Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+ Board €20.80 incl. delivery @ Arrow

Doge · 10-08-2018 2:25pm

DHL are having none of it.

To submit an amendment to customs your proof of purchase is needed a revised invoice is not acceptable.

There is also a €50 fee for the additional service.

Time to send both packages back I'd say..

tphase · 10-08-2018 2:36pm

Doge wrote: »

DHL are having none of it.
Quote:
To submit an amendment to customs your proof of purchase is needed a revised invoice is not acceptable.

There is also a €50 fee for the additional service.
Time to send both packages back I'd say..

I'd say the only way around this in future is to send DHL a copy of the invoice in advance so they can present that to customs.

That €50 fee is a taking the piss, though

Doge · 10-08-2018 2:39pm

go4it wrote: »

Same here . Sent a return parcel email notice to ie.imports@dhl.com and i'll wait for arrow to reimburse me ( a week, a month..who knows? )

This is the email I used to contact DHL.

Just sent an email to the IE.VAT email suckit provided so hoping to get through to someone else this time.

Roberto_gas · 10-08-2018 3:50pm

Order from fedex as its looks like best option...avoid DHL...

Doge · 10-08-2018 4:00pm

Doge wrote: »

This is the email I used to contact DHL.

Just sent an email to the IE.VAT email suckit provided so hoping to get through to someone else this time.

Seems like the ie.vat email was the one the rep contacted me back on so I've just sent her 2 emails essentially. :pac:

Told her the invoice i sent is the original and not revised in any way.

I also said I could email a PayPal receipt but still waiting to hear back.

How do I arrange for the shipment to be returned?

Do I need to contact arrow first?

ed1140 · 11-08-2018 10:48am

Got my pi and case yesterday from DHL, fast delivery, no charges

tphase · 12-08-2018 4:41pm

ed1140 wrote: »

Got my pi and case yesterday from DHL, fast delivery, no charges

what value did Arrow put on the commercial invoice?

Standard Toaster · 12-08-2018 10:06pm

DHL looking for 21.33 customs.
So i can pay this and get it refunded later?

tphase · 12-08-2018 10:18pm

Standard Toaster wrote: »

DHL looking for 21.33 customs.
So i can pay this and get it refunded later?

no chance - I tried, DHL would not budge.
Arrow put the incorrect amount on the commercial invoice, that's all DHL (and customs) have to go on so the charges are valid unfortunately. If you don't want to pay, send it back to Arrow

Standard Toaster · 12-08-2018 10:34pm

So all in it's €42.13 for this Pi.
Is that a decent price all considered?

Thanks tphase

Doge · 12-08-2018 11:26pm

Standard Toaster wrote: »

So all in it's €42.13 for this Pi.
Is that a decent price all considered?

Thanks tphase

35 euro is the going rate for a new Pi so nope!

Standard Toaster · 12-08-2018 11:54pm

Ok cool. How do I go about firing this back to Arrow now dhl has it?

Suckit · 13-08-2018 12:06am

Standard Toaster wrote: »

DHL looking for 21.33 customs.
So i can pay this and get it refunded later?

I would dispute it now with them, but yes you should be able to get a partial refund later if you produce all of the correct documentation. But you would only get refunded VAT, not DHL's service charge.
Send them all of the documentation from Arrow and there may be a bit of back and forth, but they can't dispute the invoice, and they shouldn't be able to charge you (admin fees) for arrow's mistake of not putting the shipping charge on the invoice which is how the whole overcharging issue came to be.
I would be inclined to send it back and get a refund, if they are refusing to budge.
I choose not to use DHL for any order if I can avoid it.

RPi case available on slow delivery for €1.76
https://www.zapals.com/transparent-abs-protective-case-for-raspberry-pi-2-model-b-pi-3-model-b.html

Roberto_gas · 13-08-2018 6:30am

Suckit wrote:

RPi case available on slow delivery for â‚¬1.76

Ordered orig white and red case from aliexpress for 1.34 eur....

tphase · 13-08-2018 8:35am

Doge wrote: »

35 euro is the going rate for a new Pi so nope!

where are you getting it at that price?

JoyPad · 13-08-2018 9:59am

Ordered Friday with Fedex. Got it just now, delivered at the door. No extras, no questions asked.

Standard Toaster · 13-08-2018 10:12am

Standard Toaster wrote: »

Ok cool. How do I go about firing this back to Arrow now dhl has it?

What's the process here?
DHL have it out for delivery today.

I might re-order via Fed Ex assuming i get a full refund.

13-08-2018 10:47am

tphase wrote: »

where are you getting it at that price?

Note that counterfeit 'original' cases exist (ie the foundation red/white and black ones). While i'm sure they function as a case, they tend to be pretty rough and don't fit together well.

Anything on Aliexpress claiming to be the original case for €1.34 is likely one of these counterfeits.

https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/fake-cases-raspberry-pi-make-sure-dont-end-one/

Standard Toaster · 13-08-2018 11:07am

From Arrow:

Arrow Support wrote:

Hello ST, As we need to provide export documents with the original price on it by law, it will make your order more then 22 EUR and I am afraid you will need to pay for the customs. If you refuse the shipment we can provide a refund only after we received the part back into our warehouse.

Suckit · 13-08-2018 11:11am

Standard Toaster wrote: »

From Arrow:

The invoice will have the price paid and shipping costs. That's all you should need.

tphase · 13-08-2018 11:13am

Standard Toaster wrote: »

Originally Posted by Arrow Support Hello ST, As we need to provide export documents with the original price on it by law, it will make your order more then 22 EUR and I am afraid you will need to pay for the customs. If you refuse the shipment we can provide a refund only after we received the part back into our warehouse.
:

according to Irish Revenue, they need to supply documents specifying the price paid

tphase · 13-08-2018 11:31am

Standard Toaster wrote: »

I might re-order via Fed Ex assuming i get a full refund.

there's no guarantee that FedEx won't hit you with charges

Prince10r · 13-08-2018 2:34pm

Eventually managed to get a refund from DHL on the handling charges, (used the following link https://www.dhl.ie/en/contact_center/contact_express/contact_express_management/contact_management_form.html) now I need to follow up with Revenue process below to get the VAT back. Will be attempting this by email. Thanks again to SuckIt for the post pity about all the jumps through hoops.

Once the charges are paid to DHL you should apply in writing to - Revenue Customs Service, Cargo Terminal 1, Dublin Airport, Co. Dublin K67 D8P3 - email cargodap@revenue.ie - telephone -01/812 2604, for a refund of the additional VAT paid. Your application should include - your full name and address, your PPSN, proof of payment of the VAT and copies of the invoice and declaration (as attached to your enquiry). They will process your application and amend the error in the declaration.

ed1140 · 13-08-2018 2:36pm

tphase wrote: »

what value did Arrow put on the commercial invoice?

There was no value put on the package only on the invoice enclosed

tphase · 13-08-2018 2:38pm

Prince10r wrote: »

Eventually managed to get a refund from DHL on the handling charges, (used the following link https://www.dhl.ie/en/contact_center/contact_express/contact_express_management/contact_management_form.html now I need to follow up with Revenue process below to get the VAT back. Will be attempting this by email. Thanks again to SuckIt for the post pity about all the jumps through hoops.

thanks for that

I sent them a message, will up date on their response to me.
Note: if you want to keep a copy of your message, best to type it up in an editor and copy and paste it into the form - once you click send, it's gone....
(I took a screenshot too for good measure)

tphase · 13-08-2018 3:10pm

ed1140 wrote: »

There was no value put on the package only on the invoice enclosed

that's why you weren't charged

frasr · 13-08-2018 3:41pm

Got in contact with DHL on duty charge & their reply

"I am sorry for any inconvenience caused to you, customs calculate the charges based on the commercial invoice sent by your sender. Please find attached the commercial invoice for your reference."

in the invoice they sent me has a value of $34.49 (this was just for the pi, no postage listed).

Going to push them a bit to see if I get any further, but I see it going back to Arrow & the pain trying to get a refund from them :rolleyes:

tphase · 13-08-2018 3:48pm

your best bet seems to be follow the lead of Prince10r except I would suggest put in your request to Revenue for a refund first. Once they accept there is no liability, DHL haven't a leg to stand on, neither can they charge you a €50 re-assesment fee as Revenue have already accepted the re-assessed value

frasr · 13-08-2018 3:51pm

I don't think I want that hassle with revenue, found them less that incompetence before.
Got in contact with Arrow as well, again useless. Figure it'll be a return to sender & credit card charge back....

Doge · 13-08-2018 3:51pm

tphase wrote: »

where are you getting it at that price?

The Pi Hut (before shipping), Amazon which have free shipping etc..

Doge · 13-08-2018 3:52pm

I actually had 3 packages attempted to be delivered by DHL from Arrow today but told the driver that 2 would have to go back.

So all i got out of the deal was a few SMT resistors and capacitors which came in a 3rd box.

It was very frustrating to have the Pi and other items within arms reach and have to send them back haha!

tphase · 13-08-2018 4:09pm

Doge wrote: »

The Pi Hut (before shipping), Amazon which have free shipping etc..

Amazon looks like the better deal, £5 off offer at the minute so converts to around €37. The Pi hut would work out at €40.52 (f€4 more if you want the same speedy shipping as Arrow)

Burzum · 13-08-2018 4:47pm

My Pi arrived this morning with DHL, he tried charging me €21.50 I asked him what for and he told me it was calculated as the difference between the price I paid online and the price of the item to buy here, I responded bull**** and told him to take it back. Was in a crappy mood so probably didn't handle it the best. Will arrow refund the full price on this as I can't be arsed going through the whole rigmarole with revenue etc.

CathalDublin · 13-08-2018 4:51pm

tphase wrote: »

Amazon looks like the better deal, £5 off offer at the minute so converts to around €37. The Pi hut would work out at €40.52 (f€4 more if you want the same speedy shipping as Arrow)

I always use Radionics
https://ie.rs-online.com/web/p/processor-microcontroller-development-kits/1373331/
for €36.25 you can collect from their shop or inc shipping €41.66

tphase · 14-08-2018 4:11pm

I think I've exhausted all options with DHL
I used the link supplied by Prince10r to contact them, their reply made it clear they would not entertain any refund of charges as the mistake is on the part of Arrow, not DHL.
In fairness they are correct however, since they had refunded others (well, one at least) I hoped to benefit from that precedent.

If anyone waiting for one of these Pi's is being hit for charges, the best course is to refuse to accept the shipment and get onto Arrow for a refund.

If you want to avoid charges, your best bet is to send DHL a copy of the sales invoice before the shipment arrives in Ireland. They can amend the value before it's presented to customs. You'll also need to know the AWB number.

Suckit · 15-08-2018 2:05am

Burzum wrote: »

My Pi arrived this morning with DHL, he tried charging me €21.50 I asked him what for and he told me it was calculated as the difference between the price I paid online and the price of the item to buy here, I responded bull**** and told him to take it back. Was in a crappy mood so probably didn't handle it the best. Will arrow refund the full price on this as I can't be arsed going through the whole rigmarole with revenue etc.

Either he doesn't understand vat/duty at all, or I don't.
Or - he thought that was the best way to explain it to you

Or - DHL have decided to do what he said. Which I would think is illegal or at the very least a grey area. That would effectively mean that you are buying it from them.
I won't pretend to understand contracts between the buyer and the seller across the Atlantic, but I would never have thought that the courier could decide to ask for the price difference.

tphase · 15-08-2018 11:02am

Suckit wrote: »

....he doesn't understand vat/duty at all....

nor does he give a sh!t

tphase · 15-08-2018 11:04am

the latest from Arrow

"Customs requires that we show the full price of an item on the Commercial Invoice. VAT is calculated on that price. (Customs is indifferent to promotional prices or discounts.)

At least half of the DHL charge is their "Advancement Fee", which all carriers charge when they pre-pay the VSAT on your behalf. The minimum DHL fee is 12.50€. We have a shipping option specifically tailored for the EU: DHL's BreakBulk (DDP). The VAT is calculated and collected as part of the purchase, but there is no advancement fee. Please keep that in mind for future orders."

Suckit · 15-08-2018 11:44am

tphase wrote: »

"Customs requires that we show the full price of an item on the Commercial Invoice. VAT is calculated on that price. (Customs is indifferent to promotional prices or discounts.)

At least half of the DHL charge is their "Advancement Fee", which all carriers charge when they pre-pay the VSAT on your behalf. The minimum DHL fee is 12.50€. We have a shipping option specifically tailored for the EU: DHL's BreakBulk (DDP). The VAT is calculated and collected as part of the purchase, but there is no advancement fee. Please keep that in mind for future orders."

Lost my original post.

The jist of it was, it doesn't matter what the invoice says was the RRP. It only matters what you paid in total.
If you paid less than €22 (or less than €26 including negligible amount) then you are due to pay nothing else to the Government.
You only need to show proof of the amount that you have paid in total including shipping.

If DHL have any hidden BS charges or admin fees, then that has nothing to do with VAT you don't owe.

Ten Pin · 15-08-2018 11:59am

This doc...

https://www.revenue.ie/en/customs-traders-and-agents/documents/guide-to-importing-goods-through-the-post.pdf

...from revenue is reasonably clear that proof of what you paid is all that is required. They mention PayPal invoice / receipt as acceptable proof. DHL are chancing their arm on the presumption that people are afraid of Revenue and won't question it.

tphase · 15-08-2018 12:38pm

Ten Pin wrote: »

This doc...

https://www.revenue.ie/en/customs-traders-and-agents/documents/guide-to-importing-goods-through-the-post.pdf

...from revenue is reasonably clear that proof of what you paid is all that is required. They mention PayPal invoice / receipt as acceptable proof. DHL are chancing their arm on the presumption that people are afraid of Revenue and won't question it.

I would say Revenue are very clear the price paid is what duty and tax are asessed on.
DHL don't disagree - they will accept your sales invoice as proof of value and they will resubmit to customs.The problem is they will charge an excessive amount of money to do so and they can justify it on the basis that it's not their mistake.
Unfortunately, they are right....

The problem is with Arrow. They obviously have separate sales and logistics systems. The logistics system probably generates shipping invoices automatically and pulls the value from a database of retail prices rather than pulling of off the sales system. Arrow are not going to change that. Apart from not using Arrow, the only way around it is to ensure that the shipping company have a copy of the sales invoice before the shipment lands in Ireland

I just see that Arrow now offers Delivered Duty Paid shipping, maybe that would avoid DHLs rip-off advance payment surcharge.
Also the signup promotion has ended

Ten Pin · 15-08-2018 1:02pm

DHL don't disagree - they will accept your sales invoice as proof of value and they will resubmit to customs. The problem is they will charge an excessive amount of money to do so and they can justify it on the basis that it's not their mistake.

IMO it is partly DHLs mistake, they should have accepted the proof of amount actually paid.

Not sure of the exact process involved but DHL are only collecting VAT (on items less than 150) so they're not declaring anything to customs other than it being exempt. So it's the VAT declaration that matters and they only make that return every month or more.

Arrow have some blame to take but DHL are also ignoring the rules that they are claiming to implement.

Delofan · 15-08-2018 2:09pm

I too was asked for 21.33 from DHL. Got nowhere when I disputed the charge with them. Also contacted Arrow support and outlined the issue. Refused to accept the package yesterday from DHL. Just got the following from Arrow Support

Good Day,

We are very sorry to hear that you have experienced issues with your order.
We refunded the value of the order, please find attached the credit memo.
The refund can be found on Paypal by Transaction ID: xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Please scrap the part if you can not use it, there is no need to return it.

Regards,

tphase · 15-08-2018 2:19pm

Ten Pin wrote: »

IMO it is partly DHLs mistake, they should have accepted the proof of amount actually paid.

Not sure of the exact process involved but DHL are only collecting VAT (on items less than 150) so they're not declaring anything to customs other than it being exempt. So it's the VAT declaration that matters and they only make that return every month or more.

Arrow have some blame to take but DHL are also ignoring the rules that they are claiming to implement.

sorry, but DHL are not making any mistake.

I wish it were otherwise but it's quite clear the mistake is wholly on the part of Arrow. They claim they have to put the RRP on the invoice, we know that's not true. It could be a US export rule but our customs don't require it.

DHL have to use the declared value ($34.99 or ~€29) which is what Arrow put on the commercial invoice - nothing to do with DHL.

DHL will accept the proof of the amount paid and they will correct it. The problem is they will gouge you to correct that mistake. I don't believe that it costs the anything like €50 (or anything at all) to change the value of the shipment. However that's not a mistake, it's DHL ripping us off.

You may well be right about DHL making periodic VAT returns however these days, I'd expect import/export processing is largely automated so it's possible the VAT returns from imports may be processed and transferred on a daily basis

I'm not sure what rules DHL are ignoring - if anything, I think they're being a bit too efficient in implementing the rules. For one thing, I think it would be nice if, when they send a text demanding payment of duty and their excessive surcharges, they would give you at least 24 hours to dispute the amount before they clear the shipment.
Also, in case like this where the shipper makes the mistake and the receiver can prove it, DHL should bill the shipper for correcting the error.

tphase · 15-08-2018 2:20pm

Delofan wrote: »

I too was asked for 21.33 from DHL. Got nowhere when I disputed the charge with them. Also contacted Arrow support and outlined the issue. Refused to accept the package yesterday from DHL. Just got the following from Arrow Support

Good Day,

We are very sorry to hear that you have experienced issues with your order.
We refunded the value of the order, please find attached the credit memo.
The refund can be found on Paypal by Transaction ID: xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Please scrap the part if you can not use it, there is no need to return it.

Regards,

so DHL still have it?

Access · 15-08-2018 2:56pm

So what roughly will the final price of the pi be delivered after all duty and fees paid?

Delofan · 15-08-2018 3:42pm

tphase wrote: »

so DHL still have it?

Yes
I told them to send it back

Roberto_gas · 15-08-2018 4:04pm

Access wrote:

So what roughly will the final price of the pi be delivered after all duty and fees paid?

20.8 if your get it delivered thru fedex...customs issue are linked to DHL

tphase · 15-08-2018 4:06pm

Access wrote: »

So what roughly will the final price of the pi be delivered after all duty and fees paid?

€42.16

tphase · 17-08-2018 11:09am

issue resolved!

Arrow refunded the price of the Pi (which is only slightly less that what I paid in VAV and DHL fees) and say they will recheck the customs rules so, in future they may actually put the price paid instead of the retail price on the invoice. They took on board the points I made to them so fair play to them - top notch customer service.

Thanks to Prince10r for the link to contact DHL. The customer service director got back to me, he took on board the issue I raised with him and I'm happy with the reponse so fair play to DHL too.

So, Arrow site bookmarked to keep an eye out for more bargains.....

Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+ Board €20.80 incl. delivery @ Arrow

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