All things relating to Jordan Peterson

John Hutton · 09-12-2020 4:00pm

I read his 12 rules for life and watched a few videos. There is next to nothing controversial in 12 rules for life (I'll be honest I read it because it was so controversial and I was disappointed at the lack of controversial stuff). It is basic self help stuff as well as being quite educational and intellectual (if it is your first contact with this type of stuff, which is the intended audience). I can see how it would be very helpful to people, especially men, suffering with self esteem and other issues. If I could sum it up, it basically says that your are not a bad person, you need to cop on before moaning about the world around you, and you are obligated to cop on and here are 12 general ways you can do that.

Peterson has appeal because he is smart, articulate, a good teacher, is clearly empathetic (guy is easy to make cry as seen on many interviews) has charisma and is "Dad aged" with practical advice to improve your own lot and take responsibility. Of course this combination will appeal to a generation of men who are lacking positive male role models in their lives. Why do you think they all love when he calls them or says "bucko"?

There is a long video from the summer where he explains how he got hooked on the pills, basically he has always suffered with mental health issues, mainly anxiety, exacerbated by his wife being diagnosed with an apparently terminal illness. He was prescribed these pills and didn't think twice about it, they worked for a good few years but found that they began to adversely affect him so he tried to get off them, and suffered catastrophic withdrawal symptoms, mental and physical and seemed to have a mega breakdown at which stage his daughter sought out other treatments. He seems to be a lot better now. I wouldnt slag him off for getting addicted I think it could happen anyone. He admits that he was stupid, especially considering his qualifications.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts · 10-12-2020 2:21pm

John Hutton wrote: »

There is a long video from the summer where he explains how he got hooked on the pills, basically he has always suffered with mental health issues, mainly anxiety, exacerbated by his wife being diagnosed with an apparently terminal illness. He was prescribed these pills and didn't think twice about it, they worked for a good few years but found that they began to adversely affect him so he tried to get off them, and suffered catastrophic withdrawal symptoms, mental and physical and seemed to have a mega breakdown at which stage his daughter sought out other treatments. He seems to be a lot better now. I wouldnt slag him off for getting addicted I think it could happen anyone. He admits that he was stupid, especially considering his qualifications.

I guess I’m just wondering how he was given enough of them to get addicted. As anxiety medications, they’re supposed to be just stop gaps.

10-12-2020 2:25pm

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

I guess I’m just wondering how he was given enough of them to get addicted. As anxiety medications, they’re supposed to be just stop gaps.

Body chemistry. Perhaps his body tolerance wasn't properly taken into consideration? Not everyone has the same tolerance towards pills which have addictive properties... which can be seen by the massive growth of addiction in the US.

Still.. i wouldn't be too surprised if he did overuse his prescription. He was depressed, under a great amount of stress, and let's not forget the amount of hate and criticism that comes from the internet, which he would have been hooked into (since a lot of his popularity came from there). I'd hate to be an internet personality..

Danzy · 10-12-2020 2:39pm

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

I guess I’m just wondering how he was given enough of them to get addicted. As anxiety medications, they’re supposed to be just stop gaps.

With Benzos a few weeks is enough.

John Hutton · 10-12-2020 2:42pm

Danzy wrote: »

With Benzos a few weeks is enough.

Yeah he discusses that, says something like they should have been only given to him to get him through a weekend or something rather than as part of a long term treatment plan as you can get reliant and addicted very quick.

sbsquarepants · 10-12-2020 2:54pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Body chemistry. Perhaps his body tolerance wasn't properly taken into consideration? Not everyone has the same tolerance towards pills which have addictive properties... which can be seen by the massive growth of addiction in the US.

Still.. i wouldn't be too surprised if he did overuse his prescription. He was depressed, under a great amount of stress, and let's not forget the amount of hate and criticism that comes from the internet, which he would have been hooked into (since a lot of his popularity came from there). I'd hate to be an internet personality..

He strikes me as a fairly sensitive sort of person, i'd imagine the the stream of vitriol directed his way (very undeserved in my opinion) would have gotten to him. Maybe he did pop the odd extra one to get through a hard day, especially after his wifes diagnosis, maybe he was just unlucky, who knows.

However he came to find himself in the condition he did, i think the online gold rush to revel in his misery was tasteless in the extreme.

I for one am glad he's doing better now.

10-12-2020 6:35pm

I heard he was grinding them up and snorting them to try to control his hatred of "trans people"..

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts · 10-12-2020 6:42pm

Danzy wrote: »

With Benzos a few weeks is enough.

Oh, I know. I actually have a large Xanax prescription now because I have a life-limiting disease so there’s a “fuck it” attitude (also, I don’t find them addictive). But before that diagnosis, I was prescribed them a few times and it was literally two or three tablets. No more than that. Even now, I’m occasionally questioned on why I’ve been prescribed so many. In Ireland at least, they are strictly controlled. I can only think things are way more lax in Canada.

John Hutton · 24-01-2021 8:15pm

So his podcast is back up and running, first episode is good. Peterson not quite 100% yet but so much better than he was

10-02-2021 10:23am

If you want to know what went on with Peterson, watch this (Best summary I've seen):

https://youtu.be/byZ1dpD1BnA

ancapailldorcha · 10-02-2021 11:35am

Deleted User wrote: »

If you want to know what went on with Peterson, watch this (Best summary I've seen):

"The Cycle of Media LIES"

No thanks.

10-02-2021 11:40am

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

"The Cycle of Media LIES"

No thanks.

So, you didn't watch it. Why bother posting at all?

ancapailldorcha · 10-02-2021 11:43am

Deleted User wrote: »

So, you didn't watch it. Why bother posting at all?

I clicked it with the intention of watching it but that title implies that it's a well-poisoning exercise. Life's too short for that sort of carry on.

10-02-2021 11:45am

sigh

ancapailldorcha · 10-02-2021 11:46am

Well, if dumping videos is all you have to add then maybe it's best left there.

10-02-2021 11:48am

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Well, if dumping videos is all you have to add then maybe it's best left there.

I'd be perfectly fine with talking about what's contained within the video.. and I have posted to this thread many times previously (text, not videos), so I wouldn't consider it to be "dumping".

I felt it would have been of interest for those people who post to the thread.

mr.anonymous · 10-02-2021 6:57pm

Is his daughter much of an addition to his podcasts?

I tried to listen to someone I was interested in on her podcast but she seemed a bit... ditzy.

Screw Attack · 17-02-2021 5:47pm

“Dr Peterson, what’s your favourite colour?”

“Well that depends on what you mean by favourite. And it also depends on what you mean by colour. This is a very complex question...

One must acknowledge the underlying verisimilitude that is irrevocably nested within a multi-layered metaphysical substrate that many people fundamentally conflate with their ideological presuppositions with no uncertain irregularity, and not dissimilar to Jung's extrapolation of the archetypal and axiomatic juxtaposition of Raskolnikov's neo-Marxist existential nihilism.

With that said... I've written an 800 page book on the subject which unpacks the uninformative intimations with unmitigated precision, both biologically and metaphysically..."

Wibbs · 17-02-2021 5:55pm

there's more than a touch of that to him alright. A big part of his problem is that he is/was an academic dealing in an often long winded and complex subject matter where academics can also be slow to make definitive statements. He was thrust into "celebrity" and that requires dumbing everything down, or at least making it catchy. The Clean your room thing got him attention because of that simplicity. Problem is the same celeb stuff will bit people back unless they're extremely careful. If they're any way controversial they usually have to curate their own personal echo chamber to survive.

iptba · 18-02-2021 11:30pm

People who have read his book or some of his material may recall how he talks about male lobsters fighting for their place in a hierarchy. I was watching a nature documentary recently and they were talking about an animal like a big goat that lived in mountainous areas. With them, one male has lots of females at a time. Then there are lower-level males: they have fights and the narrator said that losing such a fight could mean never mating: even if they won, they weren't even at the stage of getting to mate.

And in lots of the documentaries, males of lots of different types of animals end up fighting to try to allow themselves mate.
Some can even die in the fights or after them and many get injured.

It does seem to come up quite a lot with different animals that a higher percentage of males than females don't get to mate.

Although humans can have differences to other animals, some of the same drives can apply. I could see the drive to try to ensure one gets to mate driving men to do, say, dangerous or otherwise unpleasant jobs.

18-02-2021 11:38pm

The lucky male drone bee that gets to mate with the queen, leaves his penis in the queen then dies. Or we could look at the bonobo where women are in charge. I think looking at parallels between nature and humans is largely a waste of time. Humans are far, far more diverse in their behaviors for any rule that applied to lobsters or any other animal to carry much weight.

iptba · 19-02-2021 12:18am

iptba wrote: »

People who have read his book or some of his material may recall how he talks about male lobsters fighting for their place in a hierarchy. I was watching a nature documentary recently and they were talking about an animal like a big goat that lived in mountainous areas. With them, one male has lots of females at a time. Then there are lower-level males: they have fights and the narrator said that losing such a fight could mean never mating: even if they won, they weren't even at the stage of getting to mate.

And in lots of the documentaries, males of lots of different types of animals end up fighting to try to allow themselves mate.
Some can even die in the fights or after them and many get injured.

It does seem to come up quite a lot with different animals that a higher percentage of males than females don't get to mate.

Although humans can have differences to other animals, some of the same drives can apply. I could see the drive to try to ensure one gets to mate driving men to do, say, dangerous or otherwise unpleasant jobs.

With human data, there is evidence that more men than women didn't go on to be a parent of one or more children
e.g.

For much of human history, a greater proportion of women in the population reproduced relative to men, they found. This means "that even though there may be equal numbers of males and females in a population, a larger proportion of the females than the males are reproducing," Stoneking said.

https://www.livescience.com/47976-more-mothers-in-human-history.html

ancapailldorcha · 19-02-2021 12:53pm

iptba wrote: »

People who have read his book or some of his material may recall how he talks about male lobsters fighting for their place in a hierarchy. I was watching a nature documentary recently and they were talking about an animal like a big goat that lived in mountainous areas. With them, one male has lots of females at a time. Then there are lower-level males: they have fights and the narrator said that losing such a fight could mean never mating: even if they won, they weren't even at the stage of getting to mate.

And in lots of the documentaries, males of lots of different types of animals end up fighting to try to allow themselves mate.
Some can even die in the fights or after them and many get injured.

It does seem to come up quite a lot with different animals that a higher percentage of males than females don't get to mate.

Although humans can have differences to other animals, some of the same drives can apply. I could see the drive to try to ensure one gets to mate driving men to do, say, dangerous or otherwise unpleasant jobs.

Sure but you've made this point fairly succinctly. If I recall correctly, 12 rules details four stages of convention relating to lobster on lobster dispute resolution and combat. This goes on over multiple pages when a few sentences would have sufficed. This is largely representative of the rest of the book.

iptba · 19-02-2021 1:48pm

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Sure but you've made this point fairly succinctly. If I recall correctly, 12 rules details four stages of convention relating to lobster on lobster dispute resolution and combat. This goes on over multiple pages when a few sentences would have sufficed. This is largely representative of the rest of the book.

OK. I have only read the first chapter or so but I put that down to getting out of the habit of reading books.

Wibbs · 19-02-2021 2:04pm

iptba wrote: »

With human data, there is evidence that more men than women didn't go on to be a parent of one or more children
e.g.

You see this in the genes alright. More female lines than male. Mate competition could be part of that, but other factors like more men dying young because of hunting, war etc are in play too. I seem to recall when we started to settle down and farm this genetic difference started to narrow quite appreciably. Even though more men would still die younger on average. Though on the other side of that women's own longevity was affected before modern medicine came along. EG in ancient Rome married women of means would make their first will when they discovered they were pregnant. I seem to recall too that this genetic gender bias was present to different degrees in different populations across the world and varied with time too. As partyjungle notes humans have extremely diverse mating strategies which vary with time, culture and geography. Pick a strategy and type of mate selection and set up and humans have done it. It's one of our "killer apps" survival wise, along with things like an extremely diverse diet.

19-02-2021 2:09pm

Wibbs wrote: »

You see this in the genes alright. More female lines than male. Mate competition could be part of that, but other factors like more men dying young because of hunting, war etc are in play too. I seem to recall when we started to settle down and farm this genetic difference started to narrow quite appreciably.

This can be explained by the "one man one woman" social construct that came along with that. If you worked the land and property you needed children of your own. You couldn't expect one of the hundreds of kids sired by the local chief to become a lowly serf.

04-03-2021 4:39pm

Peterson's new book is out now. Anyone reading it? I have it in my reading pile here, working through the "12 Rules" book again first. My impression remains the same; there is nothing controversial, nor anything especially original, but most people will find something useful to take away. It is interesting.

I am not a worshiping disciple of Peterson in any sense, but if there was one piece of Peterson's work I would recommend wholeheartedly it would be his "Big 5" personality test. He and his associates have done some good legitimate work on this with the research behind it and I found it very useful, particularly in a practical sense, especially when compared with the more popular Myers-Briggs type tests.

Wibbs · 04-03-2021 4:58pm

Well Myers-Briggs is so bogus as to be a joke, with pretty much zero evidence for it or its results. It's about as accurate as a newspaper horoscope. So any alternative that was more rooted in clinical practice and research is to be welcomed alright.

04-03-2021 5:24pm

Wibbs wrote: »

Well Myers-Briggs is so bogus as to be a joke, with pretty much zero evidence for it or its results. It's about as accurate as a newspaper horoscope. So any alternative that was more rooted in clinical practice and research is to be welcomed alright.

It's worth the 10 dollars or so Wibbs, even just as something to do during lockdown, if it goes no further than that. Mileage may vary of course, but I found the report pretty accurately highlighted negative aspects of my personality in particular, as well as the more positive and middling. It also gives you a percentile position for each aspect.

https://www.understandmyself.com/

You can read his 2007 paper to see the research that some of this is based upon, its called 'Between Facets and Domains: 10 Aspects of the Big Five'. First result here: https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=wL1F22UAAAAJ&hl=en

If you intend on doing the personality test, do not read the paper until after you completed the test.

mr.anonymous · 04-03-2021 7:44pm

My copy of Beyond Order: 12 More Rules for Life is arriving tomorrow

Harika · 04-03-2021 8:31pm

My general tipp for all those self help books, not Just JP, is to wait for a Ted talk or someone summarizing the book on YouTube. Saves you hours of your life as those books tend to be bloated to get the page numbers up.
Myers Briggs is how you see yourself, of course you idealise yourself. There are 360 reviews out there but those are 100 euro each and make only sense in a work environment with a department working together.

04-03-2021 8:45pm

Harika wrote: »

My general tipp for all those self help books, not Just JP, is to wait for a Ted talk or someone summarizing the book on YouTube. Saves you hours of your life as those books tend to be bloated to get the page numbers up. .

Most of what they're publishing is a rehash of what's already been published elsewhere.

The point is interpretation, and how they describe it. For example, I can't stand Tony Robbins.. the way he describes, and explores topics, just bores me to tears. I can't establish any kind of connection with him.. probably due to that very american style of his. Whereas I've quite enjoyed some of Eckhart Tolle talks.. some is meh, but overall very interesting, and I can appreciate his pov better.

Different authors provide a gateway for individuals to appreciate the information they already have in a dozen other similar books on their bookshelf. Few of them are original, like say, Malcolm Gladwell's, Blink.

While I enjoy some of Petersons ideas about social change, and feminism... I find his perspective on personal development to be decidedly unoriginal.. There's just nothing special about what he writes.

As for getting page numbers up, personal development books tend to be on the slim side. The word format is usually larger, and the books themselves slimmer than a novel, or any similar non-fiction literature.

05-03-2021 5:48pm

Peterson, with his interest in archetypes, would probably say "that's the point" when accused of lack of originality. I think he presents it well, and in an interesting way.

Invidious · 22-03-2021 11:44am

Has anyone read Dr Peterson's "Beyond Order"? Curious to know if it's worth buying.

iptba · 05-09-2021 1:33pm

How Women select Men (Natural Selection) - Jordan Peterson https://youtu.be/H3z8kIZmzk8 (5 minutes)

iptba · 01-12-2021 2:48pm

I see that "Jordan Peterson" is trending on Irish Twitter. I think it was prompted by this announcement of his talk in the 3 Arena next September.

https://twitter.com/aikenpromotions/status/1465968924026048515

Dufflecoat Fanny · 14-12-2021 11:12am

ya but the tickets on sale are crap atm. Blocks K M and L only for sale. 76 quid

Dufflecoat Fanny · 14-12-2021 11:13am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118318820#Comment_118318820

and A

31-01-2022 8:20am

Did anyone here watch Peterson's recent appearance on JRE? It went on for 4 hours. I didn't enjoy it very much because it focused on the more esoteric, Biblical side of Peterson's work, which I have always found absurd or, to be polite, not quite as profound and consequential as he makes it out to be.

I also thought he was a little too ingratiating and emotional, and man did he monologue (while ironically referring to the redemptive nature of his supposed dialogue with Joe).

Dufflecoat Fanny · 11-09-2022 9:40pm

Couldn't get parking anywhere near the gig. Dublin city is a complete joke. had to go home

iptba · 11-09-2022 10:24pm

I saw on social media today (he was trending on Twitter) he was photographed with Cristiano Ronaldo

12-09-2022 9:12am

Don't see anything written anywhere about his appearance in Dublin yet. Wonder was there anything interesting in it at all?

His recent appearance on Lex Friedman felt a little more listenable than his slightly less recent appearance on JRE. But again nothing really all that interesting or new or stand out about it.

iptba · 18-09-2022 3:34am

Katharine Birbalsingh @Miss_Snuffy

I tweeted photos of Jordan Peterson’s visit to Michaela*. Like this one.

They reported me to the police for hate crime.

Many pleas to Ofsted for an immediate inspection.

Cries of safeguarding concerns.

Demands for my removal as Head.

But they deny cancel culture exists.

https://twitter.com/Miss_Snuffy/status/1571056735150026761

*That's a school

Dufflecoat Fanny · 18-09-2022 3:16pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119606306#Comment_119606306

Only review I could find about the Dublin gig. It's Gript so beware.

https://gript.ie/jordan-peterson-received-a-resounding-cead-mile-failte-at-the-3-arena/

05-01-2023 3:15pm

He just did this video with Chloe Chole who's detransitioned. It's a tough watch but it's nice to see him back "in his lane" in more of a therapist capacity, it's where he is at his best IMO.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6O3MzPeomqs

On that same note, his daughter has posted that the Canadian Association of Psychologists are threatening to take away his license because of a few tweets. He's said he won't partake in the media retraining and review process they want him to do.

Harika · 12-03-2023 3:24pm

I love that the most important thinker of our generation reposts fetish porn thinking it is a CCP breeding program.

Enjoy on your own risk at the platform managed by the other stable genius.

All things relating to Jordan Peterson

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