form is so many orders of magnitude lower than in the concentrated form you see it in today, it's a wonder there's anyone left alive in the country. People like this don't help the public make informed decisions on drug taking, irrespective of what their profession is.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 17-01-2020 11:14pm

tuxy wrote: »

We could have it replaced with methamphetamine, it's much cheaper so there is less need for people to waste money.

The Consultant in Emergency Medicine, who spent most of the last 40 years working in ERs in Ireland and the UK, said he has first-hand experience of the peculiar blood lust fuelled by cocaine.

Godb****e. I wonder how much first-hand experience he has in drug usage that doesn't result in "blood-lust"...? FFS, that's not even what the drug does to most people.

tdf7187 wrote: »

Fwiw:

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/cocaine-is-almost-synonymous-with-grotesque-violence-says-er-specialist-976081.html

Ecxtacy ftw. A fraction of the price, longer effects and generally calmer results.

Doctor Nick · 17-01-2020 11:32pm

Cocaine is a beautiful drug. Even more so in its free base form. But there is a reason it's known as "more" by users. One line is never enough, one pipe certainly is never enough.

When I was active on the pipe I'd easily spend €300 a night on it. You'd sell your own grandmother for one more pipe. I've been on both sides of the decriminalisation debate but currently have to think no, it would not be good.

I'm lucky to have come out the other side relatively unschated from my alcohol, cannabis, coke, crack, heroin, benzo, z drug addictions. Had I been able to get these freely in a chemist that may not have been the case. Trouble with addicts is what they have is never enough. The thrill is in getting more!

mumo3 · 17-01-2020 11:41pm

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.breakingnews.ie/ireland/traces-of-cocaine-found-in-toilets-near-dail-chamber-244930.html

Anyone remember this coming out!!

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 17-01-2020 11:47pm

mumo3 wrote: »

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.breakingnews.ie/ireland/traces-of-cocaine-found-in-toilets-near-dail-chamber-244930.html

Anyone remember this coming out!!

I'd be more surprised if there wasn't...!!

Cocaine

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